OCLogs: 2018-07-25.log

Stuff goes here

L1[00:07:31] <Draconiator> Hmmm, I just saw a tumbling satellite. thought it was a firefly at first. 2 flashes about a second apart, then a pause of 5 seconds.

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L3[00:08:33] <Draconiator> Over Northern Maine, USA about 1AM EST

L4[00:16:21] <Draconiator> Think I found it. https://www.n2yo.com/satellite/?s=5213

L5[00:22:34] <JVFoxy> must have just started going into shadow when you saw it

L6[00:24:12] <JVFoxy> I saw the ISS buzz over head a few weeks back I was about pack things up and go inside after trying to track one of the other ham satellites

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L27[04:56:14] <Mat2ch> uh uh, launch in around two hours \o/

L28[04:57:15] <JVFoxy> when does the 'rocket age' start?

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L42[06:51:06] <Mat2ch> So, that was a funny SpaceX launch. First you see nothing, after 300m you see the mist layer and then you see nothing again, because everything is in the dark and nobody seems to pack the Sony camera chips that can "see" in the dark

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L51[09:05:32] <Eddi|zuHause> <JVFoxy> when does the 'rocket age' start? <-- when rockets are the dominant form of transportation

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L53[09:06:18] <JVFoxy> commute to work in space... by rocket? I kind of hope we find some other means to get out there. Hate to see the ground littered with parts

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L62[09:28:51] <Althego> i couldnt log in because of the +r

L63[09:29:02] <Althego> but i watched the double launch live

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L66[09:44:11] <TheKosmonaut> Althego: we are being bombarded by bots

L67[09:44:13] <TheKosmonaut> Sorry

L68[09:44:26] <APlayer> Should we put up a warning in the topic?

L69[09:44:26] <Althego> i wonder how i can get my password from the client :)

L70[09:44:33] <Althego> that doesnt help

L71[09:44:53] <TheKosmonaut> APlayer: well it won't help if they can't join

L72[09:44:54] <APlayer> It would tell people to register before joining, due to reasons

L73[09:44:59] <APlayer> Sure it will

L74[09:45:07] <TheKosmonaut> Not if they can't join the channel

L75[09:45:09] <APlayer> /topic #[channel]

L76[09:45:11] <Althego> no because when i cant join then i dont see the topic :9

L77[09:45:22] <Althego> ah never tried that

L78[09:45:28] <TheKosmonaut> APlayer: if they're not registered, I doubt they'd do that though

L79[09:45:32] <TheKosmonaut> Worth a shot

L80[09:46:01] <APlayer> Or, not sure if that works on EsperNet, but I've seen channel redirects on freenode

L81[09:46:24] <Zarthus> they work here too

L82[09:46:32] <APlayer> That is, registered users join the intended channel, unregistered ones get redirected to, say #KSPOfficial-unregistered

L83[09:46:47] <Zarthus> /mode #channelA +b *!*@somehost$#channelB

L84[09:47:08] <APlayer> That sounds ideal to me

L85[09:48:01] <Zarthus> i'm not sure if it works with extbans, but in theory /mode #KSPOfficial +b $~a$#kspofficial-unreg should work.

L86[09:48:17] <Zarthus> so long as the person setting the ban owns #KSPOfficial-unreg

L87[09:48:43] <APlayer> Does that lift the ban when the person registers?

L88[09:48:58] <JVFoxy> Althego wait.. double launch?

L89[09:49:13] <Zarthus> APlayer: yes. because of the $a extban

L90[09:49:13] <Wastl2> Isn't it +f rather than +b?

L91[09:49:21] <Althego> yes, there was an ariane 5 launching 4 galileo sats and a spacex launch with 10 iridium at the same time

L92[09:49:23] <APlayer> Ah, I see

L93[09:49:29] <Zarthus> a +f applies to all users

L94[09:49:38] <Zarthus> they want only unregistered users.

L95[09:49:48] <JVFoxy> Althego ah ok... same site or.. I heard something but didn't get to check further

L96[09:49:57] <Althego> hehe, no

L97[09:50:03] <APlayer> No way they launch two rockets from one site

L98[09:50:19] <APlayer> Ariane is Kourou (however you spell that), SpaceX is KSC

L99[09:50:24] <Althego> ariane is usually french guyana, spacex was vandenberg

L100[09:51:07] <APlayer> TheKosmonaut, UmbralRaptop: What do you guys say about the channel redirect thing?

L101[09:51:35] <Wastl2> With +f, it forwards all users that are unable to join because of some channel modes, among them +r.

L102[09:51:41] <Zarthus> oh

L103[09:51:48] <Zarthus> you could be right on that, yeah

L104[09:52:05] <JVFoxy> ya.. though come to think of it, reasons for not doing a double launch at same site, like KSC?

