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L4[00:55:16] <kmath> YouTube - Alien:
Low-budget Remake
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L10[02:07:22] <Mat2ch> but music for
now
L11[02:07:58] <Althego> finally
L12[02:08:10] <Mat2ch> I just got up
:D
L13[02:08:16] <Althego> however the
nasaspaceflight stream was live before the official
L14[02:09:43] <Mat2ch> well, they're
talking and talking
L15[02:09:46] <Mat2ch> too much for
me
L16[02:10:03] <Althego> now the stream
starts for real
L17[02:10:31] <Althego> they have to add
crew dragon to the intro
L18[02:11:13] <Althego> next spacex launch
is also starlink
L19[02:11:32] <Althego> ok i get it they
launch relatively cheaply, but they still need to get money from
somewhere
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L21[02:15:47] <Mat2ch> Althego: it's an
investment and they soon will open the network for customers
L22[02:15:56] <Mat2ch> and you can bet that
every Tesla vehicle will use it.
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L25[02:25:07] <Althego> is that sunlight on
the fins?
L26[02:25:55] <darsie> url?
L27[02:26:17] <Althego> topic
L29[02:26:26] <kmath> YouTube - Starlink
Mission
L30[02:26:33] <darsie> thx
L31[02:30:27] <Althego> nice landing
L32[02:30:41] <Althego> maybe they got fed
up with flat earthers claiming it is fake because you never see it
landing
L33[02:30:49] <darsie> :)
L34[02:33:32] <Mat2ch> and how to make
Starlink cost-effective is easy. Soon there will be around 1
million Tesla vehicles out there. And they pay around 10 USD/EUR
per month for service. If you take only 3 of those money you have a
single launch payed in about a year
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L36[02:41:30] <Althego> you can still see
the 3 sats moving away
L37[02:43:20] <Althego> we have to persuade
them to at least once play the music kerbals hear when they go into
space :)
L38[02:44:32] <Althego> it is going to pass
almost overhead, but probably no feed by then
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L40[02:54:10] <Althego> so they dont have
coverage... for now. will be funny to have streaming video of their
launch through their own satellite constellation
L42[03:00:17] <Mat2ch> (I know it ;)
L43[03:01:09] <Althego> i almost fell
asleep
L44[03:01:41] <Mat2ch> Isn't starlink
another company?
L45[03:01:41] *
packbart just woke up and missed both launches
L46[03:02:08] <Mat2ch> I'd have another
company to pay for all this. If it fails, SpaceX made money and
isn't bankrupt
L47[03:02:12] <Althego> no, starlink is a
brand name
L48[03:02:23] <Mat2ch> Then they're very
sure it wont fail
L49[03:02:29] <Althego> we dont know how
much the launches really cost
L50[03:02:53] <Mat2ch> that's true.
L51[03:03:09] <Mat2ch> The first stage of
the rocket itself was payed for by the first customer.
L52[03:03:29] <Mat2ch> So there's only the
second stage, the refurbishment and the sats to pay for
L53[03:03:31] <Althego> at least
partially
L54[03:03:59] <Mat2ch> I bet you, if you
order a new rocket you will pay fully for it.
L56[03:05:52] <packbart> one of those
canards mentioned in the title? not sure, really
L57[03:05:58] <Althego> who knows. how
could they be so cheap if they always ask for the full price?
L58[03:06:26] <Mat2ch> Dang it, the canards
are mentioned in the title? Spoiler!
L59[03:06:38] <Mat2ch> Althego: mass
production
L60[03:07:28] <Althego> the whole point of
reusability is to produce less, not more :)
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L62[03:08:03] <Althego> so as i said, we
dont know how big their profit margins are
L63[03:08:13] <Althego> probably there is
some more money coming in from nasa
L64[03:08:35] <Mat2ch> see, every Vulcain 2
is made completely by hand, which is very expensive. Every Merlin
1D is mass-produced mostly by machines
L65[03:08:37] <Althego> but it still
worries me that we havent seen many actual customer launched from
them this year
L66[03:09:00] <Mat2ch> also they need only
one Vulcain 2 for every Ariane 5, but 9 Merlin 1D
L67[03:09:04] <Mat2ch> and yes that makes
it cheaper
L68[03:09:13] <Althego> i thought 3d
printig was all the rage in rocketry now
L69[03:09:16] <Mat2ch> NASA is not a
customer?
