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L1[00:00:42] ⇦ Quits: zsh (zsh@services.esper.net) (*.net *.split)
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L5[01:50:55] *** stormlight.esper.net sets mode: +o zsh
L6[02:04:37] <Forecaster> ...
L7[02:04:55] <Forecaster> you never really notice the orbital mechanics in Elite, but they're there...
L8[02:08:20] <Forecaster> https://imgur.com/a/iYia1
L9[02:08:32] <Forecaster> This is choppy because gif, but it's nearly real-time...
L10[02:08:57] <Forecaster> My ship is orbiting the brown moon, it's orbiting the blue planet at a speed that seems... rather high
L11[02:14:35] <Izaya> pretty
L12[02:15:25] <Forecaster> I was headed for a tourist location orbiting the moon and was wondering why it was moving away from me :P
L13[02:15:51] <Forecaster> I had to turn around and intercept it as it came around the other side
L14[02:16:23] <Forecaster> once I was close enought I was caught by the moon and was now orbiting the planet with it
L15[02:16:28] <Forecaster> as seen in the gif
L16[02:28:54] <payonel> Forecaster: any feedback on the feedback i gave?
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L21[02:34:05] <Forecaster> sounds about right
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L23[02:35:42] <payomc> aasdfasd fasd fasd fasdf asdf asd/exit
L24[02:35:46] <payomc> derp
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L26[02:38:41] <Forecaster> :P
L27[02:49:09] <Forecaster> I just realized I haven't been to an asteroid station yet
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L36[03:47:46] <Inari> %give MichiBot instant chicken nugget powder
L37[03:47:47] * MichiBot accepts instant chicken nugget powder and adds it to her inventory
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L46[05:11:17] ⇨ Joins: utkum (~utkum@88.251.139.236)
L47[05:11:43] <utkum> Hello people. I have a networking question. Can anyone help?
L48[05:12:11] <Forecaster> definetly not
L49[05:12:12] <20kdc> Ask question, and you shall know.
L50[05:12:32] <Forecaster> because you haven't asked anything.
L51[05:12:35] <Saphire> utkum: fire away, we won't bite for asking.
L52[05:12:49] <utkum> Well, what is the simplest way to learn the current ip of a computer?
L53[05:12:50] <Saphire> (Unless you ask for that, heh :P)
L54[05:13:01] <Saphire> ...ah, just type "ip" in google search?
L55[05:13:17] <20kdc> *sighs* I think utkum means OC modem addresses,
L56[05:13:19] <utkum> I am talking about OC computers
L57[05:13:22] <Saphire> AHA!
L58[05:13:23] <20kdc> and the answer is to type "components",
L59[05:13:30] <20kdc> look for the line mentioning a modem,
L60[05:13:32] <Forecaster> oc computers don't have ip's...
L61[05:13:46] <Saphire> Well, thing is, there are no "ips". You have an UUID that you use to identify it
L62[05:13:50] <Saphire> But there's no IPs
L63[05:13:58] <Forecaster> much less an ip address
L64[05:14:08] <20kdc> Forecaster: Nonsense decoding is an important part of any useful support agent role.
L65[05:14:09] <utkum> @20?kdc thanks
L66[05:14:09] <Saphire> wwIt's a MAC address basically
L67[05:14:22] <utkum> then what does ifconfig bind do?
L68[05:14:29] <Saphire> Wait what
L69[05:14:39] <Saphire> utkum: oh, are you using that network floppy?
L70[05:14:47] <utkum> yep
L71[05:14:52] <Saphire> OH
L72[05:14:54] <Forecaster> @20kdc I can decode it fine.
L73[05:15:31] ⇨ Joins: brandon3055 (~Brandon@pa49-184-140-23.pa.vic.optusnet.com.au)
L74[05:15:37] <Saphire> Aha, for ip then I guess you could use "ip" if I remember it correctly.
L75[05:15:46] <utkum> BTW I am using the floppy irc client as well. Couldn't be bothered to set up an actual irc client.
L76[05:15:53] <utkum> I will try and return
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L79[05:18:06] <utkum> I am back and there is no such command as `ip`
L80[05:19:35] <utkum> I don't think I will mess with the network floppy any loneger. So will ping <UUID> work? does the Network API work with UUIDs?
L81[05:20:23] <Saphire> Oh uh
L82[05:20:27] <Saphire> ifconfig should work
L83[05:20:33] <Saphire> To show IP
L84[05:20:36] <Saphire> I think?
L85[05:20:47] <utkum> lemme try
L86[05:21:39] <utkum> I don't see the IP I bound, just the hardware UUID(?)
L87[05:23:38] <Saphire> Aha, you can `ifconfig bind someaddr`
L88[05:26:00] <utkum> yes. is there a way I can manage the "bound" IPs? ifconfig only has the bind parameter.
L89[05:28:36] <Saphire> type ifconfig
L90[05:28:43] <Saphire> ...you can't unbind them though
L91[05:28:52] <Saphire> The whole thing is... unfinished, let's say.
L92[05:28:59] <utkum> So its just not documented
L93[05:29:05] <utkum> Ok thanks for the help
L94[05:29:28] <utkum> I think I can figure the rest out
L95[05:29:30] <Saphire> It's not JUST undocumented, but also unfinished
L96[05:29:40] <Saphire> utkum: so, what did you want to use it for?
L97[05:29:54] <utkum> Remotely conrtolling a big reactor.
L98[05:30:03] ⇦ Quits: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@p57972296.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 383 seconds)
L99[05:30:24] <Saphire> Ooooooh
L100[05:30:43] <Saphire> ...I really really should try to make a thign for that <.<
L101[05:30:52] <Saphire> utkum: how remote are you speaking?
L102[05:31:16] <utkum> >100 blocks. Just for the lols.
L103[05:31:42] <utkum> Maybe I can commit my lua scripts if I like it to the github page.
L104[05:32:15] <Saphire> You surely can :3
L105[05:32:27] <utkum> Well, time to get coding...
L106[05:32:31] <utkum> bye
L107[05:32:42] <Saphire> Hmm, 100 blocks would mean either a huge cable, or some kind of spot-loaded chunk loaded wireless... uh..
L108[05:32:56] <Saphire> utkum: aww... see ya later I hope?
L109[05:33:06] <utkum> we can only hope
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L112[05:37:23] ⇨ Joins: utkumaden (~utkumaden@88.251.139.236)
L113[05:38:10] <utkumaden> @Sapphire Well, just for appreciation I am connecting with a proper irc client now. So hello
L114[05:39:00] <Inari> %pet utkumaden
L115[05:39:01] * MichiBot pets utkumaden with a micro-singularity. utkumaden recovers 8 health!
L116[05:39:02] <Inari> Good job!
L117[05:40:40] * utkumaden gets nauseous by the sheer amount of irc commands. You can never have enough.
L118[05:54:58] ⇨ Joins: Tbat (~Tbat@185.86.106.168)
L119[05:55:14] <utkumaden> Actually you know what this mod really needs? ssh or telnet.
L120[05:58:33] ⇨ Joins: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@p57972296.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L121[06:04:00] <Saphire> https://imgur.com/gallery/S7GQk wait what? I am in siberia and I don't notice any fires.
L122[06:04:12] <Saphire> utkumaden: uh... I think some tried :P
L123[06:04:35] <Saphire> And my nickname is with only one p unlike the proper name of gemstone
L124[06:04:48] <utkumaden> whoops. my bad
L125[06:06:27] <utkumaden> It shouldn't be too hard though. At least if it's not encrypted.
L126[06:07:55] <Saphire> Hmm
L127[06:08:03] <Saphire> Look at oppm page
L128[06:08:18] <Saphire> openprograms.github.io
L129[06:08:30] <Saphire> http://openprograms.github.io
L130[06:11:47] <utkumaden> There is a telnet package wooo
L131[06:13:31] <Saphire> Hmm, pretty sure that is in-OC?
L132[06:13:36] * Saphire Sa
L133[06:13:40] <Saphire> ... Gah
L134[06:13:47] * Saphire pokes Sangar
L135[06:14:05] <Skye> hmmm
L136[06:14:09] <Inari> https://images-ext-2.discordapp.net/external/34WVSwC_od5-QCCsC9TqzyRr5Cr-Rx2PBPta1vG1YhY/https/i.imgur.com/Q5zwUFE.png
L137[06:14:11] <Skye> true telnet is possible
L138[06:14:22] <utkumaden> @Saphire, nope, actual telnet. I was hoping for ingame telnet.
L139[06:14:38] <Saphire> Skye: yeah, the problem is to have input/output facilities
L140[06:14:41] <Skye> Izaya has an OC with remote shells.
L141[06:14:48] <Skye> Saphire, just emulate a serial terminal
L142[06:14:55] <Saphire> utkumaden: hmm, if you up to double openos...
L143[06:15:11] * Izaya has an OS with multiple local terminals, even
L144[06:15:24] <Saphire> Skye: OR implement actual terminal facilities in the OS
L145[06:15:33] <Izaya> most recent feature
L146[06:15:39] <Izaya> username/password login
L147[06:16:05] <Saphire> Izaya: so you just did same thing as Linux, ability to have multiple vTTY?
L148[06:16:22] <utkumaden> @Izaya, Are you the dev of one of the OSes, or are you making your own?
L149[06:16:38] <Skye> Izaya, please tell me you hash your passwords with a decent hash
L150[06:16:42] <Izaya> utkumaden: https://lain.shadowkat.net/~izaya/ocdoc/PsychOS/ this is mine
L151[06:16:46] <Izaya> Skye: sha256
L152[06:16:53] <Skye> with salt?
L153[06:16:54] <Saphire> utkumaden: you don't need to use @ to ping people in IRC. Please don't do that unless you want to ping a Discord user
L154[06:16:56] <Izaya> Saphire: 'terminals' are more an IPC listener
L155[06:17:07] <Saphire> Izaya: IPC?
L156[06:17:14] <Izaya> Skye: 16 chars of delicious random characters
L157[06:17:19] <Izaya> Saphire: events
L158[06:17:26] <Saphire> Aha
L159[06:17:29] <Izaya> you push display events with a session ID and a string
L160[06:17:41] <Skye> Izaya, also... will you have encryption? :P
L161[06:17:43] <Izaya> then whatever IO device you use listens for those events
L162[06:17:48] <Izaya> Skye: encryption?
L163[06:17:48] <Skye> as in
L164[06:17:54] <Skye> network level encryption
L165[06:17:58] <Izaya> maybetm
L166[06:18:16] <Saphire> Maybe™
L167[06:18:41] <Skye> Izaya, say like a copper encryption layer. :P
L168[06:18:51] <Saphire> Hmm
L169[06:18:55] <Izaya> Skye: no reason I couldn't add an extra stage to the pipeline
L170[06:19:00] <Saphire> ...I want to make a massive q-q
L171[06:19:03] <Saphire> *mainframe
L172[06:19:26] <Izaya> that said, seems pretty limited to me
L173[06:19:31] <Skye> Saphire, that's kinda impossible in OC?
L174[06:19:37] <Izaya> Skye: why tho
L175[06:19:40] <Saphire> Skye: why so?
L176[06:19:53] <Izaya> Saphire: PsychOS also supports clustering by proxying events over the network
L177[06:19:57] <Skye> Izaya, well symmetric encryption, allow the negotiation of the key up to the user
L178[06:20:07] <Skye> Saphire, because OC computers share a thread
L179[06:20:15] <Saphire> And..?