L105[09:53:03] <APlayer> JVFoxy: One explosion breaks two schedules, for one. Also, the launches would have to be in sync, on order to evacuate all staff from the site, and in order to not affect one another in terms of radio and whatever

L106[09:53:25] <APlayer> The fuel, staff and water capacity is probably only enough for one rocket too

L107[09:53:44] <APlayer> Plenty of reasons

L108[09:54:30] <Althego> but spacex did double launcing already :)

L109[09:54:31] <TheKosmonaut> APlayer: that's a decent idea yeah

L110[09:54:34] <Althego> landiung

L111[09:54:37] <Althego> klan

L112[09:54:38] <Althego> eh

L113[09:54:40] <Althego> landing

L114[09:54:46] <TheKosmonaut> I dont trust myself to set that up, I'm on my phone and in the train atm

L115[09:54:47] <APlayer> Landing is a different thing from launching

L116[09:55:19] <APlayer> Zarthus: Do we just set up #KSPOfficial-unregistered and set the mode you send us on #KSPOfficial?

L117[09:55:34] <Zarthus> yeah, but +f #KSPOfficial-unreg should be better.

L118[09:55:40] <Zarthus> I *think*, I'm not sure.

L119[09:55:49] <Zarthus> +f might also get banned people, but eh.

L120[09:55:56] <APlayer> Why not.

L121[09:56:34] <Zarthus> i would advocate setting +m on that channel too so the spammers don't become annoying there.

L122[09:56:43] <Wastl2> +f gets people who can't join due to +ijlr, that is, invite only, join throttle, limit, registered only.

L123[09:56:48] <JVFoxy> so.. like that scene in Armageddon, would never happen :P

L124[09:57:03] <Zarthus> cool, you seem to know more about it than i do

L125[09:57:19] * Zarthus is actively playing WoW right now.

L126[09:57:27] <Zarthus> did I say WoW? I meant World of Kerbals.

L127[09:57:43] <JVFoxy> well Gemini they launched two kinds of craft, not at the same time but from same site, just spaced out by an hour and half.

L128[09:58:12] <APlayer> Could someone please test the setup?

L129[09:59:11] <Zarthus> sure.

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L131[09:59:46] <Zarthus> (16:59:38) Cannot join channel (+r) - you need to be identified with services

L132[09:59:49] <Zarthus> you forgot to add +f

L133[10:00:08] <APlayer> /mode #KSPOfficial +f $~a$#kspofficial-unreg

L134[10:00:16] <APlayer> That's what I used

L135[10:00:20] <Draconiator> lol, my auto excecute is too fast.

L136[10:00:21] <Draconiator> Cannot join channel (+r) - you need to be identified with services

L137[10:00:21] <Draconiator> -NickServ- You are now identified for Draconiator.

L138[10:00:21] <Draconiator> -

L139[10:00:50] <APlayer> /mode #KSPOfficial +f $~a$#KSPOfficial-unreg

L140[10:00:55] * UmbralRaptop has had that before

L141[10:01:14] <APlayer> Let me try that (it's not case sensitive though, is it?)

L142[10:01:36] <Althego> now i changed the password, hopefully i can remember it now

L143[10:02:09] <UmbralRaptop> Case only affects how it looks.

L144[10:02:28] <JVFoxy> ugh I changed my nick.. had to add password.. was worried about coming back, and ya, totally screwed things up.. took ten minutes fixing

L145[10:04:58] <APlayer> Zarthus: Ah, now I see. I'm getting "$~a$#KSPOfficial-unreg :No such channel"

L146[10:05:43] <Zarthus> APlayer:

L147[10:05:44] <Zarthus> /mode #KSPOfficial +f #KSPOfficial-unreg

L148[10:05:51] <Zarthus> the $~a was part of a different syntax.

L149[10:06:07] *** APlayer sets mode: +f #KSPOfficial-unreg

L150[10:06:18] <APlayer> Perfect

L151[10:06:24] <APlayer> Thank you very much!

L152[10:07:04] <Zarthus> QA approved.

L153[10:07:39] <JVFoxy> mmm.. yay?

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L155[10:19:57] <mischief> that's odd

L156[10:20:06] <mischief> jebediah kerman is alive and in my crew manifest again.

L157[10:20:09] <mischief> thought he died o.O

L158[10:20:21] <Althego> depends on game settings

L159[10:20:33] <Althego> normally they go to missing and magically reapper

L160[10:20:49] <JVFoxy> the core 4... just MIA.. for a bit

L161[10:20:56] <JVFoxy> others not so lucky

L162[10:24:48] <Althego> there is some suspicion that they are cloned

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L164[10:25:49] <JVFoxy> center hasn't a cloning building... that we know of

L165[10:26:01] <Althego> must be underground

L166[10:26:07] <Althego> where do you think all those kerbals come from

L167[10:26:25] <JVFoxy> then again.. from what I remember the history behind how they came up with the idea of the game....

L168[10:26:43] <JVFoxy> its just in how you want to see it...

