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L6[01:57:47] <Althego> managed to move the
test result viewer web2py application from debian 6 to 10
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L20[02:59:46] <sandbox> ugh I think my
battery is dying
L21[03:02:12] <darsie> 100 EC battery?
:)
L22[03:06:19] <sandbox> CR2032
L23[03:06:39] <sandbox> I have plenty of
spares
L24[03:08:51] <darsie> What's it for?
bios?
L25[03:09:02] <sandbox> yup
L26[03:10:50] <Althego> how old is
it?
L27[03:11:18] <sandbox> 6 years I
think
L28[03:11:32] <Deddly> Those batteries are
so annoying.
L29[03:11:36] <Althego> yes that is already
aging
L30[03:12:29] <Deddly> Annoying in the
sense that it's the same price to buy 10 as it is to buy 1, so you
end up with a bunch of them kicking around in a drawer somewhere,
and you forget about them by the time you need another one, so you
buy 10 more
L31[03:12:51] <Althego> why is it not a
capacitor?
L32[03:13:31] <Deddly> Capacitors are not
ideal for storing energy for long periods without receiving a
charge
L33[03:13:40] <Althego> but that i i
L34[03:13:45] <Althego> it is not long
periods normally
L35[03:13:52] <Althego> at most a few
days
L36[03:14:03] <Althego> then it would
recharge when you tur the machine on again
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L38[03:14:15] <Deddly> Batteries are also
much smaller
L39[03:14:23] <Althego> and a lot more
annoying
L40[03:14:53] <Mat2ch> Althego: aging? I've
never changed a bios battery for the last 15 years or so
L41[03:15:16] <Althego> in my old p1 when
it was around 8 years old it was depleted
L42[03:15:31] <Althego> i replaced it with
two aa bateries :)
L43[03:21:08] <Deddly> Surely how long they
last depends on your uptime
L44[03:21:39] <Deddly> That just means that
Mat2ch hardly ever turns his machine off :P
L45[03:24:05] <Mat2ch> Deddly: ;P
L46[03:24:06] <Mat2ch> :D
L47[03:24:30] <Mat2ch> well, for me they
could just use a powercap...
L48[03:24:32] <Mat2ch> :P
L49[03:25:17] <Mat2ch> also this battery
shouldn't have much to do these days. Everything is store in flash
memory, only the time has to be counted up
L50[03:25:52] <Mat2ch> so the self
discharge of the battery should be much higher than what is used of
it :D
L51[03:27:15] <Deddly> Talking of which,
battery is running out on this machine
L52[03:27:18] <Althego> actually the time
is not important
L53[03:27:23] <Deddly> Not the CMOS one,
mind
L54[03:27:26] <Althego> because it can just
ntp upon boot
L55[03:29:52] <Deddly> ntp?
L56[03:29:58] <Althego> network tiem
protocol
L57[03:30:48] <Deddly> Ah
L58[03:31:53] *
Deddly remembers back in the day, when he used to regularly change
the system date and time so he could keep playing time-limited
demos
L59[03:31:55] <Mat2ch> Yeah, that's another
thing
L60[03:32:16] <Mat2ch> but not every
computer is connected to the interwebz ;)
L61[03:32:31] <Mat2ch> Deddly: those were
the days. ;)
L62[03:32:33] <Deddly> On the Amiga, the
date and time wasn't the least bit important
L63[03:33:09] <Deddly> Gotta go,
seeyas
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L65[03:37:02] <sandbox> I remember the
rollercoaster tycoon demo had a timer :P
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L68[03:48:50] <hatrix> is there a mod to
create groups in the tracking station?
L69[03:49:09] <hatrix> I'd like to group
sats related to the same mission
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L74[05:02:22] <packbart>
CommnetConstellation
L77[05:03:20] <hatrix> it's working fine
:)
L78[05:03:45] <packbart> oh, right, you
mant just grouping them in the tracking station?
