L1[00:02:33] <Mat2ch> darsie: I'm always impressed by the size of your sats.

L7[00:24:22] <pureblood> whoa, more people here than in #kspmodding, but are there any MM ninjas?

L8[00:26:15] <pureblood> I want to patch every non-RO tank that has either LF or Oxidizer or MP to have ModuleFuelTanks

L9[00:26:49] <pureblood> of the volume deduced from original volume occupied by stock fuels

L10[00:27:08] <pureblood> but maybe someone already has this patch? If yes - please share

L11[00:37:05] <darsie> Mat2ch: It had plenty of dv for Eve. I even made orbit and circularized with aerobraking.

L12[00:38:00] <darsie> SporkWitch: When did you buy KSP?

L13[00:40:54] <darsie> Mat2ch: The hecs was cheap, but tedious. Needed to trick it into (anti)normal attitude, because I didn't bring a long range antenna. Only had pro/retrograde buttons. And I should have deleted the maneuver node. Once out of radio range it stays.

L14[00:48:23] <SporkWitch> darsie: pretty early on, well before 1.0 lol

L15[00:48:37] <darsie> oh :)

L16[00:48:45] <darsie> How come you have so little experience, then?

L17[00:48:55] <SporkWitch> because i also haven't PLAYED IT sinced then lol

L18[00:49:04] <SporkWitch> it's practically a whole new game

L19[00:49:06] <darsie> ok :)

L20[00:49:35] <pureblood> any MM-aware experienced player in here?

L28[02:04:49] <raptop> ;mission

L29[02:04:49] <LunchBot> raptop: You misread tako as taco, and attempt to eat the kraken. You die. Twice.

L30[02:04:58] <raptop> ...that tracks

L31[02:22:33] <pureblood> is anybody here proficient in ModuleManager?

L42[04:32:16] <pureblood> no one? Really?

L43[04:32:49] <pureblood> Raidernick: you should know

L44[04:32:59] <Althego> rat rap

L45[04:44:35] <SporkWitch> pureblood: If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later.

L48[05:46:36] <pureblood> SporkWitch: the question was raised above. I will repeat it now:

L49[05:46:53] <pureblood> I want to patch every non-RO tank that has either LF or Oxidizer or MP to have ModuleFuelTanks of the volume deduced from original volume occupied by stock fuels, but maybe someone already has this patch? If yes - please share

L52[05:49:32] <pureblood> the task at hand seems to be common enough, and the only reason I don't have it done/tested yet is I haven't used RO with my 1.3 and 1.4.3 RSS installs, rolling my own CRP-using patches. Now that I see 1.10.1 more or less usable with RO, I thus want to promote every non-RO liquid tank to wip-RO/useable status

L60[08:37:32] <Althego> zombanwa

L63[09:18:05] <Rolf> watch out for kerbals trying to capture farts for one of rocket projects

L64[09:18:10] <Rolf> ;mission

L65[09:18:11] <LunchBot> Rolf: You taunt KwirkyJ. Handsome Ron sees your gross safety violations and shuts down your space program.

L66[09:18:44] <Rolf> i guess trying to taunt by flying rocket across kwirkj was too much

L67[09:18:51] <Rolf> *view

L68[09:19:42] <darsie> I captured a fart in a funnel in the bathtub and lit it. It burned with a roar. Someone said that was due to the hydrogen in it.

L69[09:20:06] <Rolf> methine and oxygen mix I'd guess

L70[09:20:19] <darsie> Not much methane in human fart, I read.

L71[09:20:30] <darsie> 0-10%, IIRC.

L72[09:20:35] <Rolf> hmm ok

L73[09:23:43] <darsie> The typical chemical makeup of farts is 60% Nitrogen, 20% Hydrogen, 10% Carbon Dioxide, 5–10% Methane and 5% Oxygen. https://fartshare.com/chemical-makeup-of-farts/

L74[09:24:11] <Rolf> so, theres 2 fuels, and oxygen

L75[09:24:21] <Rolf> and 70% other stuff

L76[09:26:20] <flayer> lmao

L83[11:30:43] <Mat2ch> pureblood: oh, RO has its own community somewhere

L84[11:31:38] <Mat2ch> pureblood: https://discord.com/invite/ZGbR6nv

L85[11:31:52] <flayer> whats the latest on ksp2

L86[11:32:01] <Mat2ch> done in two years.

L87[11:32:02] <Mat2ch> :D

L88[11:32:11] <flayer> and then another year for the mods

L89[11:32:23] <flayer> so i got plenty of time to delay getting a new computer

L90[11:33:25] <Mat2ch> probably

L91[11:33:51] <Mat2ch> Prices are high now, hardware will be faster then, happy inflation everyone! Sadly not cosmic.