L169[10:30:12] <mischief> my stupid rockets always fall over

L170[10:30:44] <JVFoxy> in flight or on the ground?

L171[10:31:10] <mischief> flight

L172[10:31:21] <mischief> probably drag

L173[10:32:36] <JVFoxy> pic.. otherwise I can only guess

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L175[10:44:14] <Althego> dont forget by default tanks drain from the top

L176[10:44:35] <Althego> so a rocket becomes increasingly unstable in flight

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L178[10:44:47] <JVFoxy> ... remember that being the old way

L179[10:45:04] <Althego> you can change that now by priority

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L181[10:47:21] <JVFoxy> remember old system, top most tanks drained first, down towards engines.. trouble was each tank had fuel and oxy at the same time

L182[10:47:38] <JVFoxy> now.. they all drain evenly as far as I remember..

L183[10:47:42] <JVFoxy> butyou can also set it up how you want

L184[10:48:15] <Althego> even if they drain evenly

L185[10:48:25] <Althego> the payload (like next stage) is on the top

L186[10:48:29] <Althego> unchanging

L187[10:48:35] <APlayer> mischief: Imagine a dart. It is very heavy at the front, and has fins at the back. This keeps the front at the front due to momentum, and the back drags behind due to the fins. That's also how your rocket should look like.

L188[10:49:24] <Althego> but where the lack of real aero calculations shows for me is that it is really hard to have a rocket without fins, while in reality that does not seem to be a problem

L189[10:49:50] <APlayer> Front heavy, and the drag should be at the back. Note that adding fins is undesirable unless absolutely necessary, because (1) you loose some dv to the additional drag, and (2), once you dump your stage with the fins, you loose your drag and your upper stage is what starts tipping over.

L190[10:50:16] <APlayer> The proper solution is to make it front heavy, really

L191[10:50:22] <Althego> unless you pushed the first stage tp an altitude where that doesnt happen

L192[10:50:35] <Mat2ch> Althego: Almost none of my rockets in KSP have fins

L193[10:50:43] <APlayer> Althego: If you do that in stock, your rocket will probably be unreasonable

L194[10:51:14] <Mat2ch> I just don't flip them ;)

L195[10:51:38] <Ezko> no turning after initial turn to start the gravity turn and it's fine for me at least

L196[10:51:41] <JVFoxy> Althego its a bit of a balancing act... it can be done with no fins.. I've done a lot of times. Just have to be careful on the design. And that you don't pitch over too far

L197[10:51:45] <Mat2ch> And I guess most real rockets would flip as well, if the exceed their turn speed

L198[10:52:15] <Ezko> follow surface prograde vector after the initial turn and no flipping

L199[10:52:36] <JVFoxy> a lot of people think 'oh more boosters, more engines'... trouble is, the more you add down there, the more weight will sit low

L200[10:52:49] <APlayer> Mat2ch: Rockets tend to tip over if you mount the sensor array wrong side up

L201[10:52:54] <Mat2ch> ;D

L202[10:53:27] <TheKosmonaut> Make fun of Proton

L203[10:53:34] <TheKosmonaut> But they did RTLS before spacex

L204[10:53:44] <APlayer> They did?

L205[10:53:58] <TheKosmonaut> So... Add that to the list of things russia/USSR did before America.

L206[10:54:00] <APlayer> Definitely never landed it, though

L207[10:54:03] <TheKosmonaut> APlayer: sure. That proton

L208[10:54:07] <TheKosmonaut> It went right back!

L209[10:54:12] <TheKosmonaut> GREAT SUCCESS YES

L210[10:54:16] <APlayer> Ah, got it

L211[10:54:20] <Althego> hehe

L212[10:54:26] <APlayer> I want to die on Mars, but not on impact?

L213[10:55:25] <JVFoxy> just hope you don't die on the way to mars first..

L214[10:55:55] <JVFoxy> was proton RTLS before gemini's 4" lift off?

L215[10:56:25] <APlayer> Is that like the choking physicist? That one must have lied when he said that he enjoyed working in a gravity-free vacuum

L216[10:56:29] <JVFoxy> I seem to recall one of the gemini's launched but it was aborted. landed right back on teh pad :P

L217[10:57:42] <mischief> hooray, i recovered Arlan

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L219[10:57:58] <mischief> no kerbal left behind

L220[10:58:41] <APlayer> Aye!

L221[10:59:30] <mischief> i don't think these missions to rescue people from the mun are worth it

L222[10:59:35] <mischief> not enough kerb bucks :(

L223[10:59:43] <Althego> from orbit?

L224[10:59:48] <Althego> free kerbals

L225[10:59:54] <mischief> err sorry

L226[10:59:58] <mischief> taking VIP to the mun

L227[11:00:10] <Althego> that is ok, if you do multiple things together

L228[11:00:32] <JVFoxy> lol...