L79[05:03:48] <packbart> +e
L80[05:03:58] <hatrix> yep
L82[05:05:01] <packbart> I have that on my
"could be useful" list but haven't tested it
L83[05:05:06] <hatrix> ah nice :)
L84[05:05:22] <hatrix> since I'm playing
with the most difficult settings I'll have a lot of relay networks
to send
L85[05:05:37] <hatrix> it will quickly
become messy
L86[05:12:11] <flayer> damn, my modified
dynawing shuttle thingie is really hard to control with a full
cargo XD
L87[05:12:58] <flayer> and i have at least
three more launches to go
L88[05:13:10] <hatrix> oh packbart
<3
L89[05:13:17] <hatrix> I can rename vessels
from the tracking station now
L90[05:13:23] <hatrix> how come that's not
in stock
L91[05:13:46] <flayer> i can do that in
stock
L92[05:13:53] <flayer> it's a ways to get
there though
L93[05:14:13] <hatrix> I can't create
groups with this mod but at least It's grouped by bodies now
L94[05:14:18] <flayer> that tracking
station mod looks sweet
L96[05:16:29] <flayer> it is really
extraordinary how our view of the universe has grown since we
started putting stuff into space
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L102[05:38:59] <Judge_Dedd> Wow I finally
found a mobile IRC client that seems to be modern and good.
L103[05:39:31] <hatrix> which one?
L104[05:39:40] <hatrix> I'm using ssh to
connect to my weechat, It's kinda bad
L105[05:39:46] <hatrix> the relay doesn't
seem to be working anymore
L106[05:39:57] <Judge_Dedd> Revolution
IRC
L107[05:40:26] <Judge_Dedd> I got it from
F-Droid
L108[05:46:56] <Judge_Dedd> No ads,
either, which would have ruined it
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L110[06:20:52] <flayer> 9 years into the
space program and i've finally hit on the 255 parts limit of the
vab level 2
L111[06:21:59] <Judge_Dedd> Heh. Yeah, L3
is pretty overkill
L112[06:22:29] <VanDisaster> back before
autostruts, not so much
L113[06:23:44] <Judge_Dedd> Depends on
your build style
L114[06:24:01] <Judge_Dedd> But yeah,
struts add up quite quickly
L115[06:24:37] <flayer> i mean, i have far
too many septratrons
L116[06:25:09] <Judge_Dedd> Especially
back in the Floppy-Rocket era when you needed to brace them out
from the body of the rocket with the Cubic Octagonal Strut for
vertical strutting
L117[06:25:49] <Judge_Dedd> (praise be its
name)
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L125[08:00:56] <kmath> YouTube - SpaceX
Starship News with SN5, SN6 and SN7, Crew Dragon to be reused for
Crew flights, Starlink
L126[08:01:02] <Althego> the movingdo
diagram is interesting
L127[08:01:06] <Althego> moving dot
L128[08:01:53]
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L129[08:02:27] <Apple7> hi
L130[08:02:30] <Mod9000> Hello,
Apple7
L131[08:02:37] <Apple7> no
L132[08:02:58] <Althego> hehe
L133[08:03:10] <Apple7> heHe
L134[08:03:16] <Althego> i try to not
provoke the bot
L135[08:03:37] <Apple7> I |
L136[08:04:06] <Apple7> ok
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L138[08:06:04] <Mat2ch> that was
weird
L139[08:06:15] <Althego> just as
expected
L140[08:08:51] <darsie> hi
L141[08:08:54] <Mod9000> Hello,
darsie
L142[08:09:14] <Althego> and this is why i
said i try not to provoke the bot
L143[08:09:29] <Althego> because it doesnt
take into accoutn who came in. replies to hi and hello
L144[08:12:08] <sandbox> Hello,
Althego
L145[08:12:22] ⇦
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L146[08:16:18] <darsie> Othello
L147[08:16:20] <hatrix> how can I compute
the Δv required for an ascent on a planet with an atmosphere?
L148[08:16:28] <Althego> you dont
L149[08:16:34] <Althego> measure it
L150[08:16:46] <Althego> that is how the
delta v maps were born
L151[08:16:47] <hatrix> isn't there a way
with the density or something?
