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L20[01:59:00] <Wuppy> morning
L21[02:00:03] <MCPBot_Reborn> [TEST CSV] Pushing snapshot_20151118 mappings to Forge Maven.
L22[02:00:06] <MCPBot_Reborn> [TEST CSV] Maven upload successful for mcp_snapshot-20151118-1.8.zip (mappings = "snapshot_20151118" in build.gradle).
L23[02:00:17] <MCPBot_Reborn> Semi-live (every 10 min), Snapshot (daily ~3:00 EST), and Stable (committed) MCPBot mapping exports can be found here: http://export.mcpbot.bspk.rs/
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L27[02:09:33] <GeoDoX> Hey wuppy
L28[02:09:49] <Wuppy> good morning
L29[02:09:55] <GeoDoX> hows it?
L30[02:10:01] <Wuppy> great :D
L31[02:10:02] <Wuppy> you?
L32[02:10:12] <GeoDoX> meh, frustrated
L33[02:10:32] <GeoDoX> trying to texture my model but hate blender right now
L34[02:10:48] <Wuppy> what do you expect with blender :P
L35[02:10:56] <GeoDoX> there needs to be a way to say "these faces are the same in the uv"
L36[02:12:11] <Wuppy> fucking hell another suicicde bomming in paris :|
L37[02:12:16] <GeoDoX> especially because even though the faces are the EXACT same, the uv doesnt think so. so if I manipulate a vertex on one of the faces, then everything changes
L38[02:12:24] <GeoDoX> oh fuck, didn't hear about that
L39[02:12:31] <GeoDoX> only 3:12am here
L40[02:12:35] <Wuppy> it hapened like a few minutes ago
L41[02:13:07] <GeoDoX> paris has been taking a beating
L42[02:13:23] <Wuppy> thankfully, only 1 normal person got killed
L43[02:13:34] <Wuppy> versus 2 people whod id it
L44[02:13:48] <GeoDoX> thats good then, well better than more i mean
L45[02:14:07] <Wuppy> at lesat it's something :c
L46[02:14:33] <GeoDoX> what would you recommend to texture my model?
L47[02:14:40] <Wuppy> maya
L48[02:14:41] <GeoDoX> It's extremely simple
L49[02:15:14] <GeoDoX> http://puu.sh/lpKkd/111461c196.png
L50[02:15:37] <Wuppy> I've never used anything outside of Maya + a tiny bit of Blender
L51[02:15:48] <Wuppy> but all of my teachers and fellow students tell me blender sucks
L52[02:18:08] <fry> paying $1000 for a model editor sucks :P
L53[02:18:16] <fry> and blender is perfectly adequate
L54[02:18:24] <Wuppy> maya is free \o/
L55[02:18:47] <Wuppy> but almost anything is free as a studnet :P
L56[02:19:36] <fry> student-free versions aren't free at all
L57[02:19:47] <fry> you're investing your time in them
L58[02:20:49] <fry> so, when you finish being a student, and try to apply gained skills in the real world, you'll be inclined to buy the soft you learned, with a full price
L59[02:21:44] <fry> so, you should always take the adult price into consideration :P
L60[02:22:23] <fry> (this is true for any student-free professional software, not only model editors)
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L62[02:22:58] <GeoDoX> looking at maya uv tutorials and it seems more difficult than blender
L63[02:23:19] <GeoDoX> and neither one seems good for cube like objects
L64[02:23:28] <Wuppy> fry, the thing is, I need an operating system so getting windows for free is nice
L65[02:23:40] <Wuppy> I also need Visual studio for C++, getting the better version for free is nice
L66[02:23:55] <Wuppy> the entire industry uses Maya, getting that for free is nice
L67[02:23:55] <GeoDoX> while you're around fry, is there a thread or something on how to use yours and shades obj loader?
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L69[02:24:11] <Wuppy> almost the entire industry uses Perforce, getting that for free is also nice
L70[02:24:32] <Wuppy> and I'm pretty sure that companies you'll work for provide most of that software for you as well
L71[02:26:10] <fry> Wuppy: who would a company choose: a programmer working with a free software, or a programmer that they have to buy $1000 license for? assuming the functionality is identical?
L72[02:26:38] <fry> GeoDoX: not much documentation is available yet, you can look at examples in the src/test folder on the forge github
L73[02:27:32] <GeoDoX> fry, is there anything special i need to do to my model?
L74[02:27:43] <fry> shouldn't be
L75[02:27:45] <GeoDoX> (positions, scale, etc)
L76[02:28:10] <fry> cube is assumed to be from (0, 0, 0) to (1, 1, 1)
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L78[02:30:06] <GeoDoX> alright
L79[02:30:19] <GeoDoX> whats the package for the obj loader?
L80[02:30:26] <Wuppy> fry, most, if not all, companies use Maya and Perforce for visual editing and revisioning so yeah...
L81[02:30:46] <Wuppy> and I'm not saying that working with expensive software is better, but why not if it's free
L82[02:30:56] <fry> because it's not free
L83[02:31:07] <fry> it's not free at all
L84[02:31:07] <Wuppy> especially in a situation like Visual Studio where the expensive versions only add features
L85[02:31:18] <Wuppy> so you can still use the basic, you'll just miss a feature or two
L86[02:31:34] <fry> again, the price tag is not the only price you pay
L87[02:31:49] <Wuppy> according to that logic, everybody should switch to linux
L88[02:32:01] <fry> they indeed should :P
L89[02:32:08] <GeoDoX> fry, is this it? https://github.com/MinecraftForge/MinecraftForge/blob/master/src/main/java/net/minecraftforge/client/model/obj/OBJLoader.java
L90[02:32:20] <fry> that's the loader, yes, GeoDoX
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L93[02:34:17] <fry> Wuppy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vendor_lock-in
L94[02:39:50] <GeoDoX> Is there a way to load the model but apply the texture after? (assuming not)
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L96[02:40:08] <fry> what "after" means here? :P
L97[02:40:53] <fry> you can change the texture in the blockstat json, for example
L98[02:40:57] <fry> *blockstate
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L100[02:42:23] <GeoDoX> Like, not do anything with UV Maps, in this case, with blender
L101[02:42:43] <fry> no, you need to actually have an uv map
L102[02:43:30] <GeoDoX> this is so frustrating, because my model is very simple
L103[02:43:58] <fry> then uv mapping in blender should be very simple too :P
L104[02:44:21] <GeoDoX> "should"
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L110[03:04:51] <Wuppy> I should finish learning javascript today...
L111[03:05:41] <GeoDoX> yay for g15 :)
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L113[03:06:33] <Saturn812> one cannot simply finish learning javascript
L114[03:06:40] <xaero> you're never really finished with it
L115[03:06:41] <xaero> yea
L116[03:06:41] <Wuppy> g15?
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L118[03:06:55] <Wuppy> yeah I agree, but I have to just learn the basics
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L120[03:07:29] <Wuppy> according to Lynda.com I have to learn it before I learn a tool used to write Python
L121[03:07:41] <Wuppy> and I want to learn it to make a slightly advanced website
L122[03:10:17] <mort_> Hi
L123[03:11:39] <Saturn812> there is nothing really to learn in js. You just have to find things as you need them
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L127[03:17:57] <sham1> Wuppy, when you say "everyone should switch to linux". They really should
L128[03:18:39] <sham1> Once WINE gets advanced enough, people no longer need windows for anything as they can run Windows stuff on linux
L129[03:21:21] <McJty> I use linux and I don't even use wine
L130[03:21:28] <McJty> There is nothing on windows that I need on linux
L131[03:24:53] <Wuppy> Saturn812, learning the syntax and some of the most commonly used systmes is a good idea though
L132[03:25:03] <Wuppy> sham1, no, gaming sucks on linux :c
L133[03:25:06] <Wuppy> as well as game development
L134[03:26:48] <sham1> gaming's not an excuse
L135[03:27:00] ⇦ Parts: SnowDapples (~powered@p5794DACE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.))
L136[03:27:00] <Wuppy> why not?
L137[03:27:21] <Wuppy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4cRn5ykA2s <3
L138[03:27:44] <Wuppy> dat summer feel on this song
L139[03:27:55] <Wuppy> also, the massive amount of awesome memmories
L140[03:28:46] <sham1> Gaming's not an excuse because Valve
L141[03:28:51] <sham1> And SteamOS
L142[03:30:58] <Wuppy> noooo the speedup button on lynda is broken :c
L143[03:31:04] <Wuppy> and this guy talks waaaay too damn slow
L144[03:31:09] <sham1> lynda?
L145[03:31:13] <Wuppy> lynda.com
L146[03:31:53] <sham1> Also, why are you trying to learn JavaScript
L147[03:32:07] <Wuppy> 1. I need it to learn a tool for python
L148[03:32:15] <Wuppy> 2. I'm going to make a website with javascript
L149[03:32:20] <Wuppy> 3. It's good to know web dev
L150[03:32:38] <Saturn812> WINE will never be that advanced
L151[03:32:54] <sham1> And that would be because?
L152[03:33:04] <Wuppy> sham1, about wine?
L153[03:33:12] <sham1> Indeed
L154[03:33:23] <Wuppy> was unsuer if that was to me or to Saturn
L155[03:33:37] <sham1> Also, I am pretty sure you make websites with HTML + CSS and not with JS
L156[03:33:43] <sham1> You use JS with HTML + CSS
L157[03:33:46] *** Vigaro|AFK is now known as Vigaro
L158[03:33:56] <Wuppy> you can make basic websites, but I need JS for some slightly more advanced stuff
L159[03:34:00] <Wuppy> I needs logics
L160[03:34:03] <sham1> AJAX?
L161[03:34:07] <sham1> Ah
L162[03:34:07] <Wuppy> AJAX?
L163[03:34:35] *** tterrag is now known as tterrag|ZZZzzz
L164[03:34:35] <sham1> AJAX enables you to get documents from the server via JavaScript
L165[03:34:46] <sham1> You can use that to update content for instance
L166[03:35:01] <Wuppy> I might need AJAX at one point
L167[03:35:27] <sham1> Gonna use jQuery or something similar
L168[03:35:30] <Wuppy> but I'll probably not need much more than a random number generator, 1 simple calculation and then a check
L169[03:35:34] <sham1> Or POJS
L170[03:35:40] <sham1> Plain Old JavaScript
L171[03:35:56] <Wuppy> I might keep a scoring system on a database or somethign later, but I'll first do the basics
L172[03:36:14] <GeoDoX> Anyone know why my texture is warping like this? http://puu.sh/lpMXn/8feefd787a.png
L173[03:36:32] <sham1> That's an awesome effect
L174[03:36:46] <Wuppy> that isn't properly uiv'
L175[03:36:47] <Wuppy> uv'd
L176[03:36:59] <Wuppy> make sure you do a planar mapping on the things around the circle in the middle
L177[03:37:22] <GeoDoX> not sure what the equivelent is in blender...
L178[03:37:45] <Wuppy> I'm sure google knows :)
L179[03:37:49] <GeoDoX> http://puu.sh/lpN0W/c313370c0d.png
L180[03:37:53] <GeoDoX> Thats my UV's
L181[03:38:07] <sham1> http://blender.stackexchange.com/questions/35375/planar-uv-mapping
L182[03:38:15] <Wuppy> you probably want a square map on the 4 corners
L183[03:38:15] <GeoDoX> Each side is "welded" together
L184[03:38:41] <Wuppy> although I'm not an artist :P
L185[03:39:00] <sham1> Yes you are
L186[03:39:17] <sham1> Programming is art
L187[03:39:19] <ThePsionic> Anyway
L188[03:39:22] <ThePsionic> aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
L189[03:39:26] <Wuppy> hai ThePsionic
L190[03:39:29] <Wuppy> sup?
L191[03:39:31] <sham1> bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbb
L192[03:39:34] <Wuppy> other than screaming :P
L193[03:39:35] <ThePsionic> my gaming pc just got back
L194[03:39:41] <ThePsionic> so i'm setting it up again
L195[03:39:49] <Cypher121> now that I think of it, the longer programming exists, the more old stuff there'll be
L196[03:39:56] ⇨ Joins: Wastl2 (~Wastl2@x55b34858.dyn.telefonica.de)
L197[03:39:59] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, why was it gone?
L198[03:40:04] <ThePsionic> because it broke
L199[03:40:10] <Cypher121> which means more "Plain Old <something>" abbreviations
L200[03:40:11] <Wuppy> what was wrong with it?
L201[03:40:22] <ThePsionic> It started bluescreening so I tried to re-install Windows
L202[03:40:25] <ThePsionic> The uninstalling worked
L203[03:40:28] <ThePsionic> The re-installing didn't
L204[03:40:48] <Wuppy> so which thing was broken? HDD?
L205[03:40:48] <ThePsionic> And apparently the RAM was busted too
L206[03:40:58] <Wuppy> ah, RAM, makes sense
L207[03:41:00] <sham1> "Plain Old <something>" is like the best way to make something sound interesting in programming
L208[03:41:02] <ThePsionic> yeah
L209[03:41:03] <Cypher121> at what point will we have to look in a dictionary to find out what POASJHDAKJDHAS means?
L210[03:41:10] <sham1> People like their acronyms
L211[03:41:40] <ThePsionic> Cypher121: http://i.imgur.com/RUWiT9M.png
L212[03:42:00] <Cypher121> yeah, it doesn't mean anything... yet
L213[03:42:31] <sham1> Plain Old ThreadWorkerMonadFactoryMonadFactoryWorkerFactory
L214[03:42:42] * Wuppy stabs the course presentation person
L215[03:42:42] <ThePsionic> :P
L216[03:42:51] <Wuppy> one does not simply add a bracket on the same line
L217[03:42:55] <ThePsionic> Anyway, a bit of feedback on my website would be super http://thepsionic.com/
L218[03:43:00] <Cypher121> MonadFactoryMonadFactory
L219[03:43:01] <ThePsionic> Wuppy: I do it literally all the time
L220[03:43:11] <Wuppy> one ESPECIALLY does not add the else on the same line as the closing bracket of an if
L221[03:43:11] <Cypher121> no, sorry, I'm not THAT into functional programming
L222[03:43:21] <ThePsionic> Oh yeah that's bad
L223[03:43:31] <Wuppy> o________________0
L224[03:43:41] <Wuppy> Javascript can break if you use the proper braces style
L225[03:43:54] <ThePsionic> gg
L226[03:43:57] <sham1> MonadFactoryMonadFactory is me parodying J2EE names
L227[03:43:57] <Wuppy> aka, next line braces
L228[03:44:08] <ThePsionic> welcome to JS
L229[03:44:22] <sham1> JavaScript is like coffee
L230[03:44:29] <sham1> You only want it once in a while
L231[03:44:29] <Wuppy> java is coffee
L232[03:44:44] <sham1> And so is CoffeeScript
L233[03:44:48] <ThePsionic> Er guys
L234[03:44:48] <ThePsionic> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoffeeScript
L235[03:44:50] <ThePsionic> wait
L236[03:44:51] <Wuppy> java is literally coffee
L237[03:44:52] <ThePsionic> damnit sham1
L238[03:44:56] <sham1> :D
L239[03:45:06] <Cypher121> wait, since then
L240[03:45:06] <Cypher121> if (condition)
L241[03:45:06] <Cypher121> {
L242[03:45:06] <Cypher121> ...