L229[11:00:38] <mischief> this is land a vip on the mun for like, < $20,000

L230[11:00:46] <JVFoxy> mun rescue contract... ya I wanna video one of those

L231[11:00:56] <Althego> still a money if you take 2-3 other missions too

L232[11:01:09] <JVFoxy> in fact.. I've a ship in orbit from a previous mission I did that I can use...

L233[11:01:24] <JVFoxy> trouble is... it lacks fuel for the plane change.. so.. I found away around that

L234[11:01:43] <mischief> i need science so i can get the dang docking port

L235[11:03:00] <mischief> ill try a probe building mission

L236[11:03:16] <Althego> docking port is overrated :)

L237[11:04:14] <JVFoxy> frig... if I recall right, stack decouplers way over rated too

L238[11:04:26] <JVFoxy> some video I recall... someone used a moon to remove a fuel tank

L239[11:04:40] <Althego> yes it was a 3 parts to the moon and back

L240[11:04:49] <mischief> wat

L241[11:04:52] <Althego> needed to stage the tank

L242[11:05:00] <Althego> so hit it on the mun

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L245[11:05:34] <mischief> hm

L246[11:05:41] <mischief> i dont have parts small enough to make a good probe

L247[11:05:57] <Althego> but since then engine isp was nerfed because of less atmosphere

L248[11:06:13] <Althego> so probably the 3 parts to the mun and back doesnt work anymore

L249[11:06:20] <Althego> but you can still go to hilly

L250[11:06:22] <Althego> gilly

L251[11:07:03] <JVFoxy> hill billy gilly?

L252[11:07:05] <mischief> i guess my probe will just be huge.

L253[11:07:39] <JVFoxy> how much science have you farmed around on kerbin?

L254[11:07:46] <Althego> trust me, i know probes like nobody else. it will be the best probe, huge, tremendous

L255[11:07:50] <mischief> probably not all of it

L256[11:08:08] <JVFoxy> I usually putter around with a jet car of sorts.

L257[11:08:17] <Althego> isnt worth to really farm science on kerbin, maybe until the gravity things

L258[11:08:35] <Althego> ksc gives you soem

L259[11:08:41] <JVFoxy> the mountain/highlands/grasslands science farming was.. interesting. jet powered vtol... ;)

L260[11:09:17] <JVFoxy> I know a lot of people get headaches doign jet powered vtols because of the spool up/down lag... just need to know how to anticipate

L261[11:09:33] <Althego> just land with a plane

L262[11:09:43] <Althego> i routinely land on mountains with the science plane 3

L263[11:10:14] <mischief> i dont think i even have plane parts.

L264[11:11:13] <JVFoxy> I guess.. but I fly planes all the time

L265[11:12:04] <JVFoxy> trouble is, having to find a spot smooth enough to land on... usually up a hill. Then turn around, hope you don't bounce, roll over or osmething

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L267[11:15:26] <mischief> flipping again -_-

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L271[11:27:13] <JVFoxy> mischief mmm... toss a pic, see whats wrong

L272[11:27:55] <APlayer> Yeah, that's a thing you should learn. Share pics of your craft, because we enjoy looking at it, and because we may help with issues if we have a pic. :-)

L273[11:28:20] <Althego> hmmm. you can flip other things too :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Gc4QTqslN4

L274[11:28:21] <kmath> YouTube - The Trashmen - Surfin Bird - Bird is the Word 1963 (RE-MASTERED) (ALT End Video) (OFFICIAL VIDEO)

L275[11:29:01] <Althego> (and i dont even watch family guy)

L276[11:31:57] <mischief> why is it so hard to keep my probe straight when the engine is on :(

L277[11:32:05] <mischief> i think i just need to get real probe parts

L278[11:32:22] <Althego> it should be easier with the engine on

L279[11:32:32] <Althego> with some vectoring at least

L280[11:32:38] <mischief> ah

L281[11:32:43] <mischief> no vecoting in this engine

L282[11:32:56] <Althego> there i syour problem

L283[11:32:58] <mischief> also, i can't set this probe orbit as a target

L284[11:33:00] <mischief> that's annoying

L285[11:33:21] <JVFoxy> its just the level of the probe

L286[11:33:39] <JVFoxy> do you mean orbit, or prograde?

L287[11:34:11] <mischief> i have a mission to put a probe in an orbit

L288[11:34:29] <mischief> it's shown in purple in map view but i can't 'set as target'

L289[11:34:45] <Althego> yes that is kind of annoyinh

L290[11:34:47] <JVFoxy> once you get into the general direction of the orbit... and out of the atmesphere, really only need to use map view.