L152[08:16:57] <Althego> too
complicated
L153[08:17:12] <Althego> you have to have
some drag model
L154[08:17:22] <darsie> hatrix: You'd have
to consider sub- and supersonic air resistance, gravity losses
...
L155[08:17:50] <Althego> also even the map
is just an average
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L157[08:17:57] <darsie> Changing Isp as
pressure decreases
L158[08:17:57] <Althego> you can go below
those values with high twr
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L160[08:19:10] <darsie> You would make a
model and simulate ascent.
L161[08:19:12] <hatrix> I'll stick to the
map then
L162[08:19:41] <Althego> basically you
would nee to reimplement the game physics again
L163[08:19:46] <darsie> Or go by trial and
error. Build rockets and see which ones get you to orbit.
L164[08:20:43] <darsie> Would you like the
result be ground level or vacuum Isp delta v, or real delta
v?
L165[08:21:21] <hatrix> vacuum I guess,
but that's only because I'm used to it
L166[08:21:39] <darsie> That's not actual
delta v, then.
L167[08:24:11] <darsie> I wonder how close
pros like spacex can estimate this. Like, how much fuel will be
left when they reach the target orbit.
L168[08:24:21] <darsie> Say, with
SSSH.
L169[08:24:38] <Althego> probably somewhat
simpler, since most the fuel is expelled in almos vacuum
L170[08:25:08] <darsie> mhm
L171[08:26:23] <darsie> Well, most dv
happens in vacuum, but a lot of fuel is burned during ascent.
L172[08:27:04] <darsie> Do they jettison
the fairing during first stage burning?
L173[08:27:28] <Althego> i think it is
second stage for spacex
L174[08:28:54] <Althego> even though even
meco is well in space
L176[08:56:16] <hatrix> there's an antenna
and solar panels
L177[08:56:18] <Althego> build a new
unmanned probe
L178[08:56:29] <Althego> not new
L179[08:56:40] <hatrix> it is though
L180[08:57:10] <darsie> You used recycled
parts.
L181[08:57:39] <darsie> Did you
build/launch it after accepting teh contract?
L182[08:57:47] <hatrix> I launched two
probes and I copied the one I just made, is that why?
L183[08:57:49] <hatrix> yes
L184[08:58:10] <hatrix> they're both on
the same rocket
L185[08:59:51] <darsie> One probe
fulfilling two contracts, not sure if that works.
L186[09:00:00] <darsie> Or one
rocket.
L187[09:00:00] <hatrix> no no I got two in
a fairing
L188[09:00:06] <Althego> that should
work
L189[09:00:47] <hatrix> maybe that's
because I copied the probe core instead of adding it via the panel
on the left in the VAB
L190[09:01:09] <Judge_Dedd> You definitely
accepted the contract first, and then build and launched the
rocket?
L191[09:01:18] <darsie> Copied with right
shift-LMB?
L192[09:01:44] <hatrix> I don't remember
the keys, it's muscle memory but yeah darsie
L193[09:02:07] <hatrix> yes
Judge_Dedd
L194[09:02:25] <Judge_Dedd> I can't see
the text on that image
L196[09:09:27] <hatrix> haha i like
it
L197[09:09:31] <darsie> :)
L198[09:09:50] <Althego> if you get an
early lv-n test contract you dont complete it
L199[09:09:56] <Althego> but use the
part
L200[09:10:30] <Althego> btw you dont
actually need to have fuel for the test :)
L201[09:21:12]
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L202[09:39:37] <Shoe> can we all
circlejerk about how bad the questions in the spacex ama is
L203[09:40:11] <Shoe> i need to see
someone else feeling as irrationally angry as me at some of these
people in order to feel good
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L206[09:42:27] ***
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L207[09:46:06] <Mat2ch> Shoe: I have the
feeling that that j-word is not appropriate for this channel
L208[09:46:20] <Shoe> Mat2ch: j
word?