L243[03:45:06] <Cypher121> }
L244[03:45:06] <Cypher121> is a java(script) convention?
L245[03:45:17] <sham1> Since never
L246[03:45:31] <ThePsionic> That's a C++ convention iirc
L247[03:45:36] <Cypher121> yeah, exactly
L248[03:45:37] <sham1> in Java(script) you usually see if (cond) {
L249[03:45:42] <ThePsionic> ^
L250[03:45:44] <sham1> It is the GNU indentation
L251[03:45:47] <Wuppy> oh god coffeescript makes my eyes bleed
L252[03:45:49] <sham1> the former
L253[03:45:52] <Saturn812> that is not tied to the language...
L254[03:45:55] <ThePsionic> The problem in JS is you need to do the following:
L255[03:45:57] <ThePsionic> if (cond)
L256[03:45:59] <ThePsionic> wait
L257[03:46:03] <ThePsionic> if (cond) {
L258[03:46:04] <ThePsionic> ...
L259[03:46:06] <ThePsionic> } else {
L260[03:46:08] <ThePsionic> ...
L261[03:46:09] <ThePsionic> }
L262[03:46:09] <Wuppy> Saturn812, is right, braces are not tied to the language
L263[03:46:12] <sham1> CoffeeScript looks nice
L264[03:46:15] <Wuppy> but what ThePsionic just wrote is plain wrong
L265[03:46:20] <sham1> The hell you talking about
L266[03:46:28] <McJty> Well they are not tied to the language but every language has its preferred coding style which is commonly adopted
L267[03:46:30] <Wuppy> technically it works, but it's not right :<
L268[03:46:36] <ThePsionic> ikr Wuppy
L269[03:47:10] <Saturn812> i think only python has a preffered coding style. The rest language just depends on the programmer itself and the framework they are using
L270[03:47:12] <Cypher121> hi McJty
L271[03:47:19] <McJty> Hi Cypher121
L272[03:47:27] <sham1> But Wuppy if you do not like CoffeeScript, have fun with ECMAScript 6 standard :D
L273[03:47:41] <sham1> That JavaScript is now
L274[03:47:47] <Wuppy> sham1, would I ever get in contact with ECMAscript 6?
L275[03:47:59] <ThePsionic> But yeah if anyone has the time to check out my website that'd be great, I don't really know what to put in the third column of the about section and I'm not entirely sure about how my portfolio is laid out
L276[03:48:03] <sham1> if you want not stupid looking anon funcs
L277[03:48:13] <sham1> () -> /* Stuff */
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L279[03:48:25] <sham1> That is ECMAScript 6 lambda
L280[03:48:50] <sham1> Not that different from CoffeeScript
L281[03:49:14] <Cypher121> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoffeeScript#Loops_and_comprehensions
L282[03:49:40] <Cypher121> I'm a bit lost, are we considering inverted "while" or "until" good?
L283[03:49:50] <sham1> 0/10 no fold
L284[03:50:58] <sham1> gcd :: (Num a) => a -> a -> a
L285[03:51:01] <sham1> eh
L286[03:51:03] <sham1> Heh*
L287[03:51:16] <sham1> Even though it should be (Integral a) now when i think about it
L288[03:51:32] <Cypher121> aaaaaaaaaaaa
L289[03:53:42] *** Vigaro is now known as Vigaro|AFK
L290[03:57:27] <Wuppy> ugh why is there still no news on the release date of Blue Mountain State Rise Of Thadland
L291[03:57:32] <Wuppy> I want that movie :P
L292[03:58:24] <xaero> is that the series with the ♫ give me a hell, give me a yeah? ♫ theme song?
L293[03:58:34] <Wuppy> yes
L294[03:59:05] <Wuppy> one of the best shows ever made, seen it like 3 times :P
L295[04:00:43] <xaero> haven't seen the show, but the song's pretty good
L296[04:00:59] <Wuppy> yeah the song is great as well
L297[04:01:36] <Wuppy> I recently found out that there's a dutch version of Blue Mountain State, it's GLORIOUS
L298[04:02:27] <xaero> now I know why you like it so much ... "It portrays certain aspects of American university life, including American football, sex, binge drinking, drugs, wild partying, and hazing." x)
L299[04:02:44] <Wuppy> that is exactly the reason why I like it
L300[04:03:38] <Wuppy> do you know any other shows/movies with a subject like that?
L301[04:03:56] <Wuppy> kinda like the Neighbors movie :P
L302[04:05:39] <ThePsionic> Hmm
L303[04:05:40] <xaero> nah.. like Kaiyouka (IIRC) I tend to not understand that lifestyle hehe
L304[04:05:52] <xaero> but to each his own :P
L305[04:05:54] <Wuppy> yeah... Kaiyouka does not agree with it :P
L306[04:05:55] <ThePsionic> Wuppy: What kind of icon would you connect to the term "exploration"
L307[04:06:07] <Kaiyouka> heh
L308[04:06:14] <Wuppy> but I agree with you xaero, everybody has their own lifestyle
L309[04:06:33] <Kaiyouka> Does drawing porn and watching Kitchen Nightmares really qualify as a lifestyle?
L310[04:06:45] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, binoculars
L311[04:06:51] <ThePsionic> hmm
L312[04:06:57] <Wuppy> or even better perhaps, binoculars on top of a map
L313[04:07:03] <Kaiyouka> compass
L314[04:07:08] <Wuppy> or a compass on a map
L315[04:07:12] <Kaiyouka> ^
L316[04:07:29] <ThePsionic> I can only have one icon :P
L317[04:07:37] <Wuppy> you can combine both in 1 image
L318[04:07:39] <ThePsionic> But yeah a compass is very good
L319[04:07:53] <ThePsionic> Wuppy: http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/compass/
L320[04:08:22] <Wuppy> not the best compass :c
L321[04:08:29] <Wuppy> I'd go with one of those fancy golden ones :P
L322[04:09:00] ⇨ Joins: HewloThere (~HewloTher@180.200.182.232)
L323[04:09:05] <ThePsionic> I'm still gonna use FontAwesome tho
L324[04:09:06] <ThePsionic> Now
L325[04:09:20] <ThePsionic> What kind of icon for "skill(ing)"
L326[04:09:20] <GeoDoX> http://puu.sh/lpO40/e8d4fa85c2.png
L327[04:09:28] <GeoDoX> Any reason why this is happening?
L328[04:09:32] <ThePsionic> or "gathering"
L329[04:09:33] ⇨ Joins: mezz_ (~quassel@2601:641:4000:82f9:f4b7:c4a0:7f9b:863b)
L330[04:09:50] <Wuppy> GeoDoX, if it's not uv'd it's not textured as far as I know
L331[04:09:51] <GeoDoX> Why the corners of the texture aren't showing?
L332[04:10:01] ⇦ Quits: orthoplex64 (~orthoplex@173.227.72.119) (Ping timeout: 190 seconds)
L333[04:10:04] <GeoDoX> it is, the uv's are shown on the left
L334[04:10:32] <GeoDoX> http://puu.sh/lpO6G/aa78c83fbc.png
L335[04:10:34] <GeoDoX> here
L336[04:10:54] <Wuppy> hmm no clue :<
L337[04:10:58] <Wuppy> not an artist :P
L338[04:12:07] ⇦ Quits: mezz (~quassel@2601:641:4000:82f9:f4b7:c4a0:7f9b:863b) (Ping timeout: 206 seconds)
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L340[04:13:21] <ThePsionic> Damnit bootstrap
L341[04:13:35] <ThePsionic> You'd expect three col-md-4 classes to be next to each other
L342[04:13:41] <ThePsionic> On the same row
L343[04:15:53] <GeoDoX> http://puu.sh/lpOie/6a3a54af96.png
L344[04:15:58] <GeoDoX> Got it
L345[04:16:06] <Wuppy> \o/
L346[04:16:09] <Wuppy> good job :D
L347[04:16:23] <ThePsionic> ayy now it works
L348[04:16:47] ⇦ Quits: HewloThere (~HewloTher@180.200.182.232) (Quit: Leaving)
L349[04:17:58] <GeoDoX> gigaherz, you here?
L350[04:17:58] <Kaiyouka> what's GeoDoX even making?
L351[04:18:14] <Wuppy> arts
L352[04:18:23] <Kaiyouka> - _ -
L353[04:18:24] <GeoDoX> Kaiyouka, the block is called a Particle Manipulator
L354[04:18:32] <ThePsionic> http://fortawesome.github.io/Font-Awesome/icon/lemon-o/ remind me why this is a thing again
L355[04:18:34] <Wuppy> Kaiyouka, I'm not wrong :P
L356[04:18:40] <GeoDoX> For a mod I'm working on :)
L357[04:18:44] <Kaiyouka> neat
L358[04:18:49] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, lemon party?
L359[04:18:50] <Kaiyouka> I hope to one day have time to work on mods again
L360[04:18:57] <ThePsionic> lol
L361[04:19:01] <GeoDoX> Cuz lemons?
L362[04:19:26] <GeoDoX> Thanks :) Kai
L363[04:20:00] <GeoDoX> Anyone know if you set the directions when you export the obj?
L364[04:20:18] <Kaiyouka> of course, by the time I DO have time, my mods will be useless because the combat update and beyond will have fucked up everything \o/
L365[04:20:37] <GeoDoX> Since Blender is Z up/down, where mc is Y up/down
L366[04:20:46] ⇦ Quits: CptRageToaster (~CptRageTo@2602:306:ccba:9f70:21e:8cff:fe36:4c5) (Ping timeout: 192 seconds)
L367[04:23:07] ⇨ Joins: CptRageToaster (~CptRageTo@2602:306:ccba:9f70:21e:8cff:fe36:4c5)
L368[04:23:08] <GeoDoX> Also, does mc use the .mtl file or just the .obj?
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L370[04:25:57] <ThePsionic> I just used the sentence "Changed portfolio to be more bootstrappy"
L371[04:26:50] <Kaiyouka> lol
L372[04:27:16] <ThePsionic> tbf it is nice and bootstrappy now http://thepsionic.com/
L373[04:27:45] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, I'm wondering, have you ever had the drink called Paardenkut?
L374[04:27:58] ⇦ Quits: CovertJaguar (Railcraft@65.183.205.6) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
L375[04:27:59] <ThePsionic> You telling me is the first time I've heard of it
L376[04:28:08] <Wuppy> do you even studnet?
L377[04:28:30] ⇨ Joins: KGS (~KGS@h-46-59-33-249.na.cust.bahnhof.se)
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L379[04:29:19] <ThePsionic> I don't
L380[04:29:43] <Wuppy> it's one of the most popular student drinks
L381[04:29:46] <Wuppy> spa rood with apfelkorn
L382[04:29:52] <Wuppy> so alcoholic apple juice :P
L383[04:30:01] <Kaiyouka> .... cider?
L384[04:30:20] <Wuppy> it tastes very different from cider, but both are tasty
L385[04:30:35] <Kaiyouka> ah
L386[04:31:28] <Wuppy> also, it's cheaper than cider in NL
L387[04:31:32] <ThePsionic> Kaiyouka: If you were wondering, the name of the drink translates to horse cunt
L388[04:31:44] <Kaiyouka> ...
L389[04:31:49] <Wuppy> yeah... the name is somewhat surprising :P
L390[04:31:58] <ThePsionic> They're students what did you expect
L391[04:31:59] <Wuppy> I did not come up with that :P
L392[04:32:23] <Wuppy> I got a club to have a special discount on them so now there is a sign there saying 5 horse vagina for 25 euros xD
L393[04:32:32] <Kaiyouka> The Netherlands is weird
L394[04:32:40] <Wuppy> it sure is
L395[04:33:15] <Wuppy> but apfelkorn is delicous
L396[04:33:22] <Wuppy> but too strong by itself, so why not add some water
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L398[04:33:37] MineBot sets mode: +v on CovertJaguar
L399[04:33:37] <Kaiyouka> Friggen boozers :p
L400[04:33:57] <Kaiyouka> ... I say, knowing full well that there is a good chance I'm drinking bourbon in December
L401[04:34:09] <Wuppy> :o Kaiyouka drinking :o
L402[04:34:28] <ThePsionic> >apfelkorn
L403[04:34:33] <ThePsionic> >too strong by itself
L404[04:34:36] <ThePsionic> pussy
L405[04:34:55] <CrystalMare> wtf
L406[04:34:59] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, I drink stuff because it tastes good, not because of % so that's why I mix it
L407[04:35:13] <ThePsionic> I definitely take both into account
L408[04:35:15] <Kaiyouka> Wuppy: yup, the things I do to entertain people for money
L409[04:35:28] <ThePsionic> It needs to taste nice but I want to get absolutely hammere
L410[04:35:28] <Wuppy> have fun Kaiyouka it's fun :P
L411[04:35:29] <ThePsionic> d
L412[04:35:38] <CrystalMare> I never get to drink
L413[04:35:43] <CrystalMare> I'm always the designated drver
L414[04:35:45] <CrystalMare> diver*
L415[04:35:47] <Wuppy> I specifically do not want to get absolutely hammered
L416[04:35:49] <ThePsionic> lol
L417[04:35:54] <ThePsionic> designated diver
L418[04:35:55] <ThePsionic> imagine that
L419[04:36:07] <CrystalMare> I do smoke weed though
L420[04:36:12] <ThePsionic> erry day?
L421[04:36:13] <CrystalMare> After 3 hours that shit is gone
L422[04:36:28] <CrystalMare> na man
L423[04:36:31] <CrystalMare> Not erry day xd
L424[04:36:38] * CrystalMare checks his jacket
L425[04:36:39] <Kaiyouka> Wuppy: it's only a shot. I presume it will be 3 seconds of imbibing followed by 30 minutes of screaming in pain as my throat burns.
L426[04:36:42] <CrystalMare> Yeah, I have 1 blunt >_>
L427[04:36:47] <CrystalMare> God I Feel like a stoner
L428[04:36:49] <Wuppy> lol Kaiyouka
L429[04:37:04] <ThePsionic> Kaiyouka: It's worth a shot
L430[04:37:06] <ThePsionic> huehehuheuehueehheu
L431[04:37:07] <Ordinastie> what's the method to override in block to make sure the block doesn't let the light go through ?
L432[04:37:09] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, why is your goal to get hammered though?
L433[04:37:26] * Kaiyouka slaps ThePsionic with an empty pizza box
L434[04:37:29] <Wuppy> Ordinastie, isn't that default behavioiur?
L435[04:37:34] <ThePsionic> Wuppy: Why else would I go out of my house
L436[04:37:40] <ThePsionic> If I go out, I want it to be good
L437[04:37:48] <Ordinastie> yes, but for some reason, my block keep letting light through :x
L438[04:38:01] <Wuppy> when I go out, the best way to do it is by getting a good bit drunk and then have fun
L439[04:38:08] <Wuppy> because being completely drunk isn't worth the money
L440[04:38:17] <Wuppy> Ordinastie, perhaps check the Glass block?