L92[11:34:31] <Mat2ch> flayer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnQP5dhxlKU

L93[11:49:34] <Mat2ch> oh, and SpaceX finally bought their own LR 11000 it seems...

L94[11:52:49] <Mat2ch> https://youtu.be/wnQP5dhxlKU?t=93 this is part of a game engine editor. But which one?

L95[11:54:16] <Mat2ch> development still in C#

L96[11:54:22] <Mat2ch> Probably still unity then.

L97[11:54:32] <Mat2ch> This will run bad. flayer buy something very big. :P

L98[11:59:17] <flayer> that kinda the point yeah lol

L99[11:59:39] <flayer> my current pc is 11 years old

L100[11:59:48] <flayer> i'm waiting until its 15 or so to replace it

L101[12:00:25] <Mat2ch> still wont be enough then ;)

L102[12:00:39] <flayer> it'll be a lot better than this one i imagine

L103[12:00:57] <Mat2ch> unity is one of the worst game engines... I'm not counting on it.

L104[12:30:58] <pureblood> Mat2ch: no irc for RO? Even for principia?

L105[12:31:25] <darsie> #ro

L106[12:31:27] <pureblood> Mat2ch: my question is not exactly RO-specific, as ModuleManager is shared between great many mods, you know...

L107[12:31:51] <pureblood> darsie: ty

L108[12:32:15] <pureblood> I vaguelly remember egg had principia # somewhere, but it's been a while

L110[13:00:47] <Althego> zombanwa

L122[20:25:30] <SporkWitch> i'm finally getting smarter. Realized I was being silly with my transfer/lander stages. No need for separate engines, use the same terrier for both, just strap some detachable fuel tanks for the transfer and capture burns, then jettison them after. Heavy Rocketry also helped a lot, a pair of the kickback SRBs, and one of the twin-nozzle liquid engines go me to orbit while only eating a little into the transfer fuel.

L123[20:25:31] <SporkWitch> Now in a 9.25/7,98 orbit (though I think it might be too close as it seems to be decaying...) with 25s of fuel left in the transfer tanks. Waste not want not, gonna use it for deorbit :P

L124[20:36:39] <darsie> SporkWitch: Did you see my Eve flyby/orbit pobe? https://i.postimg.cc/z81WG6ff/screenshot389.png

L125[20:39:09] <SporkWitch> i did not, right now i'm just happy that third time was the charm and my lander didn't tip over this time lol

L126[20:40:03] <darsie> :)

L127[20:40:15] <darsie> Well, you could click the link :).

L128[20:41:01] <SporkWitch> patience, i'm basking in mun dust lol

L129[20:41:22] <SporkWitch> is that an engine for ants? :P

L130[20:41:31] <darsie> yes :)

L131[20:42:24] <darsie> Second stage is inverted to save fairing size.

L132[20:42:26] <SporkWitch> i forgot to take an EVA science kit :'(

L133[20:50:25] <SporkWitch> i'm mildly sad that i don't leave footprints :'(

L134[20:58:23] <packbart> well, there's a mod... ;) https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/195844-110-111-112-alpha-kopernicus-expansion-continued-er/

L135[20:58:38] <packbart> I'm not sure how persistent those EVA footprints are, though

L136[20:59:07] <SporkWitch> doesn't need to be persistent (that'd make saves huge, fast), just feels like a missed opportunity heh

L137[21:22:43] <SporkWitch> yay! jeb and bob landed back home alive! lol

L138[21:23:20] <SporkWitch> Question about the deployable science stuff: 1) does a scientist need to stay there to operate it, or can it run on its own once deployed? 2) does it ever "run out," or is it an ongoing semi-passive source of science points?

L139[21:25:50] <packbart> it runs on its own but as far as I know, once an instrument transmitted "100% science", it's done.