L209[09:46:32] <Shoe> i haven’t said
anything that starts with j
L210[09:47:39] <Mat2ch> it's part of that
circle thing
L211[09:47:55] <Mat2ch> but now I've
learnt that they're using chromium for the touchscreens
L212[09:47:59] <Mat2ch> and I want to
cry
L213[09:48:01] <Mat2ch> very very
loud
L214[09:48:09] <Mat2ch> A webbrowser in
fullscreen
L215[09:48:48] <Shoe> Mat2ch: electron,
not chromium
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L219[09:50:34] <Mat2ch> it's still a bit
stupid to use something this bloated for a user interface on a
spaceship
L220[09:50:43] <Mat2ch> what happend to
good and clean code?
L221[09:53:36] <Mat2ch> I mean, drawing
things on a computer display is not hard
L222[09:53:46] <Mat2ch> there are
frameworks out there that help you
L223[09:54:01] <hatrix> maybe they needed
libraries they were too lazy to recode
L224[09:54:20]
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L225[09:54:21] <hatrix> also might be
easier to find developpers
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L227[09:54:31] <Mat2ch> and then used a
huge bloated software thing so that webdevelopers (the worst kind
of developer ;P) can create the UI?
L228[09:55:00] <hatrix> I'm sure someone
has thought this through
L229[09:55:03] <hatrix> ask them :)
L230[09:55:11] ***
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L231[09:58:11] <Mat2ch> hatrix: I've seen
so many things now. Nobody really thought this through.
L232[09:58:32] <hatrix> now that I think
about it I get it
L233[09:58:43] <hatrix> we've got awful
critical software here also
L234[09:58:45] <Mat2ch> This was a choice
by taste. Maybe because on of the project managers really likes
electron and/or developed something with it
L235[09:59:09] <Mat2ch> "it's fast to
market", "we can test in the browser and then just upload
it to the craft"
L236[09:59:19] <Mat2ch> See what I
mean?
L237[09:59:23] <hatrix> yeah
L238[09:59:48] <Mat2ch> There are so few
people out there who are really good at software design (and I
don't count myself in either)
L239[09:59:51] <Mat2ch> and so many bad
ones.
L240[10:00:32] <Mat2ch> But I at least try
to do things properly, even if it makes me itch
L241[10:01:58] <Mat2ch> (sometimes you
have the choice between pest and cholera and you can only do damage
control)
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L257[11:25:39] <Althego> lol browser for
gui
L258[11:25:42] <Althego> on a
spaceship
L259[11:25:47] <Althego> stupidest thing
eveer
L260[11:29:30] <hatrix> nice screen
picture darsie
L262[11:30:19] <hatrix> how did you
enclose the stayputnik?
L263[11:30:25] <darsie> I didn't.
L264[11:30:37] <darsie> Contract: Test the
twin boar on the launch pad. :)
L265[11:30:41] <hatrix> ah, ok
L266[11:30:54] <hatrix> I'll try to launch
my probes again
L267[11:30:59] <hatrix> hopefully it'll
work this time
L268[11:31:00] <darsie> g/
L269[11:31:02] <darsie> gl
L270[11:31:14] <Althego> as i said,
thetest works without fuel too
L271[11:31:23] <Althego> so you need an
emppty tank, a probe core and an engine
L272[11:31:27] <Althego> press spac
L273[11:31:30] <Althego> test done
L274[11:31:59] <darsie> yeah :)
L275[11:32:17] <darsie> But I'm a thorough
tester :).
L276[11:32:33] <darsie> Acquire 2300 units
of ore from Eve and land them on Gilly. Hmm ...
L277[11:33:05] <hatrix> ouch
L278[11:33:26] <darsie> I could do it in
batches :).
L279[11:34:49] <Mat2ch> Althego: it
doesn't stop at the software
L280[11:34:50] <Althego> other solutin
when i cared about that: put doen the engine upside down
L281[11:35:28] <Mat2ch> today I saw an
interview with Greg Kroah-Hartman and he talked a bit about linux
kernel development
L282[11:35:35] <Mat2ch> and about
drivers
L283[11:35:56] <Mat2ch> and in one case a
company made a new chip, which ran at double the speed of the bus
than before.