L441[04:38:18] <ThePsionic> You can have fun and get hammered at the same time
L442[04:38:26] <ThePsionic> You just wouldn't know you had fun ;)
L443[04:38:41] <Wuppy> because it probably sets it to letting through in there to true, just inverse that and it might work
L444[04:38:45] <Wuppy> ThePsionic, I want to remember
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L446[04:39:24] <ThePsionic> Ordinastie: isOpaqueCube should return true in your case
L447[04:39:36] <Wuppy> ^ that's the name for it
L448[04:39:50] <Ordinastie> yeah, it already return true :x
L449[04:40:02] <ThePsionic> rip
L450[04:40:08] <Wuppy> rip in pepperoni
L451[04:41:21] <Ordinastie> stop talking food!
L452[04:41:24] <Ordinastie> makes me hungry :x
L453[04:41:51] <ThePsionic> Ordinastie: In a moment I will be baking a ham and cheese omelette
L454[04:42:54] <Kaiyouka> I've got a pizza sitting next to me :9
L455[04:43:05] <Ordinastie> rah fuck
L456[04:43:11] <Ordinastie> it's lightOpacity
L457[04:43:21] <Ordinastie> that is set from isOpaqueCube()
L458[04:44:00] <Ordinastie> but my isOpaqueCube() returns fullBlock, that I set in my constructor
L459[04:44:08] <Ordinastie> after lightOpacity is set -_-
L460[04:44:20] <Ordinastie> stupid mojang :x
L461[04:45:57] <ThePsionic> gg
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L466[05:34:24] <ThePsionic> Re-installing Win10 on my desktop... takes a while
L467[05:37:16] ⇦ Quits: Kaiyouka (~IdiotNono@c-75-71-231-133.hsd1.co.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 192 seconds)
L468[05:37:52] *** Kolatra[away] is now known as Kolatra
L469[05:38:39] *** Kolatra is now known as Kolatra[away]
L470[05:39:22] ⇨ Joins: Kaiyouka (~IdiotNono@c-75-71-231-133.hsd1.co.comcast.net)
L471[05:39:37] <Kaiyouka> god, I need a new wi-fi adapter
L472[05:41:59] <Kaiyouka> And I already dropped $70 on a new router too > _ <
L473[05:48:24] <Cazzar> Only $70? :P
L474[05:51:41] <Kaiyouka> I'm not entirely made of money you know
L475[05:51:59] <Kaiyouka> it's 4.5-star-on-Amazon router :p
L476[05:52:58] ⇨ Joins: kimfy (~kimfy___@74.141.16.62.customer.cdi.no)
L477[05:54:24] <Cypher121> I think mine was 60 dollars and the only issue I've had is that all manuals are Chinese-only T_T
L478[05:57:27] <Kaiyouka> lol
L479[05:58:10] <Kaiyouka> I love my new router because I can broadcast a 5ghz network alongside the 2.4ghz network
L480[05:58:26] <Kaiyouka> And if my adapter actually SUPPORTED 5ghz, I'd be connected to it all by myself
L481[05:58:49] <Kaiyouka> (I share the 2.4ghz band with housemates)
L482[05:58:50] <Cazzar> \o/ http://upload.cazzar.net/u/1447847928
L483[05:59:16] <Cazzar> Kaiyouka: I know that feeling, my router supports 5 GHz but I only have the phone that can run on it
L484[06:00:39] <Kaiyouka> I think my most favorite part, though, is that the firmware has proper QoS support
L485[06:01:31] <Cypher121> dunno, everything I have supports AC and PC is connected by ethernet, so all bottlenecks are out of my control
L486[06:01:42] <Cypher121> *cough* Comcast *cough*
L487[06:01:46] <Kaiyouka> a'yup
L488[06:01:58] <Kaiyouka> I had XFinity/Comcast router+modem units for most of my time here
L489[06:02:01] <Kaiyouka> and they were shit
L490[06:02:13] <Cypher121> seriously, how did you americans manage to fuck up your comm industry so hard?
L491[06:02:51] <Kaiyouka> Because when you allow free enterprise and don't really put effort into anti-monopoly laws, you end up with corporations who run everything and can do whatever the fuck they want
L492[06:03:48] <Kaiyouka> I'm glad for the QoS in the firmware because fuck my housemates.
L493[06:04:02] <Kaiyouka> use up every last ounce of bandwidth
L494[06:04:06] <Cypher121> lol
L495[06:07:22] <Kaiyouka> I actually dread when two of them move out in/after December
L496[06:07:48] <Kaiyouka> Because I'm going to assume the replacements will be even WORSE
L497[06:10:09] <Cypher121> I'm trying to make a liquid drop entity with custom trajectory. Will it be easier to extend EntityFX or Entity directly?
L498[06:10:46] <Kaiyouka> probably EntityFX maybe?
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L502[06:42:57] <Wuppy> ugh I fucking hate skype
L503[06:43:03] <Wuppy> it's not even working anymore
L504[06:43:17] <Wuppy> I dont know the exact update number, but they managed to break everything
L505[06:46:32] <sham1> Thanks microsoft
L506[06:46:49] <Wuppy> I am actually impressed by how much they broke
L507[06:47:00] <Wuppy> they broke logins, setting saving and skype calling
L508[06:47:27] <Wuppy> if only they'd hire me, I'll be able to fix all of those things in 10 seconds, revert to previous build
L509[06:47:28] <Wuppy> :P
L510[06:50:14] <sham1> But you can't because you discover that Skype was not built upon unreal so you don't know how to work with it
L511[06:50:40] <Wuppy> I don't care what it's build with, reverting to an earlier build is easy enough :P
L512[06:50:56] <Wuppy> I know SVN, Perforce and Git so I doubt they use a different revisioning system
L513[06:51:07] <Wuppy> also, I know barebones C++ as well
L514[06:55:06] <sham1> Then realize that because Microsoft it is Ms team foundation
L515[06:57:06] <Wuppy> sham1, I can always just change the download link on the website :P
L516[06:57:21] <Kaiyouka> lol
L517[06:57:22] <sham1> :D
L518[06:57:34] <Cypher121> Wuppy: are you sure MS uses any vcs at all?
L519[06:57:57] <Kaiyouka> I wonder if my old job place swapped to using Team Foundation Server for version control
L520[06:57:59] <Wuppy> any what Cypher121?
L521[06:58:09] <Cypher121> version control system
L522[06:58:11] <Wuppy> ah, version control systems
L523[06:58:23] ⇦ Quits: KGS (~KGS@h-46-59-33-249.na.cust.bahnhof.se) (Ping timeout: 206 seconds)
L524[06:58:24] <Wuppy> Cypher121, if they didn't.... they'd be impressively stupid
L525[06:58:32] <Wuppy> although I would show why skype is so messed up right now
L526[06:58:40] <Cypher121> I think they just threw hdds with source code out of the window when they purchased skype
L527[06:58:52] <Kaiyouka> I genuinely wonder which would win in a battle: MS Team Foundation Server or IBM Rational ClearCase
L528[07:00:13] <Kaiyouka> It's the shit tier grand battle royale :D
L529[07:00:36] <Cazzar> Well, I just saved my ass
L530[07:00:52] <Cazzar> Accidentally overwrote a code file, and I had NO backups.
L531[07:01:07] <Wuppy> Cazzar, y u do dis
L532[07:01:11] <Cazzar> Luckily, I had it cached open, in an obscure way
L533[07:01:23] <Cazzar> "(Get-Module -Name PathTools).Definition"
L534[07:01:24] <Wuppy> y u no vcs
L535[07:01:36] <Cazzar> Wuppy: it was in it's infancy :P
L536[07:02:02] <Kaiyouka> no excuse :p
L537[07:02:17] <Cazzar> I had a backup!
L538[07:02:19] <Cazzar> kinda
L539[07:03:29] <Kaiyouka> lol
L540[07:04:34] <Kaiyouka> though, I guess I should point out that just because you have vcs doesn't mean you're automagically good to go
L541[07:04:43] <Kaiyouka> I almost ragequit my last job because of the vcs
L542[07:04:52] <Wuppy> which did they have?
L543[07:04:58] <Kaiyouka> IBM Rational ClearCase
L544[07:05:05] <Wuppy> never heard of it
L545[07:05:12] <Kaiyouka> Good
L546[07:05:20] <Wuppy> I expected an answer like that :P
L547[07:05:43] <Kaiyouka> The thing about ClearCase is that it's really not an intuitive software
L548[07:06:08] <Kaiyouka> It's okay if you're one person or a few people
L549[07:06:26] <Kaiyouka> but if you have dozens of people working across 20,000 files, ClearCase is shit
L550[07:06:50] <Kaiyouka> Sometimes it insists other people have hijacked a file when it's not the case
L551[07:06:54] <Cazzar> Oh, ClearCase
L552[07:06:57] <Wuppy> git starts giving problems with 20000 files as well
L553[07:06:59] <Cazzar> Never used it, though I know of it.
L554[07:07:08] <Kaiyouka> And trying to resolve conflicts on merge is just no
L555[07:07:13] <Wuppy> perforce is best vcs
L556[07:07:27] <Kaiyouka> Rational has its own DiffMerge tool and I have no goddamn idea how it works
L557[07:07:48] <Kaiyouka> And just trying to poke it resulted in my commits getting literally eaten
L558[07:08:19] <Wuppy> working for nothing, that'd get me pissed off
L559[07:08:22] <Kaiyouka> Fortunately, clearcase is anal about commits and saved some back-ups
L560[07:08:39] <Kaiyouka> but for a brief moment, I about stood up and walked out
L561[07:09:58] <Kaiyouka> All I know is I really don't want to go back to work there any time soon.
L562[07:10:48] <Cazzar> git does the same
L563[07:11:02] <Cazzar> You technically, always can reference a commit by it's SHA1
L564[07:11:09] <Wuppy> perforce is quite anal, but in a great way
L565[07:11:37] <Wuppy> you cant commit without a mesasge, which hapepns often with stupid designers and artists
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L567[07:11:54] <Wuppy> and only 1 person can check out a file at once
L568[07:12:04] <Wuppy> and you cant save/edit without checking out
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L570[07:12:22] <Kaiyouka> That sucks
L571[07:12:26] <Wuppy> it's great
L572[07:12:32] <Kaiyouka> well, depends
L573[07:12:59] <Wuppy> sometimes you'll come across a file which is already open by someone else and you cant really work on it
L574[07:13:04] <Wuppy> but it's better than merge conflicts
L575[07:13:07] <Kaiyouka> When I was working, we ran ClearCase in snapshot mode which let us have local copies of all the files and we can hijack and freely edit.
L576[07:13:18] <Kaiyouka> Which is great sometimes when you just wanna fuck around for bugfix and triage
L577[07:13:39] <Kaiyouka> because you can just unhijack the files if you don't wanna commit to the branch
L578[07:13:55] <Kaiyouka> But when you're actively working and your team lead keeps checking out the goddamn files
L579[07:13:59] <Kaiyouka> ugh
L580[07:14:12] <Wuppy> you only check out the file or 2 you work with
L581[07:14:18] <Wuppy> and you commit it as soon as you're done
L582[07:14:24] <Kaiyouka> Tell that to him
L583[07:14:26] <Kaiyouka> > _ >
L584[07:14:29] <Wuppy> him?
L585[07:14:35] <Kaiyouka> My team lead
L586[07:14:41] <Kaiyouka> who'd check out like half a dozen files at once
L587[07:14:58] <Wuppy> then he's just a dumbass
L588[07:15:02] <sham1> Git > All
L589[07:15:05] <Kaiyouka> He's a smartass dumbass
L590[07:15:22] <Kaiyouka> Must be nice to have job security as a Programmer Analyst
L591[07:15:23] <Wuppy> sham1, no
L592[07:15:59] <sham1> Wuppy, yes
L593[07:16:08] <Wuppy> P4V > Git
L594[07:16:15] <Kaiyouka> Worrisome that it's like impossible to get fired from that company
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L596[07:16:36] <Wuppy> sham1, have you ever tried Perforce?
L597[07:16:52] <sham1> No
L598[07:16:59] <Wuppy> then you cannot make a well informed decision
L599[07:17:06] <sham1> I dun need, I haz git
L600[07:17:18] <Wuppy> also, almost all big game development companies use Perforce \o/
L601[07:18:45] <sham1> And...?
L602[07:18:53] <Wuppy> that makes it important to know
L603[07:19:02] <Kaiyouka> if you're into game dev, anyway
L604[07:19:15] <Wuppy> and if most people use it, there must be some (good) reason behind it
L605[07:19:26] <Wuppy> especially considering git is free and perforce really expensive
L606[07:19:29] <Kaiyouka> That's a fallacy if I ever did see one
L607[07:19:48] <sham1> Argumentum ad populum
L608[07:20:07] <sham1> And argument from authority
L609[07:20:11] <Kaiyouka> lol
L610[07:20:15] <Wuppy> :c
L611[07:20:21] <Wuppy> I'm not good at this sort of stuff :P
L612[07:20:23] <mort_> hi
L613[07:20:27] <Wuppy> howdy mort
L614[07:20:28] <sham1> Hi
L615[07:20:35] <mort_> what's up?
L616[07:20:42] <sham1> I propably will try perforce
L617[07:20:43] <Kaiyouka> The whole "if lots of people do [x], then [x] must be good or significant" thing is hilarious because it's easily debunked with a single response
L618[07:20:59] <Wuppy> sham1, it's very expensive though :<
L619[07:21:00] <sham1> Just to see what it iffers
L620[07:21:05] <sham1> Ah
L621[07:21:22] <mort_> Kaiyouka: couldn't one argue that [x] is significant purely due to the sheer amount of people using it?
L622[07:21:37] <Wuppy> that's my opinion as well
L623[07:21:43] <mort_> I completely agree that it wouldn't necessarily be good (*cough*windows)
L624[07:21:46] <Wuppy> it might not be a fact, but it's significant in some way
L625[07:22:32] <Kaiyouka> I appear to have used the wrong word because it is 6:22 am and I cannot brain
L626[07:22:35] <sham1> Well while COBOL is still significant in banking it does not make it automatically good
L627[07:22:37] <Kaiyouka> OH WELL
L628[07:22:39] <mort_> also, I hae no idea what you were discussing, just threw an opinion out there which may or may not be appliccable in this context
L629[07:22:46] <Kaiyouka> lol
L630[07:22:51] <Wuppy> sham1, it still makes it relevant though
L631[07:23:00] <sham1> True
L632[07:23:05] <Wuppy> mort_, that perforce is better than git
L633[07:23:12] <Kaiyouka> What I was trying to get at
L634[07:23:14] <sham1> Or vice versa
L635[07:23:41] <mort_> never tried or heard of perforce
L636[07:23:55] <sham1> Me neither until now
L637[07:24:13] <Kaiyouka> is that the masses are not a barometer to be trusted because you have to remember that a lot of people do stupid shit each year like hold onto lit firecrackers or stuff jars up their butts.