L70[03:09:24] <Althego> it is a customer of
course
L71[03:09:35] <Althego> but they have some
kind of partnership
L72[03:09:45] <Althego> so there may be
money coming in for the moon things
L73[03:09:50] <Althego> before they
happen
L74[03:10:43] <Mat2ch> Well, they're
betting on Starlink
L75[03:10:54] <Mat2ch> and soon we will see
GPS III-03 launched
L76[03:11:03] <Mat2ch> then Anasis 2
L77[03:12:59] <Mat2ch> SXM 7, Türksat 5A,
SXM 8, GPS III-05, SARah 1 (which is for the BND), USSF-44,
MicroGeo...
L78[03:13:13] <Mat2ch> there is a pretty
long list of launches to do
L79[03:13:47] <Mat2ch> wikipedia lists at
least 19 upcoming launches
L81[03:14:14] <Mat2ch> so almost every week
a launch
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L86[03:27:11] <hatrix> how do you exit IVA?
._.
L87[03:27:31] <packbart> press
"c"
L88[03:27:36] <hatrix> ah thanks
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L90[03:29:16] <flayer> woops, i thought i
had enough to do an ike + duna landing AND get back to kerbin, but
i only barely made it back to the orbiter
L91[03:31:59] <hatrix> I hope you've got a
miner on ike ready to refuel
L92[03:33:03] <flayer> almost. i landed one
on duna, but it is immobile and has insufficient resources.
L93[03:33:12] <hatrix> rip
L95[03:34:57] <flayer> oh well, they have
enough snacks until the next window opens up
L96[03:35:00] <hatrix> docked*
L97[03:35:02] <Althego> long base is
long
L98[03:35:26] <hatrix> also low FPS are
low
L99[03:35:44] <hatrix> I stopped expanding
it because I couldn't move anymore D:
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L102[03:41:47] <flayer> i'm sending a
mobile base to duna
L103[04:08:37] <hatrix> I thought the
whole thing was just glitched in the ground
L104[04:08:47] <hatrix> why do you have a
chute on the rover though?
L105[04:18:47] <flayer> just happened to
be so
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L114[06:38:26] <Althego> ksp is only 9.99
eur on gog.com
L115[06:45:37] <Althego> hah supcom with
forged alliance only 3 eur. i didnt know they have it. i have my
own disc ripped in an mdx image, but i dont have forged
alliance
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L118[06:55:10] <Althego> no man's sky is
also half off
L119[06:55:20] <Althego> supposdly it
bacme quite good over time
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L121[07:29:20] <sandbox> I wonder how it
would have turned out if sony hadn't offered them a load of
money
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L123[07:30:34] <nate> potentially better
as they could have done a better crowd sourcing and wouldn't have
had a major publisher shoving them to release as soon as
possible.
L124[07:31:22] <nate> but even at that
sony didn't even give them "A load of money", like 90% of
what sony did was simply front the advertising and promotion
costs
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L129[08:17:11] <Guest20847> KSP Newbie
here: I have Jeb on an EVA near the KSC and at first he'd only walk
forward, now all he does is turn (spin) in place (I have no idea
what key I pressed that changed the action). I've tried restarting
the game; tried holding down and tapping the "alt" keys,
the "H" key, changing the camera view, unbinding the
keypad keys I'd mapped to Ker
L130[08:17:11] <Guest20847> bal movement,
and just can't seem to find a solution. Any suggestions would be
appreciated.
L131[08:19:58] <hoglahoo> sounds like
Jeb's being difficult
L132[08:20:35] <Guest20847> Maybe he's
ticked off because I've been favoring Val for my flights! LOL
L133[08:22:17] <Guest20847> This is 1.9
btw
L134[08:24:13]
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L135[08:24:53] <TheKosmonaut> That’s
odd.