L291[11:34:49] <Althego> but you can get around it

L292[11:34:59] <Althego> and also no real precision is required

L293[11:35:32] <JVFoxy> lol.. I avoid doing satellite contracts but I'll snag the occasional kerbal in orbit rescue mission

L294[11:35:45] <Althego> i use them to deploy my commsats

L295[11:35:54] <Althego> so i get my sats for free

L296[11:36:07] <JVFoxy> I wouldn't mind a space station contract.. if the requirements weren't so high

L297[11:36:13] <APlayer> How would you set an orbit as target? A target only adds a marker for you to point at a thing. An orbit is not something you could point at

L298[11:36:28] <Althego> the station and base contratcs are full of fuel

L299[11:36:38] <Althego> i look at them: no way i am transporting that much, skip it

L300[11:36:43] <JVFoxy> I mean.. 5 kerbals.. 6000 fuel.. really?

L301[11:36:57] <Althego> how? by selecting it

L302[11:37:09] <Althego> basically without target selection there is no way to display inclination for example

L303[11:37:26] <Althego> ok it shows the and and dn, but cant really pinpoint it

L304[11:37:36] <JVFoxy> guess just have to pan the view, see how close you can get

L305[11:37:50] <Althego> so for that you have to place the comare that you look at both orbits from the side

L306[11:37:54] <Althego> and this is just annoying

L307[11:38:07] <JVFoxy> I got one geo stationary contract... said it wanted over a particular landmark on kerbin... eh..

L308[11:38:08] <Althego> it should just display the an/dn point as for targets

L309[11:38:51] <JVFoxy> I suppose I could do an orbit contract.....

L310[11:39:23] <JVFoxy> just.. interests sorta stuck else where mission idea wise

L311[11:41:07] <mischief> https://i.imgur.com/RxYlYMs.png

L312[11:41:13] <mischief> not sure i have enough fuel left

L313[11:41:40] <Althego> at that point you need very little

L314[11:42:14] <JVFoxy> that far out... go for it..

L315[11:42:38] <JVFoxy> going slow enough, requirements aren't big.. it'll be tight though

L316[11:44:07] <mischief> YAY

L317[11:44:09] <mischief> i made it

L318[11:44:22] <JVFoxy> I could so easily upgrade my VAB/SPH early on.. get unlimited size/weight.. but then, where's the challenge?

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L320[11:48:07] <Althego> my usual challenge to launch an eve probe in the first few days while it is still in the window, launch a duna probe that arrive when the launch window opens

L321[11:48:25] <Althego> but at rrival both are really outdated

L322[11:49:05] <mischief> https://i.imgur.com/59uwuKw.jpg

L323[11:49:10] <mischief> here's my goofy lookin probe

L324[11:49:27] <Althego> hehe

L325[11:49:34] <Althego> yes i usually do stuff like that too

L326[11:49:51] <Althego> with 2 antennas, and those are my first commsats to

L327[11:50:05] <mischief> ah, you need 2?!

L328[11:50:09] <Althego> no

L329[11:50:13] <mischief> oh

L330[11:50:18] <Althego> but these are not really powerful antenna

L331[11:50:18] <mischief> i added only one of the big ones

L332[11:50:21] <mischief> it said it can relay

L333[11:50:24] <Althego> yes

L334[11:50:36] <Althego> at least 1 from this

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L336[11:50:49] <Althego> but for antennaless probes moving on the surface and such

L337[11:50:56] <Althego> these are really weak

L338[11:51:07] <mischief> so what interesting thing can i do now that there is a probe in the air?

L339[11:51:35] <Althego> also even with 2 antennas they cant be too far away because the signal is weak

L340[11:51:43] <JVFoxy> mischief oh .. tip...

L341[11:52:18] <JVFoxy> when you get a chance, turn your probe so the sun will hit panels all around regardless where it is.. that way don't get stuck without a relay hwen sun hits spot on it where blocks panels

L342[11:53:03] <Althego> usually i do that too but i doubt electricity is simulated why unfocused

L343[11:53:18] <Althego> while

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L345[11:54:20] <JVFoxy> would have to test it... I never really thought of it. I just set the orientation up just in case.. I know its a problem when you warp.. and forget

L346[11:55:19] <JVFoxy> lol.. I hate when some stuff gets so rail tracked... like debris that refuses to disappear, even though its orbit takes it far down inside of kerbin.. yet comes out fine when not focused?

L347[11:55:33] <Althego> hehe

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L349[11:55:43] <Althego> yes i dont like this aspect

L350[11:55:56] <Althego> debris actually is deorbited below a certain altitude

L351[11:56:16] <Althego> but if it is above that and not focues, it just stays there

L352[11:57:06] <JVFoxy> I usually just decomission them manually when I get the chance if they get that low and don't go away

L353[11:58:51] <Draconiator> Is it possible to keep something orbiting Kerbin in the high atmosphere? I.E. more than 65K

L354[11:59:35] <JVFoxy> think it warns you before you go back to tracking center

L355[12:00:08] <JVFoxy> lol.. possible.. ? leave a plane in orbit.. come back ot it when its over something you want ot chekc out

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L357[12:01:26] <Althego> it is possible to have it dip down periodically

L358[12:01:54] <Althego> but that is alreayd orbital speed

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L360[12:04:15] <JVFoxy> old version.. I could get it just slightly over oribital speed just below the 70km mark.. had to actually pull a slight negative to keep it from flying off

L361[12:04:49] <JVFoxy> burned quite a bit of fuel getting up there, but once it was there... was crazy efficient

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L364[12:06:56] <mischief> does direction matter for antennas?