L180[06:20:15] <Izaya> Skye: share 16 threads
L181[06:20:22] <Izaya> possibly more or less
L182[06:20:35] <Izaya> depending on config
L183[06:20:38] <AmandaC> %choose NMS or reactivate the core of the earth with a good bappin'
L184[06:20:39] <MichiBot> AmandaC: NMS
L185[06:20:57] <Saphire> Thing is, I want something that looks like mainframe at the very least
L186[06:21:54] <Izaya> Saphire: 15 microcontrollers and a machine with a bunch of RAIDs attached? :P
L187[06:21:59] <Saphire> Mainly: dumb terminals, tons of them, all hooked up to the mainframe that is composed of several different units with CPUs dedicated to the actual number crunching
L188[06:22:06] <Skye> hm
L189[06:22:13] <Saphire> ... Also, hmm
L190[06:22:17] <Saphire> Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
L191[06:22:21] <Skye> maybe have stuff like disk processors
L192[06:22:29] <Skye> that provide a virutal FS that's fast and huge
L193[06:22:31] * Izaya could do all of that
L194[06:22:35] <Skye> and connect them to different things
L195[06:22:48] <Izaya> minus the stuff skye's talking
L196[06:22:51] <Skye> also VMs would be fun. :P
L197[06:23:01] <Skye> run OpenOS on PsycheOS mainframe. :P
L198[06:23:04] <utkumaden> And terriby slow Skye
L199[06:23:13] <Skye> utkumaden, maybe
L200[06:23:15] <Saphire> ... Okay, now you're just making vm/370
L201[06:23:28] <Skye> Saphire, don't you like that? :P
L202[06:23:30] <Izaya> Skye: I experimented with that
L203[06:23:35] <Izaya> didn't get around to doing much
L204[06:23:44] <Saphire> Skye: no, I like it.
L205[06:23:44] <Izaya> it doesn't like copperative multitasking
L206[06:24:07] <Saphire> Izaya: isn't that what coroutines are?
L207[06:24:39] <Izaya> Saphire: yes. openos doesn't cooperate well
L208[06:24:58] <Saphire> Hmm?
L209[06:25:10] <Saphire> Oh, you mean VM thing?
L210[06:25:15] <Izaya> yeah
L211[06:25:36] <Saphire> Just don't use Lua and instead.. let's say MIPS? :P
L212[06:25:41] <Izaya> :D
L213[06:25:49] <Saphire> Or System/370 architecture
L214[06:25:57] <Izaya> in all seriousness I'm not rewriting PsychOS on a whim
L215[06:26:04] <Saphire> Duh
L216[06:26:12] <Izaya> that said
L217[06:26:24] <Izaya> no reason you couldn't write an OS with virtualization facilities for MIPS
L218[06:26:44] <Skye> Izaya, could you use microcontrollers to run OpenOS, with a minimal emulator for the hardware
L219[06:26:55] <utkumaden> let's write it in c... like that will pair well with java and lua.
L220[06:27:01] <Izaya> Skye: now that's an interesting idea
L221[06:27:17] <utkumaden> infact compile linux for it.
L222[06:27:18] <Saphire> utkumaden: uuuuuh
L223[06:27:19] <Izaya> emulate the GPU and keyboard and a fs
L224[06:27:21] <Saphire> Uh
L225[06:27:27] <Saphire> utkumaden: let me surprise you
L226[06:27:38] <Izaya> netboot it
L227[06:27:46] <Izaya> ... though they'd need a lot of memory
L228[06:27:54] <Skye> the FS could be a netfs
L229[06:27:56] <Izaya> you need to keep like 700k of files in memory
L230[06:27:58] <Saphire> Google "OpenComputers 1st April mips Linux"
L231[06:28:03] <Saphire> utkumaden: do this ^
L232[06:28:16] <Skye> Izaya, what if the FS is on the network?
L233[06:28:18] <Skye> slow...
L234[06:28:29] <Izaya> it'd be cheaper, that's for sure
L235[06:28:42] <Izaya> man, too bad you can't strip OpenOS down to 64k
L236[06:28:56] <Saphire> Heh
L237[06:29:13] <Skye> shame you can't have swap
L238[06:29:33] <Izaya> Skye: it'd net you a whole extra 64k of memory
L239[06:29:35] <Izaya> :D
L240[06:30:01] <Saphire> Skye: well, if you use an actual architecture
L241[06:30:23] <Saphire> ...or you somehow extend Lua bytecode to be close to a real architecture.
L242[06:30:31] <Saphire> With memory management and shit
L243[06:30:59] <Skye> you can't use bytecode
L244[06:31:24] <Izaya> you can
L245[06:31:32] <Izaya> you have to enable it though
L246[06:31:35] <Saphire> ^
L247[06:31:50] <Saphire> utkumaden: so... Did you found it yet?
L248[06:32:18] <Izaya> anyone want to write some JS for me?
L249[06:32:28] <utkumaden> Saphire: I did. Interesting indeed.
L250[06:32:31] <Izaya> :3
L251[06:32:38] <Inari> some.js
L252[06:32:52] <Saphire> Izaya: hmm?
L253[06:32:55] <utkumaden> I would hop on if it was .cs
L254[06:33:12] <Saphire> ...ew
L255[06:33:16] <Izaya> wait
L256[06:33:20] <Izaya> everyone has telnet anyway
L257[06:33:28] <Saphire> Izaya: hmmmm?
L258[06:33:32] <Izaya> was gonna ask for you to write a client for a copper tcpbridge
L259[06:33:45] <Saphire> And..?
L260[06:33:46] <Izaya> but I can just run a program behind a telnet connection
L261[06:33:57] <Izaya> that uses plain lua copper libraries
L262[06:34:25] <Izaya> ... do most terminal emulators support vt52 escape codes?
L263[06:35:15] <Izaya> even better
L264[06:35:18] <Izaya> have a specific box
L265[06:35:19] <Saphire> I think?
L266[06:35:24] <Izaya> with ssh
L267[06:35:36] <Izaya> and a user that can only use the nsh client program
L268[06:35:38] <Izaya> :D
L269[06:36:21] <Saphire> ...why
L270[06:36:33] <Izaya> so I can tell people the username and password
L271[06:36:45] <Izaya> and they get an encrypted connection to a copper/nsh bridge
L272[06:36:51] <Izaya> so they can do remote login to any box on the bridge
L273[06:37:00] <Izaya> (or on networks past those boxes)
L274[06:37:47] <Skye> BBS!
L275[06:37:49] <Skye> make a BBS
L276[06:37:54] <Izaya> exactly Skye :3
L277[06:38:04] <Izaya> I want to run most of the software on OC computers though
L278[06:39:08] <utkumaden> Izaya: will your OS have a windowing system? Like X? Is it even possible.
L279[06:39:20] <Izaya> utkumaden: it's plannedtm
L280[06:39:27] <Izaya> no reason it can't
L281[06:39:33] <Izaya> I'm just focusing on more important stuff rn
L282[06:40:00] <Saphire> utkumaden: you can write your own
L283[06:40:14] <Saphire> Make something like XServer :D
L284[06:40:42] <utkumaden> Saphire: I hate UI programming in general, CLI and GUI at the same time...
L285[06:40:50] <Saphire> Muahaha
L286[06:41:02] <Izaya> utkumaden: I was gonna avoid the issue
L287[06:41:09] <Izaya> since it's all text
L288[06:41:15] <Izaya> just have virtual windowed terminals
L289[06:41:28] <Saphire> Izaya: ... Holy shit you're making Linux
L290[06:41:40] <Saphire> I mean, at least the terminal thing is pretty close
L291[06:42:00] * utkumaden thinks Izaya is Torvalds 2.0
L292[06:42:17] <Izaya> I don't swear enough
L293[06:42:24] <Saphire> (Linux has a rather robust terminal system, and it actually stems from the 80s and before, all the way to mainframes, then those teletypes thing)
L294[06:43:04] <utkumaden> @Saphire It's based on UNIX, which is why everything is a file in linux.
L295[06:43:11] <Saphire> utkumaden: uh,,
L296[06:43:18] <utkumaden> @ again... whoops
L297[06:43:21] <Izaya> files are streams
L298[06:43:22] <Saphire> I am not talking about files
L299[06:43:26] <Izaya> :D
L300[06:43:29] * Izaya runs
L301[06:43:32] <Saphire> But rather the terminal subsystem itself
L302[06:44:01] <Saphire> Which handles UART, COM, vTTY and terminal emulators in absolutely same fashion
L303[06:44:17] <Saphire> And ssh/tmux/etc
L304[06:44:38] <Saphire> Like, literally same
L305[06:45:01] <Saphire> Actually UART is even closer?
L306[06:45:03] <utkumaden> why reinvent the wheel.
L307[06:45:13] <Skye> Izaya isn't torvalds
L308[06:45:20] <Skye> Izaya has a microkernel
L309[06:45:30] <Saphire> utkumaden: exactly. It's amazing how dumb and simple that system is
L310[06:46:10] <Saphire> By dumb I mean not overcomplicated
L311[06:46:25] <utkumaden> I sometimes wish windows used the linux kernel. It makes more sense once you get used to it.
L312[06:46:41] <Skye> the problems with windows are not its kernel
L313[06:46:43] <utkumaden> nt is a terrible mess at this point.
L314[06:46:44] <Syrren> ^
L315[06:46:50] <Syrren> (@Skye)
L316[06:46:51] <Skye> NT itself isn't that bad
L317[06:47:02] * utkumaden is listening
L318[06:47:03] <Skye> it's what's shovelled on top of it
L319[06:47:10] <Skye> Win32 is eeeehhhh
L320[06:47:21] <Izaya> NT is fine
L321[06:47:22] <Izaya> windows sucks
L322[06:47:25] <Skye> on top of that is UWP which is more silly abstraction
L323[06:47:26] <Saphire> Windows API is practically part of kernel by this point
L324[06:47:37] <Syrren> I'm intimately familiar with the Windows "POSIX" File API and just how horrifically broken it is
L325[06:47:38] <Saphire> Also undocumented?
L326[06:47:38] <Skye> no it isn't
L327[06:47:51] <Skye> as in the API is not really part of the kernel
L328[06:47:54] <Skye> kinda
L329[06:47:58] <Izaya> using the NT kernel is why they can emulate Linux syscalls
L330[06:47:59] <Skye> there are kernel mode parts
L331[06:48:02] <Izaya> or Unix syscalls for older versions
L332[06:48:23] <Skye> Izaya, the whole picoprocess thing is a hack to run Linux binaries natively
L333[06:48:26] <Syrren> like, fclose() sometimes returns an error without setting errno, in the absence of any valid cause for error (so presumably there is, in fact, no error)
L334[06:48:29] <Saphire> ... Hmm
L335[06:48:42] <Izaya> Skye: it's clever
L336[06:48:45] <Skye> it is
L337[06:48:46] <Izaya> they used a similar approach for WSUS
L338[06:48:54] <Skye> uh... what's that?
L339[06:48:57] <Saphire> Izaya: that was done without Microsoft as well
L340[06:49:03] <Izaya> Windows Subsystem for Unix Services
L341[06:49:09] <Saphire> Uh, see flinux
L342[06:49:13] <Izaya> WSL for Windows 8.1 and earlier
L343[06:49:25] <Skye> Izaya, I think WSUS didn't do syscalls in the same way.