L638[07:24:17] <Wuppy> makes sense, it's very expensive and stuff
L639[07:24:44] <Wuppy> I agree Kaiyouka, but after trying perforce, it's superior :D
L640[07:24:45] <sham1> Well from what I read up from perforce
L641[07:25:00] <sham1> It is good at storing for instance very large files
L642[07:25:29] <sham1> You can work git in p4 repo
L643[07:25:34] <sham1> So that is nice
L644[07:25:45] <mort_> wait, perforce supports git
L645[07:25:47] <Wuppy> I did not know that, that's very nice
L646[07:25:50] <mort_> which means it isn't a competitor to git
L647[07:26:02] <mort_> which means saying that perforce is better than git is nonsensible
L648[07:26:10] <mort_> did you mean github?
L649[07:26:27] <Wuppy> mort_, giving support for something does not make it not a competitor
L650[07:26:28] <mort_> from what I'm reading, it seems more like a competitor to github than to git
L651[07:26:45] <Wuppy> github is just a server with git on it
L652[07:27:26] <Wuppy> and git and perforce are both vcs
L653[07:28:18] <mort_> but perforce talks a lot about how it is used with git, based on gitlab, has things to do with gitswarm whatever that is, and its helix thing claims to be a complete git ecosystem
L654[07:28:38] <mort_> not about how it's an alternative to git or how it's a version control system
L655[07:28:55] <Cazzar> mort_: git supports subversion.. that doesn't mean they don't compete
L656[07:28:59] <sham1> I think it is a plugin that allows git to do stuff for perforce repo
L657[07:29:05] <Wuppy> exactly what Cazzar said
L658[07:29:08] <sham1> Also, that
L659[07:29:09] <Cazzar> https://git-scm.com/docs/git-svn
L660[07:29:26] <Cazzar> It's provided as a transitioning tool
L661[07:30:12] <mort_> it talks an awful lot about git and nothing about its own VCS though
L662[07:30:30] <Wuppy> it is it's own VCS and it's amazing
L663[07:30:39] <Wuppy> take a look at P4V
L664[07:30:57] <mort_> I'll take your word for it, you know more about it than me
L665[07:31:37] <Cazzar> THEORETICALLY I now should have a SCM backup of my work now
L666[07:31:39] <mort_> just odd that the website mostly focuses on how it does things with git
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L668[07:31:43] <Cazzar> That I have also documented it.
L669[07:32:01] <Cazzar> \o/ https://github.com/Cazzar/PowershellPathTools/blob/master/PathTools.psm1
L670[07:32:25] <Cazzar> powershell is actually rather nice to dev in.
L671[07:34:57] <gigaherz> GeoDoX: nope I wasn't there. just woke up. ;P
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L673[07:35:51] <gigaherz> Cazzar: I don't really agree with the verb-object naming convention XD
L674[07:36:07] <Cazzar> gigaherz: Blame powershell :P
L675[07:36:22] <gigaherz> yeah
L676[07:36:33] <gigaherz> I was replying to [14:32] (Cazzar): powershell is actually rather nice to dev in.
L677[07:36:38] <gigaherz> not commenting on the code
L678[07:36:39] <gigaherz> XD
L679[07:36:50] <gigaherz> the code simply looks powershell-y
L680[07:36:53] <Cazzar> Did I say I was talking about the code itself :P
L681[07:37:08] <Cazzar> I was just saying, blame it for the Verb-Object notation
L682[07:37:16] <gigaherz> I am!
L683[07:37:20] <SkySom> I like it.
L684[07:37:27] <SkySom> Verb-Object works well for me
L685[07:37:37] <gigaherz> I prefer no dashes ;P
L686[07:37:48] <gigaherz> I'd have nothing about GetPath ;P
L687[07:38:01] <gigaherz> against*
L688[07:38:03] <gigaherz> sorry just woke up
L689[07:40:42] <Cazzar> Okay, I really shouldn't attempt this
L690[07:40:58] <Cazzar> Because, I am going to get EVERY reference Vaz added to the achievement names.
L691[07:42:53] <Cazzar> Also, damnit: http://upload.cazzar.net/u/1447854139
L692[07:43:00] <Cazzar> Those, are ALL vocaloid songs.
L693[07:43:29] <Kaiyouka> lol
L694[07:43:51] <Kaiyouka> I'm boycotting that mod if the songs are all sung by Miku
L695[07:44:22] <Cazzar> Some are
L696[07:44:27] <Cazzar> Vaz likes a lot of IA
L697[07:44:35] <Kaiyouka> I like Vaz, then
L698[07:44:45] <Kaiyouka> IA's the shit
L699[07:44:56] <Cazzar> One reason I like IA is because, Lia
L700[07:45:04] <Kaiyouka> yup
L701[07:45:13] <Cazzar> Good, you know Lia
L702[07:45:30] <Cazzar> hmm
L703[07:45:46] <Kaiyouka> speaking of Lia, I'm gonna listen to the Charlotte OP
L704[07:45:59] <Cazzar> I was looking to see if there was an IA cover of Heartily Song
L705[07:46:12] <Cazzar> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jERCbRBwRU&ab_channel=Bonecuss (this_)
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L707[07:46:50] <Kaiyouka> I might have to watch Charlotte at some point
L708[07:46:56] <Kaiyouka> if I ever have THE TIME
L709[07:48:03] <Cazzar> I need to as well
L710[07:48:08] <Cazzar> maybe when I get home tomorrow..
L711[07:48:27] <Cazzar> also, is it bad I know what the redacted word is here? "I can take off my (redacted)"
L712[07:48:37] <Kaiyouka> lolwut
L713[07:49:04] <Cazzar> Just, look up Kagamine Rin I can take off my on youtube and you will see.
L714[07:49:19] <Cazzar> I would advise against doing so at work
L715[07:49:26] <Kaiyouka> Oh, that song
L716[07:49:32] <Cazzar> It's a song, yes, though the name along
L717[07:49:36] <Cazzar> alone*
L718[07:49:47] <Kaiyouka> That was a weird song
L719[07:50:09] <Kaiyouka> (I actually have listened to this song a long time ago)
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L721[07:58:27] <Kaiyouka> oh shoot 7am
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L726[08:08:57] <Cazzar> If I was bored, I could make a massive list of this
L727[08:09:02] <Cazzar> https://gist.github.com/b7b92edfe1cb98f45b06
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L736[08:51:27] <ThePsionic> rofl Cazzar
L737[08:52:12] <Cazzar> Those are the ones I got within 20 seconds of actual kg reading it.
L738[08:52:59] <ThePsionic> achievement.botania:desuGun.desc=ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN ASADA-SAN
L739[08:53:00] <ThePsionic> wat
L740[08:55:01] <Cazzar> Not a clue
L741[08:56:09] <ThePsionic> Anyway
L742[08:56:18] <ThePsionic> I found the most stupid GitHub Issues comment ever
L743[08:56:21] <ThePsionic> https://github.com/MinecraftForge/MinecraftForge/pull/2194#issuecomment-157721522
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L746[09:08:44] <SkySom> I do like how he's willing to just break stuff just to add a name.
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L748[09:09:52] <ThePsionic> ikr
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L750[09:10:58] <SkySom> I mean yeah Forge has broke backwards stuff before. But it was for stuff like fixing Fluids.
L751[09:11:01] <SkySom> Not adding a name...
L752[09:11:27] <gigaherz> wouldn't that PR break every single mod ever created that doesn't have an explicit "pretty name"?
L753[09:11:31] <sham1> Fixing fluids is a good thing
L754[09:11:40] <Unh0ly_Tigg> I wonder if forge for 1.8.8 will bring the change lex mentioned at minecon...
L755[09:12:08] <gigaherz> which change?
L756[09:12:38] <Cazzar> gigaherz はい
L757[09:12:51] <sham1> It bring japanese?
L758[09:13:03] <gigaherz> I can't read asian characters ;P
L759[09:13:09] <Cazzar> That's yes in Japanese.
L760[09:13:39] <Cypher121> so you replied "yes" to "which change?"
L761[09:14:05] <sham1> Which change
L762[09:14:06] <SkySom> Yeah Fixing Fluids was important.
L763[09:14:17] <SkySom> Names for users... Not so much.
L764[09:14:25] <Cazzar> Cypher121 what comment did gigaherz make that fits having a boolean response better?
L765[09:14:32] <SkySom> Would it be a nice thing to add for 1.9, maybe.
L766[09:14:46] <Cazzar> TL;DR common sense.
L767[09:14:52] <SkySom> But that point everything would already need at once a one over to make sure it works.
L768[09:14:53] <sham1> names for users is still nice to have
L769[09:14:56] <sham1> But not forced
L770[09:15:26] <Cypher121> oh, I only noticed 1 message
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L772[09:16:01] <SkySom> I mean I could see it being forced. Just not in a way that is gonna break things.
L773[09:16:28] <gigaherz> I see no point
L774[09:16:38] <gigaherz> like
L775[09:16:55] <Cypher121> the only way I see that will force it, but not break it on users' side is making it a compilation requirement
L776[09:17:01] <gigaherz> suppose I made a mod that adds a few dozen different types of flowers
L777[09:17:04] <gigaherz> and I just call it "flowers"
L778[09:17:17] <gigaherz> there's no need for me to have an explicit display name
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L780[09:17:22] <gigaherz> different than the modid
L781[09:17:28] <Cypher121> isn't that called Botania?
L782[09:17:38] <gigaherz> no, botania adds MAGICAL flowers
L783[09:17:38] <gigaherz> ;p
L784[09:17:46] <gigaherz> anyhow
L785[09:17:49] <gigaherz> it was a random example
L786[09:18:22] <gigaherz> but yeah, something like Botania, Thaumcraft, has 0 need to have both a modid string, and a display name
L787[09:18:39] <gigaherz> and anything that purposefuilly WANTS to be stylized as a single word without spaces
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L789[09:18:49] <sham1> Well that is because their modID is their name
L790[09:18:53] <gigaherz> sure
L791[09:19:23] <sham1> But for something like my mod, I'd rather have the modID be "fcraft" than "FluidCraft" that it should be if I cannot have a separate name for my thing
L792[09:19:35] <gigaherz> no one is removing the name
L793[09:19:39] <sham1> Ah
L794[09:20:01] <gigaherz> normally forge(fml) uses the modid as a name
L795[09:20:05] <gigaherz> if a name isn't provided explicitly
L796[09:20:15] <gigaherz> that PR proposes removing this default
L797[09:20:23] <gigaherz> and making it mandatory to include the name parameter in the @Mod
L798[09:20:35] <sham1> Yeah I know
L799[09:20:57] <gigaherz> so I say that I see no point in requiring it
L800[09:21:00] <gigaherz> and I see many points against
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L802[09:22:21] <ThePsionic> http://i.imgur.com/Dn0K0hY.png Another round of Guess That Texture, if anyone's up fo rit
L803[09:23:50] <gigaherz> a red person wearinga white cape, while free-falling
L804[09:24:03] <Wuppy> I honestly have no clue
L805[09:24:05] <Wuppy> red scissors
L806[09:24:32] <ThePsionic> Wow you're all terrible at this
L807[09:24:39] <Wuppy> OR
L808[09:24:42] <Wuppy> another option
L809[09:24:45] <Unh0ly_Tigg> hint?
L810[09:24:51] <ThePsionic> Unh0ly_Tigg: space
L811[09:24:54] <Wuppy> your texturing skills are not as good as you think it is
L812[09:25:02] <sham1> Space ship
L813[09:25:02] <ThePsionic> I know they aren't, Wuppy
L814[09:25:07] <ThePsionic> Which makes this game even more fun
L815[09:25:12] <ThePsionic> Nope sham1
L816[09:25:15] <Wuppy> portal gun
L817[09:25:20] <ThePsionic> nop
L818[09:25:27] <Unh0ly_Tigg> meteor shower related item?
L819[09:25:28] <sham1> a horn
L820[09:25:31] <ThePsionic> nop and nop
L821[09:25:32] <Wuppy> yo momma
L822[09:25:36] <Wuppy> :P
L823[09:25:37] <ThePsionic> pls
L824[09:25:47] <Unh0ly_Tigg> another hint?
L825[09:25:55] <ThePsionic> Unh0ly_Tigg: nomnomnom
L826[09:25:56] <shadekiller666> a cone?
L827[09:25:58] <ThePsionic> nope
L828[09:26:03] <Unh0ly_Tigg> food packet
L829[09:26:06] <Wuppy> space food
L830[09:26:08] <Wuppy> space bacon
L831[09:26:09] <Wuppy> space pig
L832[09:26:15] <shadekiller666> frosting tube
L833[09:26:16] <ThePsionic> Wuppy: The first one was correct
L834[09:26:22] <ThePsionic> It's a tube of astronaut food
L835[09:26:29] <shadekiller666> ...
L836[09:26:38] <Wuppy> 1. how is that a tubne
L837[09:26:39] <gigaherz> yo ureally need more detail there ;P
L838[09:26:41] <ThePsionic> Hey, I never said I was *good* at texturing
L839[09:26:43] <Wuppy> 2. how should we've guessed
L840[09:26:46] <shadekiller666> you have terrible texturing skills
L841[09:26:50] <ThePsionic> I know
L842[09:26:51] <ThePsionic> Thanks
L843[09:26:58] <ThePsionic> But, in my defenct
L844[09:27:00] <ThePsionic> defence*
L845[09:27:03] <ThePsionic> "Placeholder"
L846[09:27:24] <shadekiller666> mhmm sure it is
L847[09:27:40] <shadekiller666> inb4 that texture is still in use a year from now
L848[09:27:59] <ThePsionic> Knowing myself, yes
L849[09:28:00] <SkySom> inb4 texture is never changed
L850[09:28:41] <Unh0ly_Tigg> well, that's what happened with the inventory textures...
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L856[09:40:37] <AtomicStryker> yo, can any of you name me some java tool with a gui (criteria is it has some buttons to push, maybe some text fields...)
L857[09:40:50] <AtomicStryker> something like jEdit
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L862[09:46:07] <ThePsionic> http://i.imgur.com/iQ0TKQ8.png so good at textur
L863[09:46:29] <sham1> IT'S ALIVE
L864[09:46:36] <ThePsionic> sham1: WHAT IS IT THOUGH
L865[09:46:43] <ThePsionic> i know what it is I just wonder whether you know
L866[09:46:47] <sham1> It is an apple with eyes
L867[09:46:53] <ThePsionic> close but no cigar
L868[09:46:58] <shadekiller666> le crab
L869[09:47:12] <ThePsionic> shadekiller666: if only you and sham1 would have combined efforts
L870[09:47:16] <ThePsionic> it's a crab apple
L871[09:47:29] <shadekiller666> ba dum tish
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L879[10:09:12] <Commodore64> yello
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L882[10:13:31] <Commodore64> I've recently come to the conclusion that before making a mod that changes spawnrules, I should probably do some more java immersion first
L883[10:13:46] <Commodore64> has anyone followed these tutorials?
L884[10:14:11] <Commodore64> http://math.hws.edu/javanotes/contents-with-subsections.html
L885[10:14:40] <Thutmose> does anyone have an example of how to register a fluid block to use the forge fluid renderer?