L136[08:24:57]
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L137[08:25:00] <TheKosmonaut> He may be
stuck on terrain
L138[08:25:10] <TheKosmonaut> You cant
just recover him from the tracking center
L139[08:25:50] <Guest20847> 'stuck on
terrain'? can you clarify?
L140[08:26:42] <Guest20847> I think I
probably could recover him, getting to him from the tracking center
seems to be available. I was more concerned with seeing if this is
going to be a recurring problem.
L141[08:27:15] <Guest20847> As I newbie
I'm trying to get comfortable with all of the controls.
L142[08:28:45] <Guest20847> Yes, I was
able to recover Jeb and the vehicle separately via the drop down
once I had focus.
L143[08:32:05] <Guest20847> I don't know
why it would make a difference, but I'll also mention that Jeb was
near the KSC Monolith.
L144[08:32:18] <JVFoxy> oh is he just
facing away from camera rather than turning to face direction to
walk?
L145[08:34:17] <JVFoxy> think there is a
sort of walk mod switch.. not sure if it was to do with SAS
(toggled with 'T' key) while on EVA or something else.
L146[08:34:48] <Guest20847> It doesn't
seem to matter what direction I have the camera. No matter what
keys I press he only moves forward. I just now moved him to the
launchpad for an EVA; got him to climb out; he jumped in place, but
all I can get him to do is walk forward regardless of pressing any
key.
L147[08:35:07] <Guest20847> space bar does
still make him jump
L148[08:35:37] <JVFoxy> there's a key..
let me look it up
L149[08:35:54] <JVFoxy> it goggles the
'strafing' on and off
L150[08:35:57] <Guest20847> Q and E have
no effect; WASD all make him walk forward.
L151[08:36:52] <Guest20847> I must've
tapped something, because now the WASD keys seem to be making him
move forward/backard/right/left. But what key ...
L153[08:37:19] <JVFoxy> try just tapping
the 'alt' key alone.. see if that does anything
L154[08:37:31] <Guest20847> Nope, spoke
too soon. we're back to only moving forward.
L155[08:37:31] <JVFoxy> guessing you on
PC/windows?
L156[08:37:40] <Guest20847> Yes,
Win10
L157[08:37:51] <Guest20847> Let me try
alt, though I tried it before.
L158[08:38:15] <Guest20847> Nope, no joy
with either Alt key.
L159[08:38:47] <Guest20847> Yep, I checked
that key bindings page, got that in another window as reference. No
joy.
L160[08:38:54] <JVFoxy> I know during
space eva.. depending on if SAS is turned on can affect
things
L161[08:41:30] <Guest20847> Turning off
SAS doesn't seem to have an effect. But just now I tapped 'L' and I
got WASD working again.
L162[08:42:14] <Guest20847> But Q and E
won't work. And when I Alt-Tab between the app and this page, it
goes back to only moving forward.
L163[08:42:26] <Guest20847> Even after
tapping 'L'
L164[08:43:19] <JVFoxy> firing up KSP on
my other machine.. give me a moment
L165[08:43:24] <Guest20847> thanks
L166[08:43:49] <JVFoxy> remember when L
toggled helmet lights
L167[08:45:39] <Guest20847> My Lights
action group doesn't do anything when I tap 'L'. But the helmet and
helmet light keys work (U and O).
L168[08:46:05] <Guest20847> U toggles my
Light action group, btw
L169[08:46:33] <JVFoxy> btw.. did you tap
left alt key?
L170[08:47:03] <JVFoxy> oh right.. u for
helmet, L for ship lights
L171[08:48:33] <JVFoxy> didn't even know
'O' for helmet till now
L172[08:49:03] <Guest20847> Left Alt +
W/A/S/D seemed to work for a moment, both when held down and
tapped. But tap again and it goes back to walking forward, and
holding or tapping Left Alt doesn't change anything. I think... let
me try again.
L173[08:50:30] <Guest20847> Ok, looks like
I was mistaken. Tapping left alt seems to be toggling me between
walking forward with all four keys, and walking
forward/back/side-stepping left and right. So that's good.... but Q
and E aren't working to get Jeb to turn.