L344[06:49:26] <Izaya> all the way back to Windows NT 3.5 or so
L345[06:49:37] <Saphire> Literally an attempt to do what wine does: run Linux programs on Windows/NT kennel
L346[06:49:39] <Izaya> WSUS also didn't execute ELF binaries
L347[06:49:40] <Saphire> *kernel
L348[06:49:40] <Skye> it could only run binaries compiled for it
L349[06:49:49] <Skye> it was a Unix
L350[06:49:51] <Saphire> flinux was amazing
L351[06:49:58] <Skye> Unix being a random collection of APIs
L352[06:49:59] <Izaya> I'm pretty sure it used PE binaries, ie normal Windows binaries with UNIX syscalls
L353[06:50:07] <Izaya> /apis and shit
L354[06:50:18] <utkumaden> I always shy away from unmanaged language because of all this ^. Why haven't the OSes accepted a standard system like opengl. stdio is a thing, why can stdgui be a thing.
L355[06:50:19] <Skye> Windows could run OS/2 stuff
L356[06:50:31] <ben_mkiv> well, sounds like inverted wine :D
L357[06:50:34] <Saphire> Until MS killed it with the blast from their "revolutionary" Ubuntu not-vm
L358[06:50:37] <ben_mkiv> just do the opposite of wine source
L359[06:50:56] <Saphire> Well, they didn't really killed, the project just died because of that
L360[06:51:07] <Izaya> utkumaden: Microsoft has invested too much money into DirectX and all the games are written for it
L361[06:51:13] <Izaya> they're not about to give up that lead
L362[06:51:18] <Izaya> it's one of the few they have left
L363[06:51:20] <Syrren> Vulkan
L364[06:51:59] <Saphire> Syrren: Linux of graphical APIs
L365[06:52:29] <Saphire> Awesome, flexible, free, but hell to set up and nobody knows how to work with it
L366[06:52:42] <utkumaden> I have dabbled in OpenGL in my own time. DirectX and Vulkan are unknown territory for me.
L367[06:52:58] <Saphire> DirectX is better compared with SDL
L368[06:53:02] <Syrren> Saphire: last 2 parts are resolved over time, usually, no?
L369[06:53:11] <Saphire> Syrren: see Linux :c
L370[06:53:18] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/pnxyro.webm new users system
L371[06:53:23] <Syrren> hey, Linux a LOT easier to set up these days
L372[06:53:29] <Syrren> s/a/is a/
L373[06:53:29] <MichiBot> <Syrren> hey, Linux is a LOT easier to set up these days
L374[06:53:37] <utkumaden> Saphire: Linux isn't just arch...
L375[06:53:42] <Izaya> @20kdc ^
L376[06:54:09] <Syrren> ...lol, of course you'd think it's a pain to set up if you've only tried arch
L377[06:54:11] <AmandaC> no, it's just Ubuntu, clearly! ~flees~
L378[06:54:31] <Saphire> utkumaden: actually archlinux is very simple to set up
L379[06:54:40] <Saphire> You just need to know exactly what you're doing
L380[06:55:05] <Saphire> ... Ubuntu installer is horrible on the other paw
L381[06:55:28] <Saphire> Because something goes just a little bit wrong... RIP
L382[06:55:36] <Saphire> *if
L383[06:55:36] <utkumaden> Well, the first time I tried it, it took me 2 days to set up a simple usb wifi device. Even then it was fairly broken
L384[06:55:56] <Saphire> utkumaden: netctl
L385[06:55:58] <Syrren> "it" being Ubuntu, or Arch?
L386[06:56:06] <Saphire> ^
L387[06:56:10] <Izaya> the only thing I have driver issues with occasionally is my graphics tablet and it's an off-brand thing from like 2001
L388[06:56:14] <Syrren> also, wifi is one of the significant pain points of Linux, whichever distro you use, sadly
L389[06:56:23] * AmandaC huggles her openSUSE Tumbleweed
L390[06:56:30] <Saphire> AmandaC: awww, that's cute
L391[06:56:31] <Izaya> AmandaC: how comfy is SUSE?
L392[06:56:43] <utkumaden> Syrren: I never had trouble with Linux Mint. It has always worked for me.
L393[06:56:50] * Saphire hugs the kitten clinging to a tumbleweed
L394[06:56:52] <Syrren> SuSE was the first Linux distro I ever used :P
L395[06:57:00] <AmandaC> Izaya: I'm liking it a lot. Had some suspend/resume issues with the Leumur under 4.11 but that seems to have resolved itself in the 4.12 kernel
L396[06:57:13] * Izaya started on Solaris - not a Linux distro but close enough
L397[06:57:22] <Izaya> AmandaC: this is on the system76 machine, yeah?
L398[06:57:25] <AmandaC> yeah
L399[06:57:30] <Izaya> nice
L400[06:57:36] <Saphire> I still don't get what is my issue with suspend/restore
L401[06:57:44] <AmandaC> Actually, I should update the support ticket I opened with them about it, tell them it seems t have resolved itself with a kernel update.
L402[06:57:44] <Syrren> Are you using TuxOnIce?
L403[06:57:47] <Saphire> Somehow
L404[06:57:55] <Saphire> Somehow, I don't know how or why
L405[06:58:05] <Saphire> After I restore system after suspend...
L406[06:58:14] <Saphire> It thinks the keyboard is laptop keyboard
L407[06:58:17] * utkumaden has always been a Linux Mint User.
L408[06:58:33] <Saphire> AND THERE'S NOT A MENTION OF THAT ON THE INTERNET WTFE
L409[06:58:38] <Syrren> Saphire: which hibernation and hooks systems are you using?
L410[06:58:45] * Izaya is currently running Arch, Debian and Mint on the same machine, all at once :3
L411[06:58:47] <Saphire> Syrren: oh, uh...
L412[06:58:49] <Syrren> the former being kernel or tuxonice, the latter being pm-tools or similar
L413[06:58:50] ⇨ Joins: WatchtowerOrator (~Watchtowe@83.223.21.91)
L414[06:58:50] <WatchtowerOrator> Time for a new episode from Forecaster! You're welcome!
L415[06:58:50] <WatchtowerOrator> https://youtu.be/-zcm6d0A2Nc - RailcraftLP [Episode 39] - Problems & Construction
L416[06:58:50] <WatchtowerOrator> Tags on this video: robot,E.V.E,opencomputers,building,ic2,industrialcraft2,expanding,reactor
L417[06:58:50] <MichiBot> RailcraftLP- [Episode 39] - Problems & Construction | length: 33m 41s | Likes: 0 Dislikes: 0 Views: 0 | by Forecaster | Published On 9/9/2017
L418[06:59:02] <Saphire> Linux built in?
L419[06:59:08] <Syrren> kernel, then
L420[06:59:08] <Saphire> Kernel I mean
L421[06:59:12] <Syrren> which hooks system?
L422[06:59:17] <Saphire> Like, that restore flag
L423[06:59:26] <Saphire> Uh, systemd :v
L424[06:59:36] <Saphire> No wait
L425[06:59:38] <Saphire> Udev
L426[06:59:40] <Syrren> oh yeah, I forgot about that fucking katamari damacy
L427[06:59:43] <utkumaden> systemd hybrid?
L428[06:59:50] <Syrren> udev is device hooks, I'm talking about PM hooks
L429[06:59:52] <Saphire> No no no, just udev
L430[06:59:55] <Syrren> pm-utils/laptop-mode-tools
L431[06:59:56] <Saphire> Oh
L432[06:59:59] <Saphire> Wait, what
L433[07:00:01] * Izaya doesn't use hibernate because SSD
L434[07:00:10] <Saphire> ... it's a desktop!
L435[07:00:13] <Saphire> Not a laptop
L436[07:00:21] <Syrren> *sigh*
L437[07:00:28] <Syrren> / = either-or
L438[07:00:38] <Saphire> Oh, um
L439[07:00:40] * utkumaden has a WD Black, but thinks it is still slow. will buy an ssd for a proper build.
L440[07:00:49] <Syrren> utkumaden: laptop or desktop?
L441[07:00:55] <utkumaden> Syrren, laptop
L442[07:01:00] <Skye> I have a HGST Deskstar NAS 4TB 7200rpm drive
L443[07:01:01] * Izaya did the best SSD mounting job yesterday
L444[07:01:10] <Izaya> I taped it to the back of the motherboard tray :D
L445[07:01:14] <Syrren> Saphire: you might want to try tuxonice. tbh I dunno how well it works with systemd, but I do remember it helping me unfuck an otherwise non-hibernating laptop
L446[07:01:37] <Syrren> Izaya: watch out for thermal issues if you push that disk hard enough... although shouldn't be possible over SATA.
L447[07:02:01] <Saphire> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/pm-utils#Installation
L448[07:02:03] <utkumaden> HDD: *melts solder off mobo*
L449[07:02:03] <Izaya> Syrren: it's a cheapo Toshiba one anyway
L450[07:02:05] <Syrren> utkumaden: Samsung 850 Pro if you want SATA, Samsung 950 if you want NVMe (and can afford it)
L451[07:02:10] <Saphire> Doesn't seems to be something I installed
L452[07:02:19] * Izaya needs to get an mSATA SSD for his laptop
L453[07:02:24] <Saphire> So I suspect I don't have any pm hooks? IDK
L454[07:02:29] <Syrren> Saphire: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/TuxOnIce
L455[07:02:38] <utkumaden> I will probably buy an m.2 if my next machine supports it.
L456[07:02:54] <Izaya> My desktop has M.2 but shit's expensive so
L457[07:03:21] * AmandaC decides TuxOnIce must be a Tux reskin of Yuri On Ice!, regardless of the order they came into existance
L458[07:03:57] <Syrren> Izaya: expensive but so fucking worth it when full-text-searching a ~16GB codebase
L459[07:04:11] <Syrren> work got me a laptop with 960 pro. *whooooosh*
L460[07:04:13] <Izaya> Syrren: I am currently 100% broke
L461[07:04:17] <Syrren> ...ouch!
L462[07:04:22] <Izaya> I have about $4.50 to my name
L463[07:04:26] <Syrren> my sympathies
L464[07:04:29] <utkumaden> The things is I will go to uni in 2 years, and must buy a laptop. I would rather buy a SATA one, but not many laptops have 2 SATA bays.
L465[07:04:34] <Izaya> which is a dollar less than I need for a bottle of coke
L466[07:04:39] <Izaya> so I'm not very happy about that.
L467[07:05:25] <Syrren> utkumaden: many laptops can replace ODD with HDD via a caddy
L468[07:05:39] <Izaya> ^
L469[07:05:42] <Izaya> most useful feature ever
L470[07:05:57] <Syrren> ^ except that I want a battery instead and my particular thinkpad doesn't support that D:
L471[07:05:58] <utkumaden> Syrren: Aren't ODD bays micro Sata or something like that
L472[07:06:19] <utkumaden> With a smaller power connector?
L473[07:06:21] <Syrren> utkumaden: 3G/WiFi cards are often mSATA. ODD bays are normal SATA, although they might be height-limited (7mm instead of 9mm)
L474[07:06:38] <Syrren> you'll need a ~$15 caddy to hold the hdd.
L475[07:06:45] <Skye> mPCIe
L476[07:07:07] <Skye> I want an mSATA SSD
L477[07:07:18] <Syrren> Samsung 850 Evo comes in an mSATA model
L478[07:07:26] <Syrren> tbh I'm not a fan because Evo == TLC
L479[07:07:34] <utkumaden> If ms makes a proper surface and releases it world wide, I would buy it...
L480[07:07:43] <Skye> Syrren, what does that mean?