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L891[10:32:43] <ThePsionic> tfw someone pms you and then immediately leaves
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L893[10:36:05] <Thutmose> so the ModelFluidDebug mod uses this: new ModelResourceLocation(MODID.toLowerCase() + ":" + TestFluidBlock.name, "fluid") for the fluid location, then has a "TestFluidBlock.name".json in blockstates, but that is only thing in resources. I tried doing similar, with just changing the name of the json, and the fluid in the custom tag, but it says this on load: "Model definition for location thutconcrete:asphalt#fluid not found"
L894[10:37:07] <Thutmose> the ModelFluidDebug mod doesn't have anything else in the resources besides the one json in blockstates, and I have the same formatted ModelResourceLocation used for the two places it is used in that mod
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L898[10:48:28] <LexManos> Look at the json, it defines 'fluid' and 'gass' -.-
L899[10:48:40] <LexManos> fairly straight forward if you spend 10 seconds to look
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L903[10:51:10] <Thutmose> yes, and this is the json I used: http://pastebin.com/1mSSFvRu I don't have a gas, but I also tried this incase it needed that state for some reason: http://pastebin.com/WhgxfkwZ
L904[10:51:51] <Thutmose> and the ModelResourceLocation I used is: fluidLocation = new ModelResourceLocation( ThutConcreteReference.MOD_ID + ":asphalt", "fluid");
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L907[11:00:04] <Thutmose> has anyone other than ModelFluidDebug managed to get a fluid rendering with the forge fluid renderer?
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L920[11:53:01] <MattDahEpic> !latest
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L926[12:07:43] <MattDahEpic> !gm func_72375_a
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L933[12:25:29] <MattDahEpic> is the FMLFingerprintViolationEvent called for ALL mods if ANY mod has a missing signature?
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L936[12:25:52] <MattDahEpic> or only the signature-less mod?
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L944[12:38:27] <AbrarSyed> MattDahEpic, signature checking on each mod as it loads
L945[12:38:42] <AbrarSyed> that method is called for all LOADED mods, when the next mod is missing a requested signature.
L946[12:39:11] <AbrarSyed> if my mod loads first, and your mod laods second.. I get a method call becuase yours doesnt have signature. But nobody got a messag ecall if I dont have a signature.
L947[12:39:16] <AbrarSyed> *method call
L948[12:39:34] <MattDahEpic> cool
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L950[12:42:26] <Unh0ly_Tigg> what I want to know is, if you have to include the class annotated with @Mod when you generate signatures, and then that signature value is injected into said class, doesn't that change the classes signature? do you just keep repeating that until the signature doesn't change?
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L955[12:51:09] <AbrarSyed> Unh0ly_Tigg, you store the fingerperint. Your key has a unique fingerprint sued to identify it, when somthing is signed, it can be cryptographically analyzed to find the fingerprint and thus verify the author
L956[12:52:22] <AbrarSyed> the @mod shoudl have the fingerpritn hardcoded. The signing takes hashes of all your classes and signs them with your secret key. FML then checks said signature to see if it has the fingerprint you hardcoded into the @mod.
L957[12:52:51] <diesieben07> its basically.... you encrypt (=sign) something with your private key. the fact that it can then be unlocked with yyour public key PROOVES that is was you who signed it
L958[12:53:12] <AbrarSyed> if either the signing is missing/broken (someone modified the classes), or the fingerprint doesnt match yours (someone else signed?) then itl fail and call the wrongFingerprint method or wtvr
L959[12:55:29] <AbrarSyed> anyways.. the bottom line is that its all circumventable.. and its not all that hard either.. and so its pointless. Unless you wanna verify that someone is using the build YOU distributed (verifyable by your signature) and not some otehr version.
L960[12:56:06] <AbrarSyed> its impossible to force someone to use your signed version unless you have some external program that they are forced to use that can verify your signature.
L961[12:56:08] <Unh0ly_Tigg> what I'm saying is, how does injecting the fingerprint into the annotation in the file not affect the hash value for that class?
L962[12:56:18] <diesieben07> you inject the fingerprint BEFORE hashing
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L964[12:56:24] <AbrarSyed> ^
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L966[12:56:41] <AbrarSyed> every private key has a fingerprint, its not generated by the signing process or anything
L967[12:56:51] <Unh0ly_Tigg> oh, so the finger print has little to do with the hashes... ok
L968[12:57:23] <diesieben07> what i am wondering...
L969[12:57:27] <AbrarSyed> your fingerprint is your identity as a person who can sign stuff. thats all it is. multiple mods can have the same fingerprint if its from the same author.
L970[12:57:44] <AbrarSyed> bu no 2 people should have the same fingerprint
L971[12:57:47] <diesieben07> couldn't you like... sign the hashes of all classes with your private key and put it in the meta inf
L972[12:57:59] <AbrarSyed> lol, thats basically what the jarsigner does..
L973[12:58:12] <diesieben07> how is that easily foolable then? :D
L974[12:58:18] <AbrarSyed> hence the whole thing about deleting the META-INF whenever you modded old MC with new classes
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L976[12:58:33] <diesieben07> like...
L977[12:58:50] <AbrarSyed> once its one someones computer, its completely up to them to remove the signing signatrue and stuff. WHat then?
L978[12:58:51] <diesieben07> yeah it only works if it wont load unless its signed
L979[12:58:58] <AbrarSyed> ^
L980[12:59:14] <AbrarSyed> what if the user just signs it with their own signature after modifying it..
L981[12:59:24] * diesieben07 hates circular problems like tis in security
L982[12:59:37] <AbrarSyed> it comes down to the fact that you need a trusted platform to have any security at all. And MC just doesnt have it...
L983[12:59:41] <diesieben07> yea
L984[12:59:49] <Unh0ly_Tigg> and couldn't a coremod remove the annotation data of a @Mod annotation from a normal mod if it chose to?
L985[13:00:11] <AbrarSyed> unless forge starts going arround signing peoples keys so that nothing can be used with forge unless its been signed by forges key... but then someone can just remove that part of forge, and recompile it themselves...
L986[13:00:30] <AbrarSyed> yeah coremods also kill any and all security...
L987[13:00:50] <AbrarSyed> never at any time can you save your software from what the user might do.
L988[13:00:55] <diesieben07> abrar, that would would require people to use that modified version of forge
L989[13:01:00] <diesieben07> this is not about users, really
L990[13:01:20] <diesieben07> this is about other people injecting malicious stuff into your mod and putting it up for download
L991[13:01:30] <AbrarSyed> there is nothing you can do....
L992[13:01:38] <diesieben07> i know :D
L993[13:02:04] <AbrarSyed> unless your mod just doesnt work without a required server component.. but that wont stop a malicious fake.. so yeah...
L994[13:02:18] <diesieben07> you can't program trust.
L995[13:02:59] <AbrarSyed> well, you can do SOME things... I mean.. we could make a tweaker that starts before anything and forces everytone to be signed and by valid keys etc.. and popup to the user that XYZ mod is unsigned etc
L996[13:03:14] <AbrarSyed> but thats about it.. and its unlikely that oneone would use something so annoying
L997[13:03:43] <diesieben07> signing only makes sense if not everyone can generate thier own certificate
L998[13:04:10] <Unh0ly_Tigg> https://account.mojang.com/documents/minecraft_eula#content that first paragraph "Please think carefully before you make any content available, because it may be made public and might even be used by other people on a way you don't like."
L999[13:04:24] <AbrarSyed> not true. you can have a single trusted root certificate, similar to the way HTTPS signing authorities work
L1000[13:04:48] <diesieben07> SSL works by having ttrusted parties that give out certificates
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L1002[13:04:57] <diesieben07> you can still make your own
L1003[13:05:11] <diesieben07> but then you have NO way to know that that guy who says he's googleis actually googl
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L1005[13:05:28] <AbrarSyed> so I would have to make a mod that only trusts things signed by a trusted authority (me), and it would only be able to run mods whos authors keys I have signed
L1006[13:05:56] <diesieben07> so everyone has to send their mods to you and geet the back signed?
L1007[13:05:58] <diesieben07> sounds fun.
L1008[13:05:59] <diesieben07> -.-
L1009[13:06:05] <Unh0ly_Tigg> but then it's up to the end user to actually use that mod
L1010[13:06:21] <AbrarSyed> nono, they get their KEYS signed by me. so anything they sign with their key is backed by my root key. like HTTPS
L1011[13:06:42] <diesieben07> isnt that what I just said?
L1012[13:06:46] <AbrarSyed> your ssl key is backed by the CA's root key, and is trusted by anything that trusts the CAs key.
L1013[13:07:04] <diesieben07> just that int he "real world" of HTTPS and SSL the certificates are given out by not one but more than one
L1014[13:07:07] <AbrarSyed> they dont send me their mod. I sign and certificate them as an author, and they sign their owns mods and live hapily ever after.
L1015[13:07:46] <Unh0ly_Tigg> one of these days, I chould clean my gradle cache and reconfigure the gradle projects I actually use...
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L1017[13:07:47] <diesieben07> yeah that is how HTTPS works.
L1018[13:07:59] <AbrarSyed> most clients just have a list of trusted CAs..
L1019[13:08:05] <diesieben07> I know.
L1020[13:08:16] <diesieben07> and in the case you described that list would have 1 entry: you.
L1021[13:08:28] <AbrarSyed> yes exactly
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L1023[13:09:12] <diesieben07> as i said, you cannot code trust
L1024[13:09:22] <AbrarSyed> of course this is all pointless becuase the user could 1) not use my mod 2) get a malicious version of said mod that simply doesnt work 3) gets a malicious version of this mod that allows malicious content under the guise of trusted signed content
L1025[13:09:37] <AbrarSyed> which is the root of the problem...
L1026[13:10:12] <Unh0ly_Tigg> and the only way to prevent that from happening is to not make *anything* public...
L1027[13:10:13] <diesieben07> i do not see how 3 is possible.
L1028[13:10:38] <Unh0ly_Tigg> 2 is a more broad version of 3
L1029[13:10:46] <AbrarSyed> if they are editting my mod, it would be trivial to add a second figerprint to check for, which would be the virus authors fingerprint, which would allow 'signed' yet malicious mods
L1030[13:11:10] <diesieben07> except the guy editing is not you and hence cannot sign shit as you.
L1031[13:11:11] <AbrarSyed> where #2 is the equivalent of commentng out the if statement
L1032[13:11:12] <TehNut|Sleep> So in 1.8, doesOreNameExist() isn't a thing. What would be better: Using reflection to write my own version or using getOres(String).isEmpty()?
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L1034[13:11:27] <diesieben07> and unless the authority allows "guy editing" to sign stuff...
L1035[13:11:42] <diesieben07> but then the mod would be marked as "by guy editing" not "by original guy who made the mod"
L1036[13:12:21] <AbrarSyed> its the circular problem again, my 'security mod' wouldnt be able to check itself.
L1037[13:12:56] <diesieben07> assuming the security mod is forge
L1038[13:13:15] <diesieben07> then yes you cannot prevent people from downloading forge from somewhere else
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L1040[13:15:29] <AbrarSyed> well, if the security mod is a tweaker that starts before forge, it can verify forge... just not itself.
L1041[13:16:12] <AbrarSyed> might be able to have forge check for said security tweaker, but what if the whole stack is compromised? a whole compromised modpack?
L1042[13:16:41] <AbrarSyed> hmm.. this is getting more viable.. a whole compromized modpack is a much larger barier to entry for a hacker...
L1043[13:16:46] <diesieben07> you cant fix PEBCAK
L1044[13:16:47] <AbrarSyed> rather than a single compromozied mod..
L1045[13:16:53] <Unh0ly_Tigg> and then down the rabbit hole we go
L1046[13:17:01] <diesieben07> wait why did i put a K there
L1047[13:17:11] <AbrarSyed> so every mod that I verify,. has to in turn verify me for all this to work..
L1048[13:17:13] <diesieben07> well, both works
L1049[13:17:25] <AbrarSyed> and only then will we get some security...
L1050[13:17:30] <Unh0ly_Tigg> Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard, diesieben07
L1051[13:17:32] <AbrarSyed> and just a teeny bit
L1052[13:17:39] <diesieben07> yeah yeah i know
L1053[13:17:56] <AbrarSyed> I feel its unlikely for someone to install a whole modpack from a compromized source...
L1054[13:18:03] <diesieben07> i typed it and then thougth "wait shouldnt it be between chair and computer? why K?"
L1055[13:18:07] <diesieben07> then i realized keyboard.
L1056[13:18:18] <Unh0ly_Tigg> heh, circular security solves circular issues of security...
L1057[13:18:28] <diesieben07> abrar, modpack usually comes trough a launcher. launcher = one compromised download
L1058[13:18:47] <Unh0ly_Tigg> I've never heard of pebcac... only pebcak
L1059[13:18:52] <AbrarSyed> so compromised launcher.. those are a whole nother issue we have no control over
L1060[13:19:19] <Unh0ly_Tigg> force forge/mod to check for mojang launcher.
L1061[13:19:32] <AbrarSyed> I was thinking the idiot trying to download EE3 gets it off uberMinecraftDownloads.com, and tries to load it into their MC instance.. only to have it stoppe dby said security mod.
L1062[13:19:50] <diesieben07> yea
L1063[13:19:57] <diesieben07> which requires them to have tht security mod installed :P
L1064[13:20:09] <AbrarSyed> which could be enforced by the mods they want to install requiring it.
L1065[13:20:11] <diesieben07> which he would logically also get from stupidsite.com
L1066[13:20:17] <AbrarSyed> not always
L1067[13:20:34] <AbrarSyed> they might just wanna add 1 extra mod to their legit FTB pack
L1068[13:20:43] <Unh0ly_Tigg> have it be done via a method similar to chickenbone's deploader.
L1069[13:20:49] <diesieben07> hmm
L1070[13:21:26] <Unh0ly_Tigg> runtime downloading from source, which the location is encrypted.
L1071[13:21:31] <AbrarSyed> launchers like multiMC can be written in C++ and stuff.. nothing we can do about those.. short of SELinux or an antivirus
L1072[13:21:36] <diesieben07> kill it!
L1073[13:22:17] * AbrarSyed has half a mind to actually make such a security mod now..
L1074[13:22:50] <AbrarSyed> along with a seperate utility that can check and verify all the mods you got without running MC at all, and teling you which ones are compromised
L1075[13:23:22] <Unh0ly_Tigg> well, considering that I can technically get around the fml security manager and close mc when I want without fml redirecting the close call...
L1076[13:23:55] <Unh0ly_Tigg> web utility via https.
L1077[13:24:31] <Unh0ly_Tigg> upload the mod files (without executing them), and check them on a server out of the end users control
L1078[13:24:57] <AbrarSyed> sounds a lot like an antirvirus...
L1079[13:25:21] <AbrarSyed> could probably do that with client-side js.. thanks to the keybase GPG js libs
L1080[13:26:01] <Unh0ly_Tigg> but how would you access the files from js, I doubt that the browser would let you access them.