L174[08:50:31] <JVFoxy> left alt for me
changes between facing the direction (WASD) and walking
sideways
L175[08:51:38] <JVFoxy> Q/E doesn't do
anything while walking.. far as I can tell
L176[08:52:09] <JVFoxy> only when
jetpacking
L177[08:52:40] <Guest20847> Huh. Ok, fair
enough ... but now I'm not sure I'm following how to change
direction that Jeb is walking in.
L178[08:53:16] <JVFoxy> left click mouse,
drag around to change camera angle
L179[08:53:39] <JVFoxy> when pressing W,
he will forwards/away from camera
L180[08:54:17] <JVFoxy> when not in strafe
mode.. I can tap WASD in a circle, make them walk around on the
spot
L181[08:54:31] <Guest20847> Sorry, what's
strafe mode?
L182[08:54:46] <JVFoxy> walking
sideways
L183[08:55:19] <JVFoxy> translating
sideways, strafing.. as oppose to facing the direction you press
and just walking that way
L184[08:56:13] <Guest20847> Changing the
camera angle has no effect on the direction he's facing. I must be
missing something in your explanation.
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L186[08:57:25] <JVFoxy> they dont' change
right away... its when they start walking
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L188[08:59:20] <Guest20847> Ok, I think
I'm starting to get it. I finally got him to change the direction
he was facing, so it looks like I'll have to experiment to
understand how the camera angle influences the movement.
L189[09:00:56] <Guest20847> thank you for
your help and patience. I appreciate it!
L190[09:01:16] <JVFoxy> ya.. between the
walk modes, one they walk depending which key you press. the other
is based on where the camera is.. can sorta steer using left click
and panning camera around
L191[09:02:12] <JVFoxy> just take care
while on EVA in space.. its a bit of a different beast than having
solid ground under foot
L192[09:03:43] <Guest20847> Thanks! I'm
working thru career mode and have a couple of missions offered to
rescue Kerb's from orbit, so I imagine I'd better get good at EVA
in space before I try that! LOL
L193[09:05:57] <JVFoxy> not only that,
getting two ships to be close and no or little velocity between the
two while in orbit
L194[09:10:44] <JVFoxy> lol... left Kerbal
standing with pod on runway for the past five minutes. Go to look
back, see pod has slowly slide across runway...
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L198[09:35:48] <bEagle> what's the general
cause of a flat spin?
L199[09:36:12] <bEagle> i mean what's the
problem with my space plane
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L201[09:42:02] <FLHerne> bEagle: Centre of
drag ahead of (or too close to) the centre of mass
L202[09:42:11] <JVFoxy> maybe not enough
tail fin?
L203[09:42:16] <FLHerne> Try chucking an
arrow backwards
L204[09:43:00] <bEagle> col and com are
where they're supposed to. it's a medium sized craft with a lot of
vertical stabilizers
L205[09:43:26] <JVFoxy> trouble with stock
KSP, it only tells you overall dynamics, doesn't separate pitch and
yaw
L206[09:43:53] <JVFoxy> ah... got a lot of
drag producers up front?
L207[09:44:43] <FLHerne> bEagle: It's not
that one engine flames out?
L208[09:44:54] <JVFoxy> looking at Mk2
lander can, Kerbals come with warnings now?
L209[09:45:23] <FLHerne> That can happen
sometimes with high-altitude things
L210[09:46:03] <JVFoxy> FlHerne I remember
that being a thing in older versions. Don't they just all flame out
at once now?
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L212[09:47:01] <FLHerne> No idea, I've not
been able to play since 1.4.5 or so
L213[09:47:05] <bEagle> JVFoxy just the mk
2 cockpit, nothing else
L214[09:47:23] <bEagle> FLHerne: nope,
going with rockets so no flameouts
L215[09:47:37] <FLHerne> (but in the next
week, all the parts for my computer should be here, and then I can
see what's new :D)
L216[09:47:39] <JVFoxy> bEagle can you
throw us a pic?