L481[07:08:03] <Syrren> okay so there's different ways to use flash memory
L482[07:08:17] <Syrren> in decreasing order of performance/longevity - SLC, MLC, TLC
L483[07:08:25] <Syrren> Single, Multi (two) Triple level cell
L484[07:08:45] <Syrren> 1 bit per cell (2 voltage levels), 2 bits per cell (4 voltage levels), 3 bits per cell (8 voltage levels)
L485[07:09:25] <Syrren> less bits per cell = more "distance" between voltage levels, which makes cells useful for longer and less likely to corrupt
L486[07:09:40] <Skye> I want an mSATA SSD that had a decent amount of storage space.
L487[07:09:49] <Skye> without being too expensive
L488[07:09:53] <utkumaden> We have come full circle. Analog->Digital->Semi-Analog
L489[07:10:07] <Syrren> pure-SLC is usually used in Enterprise SSDs, with accompanying price-tag
L490[07:10:28] <Syrren> good consumer SSDs (850 Pro, et. al.) are MLC, sometimes with an SLC writeback cache
L491[07:10:29] <Skye> I don't store very important data on my laptop
L492[07:10:49] <Syrren> cheaper consumer SSDs have TLC with an SLC or MLC writeback cache
L493[07:10:55] <Syrren> cheapest ones are TLC-only
L494[07:11:13] <Izaya> Syrren: tfw no UltraBay battery connectors
L495[07:11:18] <Syrren> if you care about data integrity like I do, those writeback caches -- outside of Enterprise disks -- are a horrific prospect
L496[07:11:32] <Skye> Syrren, why?
L497[07:11:55] <Syrren> sorry, correction -- RAM-backed writeback cache, not SLC-backed.
L498[07:12:03] <AmandaC> That reminds me, I should setup backups again
L499[07:12:05] <Syrren> SLC-backed is less horrifying
L500[07:12:28] <Syrren> RAM-backed is bad because if power is lost, and consumer disks won't have big enough supercaps to fix this, your data goes poof
L501[07:12:47] <utkumaden> Is it bad that I trust a HDD more than an SSD. I would never put an important document in an SSD.
L502[07:12:59] <Syrren> SLC-backed is still kinda bad because it adds yet another aspect of "shadow work" which if interrupted by power loss may result in certain types of SSD suicide
L503[07:13:19] <Syrren> utkumaden: general rule is "if you only have one copy of data you don't care about the data" :P
L504[07:14:03] * utkumaden goes to setup 50 raid 1 arrays.
L505[07:14:15] <Syrren> Izaya: ikr? I guess I'll end up buying 9-cell + slice, but expensive as all hell by now (because old laptop model)
L506[07:14:15] <utkumaden> lol, that is true...
L507[07:14:35] <Izaya> Syrren: I just carry a spare 9-cell
L508[07:14:40] <utkumaden> ^ Syrren
L509[07:14:45] <utkumaden> I quit
L510[07:14:59] <AmandaC> There, backing up ~/Code now
L511[07:15:01] <Syrren> Izaya: T420 doesn't have the front-battery for hotswap and I don't hibernate because SSD
L512[07:15:08] <Syrren> (and root-on-ZFS can't hibernate safely yet anyway)
L513[07:15:11] <Tbat> well, I thought SSD goes read-only after certain amount of writes
L514[07:15:20] <Tbat> = no data loss
L515[07:15:22] <Syrren> Tbat: that's the "good" failure mode, yes
L516[07:15:23] <Skye> my backups are my emergency copies I kept when my HDD was dying so I had to transfer data
L517[07:15:27] <Izaya> Syrren: I just shutdown anyway
L518[07:15:33] <Izaya> 99% of the time I'm working inside mosh/ssh
L519[07:15:37] <Syrren> ah, makes sense
L520[07:15:44] <ben_mkiv> my ssd is like 10 years old and still works
L521[07:15:50] <ben_mkiv> never had a hdd for that long
L522[07:15:58] <Izaya> also, slice battery means you wouldn't be able to use the dock easily
L523[07:16:03] <Izaya> and I fscking love the dock
L524[07:16:10] <Syrren> Yeah, I do as well
L525[07:16:11] <utkumaden> ben_mkiv You must have paid a fortune if it is 10 years old.
L526[07:16:15] <AmandaC> s/d/c/
L527[07:16:15] <MichiBot> <utkumaden> ben_mkiv You must have paic a fortune if it is 10 years old.
L528[07:16:19] <AmandaC> Damn!
L529[07:16:23] <Syrren> my new work laptop doesn't have a dock connector
L530[07:16:24] * AmandaC flees
L531[07:16:37] <Izaya> :| that's annoying
L532[07:16:39] <Syrren> AmandaC: s/doc/coc/
L533[07:16:50] <ben_mkiv> 9 Power_On_Hours 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 55243
L534[07:16:55] <utkumaden> MichiBot !help
L535[07:17:00] <ben_mkiv> yea, it was the first real intel consumer ssd
L536[07:17:01] <Skye> %help
L537[07:17:02] <MichiBot> Skye: Command list: http://michibot.pc-logix.com/help
L538[07:17:14] <ben_mkiv> intel x25-m g2 80gb
L539[07:17:17] <Izaya> thinking when I have $250 to blow I'll drop some on an X220t, then when I have another $30, another dock
L540[07:17:33] <Izaya> I do love the dock
L541[07:17:35] * Izaya pokes AmandaC
L542[07:17:40] <Izaya> "here's your chance"
L543[07:17:41] <Syrren> Izaya: why a -t?
L544[07:17:44] <Skye> can anyone find me an mSATA SSD that's cheapish with a decent capacity greater than 100GB? :P
L545[07:18:01] <Syrren> Skye: 850 Evo mSATA exists in at least 250G iirc
L546[07:18:05] <Izaya> Syrren: I do a fair bit of art and technical drawing and art so
L547[07:18:05] <AmandaC> Izaya: nah, now it's no fun
L548[07:18:18] <AmandaC> The train has passed
L549[07:18:22] <Syrren> touchscreen makes sense then
L550[07:18:23] <Izaya> department of redundancy department
L551[07:18:25] <Izaya> >.>
L552[07:18:26] <ben_mkiv> well 8 years it is, not 10
L553[07:18:33] <Syrren> I just look at that screen connector and think "that's going to break SO FAST"
L554[07:18:35] <Izaya> Syrren: not just touchscreen, graphics tablet
L555[07:18:44] <ben_mkiv> but i had a corsair ssd too, which failed pretty early
L556[07:18:46] <Izaya> it has pressure sensitivity
L557[07:18:51] <ben_mkiv> guess they either are rocking solid or shitty xD
L558[07:19:32] <Skye> my plan is to get an SSD and HDD for my x220
L559[07:20:02] <Syrren> Skye: https://www.google.com.au/search?q=samsung+msata&client=firefox-b&dcr=0&source=univ&tbm=shop&tbo=u&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiiw5_1i5jWAhXMebwKHQF3D8UQsxgIJw&biw=1920&bih=1073
L560[07:20:09] <utkumaden> %lua print "enabled?"
L561[07:20:09] <MichiBot> enabled?
L562[07:20:10] <Izaya> Skye: install loonix on a like, 32GB mSATA SSD, split the HDD between a Windows install and your loonix /home&/var&whatever else
L563[07:20:24] <Skye> eeehhh
L564[07:20:29] <Skye> too expensive
L565[07:20:30] <Skye> for me
L566[07:20:35] <Skye> I'm a cheapskate
L567[07:21:01] <utkumaden> isn't % lua a bit dangerous? couldn't I crash the bot with a while loops?
L568[07:21:11] <Izaya> 16GB?
L569[07:21:16] <Izaya> that's like 20AUD
L570[07:21:16] <AmandaC> utkumaden: try it.
L571[07:21:24] <Syrren> Izaya: I assume Skye is referring to the search I linked
L572[07:21:26] <utkumaden> I don't want trouble though.
L573[07:21:30] <Izaya> oh
L574[07:21:33] <Izaya> don't mind me
L575[07:21:38] <Izaya> $lua while true do end
L576[07:21:42] <Izaya> fuck.
L577[07:21:44] <Izaya> %lua while true do end
L578[07:21:47] <AmandaC> It's pretty heavily sandboxed, thanks to gamax92
L579[07:21:48] <MichiBot> script took too long
L580[07:21:53] <Izaya> 's all good
L581[07:21:56] <utkumaden> thank god
L582[07:21:56] <AmandaC> ( and Vexatos )
L583[07:21:57] <Izaya> p. difficult to break
L584[07:22:25] <Syrren> I hope it's memory-bound
L585[07:22:46] <Syrren> otherwise it's potentially crashable via lots and lots of alloc
L586[07:23:07] <AmandaC> %lua s = "lol" while true do s = s .. s end
L587[07:23:07] <MichiBot> not enough memory
L588[07:23:12] <Syrren> :)
L589[07:24:54] ⇦ Quits: WatchtowerOrator (~Watchtowe@83.223.21.91) (Remote host closed the connection)
L590[07:24:55] <utkumaden> %lua print "enough memory"
L591[07:24:55] <MichiBot> enough memory
L592[07:25:10] <Tbat> %lua math.random()
L593[07:25:10] <MichiBot> 0.84018771715471
L594[07:25:12] <Tbat> %lua math.random()
L595[07:25:12] <MichiBot> 0.39438292681909
L596[07:25:29] <Vexatos> hi that's me
L597[07:25:31] <Vexatos> I mean what
L598[07:25:33] * Vexatos glares at AmandaC
L599[07:25:43] <AmandaC> Vexatos: you tweaked the sandbox to make %sel work. :P
L600[07:25:51] <AmandaC> unless gamax92 undid those changes
L601[07:26:03] <Vexatos> I'm pretty sure that wasn't me
L602[07:26:07] <Vexatos> I just fixed selene :I
L603[07:26:07] <Tbat> nice, no randomseed needed. Learning lua coming from Python is annoying as...
L604[07:26:44] <Tbat> Like: Let's make a dice. Hmm, math.random(6), works good, but what now. I need to randomseed(os.time()) it.
L605[07:27:09] <utkumaden> how do you do streams in lua. What would happen if we opened /dev/random and printed things from it slowly...
L606[07:27:12] <Vexatos> AmandaC, pretty sure gamax92 did all the work there
L607[07:27:16] <Vexatos> I just did fixes on the sel side
L608[07:27:34] <Vexatos> Because I am the only one who bothers understanding this silly language :P
L609[07:27:48] <Tbat> oh, os.time() is only in seconds, no fractions
L610[07:27:48] <Vexatos> utkumaden, io.open
L611[07:27:48] <AmandaC> Vexatos: I distinctly remember gamax92 being mad at you for changing it from instruction-based limiting to timer-based limiting
L612[07:28:07] <Vexatos> O right I suggested that
L613[07:28:20] <Vexatos> works much better though :⁾
L614[07:29:28] <Vexatos> %sel $(->$())()
L615[07:29:28] <MichiBot> main:255: bad argument #1 to 'pairs' (table expected, got function)
L616[07:29:41] <Vexatos> and that bug's still there
L617[07:30:45] <Saphire> https://github.com/cjdelisle/cjdns/blob/master/doc/Whitepaper.md hnnnng
L618[07:30:53] <Saphire> I wonder if that can be implemented with OC...
L619[07:33:39] <utkumaden> %lua local random = io.open("/dev/random", "r"); for i = 1,10 do local line = random:read(8); print(line) end; random:close()
L620[07:33:39] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to call field 'open' (a nil value)
L621[07:33:55] <Vexatos> not in the sandbox >_<
L622[07:34:02] <Tbat> haha
L623[07:34:24] <utkumaden> Good job on the sandboxing.