L365[12:07:00] <Althego> ah yes the near orbital jets

L366[12:07:04] <Althego> no

L367[12:07:07] <Althego> not in stock

L368[12:08:29] <JVFoxy> heh.. thankfully.

L369[12:10:23] <mischief> hm

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L371[12:12:31] <JVFoxy> those red and white extendable antenna's.. I, a while back, stuck about 8 of them on a probe.. made it look like some sorta futuristic space landmine.

L372[12:12:56] <JVFoxy> didn't mean to.. just looked cool. then relays became a thing

L373[12:17:19] <Althego> but the tiny dish is still better and cuter

L374[12:19:00] <mischief> have to rescue someone at 15 million meters out -_-

L375[12:19:07] <mischief> i need a bigger rocket

L376[12:19:28] <Althego> looks like you gonna need a bigger boat :)

L377[12:20:49] <mischief> time to break out the main sail

L378[12:21:57] <mischief> ship cost a lot :<

L379[12:23:29] <JVFoxy> mischief its cute with the one dish, ya. Though I wonder how much it threw the balance off on you

L380[12:23:42] <Althego> not much

L381[12:24:07] <JVFoxy> I usually try to balance things out.. but thats just me

L382[12:28:48] <mischief> is it better to do a bunch of burns to get a large orbit or is it the same as doing one big burn

L383[12:29:44] <Althego> one burn should be better. but if you twr is really low you must split the burn in several orbits

L384[12:31:05] <APlayer> "Space land mines" sound useful

L385[12:31:14] <mischief> i have about 2/3 a tank and i'm only at 1 million meters

L386[12:31:21] <mischief> have to go to 15 million and back

L387[12:31:28] <mischief> not to mention actually rendezvous

L388[12:33:44] * JVFoxy holds up a hand, going to try and rebuild his... space mine thing...

L389[12:34:49] <Althego> like this? https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/22/Vanguard_1_composite.jpg

L390[12:35:27] <JVFoxy> eh well... maybe not so 'ball' :P

L391[12:37:58] <Althego> hehe mark hamill went to san diego comic can... as a stormtrooper :)

L392[12:38:56] <umaxtu> hamill seems like a cool dude

L393[12:39:22] <Althego> hehe he also was something else too, but i cant write that here

L394[12:39:56] <APlayer> Ahem

L395[12:40:59] <JVFoxy> weee

L396[12:40:59] <JVFoxy> https://imgur.com/a/SX6bVEI

L397[12:41:00] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/0wIlWFh.png

L398[12:41:54] <JVFoxy> have a hard time doing names.. just called it ... prober

L399[12:42:33] <APlayer> Yay! Space hedgehog!

L400[12:43:08] <JVFoxy> well... probably needs more spikes than that

L401[12:43:44] <APlayer> Space Spiky!

L402[12:47:07] <JVFoxy> I know in real life... relay sats have antennas like that too, but are dedicated to just receiver and transmitter parts, which are connected together inside.

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L404[12:47:50] <JVFoxy> KSP.. idea of a 'relay'... means using the same dish to work two ways.. but anyways

L405[12:55:56] <mischief> think i can cover 1km in space on eva?

L406[12:56:04] <Althego> easily

L407[12:56:10] <mischief> let's do it :D

L408[12:56:15] <APlayer> What for?

L409[12:56:54] <mischief> rescue

L410[12:57:03] <mischief> the problem will be getting home

L411[12:57:18] <APlayer> I suggest you get a bit closer. 1 km is doable, but can be avoided

L412[12:57:27] <mischief> no monopropellant

L413[12:57:29] <mischief> low fuel

L414[12:57:34] <JVFoxy> ugh.. ok delta v map... ok ya I can find that easily enough. the delta v calculator thing I used to use all the time, not so much easily found

L415[12:57:36] <Althego> usually my problem is not to hit the target in a rescue

L416[12:59:17] <mischief> we are in!

L417[12:59:20] <mischief> now to get home..

L418[12:59:25] <mischief> no fuel... far away...

L419[12:59:37] <Althego> country road, take me home

L420[13:02:25] <JVFoxy> ah there we go.. derp found it

L421[13:03:12] <mischief> is 50km enough to be caught by atmosphere?

L422[13:03:25] <mischief> guess i can adjust later.