L1081[13:26:40] <Unh0ly_Tigg> also, technically, that could fall prey to a mitm attack, if the attack was done right...
L1082[13:26:51] <AbrarSyed> not with https
L1083[13:27:14] <AbrarSyed> well, we have 2 options.
L1084[13:27:24] <diesieben07> about accessing them, as long as you can get the user to drag&drop their mods folder you are good
L1085[13:27:39] <Unh0ly_Tigg> you'd be a fool to think that https is 100% secure 100% of the time...
L1086[13:27:44] <AbrarSyed> 1) we have a program the user downloads and runs, and it tells them what is compromised. like an anti-mod-virus
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L1088[13:28:16] <AbrarSyed> 2) a website where the user uploads (or gives the browser basically) the mods folder or individual mods to check
L1089[13:28:26] <AbrarSyed> Unh0ly_Tigg, how would you MITM that?
L1090[13:28:30] ⇦ Quits: Jezza (~Jezza@185.44.151.103) (Quit: Leaving)
L1091[13:28:44] <AbrarSyed> short of having a compromised browser?
L1092[13:29:28] <Unh0ly_Tigg> hack in a proxy between the computer and the server. it's not easy, and it's unlikely, but it's not *impossible*
L1093[13:30:07] <AbrarSyed> thats exactly what https was designed to stop
L1094[13:30:20] <AbrarSyed> the hacked proxy wouldnt have the valid SSL certificate, and would fail
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L1096[13:30:44] <Unh0ly_Tigg> unless it could mimic it some how.
L1097[13:31:03] <Unh0ly_Tigg> or proxy the CA servers too
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L1101[13:34:17] <AbrarSyed> I think thats unlikely, expecially since thats exactly the problem SSL and https were designed to mitigate...
L1102[13:35:07] <AbrarSyed> the browser isnt supposed to hit the CA servers, it has a list of the keys and it just validates for signatures.
L1103[13:36:04] <AbrarSyed> a properly configured ssl website shopuld also provide any intermediate keys to ensure the whole certificat echain all the way back to the CA exists and is valid. ANd its the browsers job to verify all of that with its CA root certificate list
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L1105[13:36:24] <AbrarSyed> even the OS has a part in this...
L1106[13:36:55] <AbrarSyed> anywyas.. so you guys think anyone will want to force a circular dependency on some security-tweaker that attempts to ensure security?
L1107[13:37:50] <AbrarSyed> it would definitely slow down start times a bit
L1108[13:38:08] <shadekiller666> a bit?
L1109[13:38:16] <shadekiller666> that sounds like a launch nightmare
L1110[13:39:06] <shadekiller666> security is nice, but i feel like a lot of mod users would be more upset that the game takes an extra minute to launch than they would be happy about the security
L1111[13:39:26] <AbrarSyed> I dont think it would take that long
L1112[13:39:41] <AbrarSyed> may be noticable, but not a whole minute
L1113[13:39:58] <Unh0ly_Tigg> depends on the users hardware
L1114[13:40:01] *** SnowShock35 is now known as zz_SnowShock35
L1115[13:40:14] <AbrarSyed> it would start before forge, verify forge, and then use FMLs way of verification to verify all the other jars.
L1116[13:40:15] <SSBlur_> Eh, I may have to agree with shadekiller here, people tend to dislike longer load times.
L1117[13:40:52] <Unh0ly_Tigg> it would be slow on a pentium, but fast on an i7, and I know a lot of the minecraft community tends towards the pentium end of that scale...
L1118[13:41:08] <SSBlur_> Especially if it impacts smaller packs around as much as larger ones, that could be a very noticeable footprint to users of smaller packs.
L1119[13:41:24] <AbrarSyed> it might be
L1120[13:41:38] <diesieben07> honestly, this does not sound like kinda thing to attack about load times.
L1121[13:41:39] <Unh0ly_Tigg> and getting it to O(n) would be interesting.
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L1123[13:41:48] <AbrarSyed> no idea till we can get a protorype and test
L1124[13:42:02] * diesieben07 points to http://www.minecraftforge.net/forum/index.php/topic,35018.msg184745.html#msg184745
L1125[13:42:33] <shadekiller666> if it can be made to run quick, and be predictable in what it finds valid, and doesn't require much input from the user i think it would be interesting to try
L1126[13:43:03] <shadekiller666> and the number of false invalidities being low
L1127[13:43:35] <AbrarSyed> update checkers are a problem of their own.. especially when the update json or something doesnt exist and it waits for the HTTP timeout of like 10 seconds..
L1128[13:43:35] <SSBlur_> Aye, I guess that is fair.
L1129[13:43:56] <AbrarSyed> there will be no such thing as a false invalidity. validity is very black/white
L1130[13:44:23] <SSBlur_> I don't get why people don't run update checkers in seperate threads, if at all.
L1131[13:44:34] <shadekiller666> and the process of validating your mod would have to be easy, and fast
L1132[13:44:40] <AbrarSyed> the additional problem would be geting mod authors on board to get the circular on the security tweaker.
L1133[13:45:21] <AbrarSyed> thats the biggest problem that I see... nobody wants to force everyone to get ANOTHER extra required mod to play..
L1134[13:45:41] <shadekiller666> this would likely have to be part of forge
L1135[13:45:47] <AbrarSyed> and if they have SEMC (security enhanced minecraft) versions, and non-SEMC versions of their mod.. that defeats the whole purpose
L1136[13:46:06] <shadekiller666> otherwise nothing would run and everyone would get very angry and cause a shit storm...
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L1138[13:46:14] <SSBlur_> Yeah, that does seem like a problem.
L1139[13:46:17] <AbrarSyed> I think its easier to have a mod verify a specific other mod, rather than to verify all of forge...
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L1142[13:47:05] <shadekiller666> making mod users download ANOTHER mod is a death sentence
L1143[13:47:13] <shadekiller666> thats been proven multiple times
L1144[13:47:42] <AbrarSyed> SEMC would be a seperate thing people have to download, thats an unavoidable fact.
L1145[13:47:49] * AbrarSyed has given it a name now.. SEMC...
L1146[13:48:10] ⇨ Joins: Vazkii (~Vazkii@a79-169-163-74.cpe.netcabo.pt)
L1147[13:48:37] <Unh0ly_Tigg> or MCSE: Minecraft Security Essentials... /s
L1148[13:49:23] <gabizou|laptop> and I'm guessing it's out of the question for a tweaker to auto download the security mod
L1149[13:49:29] <AbrarSyed> if SEMC was compromised, that would have to be a game breaker, otherwise there is no seuciryt gained, similar to the FMLs current signature checking which relies on mods checking each other.
L1150[13:49:33] <gabizou|laptop> like thaumcraft does?
L1151[13:49:35] <AbrarSyed> so I was thinking this..
L1152[13:49:44] <AbrarSyed> the security mod would consist of a wteaker, and 2 actual mods, all in 1 jar.
L1153[13:50:14] <AbrarSyed> the tweaker would start and verify fml/forge/ll or whwtaver, and then inject its own mod into the laod process, which would use FMLs signature checking to validate all the other mods subsequently laoded.
L1154[13:50:39] <AbrarSyed> the 3rd mod would load last, and would be the thing all the actual mods should verify to ensure that SEMC/MCSE isnt compomised itself
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L1156[13:51:09] <AbrarSyed> ok maybe not all these 3 in 1 jar.. but in an installer that would make all of them come in a package together....
L1157[13:51:37] <AbrarSyed> that way we get a nice full-circle ring of security.
L1158[13:51:54] <shadekiller666> so all mods would have to explicitly have code to validate?
L1159[13:52:11] <AbrarSyed> yeah, thats like 3 lines by my estimation.. but yeah
L1160[13:52:42] <shadekiller666> hmmm
L1161[13:52:44] <AbrarSyed> if the burden of security is on a single platform, then if that platform is compromised, everything is.
L1162[13:52:59] <AbrarSyed> single point of failiure and all that... it has to be a web of trust, of sorts...
L1163[13:53:21] <shadekiller666> would each mod also have to check validity of all others?
L1164[13:53:30] <AbrarSyed> no it would.
L1165[13:53:42] <AbrarSyed> each mod would check the validity of the 'validity checker mod' which checks all others
L1166[13:54:21] <shadekiller666> what happens on the event that one is found to not be valid?
L1167[13:54:35] <Unh0ly_Tigg> crash report!
L1168[13:54:47] <AbrarSyed> popup, "UNSIGNED UNTRUSTED MOD XXYYZZ!"
L1169[13:54:58] <AbrarSyed> idk, either crash report, or allow them to trust it?
L1170[13:54:59] <SSBlur_> Ugh popups
L1171[13:55:19] <shadekiller666> and what happens if not all mods validate with the validity checker?
L1172[13:55:30] <AbrarSyed> it might just be a screen in the mc loadign thing.. idk.. thats secondary UI stuff that can be determined after we determine whether all this feasable at all
L1173[13:55:57] <SSBlur_> What if a mod modifies the variables in use by the validity checker using reflection or something?
L1174[13:56:07] <SSBlur_> Or ASM
L1175[13:56:16] <shadekiller666> and the whole point of this would be to solve what problem? 3rd party mod distributers?
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L1177[13:56:20] <AbrarSyed> that just weakens the security of the whole system really.. I cant know that another mod checks me.. dont think thats possible.
L1178[13:56:42] <AbrarSyed> SSBlur_, it would cryptographically check the signature and hash of my classes and stuff
L1179[13:56:43] <shadekiller666> well
L1180[13:57:11] <SSBlur_> AbrarSyed, okay, fair enough
L1181[13:57:59] <AbrarSyed> if I can get a PR into forge that checks the validity of MCSE (MC security essentials.. its growing on me).. that would be enough...
L1182[13:58:13] <AbrarSyed> but i find that extemerly unlikely that such a PR would get in
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L1184[13:58:47] *** MorphFK is now known as Morphan1
L1185[13:59:04] <shadekiller666> isn't lex big on security?
L1186[13:59:07] <SSBlur_> How would this deal with mods like Optifine and such
L1187[13:59:14] <SSBlur_> Same as others?
L1188[13:59:29] <shadekiller666> same way we've been dealing with optifine
L1189[13:59:37] <AbrarSyed> well, IIRC optifinie is a tweaker, so it will be verified with the other tweakers (including forge, which is a tweaker)
L1190[13:59:38] <shadekiller666> hardcoding around it...
L1191[13:59:40] <SSBlur_> Good point
L1192[13:59:52] <AbrarSyed> LL is also a tweaker, will be verified same way
L1193[14:00:29] <Unh0ly_Tigg> What about mods that check the security mod that are open source only including the security check in the binary jars (vs the source/deobf jars)
L1194[14:00:50] <AbrarSyed> say that again?
L1195[14:00:56] <Unh0ly_Tigg> as a suggestion
L1196[14:01:22] <AbrarSyed> I dont quite understand what you said
L1197[14:01:54] <Unh0ly_Tigg> like say openblocks, if it checked the security mod, to not include the code that checks the security mod in the github repo.
L1198[14:02:09] <shadekiller666> why would that be a problem?
L1199[14:02:12] <AbrarSyed> uh, why wouldnt it?
L1200[14:02:32] <shadekiller666> ?
L1201[14:02:34] <AbrarSyed> the security mod checking code itself can be anywhere, its not private code by any means...
L1202[14:02:46] <AbrarSyed> its perfectly fine that its in the githbu repo..
L1203[14:03:16] <AbrarSyed> I dont know why someone would go through a bunch of effort to ensure its not in the MC repo, and instead injected aferwards externally.. as that would likely break the signature of the mod itself
L1204[14:03:34] * AbrarSyed imagines integrating keybase into this would be glorious
L1205[14:03:45] <shadekiller666> and having it on github would make it easier to get adopted by mods
L1206[14:03:53] <shadekiller666> keybase?
L1207[14:04:02] <AbrarSyed> https://keybase.io/
L1208[14:04:08] <SSBlur_> I am officially confused by this mod.
L1209[14:04:14] <SSBlur_> It is a security mod
L1210[14:04:33] <AbrarSyed> gimme a moment, il write up a gist to explain it all
L1211[14:05:10] <shadekiller666> O.O
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L1213[14:05:25] <shadekiller666> you can type in anyone's name and get their usernames for anything?
L1214[14:08:46] <AbrarSyed> well, say you want to send me somethign encrypted.
L1215[14:08:56] <shadekiller666> ok
L1216[14:09:07] <AbrarSyed> you can encrypt it with my public PGP (pretty good privacy) key. The only problem is.. you dont know what that key is.
L1217[14:09:35] <AbrarSyed> you can google arround, ask people, you might get a key, but you have no idea if that key actually belongs to me. I tmight be the key of the FBI or some alicious man in the middle.
L1218[14:09:43] <Ivorius> It's it fuckaduck?
L1219[14:09:48] <Ivorius> I bet your key is fuckaduck
L1220[14:10:14] <AbrarSyed> Keybase is a website that has peoples public PGP keys. It attaches it to their Socieal Media accounts and verifies that the owner of the key is also the owner of said Socieal Media accounts.
L1221[14:10:22] <shadekiller666> keybase is intended to tie an encryption (PGP) key to a person?
L1222[14:10:56] <AbrarSyed> PGP keys come in pairs, a public and a private key. If you encrypt something with the public key, it can only be decrypted by the coresponding private key.
L1223[14:11:19] <shadekiller666> thats interesting
L1224[14:11:30] <AbrarSyed> if you sign something with the private key, it can be verified with the public key.
L1225[14:11:42] <AbrarSyed> all of this, to ensure you are talking only to the person you wanted to.
L1226[14:12:12] <AbrarSyed> this kind of asymmetric encryption with keypairs is the foundation of all modern crypto, and is used everywhere from ssh keys, to SSL keys, etc
L1227[14:12:38] * AbrarSyed can get into the math proofs of how it works.. but wont right now.
L1228[14:12:46] <AbrarSyed> basically.. the public key == your fingerprint.
L1229[14:12:52] <shadekiller666> ahh
L1230[14:13:02] <AbrarSyed> and I can verify that its YOUR fingerprint by checkign keyabse and seeing that its tied to your github account
L1231[14:13:05] <shadekiller666> private key == your id card?
L1232[14:13:11] <AbrarSyed> your fingerprint as opposed to someone elses
L1233[14:13:39] <shadekiller666> k
L1234[14:13:50] <AbrarSyed> yeah sorta, the private key is somethign no one else should ever see or use. the public key should be open to everyone.
L1235[14:14:09] <shadekiller666> its the joint connecting your finger to your hand :P
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L1237[14:15:06] <shadekiller666> does everyone have a PGP key?
L1238[14:15:20] <AbrarSyed> but yeah.. so you can sign something with your private key, and someone else can verify that its your signature by checking it with the public key
L1239[14:15:20] <glasspelican> you need to make on
L1240[14:15:22] <glasspelican> one
L1241[14:15:23] <AbrarSyed> ^
L1242[14:15:30] <shadekiller666> ok
L1243[14:15:49] <AbrarSyed> you generate your own keys.. people can have multipel keys.. but remember that its your identity on the internet or something like that
L1244[14:15:54] <gabizou|laptop> I need to renew my key in the next couple of weeks.