L624[07:34:52] <Saphire> %lua for k,v in pairs(_G) print(k,v) end
L625[07:34:52] <MichiBot> main:1: 'do' expected near 'print'
L626[07:34:56] <Saphire> %lua for k,v in pairs(_G) do print(k,v) end
L627[07:34:56] <MichiBot> main:1: bad argument #1 to 'pairs' (table expected, got nil)
L628[07:35:03] <Saphire> %lua for k,v in pairs(_ENV) do print(k,v) end
L629[07:35:11] <MichiBot> Message too long to send to channel https://paste.pc-logix.com/werunalagi
L630[07:35:14] <Izaya> man only having 2 mods is nice
L631[07:35:16] <Izaya> load time is short
L632[07:35:23] <Saphire> Heh
L633[07:35:30] <Izaya> still takes 30 seconds but \o/
L634[07:35:30] <Tbat> which ones Izaya
L635[07:35:31] <Tbat> ?
L636[07:35:42] <Izaya> Tbat: OpenComputers and Computronics
L637[07:35:48] <Izaya> 's the setup for my dedicated OC server
L638[07:36:00] <Tbat> alright
L639[07:36:16] <Tbat> i would probably be able to survive with only oc and enderio
L640[07:36:31] <Tbat> ofc some client mods like mouse and inventory tweaks
L641[07:36:42] <Saphire> Lol
L642[07:36:54] <utkumaden> What would happen if you had OpenComputers and ComputerCraft /plays Machintosh420
L643[07:37:09] <Izaya> uh
L644[07:37:13] <Izaya> you could talk between them
L645[07:37:20] <Izaya> OC could use all the CC peripherals...
L646[07:37:27] <Saphire> %lua s=nil
L647[07:37:30] <utkumaden> Did not know that
L648[07:37:36] <Saphire> %lua for k,v in pairs(_ENV) do print(k,v) end
L649[07:37:37] <MichiBot> Message too long to send to channel https://paste.pc-logix.com/baqalizeha
L650[07:37:38] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/tsrogp.png this is the entire server
L651[07:38:00] <Saphire> %lua for k,v in pairs(getmetatable(_ENV)) do print(k,v) end
L652[07:38:00] <MichiBot> main:1: bad argument #1 to 'pairs' (table expected, got nil)
L653[07:38:02] <utkumaden> Izaya needs more computers. lol
L654[07:38:14] <Izaya> gonna redesign the whole thing soon
L655[07:38:17] <Saphire> .lua uhm()
L656[07:38:20] <Saphire> %lua uhm()
L657[07:38:20] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to get length of local 'a' (a nil value)
L658[07:38:22] <Izaya> more efficient and such
L659[07:38:28] <Izaya> considering going 100% wireless
L660[07:38:44] <Saphire> %lua for k,v in pairs(debug) do print(k,v) end
L661[07:38:58] <utkumaden> Izaya: I wish you good luck, I guess.
L662[07:39:14] <Izaya> then I'm gonna use drones to automate cold storage
L663[07:39:24] <utkumaden> I was initially goin to do a crazy AE system, but turns out they nerfed it.
L664[07:39:25] <Izaya> so I can manage disks and such by issuing a command
L665[07:39:43] <Izaya> y'know, "move disk id 9001 to computer 437"
L666[07:40:17] <utkumaden> r/ProgrammerHumor worth. "Even writes code in games."
L667[07:40:36] <Saphire> utkumaden: eh, just look at ANY zachtronics game
L668[07:43:20] <Izaya> why is it that every second value returned by an internet request is ""?
L669[07:43:53] <utkumaden> wat?
L670[07:46:26] ⇨ Joins: Tbat_ (~Tbat@185.86.106.168)
L671[07:46:42] <Izaya> utkumaden: you use the internet component to make a http(s) request
L672[07:46:57] <Izaya> every second value it returns will be an empty string
L673[07:47:38] <utkumaden> Weird. Maybe it self disposes? (my c# usage is showing again.)
L674[07:47:51] <Izaya> I'm going with it doesn't actually have the data I want >.>
L675[07:48:05] <Izaya> still, concatenating a string with an empty string is 100% valid
L676[07:48:11] <Izaya> so \o/
L677[07:49:06] ⇦ Quits: Tbat (~Tbat@185.86.106.168) (Ping timeout: 183 seconds)
L678[07:49:32] <utkumaden> %lua local l = "string"; print(substing(l, 1))
L679[07:49:32] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to call global 'substing' (a nil value)
L680[07:49:36] <utkumaden> %lua local l = "string"; print(substring(l, 1))
L681[07:49:37] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to call global 'substring' (a nil value)
L682[07:49:53] <Izaya> try l:sub
L683[07:49:56] <Izaya> or string.sub
L684[07:50:13] <utkumaden> %lua local l = "string"; print(l:sub(1))
L685[07:50:13] <MichiBot> string
L686[07:50:25] <utkumaden> %lua local l = "string"; print(l:sub(1, 1))
L687[07:50:25] <MichiBot> s
L688[07:50:28] <utkumaden> There
L689[07:51:02] <Saphire> What do you mean by being valid?
L690[07:51:14] <Izaya> Saphire: it's concatenating two strings
L691[07:51:17] <Izaya> even if one is empty
L692[07:51:20] <Saphire> Of course it's valid, because even empty string is still a string
L693[07:51:23] <Izaya> ie no issue, just not the most efficient
L694[07:52:37] <Saphire> Ah. Maybe is does something under hood for that
L695[07:52:47] ⇨ Joins: DevonX| (~DevonX@128.77.95.157)
L696[07:54:45] <Izaya> now a PsychOS feature: wget.
L697[07:55:16] ⇦ Quits: utkumaden (~utkumaden@88.251.139.236) (Ping timeout: 183 seconds)
L698[07:56:22] <Izaya> which, by extension, means it's a lot easier to update
L699[07:58:28] <Vexatos> aaand another bug fixed in selene
L700[07:58:31] <Vexatos> thanks AmandaC :⁾
L701[08:00:22] <Izaya> Skye: so you think I should go 100% wireless for my datacentre?
L702[08:00:56] <Izaya> sidestep the throttling issue
L703[08:04:12] <Skye> Izaya, eeehhh... depends. I'd suggest you have wireless sectors, then link those sectors with relays?
L704[08:04:35] <Izaya> Skye: uh
L705[08:04:38] <Izaya> how tho
L706[08:05:01] <Izaya> I'm trying to fit the whole thing into one chunk
L707[08:05:06] <Skye> well
L708[08:05:08] <Skye> I guess
L709[08:05:14] <Skye> if the wireless signal propogates that far
L710[08:11:54] ⇦ Quits: DevonX| (~DevonX@128.77.95.157) (Quit: Leaving)
L711[08:18:01] <Izaya> in other news
L712[08:18:05] <Izaya> uCs work perfectly
L713[08:18:41] <Izaya> y'know how some companies offer like, VPSes for cheap hosting?
L714[08:19:03] <Izaya> my cheap hosting will be 256k RAM/64k disk microcontrollers
L715[08:20:51] <Izaya> (going up to 4M RAM/16M storage servers)
L716[08:26:37] <Saphire> Izaya: hey, do you think the cjdns routing protocol can work with oc? Routing itself, not the encrypted data
L717[08:26:53] <Izaya> I'd have to look into it
L718[08:26:59] <Skye> Izaya's currently using copper
L719[08:27:08] <Izaya> ^
L720[08:27:14] <Izaya> copper can do automatic mesh networking
L721[08:30:52] <Saphire> Cjdns can do too
L722[08:31:05] <Izaya> yeah but
L723[08:31:11] <Izaya> this is already implemented and it's like 2k of code
L724[08:31:40] <Saphire> Hmm
L725[08:36:37] <Tbat_> I really dislike that robot.suck() will steal your armor...
L726[08:37:18] <Temia> Naughty robot. >.>
L727[08:37:25] <Izaya> very
L728[08:37:54] <Temia> Inari, have you been teaching the robots things?
L729[08:38:20] ⇦ Quits: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@p57972296.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 195 seconds)
L730[08:43:01] <Izaya> Skye: https://a.pomf.cat/trtmne.png density
L731[08:43:30] <Izaya> I can layer these to be offset
L732[08:43:36] <Skye> why computers and not micro-controllers
L733[08:43:46] <Izaya> because I can add actual storage to these if I want
L734[08:43:59] <Izaya> among other things
L735[08:44:20] <Skye> is there anything you can fit into the gaps?
L736[08:44:26] <Izaya> chests
L737[08:44:29] <Izaya> for cold storage
L738[08:44:37] <Skye> how will that work with drones?
L739[08:45:14] <Izaya> you'll be able to request the drone to move a disk from a chest to a computer
L740[08:45:26] <Skye> so you'd need a gap between two layers
L741[08:45:31] <Izaya> yup
L742[08:45:34] <Izaya> planned
L743[08:45:41] <Izaya> well, actually I'm planning a 2-high gap
L744[08:45:57] <Skye> why?
L745[08:46:02] <Syrren> maintenance, I assume
L746[08:46:03] <Izaya> so I can walk between
L747[08:46:28] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/yilbiw.png
L748[08:49:16] ⇨ Joins: utkumaden (~utkumaden@88.251.139.236)
L749[08:58:50] ⇦ Quits: ashka (~postmaste@server2.shellgratuit.com) (Ping timeout: 200 seconds)
L750[08:59:01] ⇨ Joins: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@p57972296.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L751[09:06:44] <20kdc> so, is this an OC server farm?
L752[09:08:04] <AmandaC> Vexatos: huh?
L753[09:08:13] <AmandaC> I was constructing dark magick in golang templates
L754[09:16:41] <utkumaden> doesn't require scan present working directory for files as well?
L755[09:20:45] <Skye> I was pinged?
L756[09:21:19] <Inari> Dunno
L757[09:21:23] <Inari> check your mentions?
L758[09:24:26] <utkumaden> Can you call functions from below in lua?
L759[09:24:42] <Inari> Depends
L760[09:25:32] <20kdc> https://paste.pc-logix.com/elobevufax
L761[09:25:57] <Izaya> @20kdc, quite so an OC server farm. Would you like a PsychOS node with 256k RAM and 64k storage?
L762[09:26:03] <Inari> Lua scripts parse from top to bottom. If a function exists by the time your code executes, you can call it. so if you have function a() b() end function b() end that works as long as you don't try to call a() before function b ()
L763[09:26:32] <ben_mkiv> oO
L764[09:26:34] <utkumaden> Thought so
L765[09:26:46] <20kdc> Izaya: Not at present, but thank you for the offer
L766[09:26:47] <ben_mkiv> wouldnt that example not work?
L767[09:26:47] <Inari> @20kdc don't even need "local x" neccessarily
L768[09:26:57] <20kdc> Inari: pollutes global table
L769[09:27:00] <ben_mkiv> because you call b in a before b is defined
L770[09:27:01] <Inari> ben_mkiv: Nah, it works
L771[09:27:10] <Inari> ben_mkiv: You don't
L772[09:27:13] <utkumaden> Also how does require() work in opencomputers work? does it not scan the current directory for *.lua?
L773[09:27:16] <ben_mkiv> or is it, because a wasnt called yet?