L284[11:36:11] <Mat2ch> But there was no
way to determine automatically what chip you have in front of
you.
L285[11:36:19] <Althego> lol
L286[11:36:33] <Althego> let me guess, had
to run a small test
L287[11:36:37] <Mat2ch> I recommend
installing a webcam on the chip and reading the label ;)
L288[11:36:46] <Mat2ch> He rejected the
driver ;)
L291[11:45:58] <hatrix> ok the "new
probe" thing is ticked now :)
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L295[12:13:34] <Shoe> Althego: javascript
is the future of UI, as much as we hate it
L296[12:13:40] <Althego> hehe
L297[12:13:58] <Althego> that was
prophesized long time go
L298[12:16:37] <packbart> I don't really
hate it (much)
L301[12:31:27] <FLHerne> > Of course we
play KSP :)
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L309[13:40:48] <darsie> The Ant and Oscar
B served as crumpling zone for landing.
L310[13:40:52] <Althego> i was wondering
what the station was
L311[13:41:00] <Althego> i didnt recognize
this as a station
L312[13:41:01] <darsie> Rolled to the
target.
L313[13:41:15] <darsie> The thing with 5
seats.
L314[13:41:22] <Althego> why not 6
L315[13:41:29] <darsie> Contract asked for
5.
L316[13:41:38] <Althego> but 6 is easier
to do
L317[13:41:47] <darsie> I have a mod that
can do 5 ;).
L318[13:41:55] <darsie> EEX
L319[13:42:04] <bEagle> oh no 5
L320[13:42:12] <darsie> Plus, 5 is more
comfy :).
L321[13:42:23] <bEagle> like that thing is
comfy to begin with
L322[13:42:31] <darsie> :)
L323[13:42:36] <bEagle> :) to you too
:D
L324[13:42:58] <darsie> It's just the
beginning. It may be expanded wiht the docking port :).
L325[13:43:12] <Althego> hehe
L326[13:44:28] <darsie> The lander can is
for refuelling jetpacks etc. Tourists have to get in an external
command seat to receive fuel from Munfrey, as they can't leave the
capsule once they enter.
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L328[13:46:09] <JVFoxy> wait... tourists
can sit on the seats?
L329[13:46:27] <bEagle>
that's...wrong
L330[13:46:50] <darsie> JVFoxy: They can.
At least in 1.7.3.
L331[13:47:12] <darsie> They can't leave
capsules, though.
L332[13:47:28] <darsie> Someone tell me if
they still can in 1.9.1.
L333[13:48:17] <JVFoxy> ah ok.. I hadn't
gotten quite that far in the tech tree in most games to get the
chair yet
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L336[13:48:51] <bEagle> there are so many
things the wiki doesn't know
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L338[13:49:04] <darsie> Add it.
L339[13:49:09] <Black_Eagle> no.
L340[13:49:25] <darsie> Munvey*
L341[13:52:31] <JVFoxy> Black_Eagle as in
what sort of tihngs?
L342[13:55:57] <Black_Eagle> ah, lots of
things like aerodynamics and tourists leaving seats and so
forth
L343[13:56:22] <Black_Eagle> i don't
remember all of them rn but it's not uncommon for me to stumble
upon something the wiki doesn't know
L344[13:56:28] <Black_Eagle> anyway
L345[13:56:36] <Black_Eagle> i'm sorry but
i must head to bed
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L349[14:00:39] <darsie> Where is
that?