L423[13:03:32] <mischief> time for a deep dive

L424[13:03:36] <Althego> you will be slowed down slightly

L425[13:03:47] <Althego> with low to moderate heating

L426[13:04:08] <mischief> we'll find out how 'moderate' quite shortly

L427[13:04:19] <Althego> probably not noticable

L428[13:04:27] <mischief> going at 3.2km/s

L429[13:04:29] <Althego> unless you are coming back from jool :)

L430[13:04:41] <mischief> haha

L431[13:05:07] <Althego> 3.2 km/s that is close to the mun distance

L432[13:05:18] <JVFoxy> so.. that little probe thing I did... with ant engine DV of 1900...

L433[13:05:23] <Eddi|zuHause> <APlayer> How would you set an orbit as target? A target only adds a marker for you to point at a thing. An orbit is not something you could point at <-- would be useful to have AN/DN at least

L434[13:05:36] <mischief> i'll just point my rear end first

L435[13:05:40] <mischief> that way it burns off first :)

L436[13:05:52] <mischief> aw crap

L437[13:05:55] <mischief> i escaped

L438[13:05:58] <APlayer> Add maneuver at AN/DN, execute

L439[13:06:06] <APlayer> Eddi ^

L440[13:06:16] <mischief> Althego: yes, i had to go to 15 million meters for a rescue

L441[13:06:28] <Althego> i dint know the distance to the mun

L442[13:06:44] <Eddi|zuHause> APlayer: but there is no marker for AN to put the maneuver node to, if you don't have a target

L443[13:06:55] <Althego> yes that is the problem

L444[13:06:59] <Althego> you can work around it

L445[13:07:04] <Althego> but really annoying

L446[13:07:04] <APlayer> Ah, got it

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L449[13:09:13] <mischief> only gonna take a few orbits to slow down xD

L450[13:09:25] <Althego> yes, that is why 45 km is better

L451[13:09:27] <Eddi|zuHause> you currently have to do some map perspective tricks to align the maneuver node with the virtual orbit plane

L452[13:10:27] <Althego> what i do i align the orbits to be seen from the edge but from a point where the node is visible and covers the node from the other side, so i can put the node there

L453[13:10:36] <Althego> really annoying and unnecessary

L454[13:10:41] <Eddi|zuHause> exactly

L455[13:10:55] *** tivec is now known as Tivec

L456[13:11:11] <Althego> also if you want to know the inclination of your orbit you have to target the current moon, and if you have only an inclined one, or none, you cant know it

L457[13:11:25] <Althego> (only with ker)

L458[13:14:05] <mischief> rscue was a success :-D

L459[13:14:09] <mischief> barely made it home

L460[13:16:01] <Eddi|zuHause> that is really typical KSP then :p

L461[13:16:25] <Althego> no that is the 0 fuel left when landing on the mun a few meters up

L462[13:16:37] <mischief> now i'll try to build a plane

L463[13:16:42] <mischief> and get whatever science i can on kerbin

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L465[13:17:34] <Eddi|zuHause> i usually get these things during random missions to places

L466[13:18:00] <Eddi|zuHause> like when it says "get temperature readings from the poles"

L467[13:18:33] <Althego> write an email to a pole you know :)

L468[13:19:08] <Eddi|zuHause> i was like 10m into poland once

L469[13:19:24] <Eddi|zuHause> on the mountain we call "Schneekoppe"

L470[13:20:27] <Eddi|zuHause> (approached from the czech side)

L471[13:21:04] <Eddi|zuHause> https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schneekoppe

L472[13:21:22] <mischief> i hate when the attachment points in the editor get messed up

L473[13:21:33] <Althego> what do you mean

L474[13:21:54] <mischief> trying to put a fuselage on a crew cabin in plane mode

L475[13:22:00] <mischief> it wont line up with the center

L476[13:22:11] <mischief> it did a few minutes ago and now it wont

L477[13:22:24] <Althego> c?

L478[13:22:38] <mischief> nop

L479[13:22:52] <mischief> ... hitchhiker storage container works

L480[13:23:09] <mischief> aha

L481[13:23:13] <mischief> i reselected the part

L482[13:24:11] <Eddi|zuHause> sometimes the perspective is weird, and the nodes won't snap

L483[13:24:32] <Eddi|zuHause> i try it from different viewing angles in those cases

L484[13:25:40] <mischief> where the hell are you supposed to put engines on planes

L485[13:25:55] <Althego> in ksp? anywhere

L486[13:26:05] <Eddi|zuHause> i usually put a Mk0 tank under the wings

L487[13:26:20] <Eddi|zuHause> and the intake/engine on either side of that

L488[13:26:53] <Eddi|zuHause> with Juno engines, or sometimes rescaled Wheezing engines

L489[13:27:39] <JVFoxy> depends on the design.. usually out the back facing that way?