L774[09:27:23] <Izaya> [can go up in both storage and memory]
L775[09:27:27] <Inari> Yes, a() is only executed once you call it
L776[09:27:30] <Inari> by which time you defined b
L777[09:27:34] <ben_mkiv> ah ok
L778[09:27:35] <ben_mkiv> gotcha
L779[09:27:37] <20kdc> utkumaden: It scans several directories for \*.lua - that script then returns the library's table.
L780[09:28:12] <Inari> http://i.imgur.com/WxHIeVR.jpg I need one
L781[09:28:26] <utkumaden> @20kdc As far as I know, it should scan the current directory, but I have gotten errors.
L782[09:28:45] <Mettaton_Fab> you need a chicken?
L783[09:29:00] <Inari> To sit on my shoulder, yes
L784[09:29:19] <utkumaden> @20kdc it may be my bad, sorry. I will ping back if I wasn't at fault
L785[09:30:20] <Inari> I wish twitter and tweetdeck made it less a pain to see tweeted images at full size
L786[09:34:17] <Inari> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJShBP3U8AECcu8.jpg:large pretty in an odd way
L787[09:39:25] <utkumaden> Does anyone know a clever way to have c# like properties in lua?
L788[09:40:04] <utkumaden> or am i forced to use getX() setX()
L789[09:40:32] <AmandaC> metatables!
L790[09:41:08] <utkumaden> Any example you can link? AmandaC
L791[09:42:03] <utkumaden> never mind I prefer accessors
L792[09:42:22] <AmandaC> %lua t = setmetatable({}, { __index=function(t, idx) print "GET " .. idx end, __setindex=function(t, idx, val) print "SET " .. idx .. val end}) t.foo = bar
L793[09:42:22] <MichiBot> main:1: unexpected symbol near '..'
L794[09:42:41] <AmandaC> %lua t = setmetatable({}, { __index=function(t, idx) print("GET " .. idx) end, __setindex=function(t, idx, val) print("SET " .. idx .. val) end}) t.foo = bar
L795[09:42:57] <AmandaC> ... WASN'T ME! ~flees~
L796[09:43:04] <utkumaden> %resetlua
L797[09:43:04] <MichiBot> Sandbox reset
L798[09:43:11] <utkumaden> AmandaC, there you go
L799[09:43:13] <Inari> is __setindex even a thing
L800[09:43:18] <AmandaC> oh, no
L801[09:43:22] <AmandaC> %lua t = setmetatable({}, { __index=function(t, idx) print("GET " .. idx) end, __newindex=function(t, idx, val) print("SET " .. idx .. val) end}) t.foo = bar
L802[09:43:22] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to concatenate local 'val' (a nil value)
L803[09:43:29] <AmandaC> %lua t = setmetatable({}, { __index=function(t, idx) print("GET " .. idx) end, __newindex=function(t, idx, val) print("SET " .. idx .. val) end}) t.foo = "bar"
L804[09:43:29] <MichiBot> SET foobar
L805[09:43:49] <utkumaden> %resetlua
L806[09:43:49] <Inari> %lua t.foo = "meow"
L807[09:43:49] <MichiBot> Sandbox reset
L808[09:43:50] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to index global 't' (a nil value)
L809[09:43:53] <Inari> ffs
L810[09:43:57] <utkumaden> You broke it again lol
L811[09:44:00] <AmandaC> %lua t = setmetatable({}, { __index=function(t, idx) print("GET " .. idx) end, __newindex=function(t, idx, val) print("SET " .. idx .. ": " .. val) end}) t.foo = "bar"
L812[09:44:00] <MichiBot> SET foo: bar
L813[09:44:02] <Inari> No?
L814[09:44:08] <AmandaC> No, it was a bad format string.
L815[09:44:21] <Inari> %lua t.foo = "meow"
L816[09:44:21] <MichiBot> SET foo: meow
L817[09:44:29] <Inari> %lua print(t.foo)
L818[09:44:29] <MichiBot> GET foo | nil
L819[09:44:46] <Inari> You forgot to make __index return the value
L820[09:44:47] <Inari> :D
L821[09:44:55] <AmandaC> yah. :P
L822[09:44:57] <Inari> Oh wait
L823[09:44:59] <Inari> It's not even really set
L824[09:45:09] <AmandaC> __index and __newindex won't get called for real values, so:
L825[09:45:21] <Inari> TRue
L826[09:45:46] <AmandaC> %lua t = setmetatable({_values={}}, { __index=function(t, idx) print("GET " .. idx) return t._values[idx] end, __newindex=function(t, idx, val) print("SET " .. idx .. ": " .. val) t._values[idx] = val end}) t.foo = "bar"
L827[09:45:46] <MichiBot> SET foo: bar
L828[09:45:55] <AmandaC> %lut t.foo
L829[09:45:59] <AmandaC> %lua t.foo
L830[09:45:59] <MichiBot> GET foo | bar
L831[09:46:02] <Inari> \o/
L832[09:46:32] <AmandaC> You could pretty easily use this to turn `t.foo = bar` into `t:set_foo(bar)`
L833[09:48:36] <Inari> But thats not like in c#
L834[09:49:04] <AmandaC> Same effect, different syntax
L835[09:49:14] <utkumaden> int integer { get; set; }
L836[09:49:15] <Inari> But the syntax is the whole point
L837[09:49:21] <Inari> Else you migth as well ahve get/set functions
L838[09:49:51] <AmandaC> I find it a bad idea to try and transfer syntax between two unrelated languages
L839[09:50:00] <Inari> Eh
L840[09:50:07] <Inari> All langauges should have certain syntax features
L841[09:50:09] <AmandaC> concepts are fine, and usually can feel natural, but syntax never does
L842[09:50:46] <Inari> C# is the best get/set way I've seen
L843[09:52:02] <utkumaden> Inari, couldn't agree more
L844[09:52:32] <AmandaC> eh, I don't really favor any one syntax / concept, I adapt to the language I'm in, unless there's a very strong reason not to.
L845[09:53:01] <Inari> Dunno, it's a pain to do it the normal setBlahBlah getblahBlah way after using something more conveninet
L846[09:53:34] <AmandaC> Inari: well, why does it have to be setBlahBlah? if blahBlah has no real special restrictions to it, just foo.blahBlah is fine, imho
L847[09:53:50] <Syrren> lvalue support is nice, agreed
L848[09:54:08] <Inari> AmandaC: Becasue later you might want to add a special restriction
L849[09:54:08] <Syrren> although I guess that needs an extra qualifier
L850[09:54:12] <Syrren> "magic lvalue" or something
L851[09:54:16] <Inari> And then you'll have to rewrite all sets of foo.blahBlah
L852[09:55:19] * AmandaC can't think of many cases where she had to narrow the scope of a variable.
L853[09:55:47] <Inari> You start out with it being some generic thing to set and then want to add extra checks later
L854[09:56:14] <AmandaC> eh
L855[09:56:20] <Syrren> or debug prints, for example. you might want to debug an action-at-a-distance problem that way.
L856[09:56:21] * AmandaC goes back to abusing Golang's text/template
L857[09:56:30] <Inari> xD
L858[09:57:30] <AmandaC> When the `merge` function doesn't do what you want: https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/TprV0pcR/
L859[10:00:16] <utkumaden> I found my own way.
L860[10:01:33] <utkumaden> %lua local _field = "lol"; function property(value) if value != nil then field = value; return value end; print(property()); print(property("xD"));
L861[10:01:33] <MichiBot> main:1: 'then' expected near '!'
L862[10:01:56] <utkumaden> %lua local _field = "lol"; function property(value) if value not == nil then field = value; return value end; print(property()); print(property("xD"));
L863[10:01:56] <MichiBot> main:1: 'then' expected near 'not'
L864[10:01:58] ⇦ Quits: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@p57972296.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 186 seconds)
L865[10:02:25] <utkumaden> %lua local _field = "lol"; function property(value) if value ~= nil then field = value; return value end; print(property()); print(property("xD"));
L866[10:02:25] <MichiBot> main:1: 'end' expected near <eof>
L867[10:02:34] <Inari> I mean, if you only need a single property, I suppose
L868[10:03:01] <utkumaden> %lua local _field = "lol"; function property(value) if value ~= nil then _field = value end; return value end; print(property()); print(property("xD"));
L869[10:03:01] <MichiBot> nil | xD
L870[10:03:24] <utkumaden> whoops. You get the point though
L871[10:15:16] <Tbat_> %lua place = {3,6,1} place = place * -1 print(place)
L872[10:15:16] <MichiBot> main:1: attempt to perform arithmetic on global 'place' (a table value)
L873[10:18:05] ⇨ Joins: Cervator (~Thunderbi@2601:4c1:4000:1050:d870:d811:dfcd:768a)
L874[10:24:22] ⇦ Quits: utkumaden (~utkumaden@88.251.139.236) (Quit: Leaving)
L875[10:31:14] <Tbat_> %lua local x,y,z = 1,10,20 v = x+y+z print(v)
L876[10:31:14] <MichiBot> 31
L877[10:48:06] <Izaya> NICE
L878[10:48:26] <Izaya> so I can put down like a million uCs
L879[10:48:38] <Izaya> from the same item
L880[10:49:07] <Izaya> they end up with different addresses
L881[10:51:21] <Izaya> same EEPROM address but EEPROMs aren't shared apparently
L882[11:00:11] <gamax92> 4 pings
L883[11:01:27] <gamax92> Yeah for MichiBot it should be instruction counter based and if Vexatos changed that I'm going to murder him
L884[11:01:27] <MichiBot> Hello gamax92
L885[11:02:05] <payonel> %murder gamax92
L886[11:02:18] <payonel> o_O
L887[11:02:20] <payonel> :)
L888[11:02:39] <payonel> %give gamax92 a phoenix down
L889[11:02:40] * MichiBot searches through her inventory for a bit. "I couldn't find anything..."
L890[11:03:40] <Inari> ~markov payonel
L891[11:03:41] <ocdoc> it is required for components -- prints 'hi'
L892[11:04:01] <gamax92> ~markov Inari
L893[11:04:02] <ocdoc> eh, i bet theres r34 of event.timer(0, something)?
L894[11:04:08] <gamax92> probably
L895[11:04:13] <Inari> Heh
L896[11:04:22] <Inari> I'd like to see that
L897[11:04:30] <payonel> haha
L898[11:04:32] <payonel> wow
L899[11:04:35] <Inari> ~markov AmandaC
L900[11:04:35] <ocdoc> gamax92: sorry that could be leveraged for a buyout or active mode.
L901[11:05:10] <CompanionCube> ~maekov
L902[11:05:23] <CompanionCube> ~markov CompanionCube
L903[11:05:24] <ocdoc> skyem123, hey ShadowKatStudios what happens if the speedup comes back with ss13 is fun.
L904[11:06:06] <Inari> ~markov Temia
L905[11:06:07] <ocdoc> Eh, fuck it, I'll be ordering the relevant file into stdin of cowsay!
L906[11:06:29] <Temia> This is a thing I would do, yes.
L907[11:06:56] <payonel> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SCdj9d8SUQ
L908[11:06:56] <MichiBot> LET ME LOVE YOU - Justin Bieber - ATC, Alex Goot, & KHS Cover | length: 3m 33s | Likes: 460,311 Dislikes: 9,349 Views: 36,843,337 | by Kurt Hugo Schneider | Published On 20/8/2016
L909[11:06:59] <payonel> i really like this song
L910[11:07:03] <payonel> i'm not ashamed!
L911[11:07:07] * payonel runs
L912[11:07:23] <Inari> %whatislove
L913[11:07:24] <MichiBot> Inari: Love is... a big pile of anti-meh!