L141[21:45:40] <packbart> SporkWitch: Footprints in 1.12: https://formularfetischisten.de/~packbart/temp/kspfp.jpg

L142[21:46:10] <packbart> I never tested that thing before. I wonder if it works with Parallax. probably not, maybe

L143[22:16:52] <SporkWitch> wow, panthers are beefy, and that afterburner is THIRSTY lol

L144[22:22:55] <SporkWitch> .... whoops, i ripped the wings off at nearly 1km/s lol

L145[22:23:15] <SporkWitch> interestingly, the tail and body are enough to keep it airborn lol

L146[22:24:42] <packbart> detachable wings

L147[22:32:12] <Mat2ch> SporkWitch: the fastest plane just use body lift in that game. :D

L148[22:32:31] <SporkWitch> yeah, lift mechanics are definitely wonky heh

L149[22:34:54] <SporkWitch> it also lets me turn in ways i shouldn't be able to; i'm in the atmosphere, how the heck can i turn faster than my momentum can catch up? lol

L150[22:35:05] <Mat2ch> weeeelll, in theory you can do this in reality, too... there are body lift concepts ;)

L151[22:35:10] <SporkWitch> true

L152[22:35:30] <SporkWitch> i just want a sane, stable, flyable plane :'( lol

L153[22:35:49] <Mat2ch> That is easy

L154[22:36:08] <Mat2ch> Even SSTOs is pretty easy.

L155[22:36:25] <Mat2ch> At least LKO with them. Making them more usable is harder.

L156[22:37:54] <SporkWitch> i went with a pretty simple setup, mk2 cockpit, cargo bay, two fuel fuselages, and the twin engine mount with panthers on it. two each horizontal and vertical stabilizers, two swept wings with aelerons, and the radial intake. thing flips around like nuts lol

L157[22:38:06] <SporkWitch> maxed out at just shy of 1km/s afterburning at sea level

L158[22:38:34] <FLHerne> SporkWitch: If you think lift mechanics are wonky *now*, you should have seen pre-1.0 plane aerodynamics

L159[22:38:43] <FLHerne> !stupid in soup

L160[22:38:43] <LunchBot> FLHerne: "People always said the old placeholder was like flying in soup, but I disagree; it was like flying in some state of matter not currently known to man."

L161[22:39:16] <SporkWitch> FLHerne: yeah, i think the last time i played the SPH had just been introduced

L162[22:39:17] <raptop> To be fair, the pre-1.0 turbojets were, uh, powerful

L163[22:39:37] <raptop> You could totally do shenanigans like go into a 80 x 30 km orbit

L164[22:39:45] <FLHerne> Surely "turn faster than my momentum can catch up" is just how all planes turn

L165[22:39:51] <raptop> (ie: something like 30 m/s circularization burn)

L166[22:39:53] <FLHerne> maybe to a less extreme degree though :p

L167[22:40:12] <SporkWitch> you know what i mean; i shouldn't be able to point retrograde without ripping the wings off lol

L168[22:40:43] <FLHerne> SporkWitch: Centre of lift has to be a bit behind the centre of drag

L169[22:40:45] <SporkWitch> that said, the retractable landing gear is MUCH more resilient... even if i couldn't slow down in time... lol

L170[22:40:59] <FLHerne> if it's forward or too close behind the plane will flip

L171[22:41:11] <SporkWitch> centre of mass, you mean, and yep

L172[22:41:17] <FLHerne> if it's too far back you'll need to constantly pull up to not nose-dive into the ground

L173[22:41:22] <FLHerne> yes

L174[22:41:45] <FLHerne> Panthers can make it hard to tell :p

L175[22:41:53] <FLHerne> massive thrust, massive vector angle

L176[22:42:12] <SporkWitch> it's a CONTROLLED flip, but it shouldn't LET me flip it like that. i think it's the wonky lift mechanics that have tailfins significantly more "buoyant" than the actual wings, which shifts the centre of lift oddly far back as well

L177[22:42:18] <FLHerne> You can fly pretty much anything with Panthers, no matter how absurdly unstable, until cutting the engines

L178[22:42:25] <SporkWitch> i've been doing a lot of designs with canards for exactly that reason

L179[22:43:05] <Mat2ch> Uhm, the flip... have you seen MiG-27s do this?

L180[22:43:58] <SporkWitch> only russian stuff i've flown are Su-25, Su-27, and Su-33

L181[22:43:59] <packbart> Stock KSP should allow a few realistically impossible tricks

L182[22:46:27] <Mat2ch> https://youtu.be/2O9q6EJhssQ?t=84

L183[22:49:37] <SporkWitch> switch to a single vertical stabilizer and that seems to have helped a lot...

L184[23:14:15] <SporkWitch> what exactly does rigid stabilization do? just get rid of the wobblyness?

L185[23:16:23] <packbart> by making part joints more brittle so they'll break easier. maybe what you're looking for in your wings

L186[23:17:57] <SporkWitch> that's what i thought; any way to enable it by default so i don't have to click every single piece? lol

L187[23:18:22] <SporkWitch> (and no, ripping the wings off was pretty much what SHOULD happen with the turn i made and the speed i was going lol)