L350[14:01:09] <hatrix> in a galaxy far
far away
L351[14:01:19] <hatrix> that's the Beyond
Home system
L352[14:01:40] <hatrix> I was getting
bored with the stock planets
L353[14:02:34] <hatrix> I like to
calculate stuff, in the stock game I didn't need relays anymore
:(
L354[14:04:20] <JVFoxy> Parts had drag
values but now I think that is tweeked a bit depending on how they
are connected to other things/
L355[14:04:42] <packbart> hmmyeah, that
Tracking Station mod looks nice. I think I'll try it
L356[14:04:56] <hatrix> definitely
useful
L357[14:05:11] <hatrix> I could argue it
lacks custom groups but that's already better than nothing
L358[14:05:52] <JVFoxy> relay networks...
that time I found someone's 'scatternetwork' video.. laser show
much?
L359[14:06:11] <hatrix> displaying all
vessels isn't a good idea :)
L360[14:06:31] <hatrix> I usually go with
path
L361[14:07:05] <packbart> I used
"CommnetVisualisation" for that. It shows only the paths
(of all vessels) instead of all the links
L362[14:07:53] <packbart> Now I use its
parent "CommnetConstellation" and use different
"frequencies" (and colors) for different networks, like
"local", "Kerbin SOI", "InterNet",
et.
L363[14:08:06] <packbart> needs more
antenna parts, though
L365[14:11:51] <hatrix> do you have
screenshots packbart?
L366[14:12:03] <hatrix> that's awfull
JVFoxy :)
L367[14:12:34] <JVFoxy> not mine.. I was
trying to find another pic, but concept is about the same
L368[14:12:49] <JVFoxy> can't say the PC
would be too happy about it.
L369[14:19:04] <flayer> flying through
some clouds hoping not to hit mountains
L370[14:21:09] <darsie> Someone tell me if
tourists can sit in command seats in 1.9.1.
L371[14:31:59] <flayer> i gotta do
something about the landing (nose is pointing up in the air lol),
but everybody's safe
L372[14:34:35] <JVFoxy> any landing you
walk away from, is a good landing. Unless its on the moon...
L373[14:34:50] <JVFoxy> ... sorry crash
landing that is
L374[14:46:55] <packbart> hatrix: no,
sorry, I can't find the sandbox save with a larger network and my
current career doesn't extend beyond Minmus, yet :)
L375[14:52:01] <JVFoxy> I've barely
reached out past Minmus... figured if I ever do, get out to one of
other planets, then maybe I can 'join the club'.
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L378[15:07:01] <kmath>
<nextspaceflight> SpaceX has been given NASA approval to fly
flight-proven Falcon 9 and Crew Dragon vehicles during Commercial
Crew f…
https://t.co/6LTxpKpSGA
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L384[15:30:50] <hatrix> I don't understand
that tweet packbart, care to explain?
L385[15:31:31] <raptop> They may refly the
Dragon capsul that took Bob and Doug to the ISS
L386[15:32:04] <hatrix> it was named
endeavour?
L387[15:32:17] <hatrix> I only know a
space shuttle with that name
L388[15:32:18] <raptop> Yes, like the
british ship and the shuttle
L389[15:32:25] <hatrix> oh ok so not the
same
L390[15:32:27] <hatrix> I was
confused
L391[15:32:33] <hatrix> properly
confused
L392[15:32:58] <raptop> fair enough
L393[15:33:25] <hatrix> I pictured a space
shuttle atop a falcon 9
L395[15:34:36] <packbart> and they had to
make everything look Apollo-like, of course ;)
L396[15:35:36] <JVFoxy> kept thinking of
that ship display in Star Trek: TNG, of all the ones named
Enterprise
L397[15:35:52] <JVFoxy> I guess Dragon
doesn't make it up there
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L400[15:46:29] <Mat2ch> well, refly
doesn't mean it will take astronauts
L401[15:46:37] <Mat2ch> they could just
reuse it for cargo flights
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L405[16:18:23] <hatrix> anyone played with
Principia here and got some feedback?
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L436[23:02:55] <Althego> total
annihilation is free on gog (for 7 more hours). but i already have
it
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L438[23:17:58] <raptop> ooh
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L440[23:18:30] <raptop> uh
L441[23:19:22] <raptop> Apparently I'm bad
at navigating gog (it took a moment to find)
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