L914[11:07:32] <Inari> Not untrue
L915[11:07:43] * payonel has lots of love
L916[11:07:47] <payonel> and free hugs
L917[11:08:07] <AmandaC> payonel: lol wtf!
L918[11:08:10] <Skye> CompanionCube, oh god those old usernames
L919[11:08:19] <payonel> AmandaC: :D
L920[11:08:22] <Skye> %whatiflove
L921[11:08:26] <Skye> %whatislove
L922[11:08:27] <MichiBot> Skye: Love is... boredom, with Metin 2 on top!
L923[11:08:49] * CompanionCube mehs payonel
L924[11:09:36] * payonel feels the meh
L925[11:10:01] <AmandaC> You merely adopted the meh.
L926[11:10:29] <Inari> %pet AmandaC
L927[11:10:29] * MichiBot brushes AmandaC with chocolate. AmandaC recovers 9 health!
L928[11:10:41] * AmandaC glares at MichiBot
L929[11:10:55] <Inari> On the bad side you'll be sticky
L930[11:11:05] <Inari> On the plus side it'll taste like chocolate when you clean yourself
L931[11:11:25] <AmandaC> And then I'll die, because chocolate is just as poisonus to cats as it is dogs
L932[11:11:36] <Inari> Psh
L933[11:12:14] <Inari> Wonder if it's poisonous to foxes
L934[11:16:56] <gamax92> yes
L935[11:17:46] <Inari> :<
L936[11:18:22] <AmandaC> It's actually poisonous to humans too, but they're much bigger so it takes a much larger amount to kill them.
L937[11:18:32] <Inari> But its so tasty!
L938[11:19:17] <gamax92> AmandaC: ACKTSHUELLY!
L939[11:19:42] <gamax92> she's right
L940[11:19:48] <Inari> xD
L941[11:19:56] ⇨ Joins: ashka (~postmaste@server2.shellgratuit.com)
L942[11:21:23] <Inari> ~markov ashka
L943[11:21:23] <AmandaC> I'm not 100% positive, but I think it might be poisonous to some degree to all mammals
L944[11:21:23] <ocdoc> Please wait ...
L945[11:21:29] <ocdoc> oh, okay. so this peripheral would need being redone for it to the charger, that probably crashed it doesn't haha
L946[11:23:41] <AmandaC> s/to some degree/to some degree of lethality/
L947[11:23:41] <MichiBot> <AmandaC> I'm not 100% positive, but I think it might be poisonous to some degree of lethality to all mammals
L948[11:24:23] <gamax92> I shall eat, and then commence testing
L949[11:27:43] ⇨ Joins: Cogitabundus (~HAL@122.15.77.139)
L950[11:28:35] <gamax92> "Automatic HD Remastering!"
L951[11:29:20] <gamax92> It's just a color filter + vignette
L952[11:33:14] <gamax92> oh good, then he over brightened everything
L953[11:42:29] <Skye> ~markov Inari
L954[11:42:30] <ocdoc> well i need more YT channels to watch xD
L955[11:43:02] <gamax92> ~markov Inari
L956[11:43:02] <ocdoc> i dont think utena because of xkcd's Bucket or something :| But theres always more TLR yet no clue on edp
L957[11:44:08] <AmandaC> Inari's speaking in cyphers again, I see.
L958[11:44:19] <Inari> https://imgur.com/gallery/sfo5NUb
L959[11:44:24] <Inari> Wonder what edp means
L960[11:45:10] <Inari> https://imgur.com/BKV5SxH
L961[11:45:45] <gamax92> You should know
L962[11:45:47] <gamax92> you said it :P
L963[11:45:59] <Inari> %shrug
L964[11:45:59] <MichiBot> No you shrug!
L965[11:46:00] <Inari> %logs
L966[11:46:00] <MichiBot> https://oclogs.pc-logix.com/
L967[11:46:17] <AmandaC> likely a mistak elike this
L968[11:46:24] <gamax92> Inari: is that a trash panda
L969[11:47:17] <Inari> https://oclogs.pc-logix.com/parser.php?log=2017-03-21.log#L851
L970[11:47:25] <Inari> Nah, just amanda mentiong %edp and %esp
L971[11:47:32] <Inari> gamax92: yes
L972[11:47:44] <AmandaC> ah
L973[11:48:32] ⇦ Quits: Cogitabundus (~HAL@122.15.77.139) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
L974[11:48:49] <Inari> utena is an anime. xkcd is xkcd. Bucket is a bot in the xkcd channel, TLR is to love-ru
L975[11:49:02] <gamax92> Inari -> English translator
L976[11:50:31] <AmandaC> damnit g.
L977[11:50:47] <AmandaC> I've had that tetris song stuck in my head ever since it was mentioned the other day.
L978[11:51:09] <gamax92> well just get a different song stuck in your head
L979[11:51:26] <Inari> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJEUG8s6hGw ?
L980[11:51:26] <MichiBot> Nightcore - Tetris | length: 2m 29s | Likes: 21,552 Dislikes: 1,027 Views: 4,168,458 | by Joana Madeira | Published On 3/7/2011
L981[11:52:00] <AmandaC> Inari: "History of the USSR set to the tetris song" -- I'm not finding it myself because it'll just get stuck in my head deeper
L982[11:52:20] <Inari> Ah, that
L983[11:52:26] <AmandaC> It's the song you didn't like because of the grainy-ness
L984[11:52:38] <Vexatos> this is nice :I https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3r9bOkYW9s
L985[11:52:38] <MichiBot> History of English (combined) | length: 11m 21s | Likes: 15,946 Dislikes: 240 Views: 1,626,147 | by OpenLearn from The Open University | Published On 8/11/2011
L986[11:53:28] <gamax92> Vexatos: hit the fry button
L987[11:54:24] <Vexatos> What does it do?
L988[11:54:38] <gamax92> probably scrambles the 128 bytes of ram the VCS has
L989[11:57:28] <Saphire> gamax92: huh?
L990[11:59:05] <gamax92> Saphire: huh?
L991[11:59:34] <Saphire> What's VCS?
L992[11:59:55] <gamax92> Atari Video Computer System
L993[12:00:39] <Inari> Sangar is activeon twitter~
L994[12:01:29] <gamax92> Sangar is also not marked as away on IRC
L995[12:02:26] <Inari> I never trust the away function
L996[12:02:29] <AmandaC> He is, however, currently combusting.
L997[12:02:47] <Saphire> AmandaC: why? D:
L998[12:03:13] <AmandaC> Small bug, don't worry, in 99.999% of universes he didn't combust, so my SLA is fine.
L999[12:03:20] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/qiojlb.png \o/ a specific headless kernel uses like 20k less memory
L1000[12:04:29] <Inari> http://tinyurl.com/yb523p3u
L1001[12:04:59] * Sangar was never here
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L1003[12:08:45] <Tbat_> drone.suck(side) also steal my armor. Maybe time to register on github and file some bugs, cause it's considered a bug right!?
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L1005[12:10:57] <Inari> Sounds like a feature to me
L1006[12:11:33] <Tbat_> well, not when it steals your jetpack high up in the sky, farming a big tree.
L1007[12:11:55] <Sangar> players have an iitemhandler capability now, so they're technically the same as a minecart. so yes. it's a feature :P
L1008[12:12:13] <Tbat_> haha
L1009[12:12:18] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/ehpoua.png new datacentre setup
L1010[12:12:42] <Sangar> nice
L1011[12:13:20] <Izaya> that's 32 microcontrollers on each side, each with 256k RAM, I have 4 rows, and I can layer it as much as I like
L1012[12:13:50] <Sangar> (but yeah, anything that auto in/outputs to/from a minecart would now need a blacklist/whitelist to not do the same with players)
L1013[12:13:50] <Tbat_> I will post a feature request then instead Sangar, like a condition for the suck()
L1014[12:14:13] <Izaya> so theoretically I can fit 32k machines in one chunk
L1015[12:14:22] <Izaya> hopefully it won't come to that
L1016[12:14:24] <Sangar> Izaya, that... sounds unhealthy :x
L1017[12:14:37] <Izaya> Sangar: server only has 1GB RAM
L1018[12:14:44] <Inari> Heh
L1019[12:14:48] <Sangar> :x
L1020[12:14:51] <Izaya> that'd need 8GB
L1021[12:15:16] <CompanionCube> AmandaC: *your* SLA?
L1022[12:15:28] <Izaya> so....
L1023[12:15:28] <Tbat_> besides the stealing, I really love the drones, great job! (please don't nerf them)
L1024[12:15:32] <AmandaC> CompanionCube: yes, for the multiverse.
L1025[12:15:39] <CompanionCube> why is it yours
L1026[12:15:51] <Izaya> as long as I stay under 4096 machines I shouldn't run out of memory
L1027[12:15:53] <Izaya> :D
L1028[12:16:07] <Izaya> which is 32 layers of microcontrollers
L1029[12:16:25] <AmandaC> CompanionCube: because cats maintain the multiverse, ofc.
L1030[12:16:35] <Izaya> AmandaC(at)
L1031[12:18:46] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/spegat.png as long as I don't build to the moon it should be fine
L1032[12:18:50] <Izaya> (that's 32 layers)
L1033[12:18:56] <Izaya> ...though
L1034[12:19:01] <Izaya> I could build a lab that high up
L1035[12:19:07] <Izaya> and it'll never interfere with below
L1036[12:21:03] <Izaya> if I had a rack full of servers with wired network cards and turned the internal switch off they wouldn't be able to communicate, right?
L1037[12:32:08] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/vdjveb.png a fair bit of worldedit later...
L1038[12:41:02] <Izaya> didn't Immersive Engineering have a vertical windmill?
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L1042[13:25:26] <S3> Izaya: what's this supposed to be?
L1043[13:25:45] <Izaya> S3: new datacentre
L1044[13:25:51] <S3> AE?
L1045[13:25:54] <S3> oh OC
L1046[13:26:35] <S3> using RAIDs?
L1047[13:26:38] <Izaya> nope
L1048[13:26:44] <Izaya> it'll be mostly microcontrollers
L1049[13:26:54] <S3> do raids allow unmanaged disks yet?
L1050[13:58:16] <MalkContent> Izaya: no. that was rp2
L1051[13:58:40] <Izaya> Oh. :<
L1052[13:58:45] <Izaya> Was gonna do a base with one on a corner
L1053[13:59:25] <MalkContent> you can't even place the kinetic generators/dynamos with the port for the turning thing faced vertically
L1054[14:00:28] <MalkContent> welp :/
L1055[14:02:07] <Izaya> yup :|
L1056[14:05:32] <MalkContent> i mean, i assume that's mostly for aesthetics, could always just build one from chisel
L1057[14:07:02] <MalkContent> n bits
L1058[14:08:33] <Izaya> was gonna be the power source
L1059[14:11:54] <MalkContent> oh. well just use waterwheels
L1060[14:12:02] <Izaya> mmm I guess
L1061[14:12:50] <MalkContent> by far the most powerful kinetic one and you can be a bit cheeky with water placement to get a little more juice
L1062[14:26:23] <MalkContent> like so
L1063[14:26:23] <MalkContent> http://imgur.com/a/CVpzd
L1064[14:26:41] <Izaya> that seems v.flaky
L1065[14:26:43] <Izaya> nice
L1066[14:27:18] <MalkContent> if i ever find a way to make water flow upwards, it's probably gonna be even better :D
L1067[14:28:08] <Kodos> Vertical Windmills afaik were from BTW/BetterWithMods
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L1073[15:35:52] <Temia> HEY INARI
L1074[15:36:05] * Temia takes Inari's revolution. runs off with it. `w`
L1075[15:36:27] <Temia> ...That was super-delayed but with Utena popping up in the markov chain, I couldn't resist
L1076[15:38:34] <Inari> Haha
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L1079[16:15:36] *** Guest29213 is now known as Thog
L1080[16:18:04] <gamax92> ~markov Temia
L1081[16:18:05] <ocdoc> Turtle why it would be just an American Megatrends'... Or Raspberry Tau today!