L217[09:48:58] <JVFoxy> I'm half wondering
if you really need that much V-stabs but also where they might be
located
L218[09:49:31] <bEagle> JVFoxy sure! just
a sec
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L221[09:50:09] <JVFoxy> k
L224[09:52:01] <JVFoxy> heh.. interesting.
Sorta like sleeker version of the Babylon 5 shuttles
L225[09:52:09] <JVFoxy> now, is it
spinning on runway or in flight?
L226[09:53:06] <bEagle> in flight,
especially on reentry
L227[09:53:16] <bEagle> i checked, the com
stays behind col even when empty
L228[09:53:34] <JVFoxy> reentry is a bit
of a pain sometimes...
L229[09:54:16] <bEagle> sometimes it also
spins when i'm going up
L230[09:54:21] <bEagle> so it's a real
problem
L231[09:54:24] <JVFoxy> I'm going to guess
you set your control surfaces for specific jobs.. right? V-stabs
are just for yaw
L232[09:54:50] <bEagle> yupo, got
that
L233[09:54:54] <JVFoxy> normally I setup
the alevons all pitch, no yaw, outside ones only do roll
L234[09:55:58] <JVFoxy> now are you
'pancaking' into the air stream, or descending with only some pitch
up?
L235[09:56:14] <bEagle> only some
pitch
L236[09:56:56] <bEagle> even if i set the
plane to surface prograde (i.e. along airstream) it still tends to
start wobbling and flat spinning
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L238[09:58:05] <JVFoxy> try reducing the
pitch up on the wings.. wondering if you've got too much and its
causing some issues with your paw
L239[09:58:07] <JVFoxy> .. yaw
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L241[09:58:48] <JVFoxy> what might happen
is, one side is catching too much air, throwing that side around
too hard
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L243[09:59:12] <bEagle> hmmm
L244[09:59:56] <bEagle> makes sense. it
doesn't quite look like a flying body after that but i guess that's
a solution
L245[10:00:06] <bEagle> i was going for a
venture star kind of design on this
L246[10:00:23] <bEagle> now wondering if
the actual venture star would have been stable at all
L247[10:00:41] <JVFoxy> ya... I think the
way KSP models airflow, even stuff with 'V' tails has issues
L248[10:01:19] <JVFoxy> I did something
similar to the F-23, had a few issues tracking. Granted this was
back early KSP version..
L249[10:01:22] <bEagle> that's a
shame
L250[10:02:01] <JVFoxy> might not have to
do completely flat wings.. just reduce the angle, take away some of
that 'yawing' tendancy
L251[10:02:08] <bEagle> but also good to
know i'm not going mad because i've been working on the spin
problem for a while and couldn't figure out what was going wrong
except that i just ran out of authority on all of my control
surfaces
L252[10:02:15] <bEagle> aye
L253[10:02:55] <JVFoxy> I tend to do a lot
of testing on things, some things takes me a bit to get right.
Trick is not to change too much on a design each time due to how it
all interacts
L254[10:07:43] <bEagle> reduced the angle
dramatically and now it doesn't wobble on the way up
L255[10:08:41] <JVFoxy> ya, when you try
to roll, it also induces some yaw as a by product
L256[10:09:30] <bEagle> yeah i think that
stabilized it on the way down too
L257[10:09:40] <bEagle> what a weird game.
but thanks
L258[10:10:26] <JVFoxy> well... there is
some truth in it.
L259[10:10:57] <JVFoxy> even in real life,
when you turn the controls to make a plane roll to one side, it
does induce a slight yaw, even with flat wings. But you
automatically correct it
L260[10:11:41] <JVFoxy> what happens is,
one control surface creates more lift on the one side, makes it
drag more.
L261[10:13:34] <Althego> so far this was a
great year. 4 months of working from home. but from next week we
have to go back 2 days a week
L262[10:14:16] <JVFoxy> bEagle just
realize, while it might look cool, it may not always work. You have
a lot of lifting surfaces caused by the MK2 body parts. But little
tail fin in comparison. It might also help a little more to add a
bit more of a strake up to the V-stabs, or pushing them back a
little more.