L1245[14:16:04] <gabizou|laptop> shadekiller666, you can even sign git commits
L1246[14:16:10] <glasspelican> i lost my private key :p
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L1248[14:16:53] <gigaherz> the weakest thing when using public key cryptography, is ensuring that the other users actually haveyour key, and not the man in the middle's key
L1249[14:17:07] <AbrarSyed> yeah I have 3 public keys out circulating.. and only 1 which I still have the private key for.. the other two got lost in windows reinstalls...
L1250[14:17:30] <gigaherz> hence why the certification system is trust-based, with a certification authority that can be trusted signing your keys
L1251[14:17:52] <AbrarSyed> yeah.. which is where the idea of Certificate Authorities used in SSL/tls/https come in
L1252[14:17:59] <illyohs> shit I just realized I forgot to move my keys with my reinstall
L1253[14:18:07] <gabizou|laptop> any repo's you guys suggest storing public keys?
L1254[14:18:14] <gabizou|laptop> tsk tsk tsk illyohs
L1255[14:18:15] <AbrarSyed> mit pgp db?
L1256[14:18:22] <AbrarSyed> https://pgp.mit.edu/
L1257[14:18:38] <AbrarSyed> also keybase, I has invites if people want
L1258[14:18:45] <gigaherz> there's many keychain/keyring services
L1259[14:19:25] <AbrarSyed> online ones? I havent seen many other than keybase and the mit db
L1260[14:19:43] <AbrarSyed> maybe these?? the mit one is one of those keyservers.. https://sks-keyservers.net/
L1261[14:21:58] <gigaherz> apple has iCloud Keychain, although dunno who would trust that ;p
L1262[14:22:14] <gigaherz> no wait
L1263[14:22:16] <AbrarSyed> generally those keychains are to manage how many people's public keys you have/trust
L1264[14:22:20] <gigaherz> that's for passwords, not specifically crypto keys
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L1266[14:22:37] <AbrarSyed> they are also generally for 'secrets' which include private keys, passwords, etc
L1267[14:23:12] <gigaherz> I recall having used a few over the years
L1268[14:23:15] <gigaherz> amybe they all closed
L1269[14:23:33] <gigaherz> PGP/GPG appeared in the 90s/early 2000s
L1270[14:23:39] <gigaherz> and then was forgotten until recently
L1271[14:25:19] ⇨ Joins: psxlover (~psxlover@78-182-193.adsl.cyta.gr)
L1272[14:27:24] <MattDahEpic> i still havent gotten my keybase invite...
L1273[14:28:02] ⇦ Quits: psxlover (~psxlover@78-182-193.adsl.cyta.gr) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
L1274[14:28:33] <MattDahEpic> whats the best way to get a list of player names for use in tab completion?
L1275[14:28:41] ⇨ Joins: Noppes (~Noppes@82-168-99-26.ip.telfort.nl)
L1276[14:29:37] <TehNut> Look at a command that does it
L1277[14:29:44] ⇦ Quits: McJty (~jorrit@d8D872E30.access.telenet.be) (Quit: Leaving)
L1278[14:30:44] <TehNut> From CommandTeleport http://tehnut.info/share/Prl1Ip5AMV.png
L1279[14:30:57] <AbrarSyed> MattDahEpic, whats toyr email, I can send you one
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L1281[14:33:05] <Unh0ly_Tigg> abrar, how many invites you got?
L1282[14:33:54] <gabizou|laptop> AbrarSyed oh, I'll take an invite
L1283[14:34:05] * AbrarSyed has 3 remaining
L1284[14:34:23] <AbrarSyed> Matthew, you got any invites to keyabse lying arround?
L1285[14:34:32] ⇨ Joins: Drullkus (~Drullkus@205.155.154.125)
L1286[14:34:45] * Matthew has 10
L1287[14:34:54] <AbrarSyed> give some to thse guys here :)
L1288[14:35:13] <Matthew> PM me emails
L1289[14:35:23] <AbrarSyed> Unh0ly_Tigg, gabizou|laptop ^
L1290[14:35:30] <gabizou|laptop> yep yep
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L1292[14:36:21] *** Vigaro|AFK is now known as Vigaro
L1293[14:36:24] <Drullkus> ?
L1294[14:36:27] <Drullkus> 10 what
L1295[14:36:38] <illyohs> AbrarSyed: Ill take one as well
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L1297[14:37:09] ⇨ Joins: Noppes (~Noppes@82-168-99-26.ip.telfort.nl)
L1298[14:37:21] <AbrarSyed> poke matthew or RX14
L1299[14:37:29] <TehNut> Drullkus: Invites to Keybase
L1300[14:37:33] <Drullkus> Keybase?
L1301[14:37:40] <AbrarSyed> https://keybase.io/
L1302[14:37:44] <Unh0ly_Tigg> can keybase usernames contain underscores?
L1303[14:37:46] <Drullkus> I googled it
L1304[14:37:54] <AbrarSyed> yeah think so
L1305[14:38:00] <TehNut> PGP key repo thing
L1306[14:38:25] <AbrarSyed> so anyone have the signature of that fingerprint checking method?
L1307[14:38:30] <Drullkus> hmmm
L1308[14:38:31] <minecreatr> who has a keybase invite?
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L1310[14:38:34] <minecreatr> I really want one of those
L1311[14:38:35] <Drullkus> idk if I want this
L1312[14:38:36] <gabizou|laptop> now I wonder
L1313[14:38:53] <gabizou|laptop> would I be naive enough to store my private key on their servers
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L1315[14:39:20] <ThePsionic> https://github.com/docker/dockercraft this is actually pretty neat
L1316[14:39:30] <Deamon> If you enjoy lessons in the issues around single points of failure gabizou
L1317[14:39:36] <Unh0ly_Tigg> and I am now generating a pgp key...
L1318[14:39:48] <gabizou|laptop> Deamon oh do tell
L1319[14:40:09] <Matthew> yeah fuck no. I don't keep my private key on their servers
L1320[14:40:21] <AbrarSyed> ^
L1321[14:40:26] <gabizou|laptop> Matthew that's what I thought
L1322[14:40:36] <AbrarSyed> well.. the private key is encrypted by your passphrase.. but hell no will I let them keep it..
L1323[14:40:47] <Matthew> generate locally, and push your pub key up
L1324[14:41:14] <Ivorius> Generate manually doing the formula by hand
L1325[14:41:16] <Ivorius> Trust no one
L1326[14:41:28] <AbrarSyed> I actually exclusively use their CLI tool, not the website.. that being said, they DO have all the PGP stuff done in clientside JS.. which is pretty cool (and secure)
L1327[14:42:58] <Deamon> generate on flash paper, keep one copy, never photograph it, ignite if area compromised ;)
L1328[14:44:35] <AbrarSyed> lol, see the latest keybase blog post about paper keys
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L1331[14:47:45] <shadekiller666> is it just me or is Fallout 4 a lot better than Fallout 3?
L1332[14:48:01] <shadekiller666> maybe its the fact i'm on pc this time and not PS3
L1333[14:48:06] <Matthew> never played any of the fallouts :P
L1334[14:48:57] <gabizou|laptop> shadekiller666 because it's pc
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L1341[14:54:13] <Unh0ly_Tigg> I'm wondering if I should reinstall arch on my old laptop again, or just switch to ubuntu for the time being...
L1342[14:54:42] <diesieben07> oh god no please dont use ubuntu
L1343[14:54:52] <gabizou|laptop> ubuntu is love
L1344[14:54:55] <gabizou|laptop> ubuntu is life
L1345[14:54:56] <Unh0ly_Tigg> I really don't want to have to deal with recompiling the b43 drivers again just to have wifi...
L1346[14:55:06] <diesieben07> unitiy is retarded beyond believe
L1347[14:55:18] <illyohs> ArchLinux <3
L1348[14:55:33] <TehNut> Then don't use Unity >.>
L1349[14:55:40] <diesieben07> well yeah
L1350[14:55:43] <TehNut> I have Cinnamon on my Ubuntu install
L1351[14:55:45] <diesieben07> still it pisses me off :P
L1352[14:55:59] <diesieben07> thats pretty much just mint then. :D
L1353[14:56:00] * heldplayer sees ubuntu
L1354[14:56:00] <TehNut> But yeah
L1355[14:56:02] * heldplayer laughs
L1356[14:56:04] <Drullkus> lol
L1357[14:56:23] * diesieben07 highfives heldplayer
L1358[14:56:26] * heldplayer goes back to his Debian laptop to try and figure out why suspend is hanging
L1359[14:56:36] <diesieben07> plot twist, /me uses windos 10
L1360[14:56:51] <Unh0ly_Tigg> if I go with ubuntu, should I go with 14.04.3 LTS, or 15.10?
L1361[14:56:54] <heldplayer> My laptop dual boots to Debian and Win10
L1362[14:57:05] <AbrarSyed> use Kubuntu, Ubuntu with a decent DE
L1363[14:57:18] <diesieben07> i tried linux, it doesnt like my graphics card
L1364[14:57:21] <AbrarSyed> and always latest man, always latest
L1365[14:57:48] <TehNut> It didn't like mine either. Games I ran on Windows at >300fps got <60
L1366[14:58:05] <TehNut> Except Minecraft. Because Java on Linux is <3
L1367[14:58:20] <diesieben07> well, if it was only that i could live with it
L1368[14:58:26] <heldplayer> OpenJDK JRE or Oracle JRE?
L1369[14:58:34] <diesieben07> but i got screen tearing like a motherfucker always and everywhere
L1370[14:58:50] * AbrarSyed gets >60 fps on shadow of mordor.... and runs arch linux...
L1371[14:59:45] * illyohs has hardly any issues running skyrim
L1372[15:00:02] <TehNut> At that time, Oracle JRE because Java 8
L1373[15:00:17] <TehNut> Can't find any OpenJDK Java 8 thing-a-ma-jigs
L1374[15:00:54] <heldplayer> OpenJDK 8 isn't in (a lot of) stable Linux distros
L1375[15:01:04] <AbrarSyed> because 'stable' == old
L1376[15:01:08] <AbrarSyed> most of the time
L1377[15:02:07] <heldplayer> Technically I could switch to Stretch, as my laptop isn't exactly something like a server that needs stability
L1378[15:03:08] <Matthew> bah keybase needs bash-completion support
L1379[15:05:05] <AbrarSyed> yes it does...
L1380[15:05:11] <AbrarSyed> zsh?
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L1382[15:10:55] <Matthew> AbrarSyed, bash
L1383[15:12:07] <LexManos> <AbrarSyed> if I can get a PR into forge that checks the validity of MCSE (MC security essentials.. its growing on me).. that would be enough...
L1384[15:12:17] <LexManos> If you sent that in i'd strip you of all access to forge anything...
L1385[15:12:34] <Matthew> lol
L1386[15:12:40] <LexManos> I like my worms still in their cans plzkthx
L1387[15:12:52] *** Cojosan is now known as Cojo
L1388[15:17:57] <LexManos> btw whoever made the seafiles file, put it in social not Forgecraft
L1389[15:18:15] <LexManos> Whops wrong channel *you saw nothing*
L1390[15:18:44] *** K-4U|Off is now known as K-4U
L1391[15:19:17] <TehNut> WE SAW EVERYTHING
L1392[15:19:25] <fry> http://cdn.iwastesomuchtime.com/522014150250.jpg
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L1396[15:21:16] <tterrag|ZZZzzz> I have openjdk8
L1397[15:21:18] <tterrag|ZZZzzz> .-.
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L1399[15:21:27] <[NK]Ghost> waddup
L1400[15:23:24] <Thutmose> so Lex or cpw, any more issues with the VillagerRegistry PR? and to cpw, is how it responds to server/client conflicts ok?
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L1412[15:49:44] <HassanS6000> !gm func_147497_a
L1413[15:51:29] *** MineBot sets mode: -b AEnterpriseAFK!*@*
L1414[15:56:12] <ThePsionic> In the constructor of PotionEffect, is duration in ticks or in seconds?
L1415[15:58:35] *** tterrag is now known as tterrag|away
L1416[15:58:44] <gigaherz> I believe ticks
L1417[15:58:45] <gigaherz> checking
L1418[15:59:06] <diesieben07> ticks is correct
L1419[15:59:51] <gigaherz> ok because I was unsure and my code didn't clarify
L1420[15:59:52] <gigaherz> XD
L1421[15:59:59] <ThePsionic> hmm
L1422[16:00:11] <ThePsionic> And it's 20 ticks in a second right (it's been a while
L1423[16:00:29] <gigaherz> yes
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L1425[16:00:49] <gigaherz> (although it can be changed, but then ALL the game runs faster/slower, so it's still 20 ticks per ingame second)
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L1430[16:09:49] <ThePsionic> Also another thing I am wondering about PotionEffect
L1431[16:09:56] <ThePsionic> What does it mean when it is "ambient"
L1432[16:10:46] <diesieben07> the particles are a bit see through, used by beacons
L1433[16:10:58] <ThePsionic> Ah
L1434[16:11:00] <tterrag|away> why was AEnterprise banned? o.o
L1435[16:14:23] *** Tombenpotter is now known as Tombensleep
L1436[16:14:54] <tterrag|away> oh, I found it...
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L1445[16:26:40] <shadekiller666> I hate Origin...
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L1447[16:29:09] <shadekiller666> can't even redeem a product code cuz EA hasn't figured out how to keep their servers running...
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L1452[16:35:42] <AbrarSyed> gigaherz, gabizou|laptop, MattDahEpic I need yal; keyabse links to track
L1453[16:36:02] <gigaherz> hm?
L1454[16:36:11] <MattDahEpic> its the permise of keybase
L1455[16:36:21] <gigaherz> no idea what keybase is ;p
L1456[16:36:26] <MattDahEpic> you say im who i am and a web of trust is made
L1457[16:36:29] <gabizou|laptop> eh?
L1458[16:36:41] <AbrarSyed> who was the third person.. hmm
L1459[16:37:05] <AbrarSyed> ah, Unh0lyTigg
L1460[16:37:15] <gigaherz> I spoke about crypto, but I haven't used any service in ages ;P
L1461[16:37:15] <Unh0lyTigg> o/
L1462[16:37:50] <gabizou|laptop> Unh0lyTigg was just registered
L1463[16:37:54] <Unh0lyTigg> abrar, I'm tracking you, I should be in the list.
L1464[16:37:57] <gabizou|laptop> AbrarSyed what do you need me to provide?
L1465[16:38:04] <gabizou|laptop> keybase.io/gabizou is moi
L1466[16:38:20] <AbrarSyed> yeah I jyst need the names
L1467[16:38:31] <Unh0lyTigg> "unh0ly_tigg" is me
L1468[16:38:35] <gabizou|laptop> gabizou is me
L1469[16:38:48] <Unh0lyTigg> I see you tracking me, gabizou.