L1082[16:21:41] <gamax92> ohh ... I wonder if this function sometimes returns non sensible stuff due to the timer it installs ...
L1083[16:24:05] <gamax92> nope, not using a timer still gives an odd result.
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L1090[16:38:10] <AmandaC> gamax92: broadcom wifi?
L1091[16:38:25] <gamax92> what?
L1092[16:42:26] <AmandaC> the timer thing reminded me of the blackhat talk I saw about the first self-propogating broadcom wifi worm.
L1093[16:42:46] <Izaya> \o/ I have power
L1094[16:42:55] <Izaya> (just set up a windmill)
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L1096[16:54:27] <lifewcody> Hello
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L1099[17:03:28] <gamax92> hmm ... these tests don't replicate in this other environment.
L1100[17:04:57] <Izaya> any way I can turn an OpenOS disk back into a normal disk?
L1101[17:07:29] <20kdc> Izaya: basically, change the label back, then rm -rf everything in the right /mnt/ subfolder, IIRC
L1102[17:07:38] <Izaya> no like
L1103[17:07:41] <Izaya> the ROM floppy
L1104[17:07:52] <20kdc> I don't think so, no
L1105[17:08:02] <20kdc> Can you get at the Managed/Unmanaged panel?
L1106[17:08:14] <Izaya> I'll see once I make this book >.>
L1107[17:13:41] <Izaya> would kill for an internet card
L1108[17:13:46] <Izaya> pasting in 30k of code will be painful
L1109[17:19:59] <AmandaC> do it in IRC-safe-essage-size base64 chunks
L1110[17:22:51] <Izaya> why tho
L1111[17:23:08] <Izaya> I can just divide it by 1k and copy-paste it
L1112[17:23:48] <Izaya> ...y'know
L1113[17:24:04] <Izaya> as I paste more in
L1114[17:24:16] <Izaya> there's a very real possibility that it'll OOM
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L1116[17:25:14] <Izaya> alright, we can do better
L1117[17:25:17] <Skye> Izaya, what are you going?
L1118[17:25:25] <Izaya> a loop that writes clipboard events to a file
L1119[17:25:46] <Izaya> Skye: I'm attempting to install PsychOS on a box with no internet card and 256k of RAM from OpenOS
L1120[17:25:59] <Skye> why?
L1121[17:26:07] <Izaya> because I don't want to use OpenOS
L1122[17:26:32] <payonel> when i get pinged because someone says openos, it makes me said that the context is "I don't want to use OpenOS"
L1123[17:26:33] <Skye> why no internet?
L1124[17:26:35] * payonel cries
L1125[17:26:46] <Izaya> there there payonel :<
L1126[17:26:56] <Izaya> I need to work on my own stuff though
L1127[17:27:03] <AmandaC> why do you hate payonel so much, Izaya? D:
L1128[17:27:16] <Izaya> :<
L1129[17:28:12] <Izaya> Skye: because survival
L1130[17:28:21] <Izaya> also it's T1
L1131[17:28:32] <payonel> openos can do t1!
L1132[17:28:32] <payonel> :)
L1133[17:28:41] <payonel> honestly, though, i think what izaya is doing is super awesome
L1134[17:28:44] * Izaya looks at it
L1135[17:28:46] * Izaya watches the computer OOM
L1136[17:28:53] <payonel> and openos can't do that (well) (especially can't do it on t1)
L1137[17:30:06] <Skye> Izaya, make a paste import tool
L1138[17:30:15] <Skye> that can be pasted itself
L1139[17:30:46] <gamax92> I see, the timer also stops when I call Sleep();
L1140[17:30:47] <Izaya> meta: just booted SEBIOS from the Lua BIOS to test my copy and now it's stuck in a loop
L1141[17:34:44] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/vrwlqw.png it's a start
L1142[17:35:08] <Izaya> ... I'm doing the paste import thing wrong.
L1143[17:35:16] <Izaya> I should open the individual files that make up the kernel
L1144[17:35:18] <Izaya> and paste them in
L1145[17:35:21] <Izaya> one by one
L1146[17:40:42] <Izaya> payonel:
L1147[17:40:44] <Izaya> on a 256k machine
L1148[17:40:50] <Izaya> I can't open a 15k text file
L1149[17:41:07] <AmandaC> Not with that attitude you can't!
L1150[17:41:17] * Izaya installs skex2
L1151[17:41:24] <Izaya> the ultimate line editor
L1152[17:41:32] <Izaya> 0.5k memory usager
L1153[17:47:27] ⇦ Quits: Nathan1852 (~Nathan185@HSI-KBW-37-209-86-166.hsi15.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
L1154[18:11:35] ⇦ Quits: Inari (~Pinkishu@p4fc1e573.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: 'The true me is no more~ Such transient life, so beautiful and precious~ You'll become mine forever')
L1155[18:12:15] ⇦ Quits: Tahg (~Tahg@pool-71-248-165-18.bstnma.fios.verizon.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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L1157[18:17:14] ⇨ Joins: Dark (~MrDark@2607:fcc8:d48b:eb00:3080:f036:74fb:39bd)
L1158[18:21:52] ⇨ Joins: Zerray (webchat@5.147.80.4)
L1159[18:22:12] <Zerray> hey guys, do someone know how I can add some kind of Lua support to visual studi 2017?
L1160[18:37:21] <Vexatos> There are better Lua IDEs than that, I'm sure :P
L1161[18:57:02] ⇦ Quits: Vexatos (~Vexatos@p200300556E26A24889BE9F424EF8F86F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: I guess I have to go now. Bye ✔)
L1162[19:20:43] ⇨ Joins: ben_mkiv|afk (~ben_mkiv@p4FED4E69.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L1163[19:26:05] <payonel> Izaya: openos needs ~140k to boot, but to load /bin/edit it would probably load in another 40k for system libs and at least 50k for /bin/edit, so that 220k, leaving 36k, you wanted a 15k file, leaving 4k
L1164[19:26:24] ⇦ Quits: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@p57972296.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 383 seconds)
L1165[19:26:32] <Izaya> payonel: it crashes at 15k
L1166[19:26:37] <Izaya> the full file is about 30
L1167[19:26:51] <payonel> Izaya: yeah, and all of that was estimates
L1168[19:26:53] <payonel> i'm not surprised
L1169[19:27:07] <payonel> lua wiggles
L1170[19:27:17] <payonel> if you have <20k you're likely going to just suddenly crash
L1171[19:27:41] <payonel> Zerray: i use vscode with the vscode-lua plugin
L1172[19:32:26] <Izaya> FINALLY
L1173[19:32:30] <Izaya> PsychOS on my machine
L1174[19:32:52] <Izaya> ended up making an internet card x_x
L1175[19:35:58] <Izaya> \o/
L1176[19:36:35] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/czfjbl.png
L1177[19:38:21] <Izaya> I can edit the file I was trying to copy onto here now
L1178[19:39:00] <Izaya> https://a.pomf.cat/kmnwxf.png
L1179[19:49:14] ⇦ Quits: Turtle (~SentientT@ip5657cbb2.direct-adsl.nl) (Read error: -0x1: UNKNOWN ERROR CODE (0001))
L1180[19:57:21] <Saphire> Izaya: can you rub it with Lua interpreter?
L1181[19:57:24] <Saphire> *run
L1182[19:57:38] <Izaya> ?
L1183[20:03:57] <Saphire> The OS
L1184[20:04:15] <Izaya> like
L1185[20:04:22] <Izaya> paste it into the lua interpreter and run it
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L1188[20:56:49] ⇦ Quits: Johannes13_ (~Johannes1@dslb-188-099-195-013.188.099.pools.vodafone-ip.de) (Ping timeout: 383 seconds)
L1189[21:05:57] <ben_mkiv|afk> sweet, ae2 support is back in 1.10.2 dev builds :)
L1190[21:06:36] <Zerray> @payonel do you know why vs code mark jump points as error?
L1191[21:06:41] <Zerray> like ::jumphere::
L1192[21:25:47] <gamax92> probably supports lua 5.1 and not 5.2
L1193[21:26:14] <Izaya> oh right goto is a thing now
L1194[21:34:27] * Saphire pokes @20kdc
L1195[21:43:39] <gamax92> damn, if I want to replace a specific export in a dll I also have to have my custom dll provide every export the original did as well
L1196[21:43:55] <gamax92> where as with ld_preload I can just make a library with one function in it
L1197[21:44:56] <gamax92> or well ... maybe I could get away with only exporting what the exe used.
L1198[21:45:19] <Zerray> guys do you know how to negate a if statement on the short way?
L1199[21:45:31] <Zerray> like if (!bool) in other languages
L1200[21:45:38] <gamax92> !
L1201[21:45:49] <gamax92> oh
L1202[21:45:54] <gamax92> in Lua use "not"
L1203[21:45:59] <gamax92> if not bool
L1204[21:46:03] <Zerray> lol
L1205[21:46:20] <Zerray> that language gona kill me on the long term xD
L1206[21:47:08] <gamax92> time to experiment with custom dlls
L1207[21:51:49] <Saphire> gamax92: whatcha hacking?
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L1210[22:06:39] <payonel> Zerray: what plugin? vscode-lua?
L1211[22:11:26] <payonel> Zerray: anyways, if yes look in the bottom right corner of the ide's window frame, there is a lua version number there, you can click on it and select a different version
L1212[22:11:28] <payonel> i use 5.3
L1213[22:12:39] <gamax92> damn, godbolt only has an x86 msvc compiler, no x86 gcc
L1214[22:14:20] ⇦ Quits: Lathanael|Away (~Lathanael@p54960DC3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 195 seconds)
L1215[22:15:22] <Zerray> @payonel thx that fixed it
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L1218[22:53:00] <gamax92> uhh okay then ... gcc doesn't support naked fuctions in x86 apparently
L1219[22:53:40] <gamax92> I have to get around this by just naming the function something else and using some inline asm
L1220[23:07:47] <Izaya> is RAM over PCI-e a thing?
L1221[23:08:43] <Izaya> would it act like swap?
L1222[23:09:46] ⇦ Quits: Cervator (~Thunderbi@2601:4c1:4000:1050:d870:d811:dfcd:768a) (Quit: Cervator)
L1223[23:29:36] <gamax92> damn, so I can't use the DLL approach, all the dlls this process uses are in the KnownDLL list so I can't replace them, and the ones that aren't are ones that are shipped by the program
L1224[23:30:00] <gamax92> perhaps I shall use ... child process modification.
L1225[23:30:52] <Izaya> you sound like you're choosing from a hat
L1226[23:39:44] <gamax92> Izaya: well, launching the process should give me full access rights to it, where as hooking into a non child process would require Administrator access
L1227[23:40:22] <gamax92> I think in linux the same-ish applies, you can ptrace a child but you need the appropriate capabilities to ptrace a non child
L1228[23:59:58] <Izaya> @MGR what weird-ass system is the server running on, it completely fucks up timeouts on PsychOS
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