L263[10:15:06] <bEagle> i'll consider
doing both
L264[10:21:17] <JVFoxy> bEagle also, twin
tails can look cool, but realize, draw a line from the center of
mass to them, the wider the 'V' it makes, the less of an effect
they have
L265[10:22:10] <JVFoxy> (side note: wing
tip fins on real airplanes helps more with lift than they do
directional control)
L266[10:47:19] <JVFoxy> eh.. quiet
morning. Went from looking up LEM assent engine to the Agena target
vehicle. Some reason, I find myself ending up at the Gemini program
again
L267[10:47:55] <Althego> quiet evening
:)
L268[10:48:16] <Althego> there was a lot
of talk before i came back
L269[10:49:38] <JVFoxy> oh.. just helping
someone out with a spaceplane design
L270[10:50:05] <JVFoxy> after which, was
trying to wrap my head around how to do a lander design using one
of the cans
L271[10:51:12] <Althego> eh. louis rossman
17 minutes ago. 20 minute rant. i click it. video removed by
uploader
L272[10:52:12] <JVFoxy> lag is real.
:)
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L277[11:15:24] <Althego> lol
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L284[12:05:46] <Althego> what, another
kerbal movie from matt lowne?
L285[13:01:28] <hoglahoo> no idea
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L303[16:56:23] <transit> so like, how am i
supposed to controll the helicopter type craft?
L304[16:56:33] <transit> no staging to
speak of
L305[17:02:27] <transit> ?
L306[17:05:39] <UmbralRaptop> Throttle and
pitch, also consider action groups for startup/shutdown
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L308[17:06:45] <transit> ok
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L312[17:15:05] <UmbralRaptop> Also the
KAL-1000…somehow
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L320[17:47:08] <JVFoxy> So... do I bring
back back my mun mission crew, or do I extend their mission and
throw in a lander next? Hmm...
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L322[18:10:19] <JVFoxy> saturday.. guess
peeps being pretty sleepy today huh? ;)
L323[18:11:03] <raptop> Been focused on
other things
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L325[18:11:28] <JVFoxy> besides
pandemic?
L326[18:13:24] <raptop> Pandemic, economic
collapse, civil unrest
L327[18:13:48] <raptop> Apparently the
writers wanted an impressive start for the 2020s season
L328[18:14:07] <raptop> Also, messing
around with a smaller project with telescope viewing angles
L329[18:14:56] <JVFoxy> If it isn't one
thing, it would likely have been something else
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L334[19:22:09] <hoglahoo> just performed a
moon mission playing for the first time in about a year, I guess.
service module ran out of fuel before I achieved lunar orbit, poor
Bob. Bill and Jeb landed in the dark as power ran out on the far
side of the moon as they were about 10km from the surface, so it
was a pretty hard landing but the pod survived out of everything
\o/
L335[19:33:05] <raptop> \o/
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L337[19:33:31] <JVFoxy> lol.. I just made
a landing too, testing out a simple lander. Staging got messed up
on way up to Kerbin orbit. Injection booster staged same time as
shroud, but stayed stuck to back of lander, and just kept pushing
it till fuel depletion. I'd put a probe core on it, I suppose I
could have shut it off but then it would come unstuck from lander.
Fort
L338[19:33:31] <JVFoxy> unately...
L339[19:34:00] <JVFoxy> I was able to work
with the highly eliptical orbit, got into mun orbit. Landed
anyways. But with only 525 DV...
L340[19:37:26] <JVFoxy> whoops... jeb had
to jump to get hold of rungs, smacked helmet on lander, ended up
doing backflip and belly flopping.. doh
L341[19:46:08] <JVFoxy> lol... ran out of
fuel.. oriented the lander can so docking port JR was facing retro.
went EVA, put kerbal up against docking port. Suit jets to push
lander rest of the way into low mun orbit
L342[19:46:51] <JVFoxy> surprisingly,
lander can didn't really turn much once I got kerbal stuck up into
the ring of the docking port
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