L1470[16:39:02] <gabizou|laptop> aye
L1471[16:39:16] <gabizou|laptop> hmm, lukegb probably would love this site
L1472[16:39:23] <MattDahEpic> https://keybase.io/MattDahEpic is me
L1473[16:40:00] <gabizou|laptop> you have no key
L1474[16:40:06] <gabizou|laptop> tsk tsk
L1475[16:40:19] <MattDahEpic> its working on it
L1476[16:40:21] ⇦ Quits: Davnit (~Davnit@71-47-89-196.res.bhn.net) (Quit: Leaving)
L1477[16:40:41] <AbrarSyed> yal know me.. AbrarSyed everywhere
L1478[16:41:01] <AbrarSyed> uhoh
L1479[16:41:03] <AbrarSyed> [abrarsyed ~] $ keybase track MattDahEpic
L1480[16:41:03] <AbrarSyed> error: bad UID: c0e9aac834da8381228ea2f9a9aa6719 != eaba7aa9470c4e40679a585bc6535519 for username MattDahEpic
L1481[16:41:21] <AbrarSyed> yeah why you haz no key? I cant track you
L1482[16:41:29] <MattDahEpic> let me re input it
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L1484[16:44:24] <illyohs> oh ya i need to set up a key
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L1489[16:51:56] <MattDahEpic> we should be good AbrarSyed
L1490[16:52:37] <Unh0ly_Tigg> great. just great... I switched to a powerline networking adapter so that I'm not using my wifi adapter (which is currently having driver issues with win10) and not having an ethernet cable running around the house... and now I'm having issues with my ethernet connection...
L1491[16:56:08] <fry> powerline is about as stable as wifi is :P
L1492[16:57:01] <gabizou> Unh0ly_Tigg powerline is only as stable as your cabling in the house is
L1493[16:57:09] <gabizou> but yeah, it's not really stable to say the least.
L1494[16:57:59] <diesieben07> the thing about wifi is and why everyone thinks it sucks is because every single fucking manufacturer of consumer grade routers and receivers seems to think its a good idea to not put ANTENNAS on their stupid WIRELESS devices
L1495[16:58:18] <diesieben07> if you buy a proper (yes, expensive-ish) router and receiver, wifi works very well. :D
L1496[16:58:29] <MattDahEpic> but then theres walls
L1497[16:58:37] * diesieben07 uses wifi fine through 3 walls
L1498[16:58:58] ⇦ Quits: Hgreb (~Hgrebnedn@d8D872D48.access.telenet.be) (Ping timeout: 192 seconds)
L1499[16:59:04] <Unh0ly_Tigg> I have a netgear nighthawk router, a tp-link powerline network adapter kit, and the house is less then 10 years old...
L1500[16:59:05] <fry> walls can be made of various materials :P
L1501[16:59:06] <diesieben07> also... how the fuck does mobile network manage like 7-8 mbit with a tower 1 mile away when inside a building
L1502[16:59:07] <MattDahEpic> 3 walls try 3 floors
L1503[16:59:21] <diesieben07> and then wifi breaks down when you are 20m away from the fukin source
L1504[16:59:26] <fry> also, there's an issue of frequency saturation
L1505[16:59:27] <diesieben07> /rant
L1506[16:59:36] ⇦ Quits: ThePsionic (~ThePsioni@82-136-247-89.ip.telfort.nl) (Quit: Leaving)
L1507[16:59:51] <fry> if you have 15 rounters in the 20m proximity, wifi won't work well :P
L1508[16:59:52] * Thutmose has a wall that he can put his wifi router on one side of, and get a 50db drop in signal on the other side
L1509[17:00:13] <diesieben07> inaccurate fry is inaccurate
L1510[17:00:13] <Unh0ly_Tigg> My router is so good, I can go .1 miles away (which is relatively pretty far) before the signal drops off...
L1511[17:00:16] <MattDahEpic> 50 whole databases!
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L1513[17:01:04] <fry> diesieben07: what's inaccurate? :P
L1514[17:01:24] <diesieben07> if you have enough frequency space you can have as many routers as you wish.
L1515[17:01:37] <diesieben07> if they are all sending on the same channel, thats when you have problem.
L1516[17:01:56] <mikebald> it's not just the same channel, there's overlap.
L1517[17:02:15] <fry> you only have ~3 non-overlapping channels
L1518[17:02:27] <diesieben07> really? I was not aware of that.
L1519[17:02:29] * diesieben07 shuts up
L1520[17:02:53] <fry> 11 in some parts of the world, 13 in others, but they're 6 wide or smth like that :P
L1521[17:03:10] <mikebald> If you have an android phone handy, opening up Wifi Analyzer you can see some nice graphs of your channels and how they're used.
L1522[17:03:19] <diesieben07> yeah i know
L1523[17:03:21] <diesieben07> i ahve done that
L1524[17:03:28] <diesieben07> that is some awful design right there if they overlap
L1525[17:03:32] * diesieben07 ignores physics
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L1527[17:03:48] * fry stops typing "it's physics!" mid-sentence :P
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L1529[17:04:18] <Matthew> fry, 5ghz has way more than 3 non-overlapping channels :P
L1530[17:04:21] <shadekiller666> all of the fisics
L1531[17:04:39] <diesieben07> i dont care, make it happen!
L1532[17:04:41] <diesieben07> i hate wires.
L1533[17:04:42] <fry> I'm ignoring 5hz, since I know very little about it :P
L1534[17:04:54] <Matthew> heh <3 5ghz
L1535[17:04:54] * fry loves and hates wires at the same time
L1536[17:05:04] <diesieben07> i want everything wireless.
L1537[17:05:08] <fry> at one hand, they're annoying and get everywhere
L1538[17:05:14] <fry> on the other - they work :P
L1539[17:05:14] <diesieben07> i hate the wires on my headphones, i hate the wire on my keyboard.
L1540[17:05:28] <MattDahEpic> wireless power
L1541[17:05:33] <diesieben07> yes!
L1542[17:05:37] <diesieben07> make it happen!
L1543[17:05:46] * diesieben07 puts computer in microwave
L1544[17:05:50] <fry> electrodynamics is a cruel mistress :P
L1545[17:06:02] * Matthew has a "wireless charger" for his phone
L1546[17:06:07] <Matthew> doen't that count :P
L1547[17:06:08] <mikebald> Qi ftw =)
L1548[17:06:11] <MattDahEpic> and here we have my tels coil room
L1549[17:06:14] <Unh0ly_Tigg> nexus 5 ftw
L1550[17:06:16] <MattDahEpic> tesla*
L1551[17:06:17] <Drullkus> The other name for my wireless charger for my phone is a microwave
L1552[17:06:21] <Drullkus> It works great
L1553[17:06:42] <Drullkus> It charges vary quickly in the microwave
L1554[17:06:51] <diesieben07> it also doesn't work afterwards
L1555[17:06:54] <diesieben07> but that doesn't count.
L1556[17:06:57] <diesieben07> its charged!
L1557[17:07:12] <AbrarSyed> MattDahEpic, your dns proof failed
L1558[17:07:16] <AbrarSyed> lemme know when its working
L1559[17:07:40] <MattDahEpic> im in the process of doing that one right now...
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L1562[17:08:54] * fry mumbles something about nothing beating personal exchanges of pgp keys
L1563[17:09:19] <Unh0ly_Tigg> alright, I need to get some sleep, hopefully get my sleep schedule back on track. see you all later.
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L1565[17:12:04] <Drullkus> !gf ItemStack 1.7.10
L1566[17:12:15] <Drullkus> !gm ItemStack 1.7.10
L1567[17:12:22] <MattDahEpic> gc?
L1568[17:12:27] <Drullkus> ?
L1569[17:12:30] <Drullkus> OH
L1570[17:12:32] <Drullkus> Constructor
L1571[17:12:32] <Drullkus> ok
L1572[17:12:36] <Drullkus> !gc ItemStack 1.7.10
L1573[17:12:44] <Drullkus> ...
L1574[17:12:48] <Drullkus> That's all
L1575[17:12:50] <Drullkus> Thanks obama
L1576[17:13:27] <Matthew> Drullkus, pls
L1577[17:13:31] <Matthew> gc = get class
L1578[17:13:36] <Drullkus> ...
L1579[17:13:37] <Drullkus> wow
L1580[17:13:44] <Drullkus> I am a scrub at MCPBot_Reborn
L1581[17:14:04] <Drullkus> itemStack(Block block, int amount, int metaData)?
L1582[17:14:10] <Drullkus> ItemStack*
L1583[17:14:23] <Drullkus> Matthew: ^
L1584[17:14:42] <minecreatr> Drullkus, you should go on the #mcpbot channel so you dont spam #minecraftforge
L1585[17:14:47] <Matthew> what about it
L1586[17:14:54] <Drullkus> Is that the correct syntax?
L1587[17:15:16] <Matthew> for what
L1588[17:15:23] <Drullkus> Getting a new itemstack
L1589[17:15:28] <Matthew> !gm ItemStack.<init>
L1590[17:15:32] <Matthew> hmm
L1591[17:15:43] <Matthew> how do you get constructors..
L1592[17:15:45] <Matthew> bspkrs, ?
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L1594[17:16:33] <diesieben07> !gm ItemStack
L1595[17:16:37] <diesieben07> like that ^
L1596[17:17:47] * Matthew grumbles
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L1601[17:29:25] <Kaiyouka> ffs
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L1605[17:33:21] <xaero> fry, true, but sneakernet if it evolves to snailmail might not be worth the hassle
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L1607[17:36:12] <fry> but you see, you only need to exchange the keys that way :P
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L1610[17:43:00] <xaero> hmm yes, if you're the kind of person who generates 4096 bit keys, you want the utmost in security
L1611[17:43:05] <xaero> so yes, I see your point :P
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L1614[17:55:40] <AtomicStryker> hey, any of you know anything about a bug with cauldron for 1.7.10 and the clients player list (displayed with tab)
L1615[17:56:04] <AtomicStryker> apparently something like 144 entries are shown no matter how many players are on a server
L1616[17:59:14] <Matthew> 0_o didn't cauldron die a long time ago?
L1617[18:00:00] <gabizou> AtomicStryker cauldron hasn't been updated for over a year
L1618[18:00:28] <AtomicStryker> does that matter? didnt you hear about those windows 3.1 machines running the critical fog systems at the french airport
L1619[18:00:37] <AtomicStryker> one year without updates is nothing
L1620[18:00:38] <TehNut> KCauldron gets updated
L1621[18:00:38] <AtomicStryker> wimps
L1622[18:00:46] <TehNut> Which is what most servers are using
L1623[18:00:50] <gabizou> AtomicStryker it kinda does, because no one supports Cauldron bugs, especially here.
L1624[18:01:08] <AtomicStryker> i do, so you are wrong on both accounts
L1625[18:01:10] <AtomicStryker> :D
L1626[18:01:25] <gabizou> if you say so
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L1628[18:01:48] <AtomicStryker> are you saying i dont exist
L1629[18:01:52] <gabizou> no
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L1631[18:02:09] <gabizou> I'm saying that cauldron hasn't been updated in over a year
L1632[18:02:41] <AtomicStryker> technically the bug is on the (purely forge) client so
L1633[18:03:56] <TehNut> Not if it's the server sending that to the client
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L1636[18:19:57] <AtomicStryker> is there a generic hook/event for packets
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L1638[18:23:32] <GeoDoX> o/
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L1640[18:27:54] <GeoDoX> shadekiller666, you still around?
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L1642[18:29:54] <AtomicStryker> is there any trick to asm transforming a constructor
L1643[18:30:06] <AtomicStryker> it is in the methods of a classnode, right?
L1644[18:33:07] <Matthew> AtomicStryker, yeah its just a method called <init>
L1645[18:33:27] <AtomicStryker> and the desc is Lclass; i assume
L1646[18:34:46] <Matthew> well the desc would be the params, just like any other method
L1647[18:35:15] <Matthew> and of course V for the return
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L1649[18:35:31] <gudenau> Hello!
L1650[18:36:38] <gudenau> I am doing stuff in a TickEvent.ClientTickEvent handler, and enabling blending makes the world freak out; how should I stop this, minus removing the blend stuff.
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L1654[18:43:13] <bspkrs> push glstate before, pop after
L1655[18:43:21] <gudenau> Did not work,.
L1656[18:43:48] <gudenau> As far as i can tell.
L1657[18:44:13] <gudenau> GL11.glPushState? Does not exits.
L1658[18:44:16] <gudenau> exist*
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L1662[18:52:49] <tterrag|away> He means matrix
L1663[18:52:59] <tterrag|away> glPushMatrix
L1664[18:53:10] <killjoy> gah, youtube updated subscriptions
L1665[18:53:15] <gudenau> That did not work. :-(
L1666[18:53:20] <tterrag|away> But the matrix does not affect flags
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L1668[18:53:28] <tterrag|away> Just unset the flags you change
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L1670[18:53:44] <tterrag|away> If you enable blending, disable it when you are done
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L1672[18:55:25] <gudenau> Not changing anything...
L1673[18:55:27] <gudenau> :-/
L1674[18:55:59] <tterrag|away> post code
L1675[18:57:15] <gudenau> Super messy ATM: http://pastebin.com/DAR7qTTJ
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L1683[19:22:00] <gudenau> Sorry, client crashed.
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L1685[19:26:04] <gudenau> So, any help?
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L1689[19:29:30] <gudenau> Hey CJ.
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L1694[19:44:13] <tterrag|away> He keeps leaving
L1695[19:44:31] <tterrag|away> Does anyone know what GLFW is??
L1696[19:44:31] <tterrag|away> Never used it
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L1698[19:45:41] <Deamon> tterrag|away, its a windowing framework which works with opengl
L1699[19:45:45] <Deamon> supports multiple windows
L1700[19:45:56] <Deamon> and its pretty nice to use imo
L1701[19:47:15] <tterrag|away> ah...ok
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L1704[19:50:04] <gigaherz> unless you typoed and you mean GFWL, which is microosft's old Games For Windows Live ;P
L1705[19:51:53] <tterrag|away> I did not
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L1744[21:01:58] <MattDahEpic> i dont understand why my ServerStartingEvent.registerServerCommand nullpointers. im giving it a new command instance!
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L1747[21:12:23] <Matthew> MattDahEpic, stacktrace
L1748[21:13:09] <MattDahEpic> https://gist.github.com/MattDahEpic/f0329a8ff237639c77fe
L1749[21:13:56] <MattDahEpic> line 69 is e.registerServerCommand(new CommandMDE());
L1750[21:14:24] <Matthew> you're probably returning null to getCommandAliases()
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L1752[21:14:26] <Matthew> don't do that
L1753[21:15:34] <Matthew> vanilla returns Collections.emptyList() for commands with no aliases
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L1755[21:22:44] <GeoDoX> I seriously hate uv mapping.
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L1788[23:21:35] *** TehNut|Gone is now known as TehNut
L1789[23:24:16] <Zaggy1024> how do I make a plant sustained by both sand equivalents (like EnumPlantType.Desert) and dirt equivalents (like EnumPlantType.Plains)?
L1790[23:25:54] <Zaggy1024> ugh, my brain is tired
L1791[23:26:01] <Zaggy1024> I forgot that it goes through canBlockStay
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