L490[13:27:46] <mischief> OH

L491[13:27:49] <mischief> tank under the wings

L492[13:27:53] <mischief> that makes so much more sense

L493[13:28:22] <JVFoxy> or on sides of the fusallage

L494[13:28:38] <Althego> that is a usual position. also on the sides of the body in a similar way with tank and intake

L495[13:28:53] <Althego> or at the end if there is no tail

L496[13:29:42] <Eddi|zuHause> i do that with the Mk2 stuff, engine at the end, and radial intake somewhere

L497[13:30:27] <Eddi|zuHause> i don't remember if that is stock or some mod, but there was a Mk2-to-2xMk1 adapter part

L498[13:30:34] <Eddi|zuHause> so you can put 2 engines at the end

L499[13:31:11] <JVFoxy> only trouble is.. what to do with intakes that case

L500[13:31:26] <JVFoxy> unless you the one cockpit with nods on either ends

L501[13:31:43] <mischief> it sorta flies :-D

L502[13:31:58] <Eddi|zuHause> i think last time i had the radial intake sort of like "ears" on the cockpit

L503[13:32:42] <Eddi|zuHause> another time i had them flat on the wings

L504[13:33:46] <JVFoxy> some reason I like the design I did with this one... https://imgur.com/a/KlmtbkW

L505[13:33:46] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/zioksod.jpg

L506[13:34:22] <Althego> yes this is nice, sort of actual airplane looks

L507[13:34:53] <Althego> i find that hard to do most of the time, because com doesnt want to align with col the way it does in a real airplane

L508[13:35:25] <Althego> i would just give a bit of angle to the winds so that they produce a bit lift in horizontal flight

L509[13:39:27] <mischief> anyone else's plane bounce while sitting on the strip

L510[13:39:42] <mischief> aw

L511[13:39:44] <mischief> i crashed :(

L512[13:39:48] <JVFoxy> then there is this crazy thing.. https://imgur.com/a/2EgtOEj

L513[13:39:48] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/PSCA0aV.jpg

L514[13:40:11] <Althego> yes there is something

L515[13:40:12] <JVFoxy> I have another variant, with engines a little more spaced out

L516[13:41:15] <JVFoxy> I don't really bother with angle too much.. things fly fast enough as is, very little trim up needed

L517[13:41:27] <mischief> bounced right into the water

L518[13:41:33] <Althego> hehe

L519[13:41:49] <JVFoxy> I'll add flaps.. help slow down. though does cause issues with pitching the plane down a bit sometimes

L520[13:45:22] <mischief> idk whats wrong

L521[13:45:31] <mischief> my plane just spins off to the side of the runway now

L522[13:46:24] <mischief> https://i.imgur.com/67UYTeZ.jpg

L523[13:46:42] <Althego> during takeoff?

L524[13:46:46] <mischief> yes.

L525[13:46:46] <JVFoxy> let me guess.. isn't pitching up?

L526[13:47:02] <Althego> wheels too back, bending with wings, etc

L527[13:47:05] <JVFoxy> probably got your center of lift and main gear too far back

L528[13:47:16] <Mat2ch> Did you read the long how to build a plane tutorial? :)

L529[13:47:27] <mischief> no haha

L530[13:48:29] <JVFoxy> admitted, one of my fav sandbox planes I made https://imgur.com/a/ntsDONI

L531[13:48:30] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/HYLuGYj.png

L532[13:48:49] <Althego> hehe i like that wheel bay thing

L533[13:48:50] <mischief> looks like a plane

L534[13:49:04] <JVFoxy> mischief you might also wanna consider switching the tail and rudder fin models

L535[13:49:37] <Althego> is that pixel minmu?

L536[13:49:37] <JVFoxy> the larger control surface is good for pitch authority.. the y aw doesn't need quite as much.

L537[13:49:47] <Althego> s

L538[13:49:57] <JVFoxy> althego lol.. ya

L539[13:50:02] <JVFoxy> test flight to north pole

L540[13:50:56] <JVFoxy> ended up going here: https://imgur.com/a/8iNxZnk

L541[13:50:57] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/GYEVg35.jpg

L542[13:51:22] <Althego> is that the ufo?

L543[13:51:33] <JVFoxy> yup

L544[13:51:34] <mischief> wooo we made it

L545[13:51:35] <Althego> lol it has a shadow

L546[13:51:49] <Althego> through the hill

L547[13:51:52] <Althego> magic

L548[13:52:00] <JVFoxy> ya.. sorta why I took the pic

L549[13:52:29] <Althego> somehow all iridium flares happen from the west at very low angle, i cant see them from here

L550[13:52:50] <Althego> one would be -6

L551[13:55:22] <Althego> how many more iridium launches for spacex?

L552[13:57:14] <mischief> anyone daring enough to eva on a space plane o-o

L553[13:57:48] <Althego> altitude, speed?

L554[13:58:26] <JVFoxy> done it on a hovering rocket..

L555[13:58:40] <mischief> ok. i got a barometer and thermometer on my plane

L556[13:58:43] <mischief> time to go somewhere

L557[13:59:25] <JVFoxy> plane might be a problem.. unless you something to catch your kerbal as it disconnects from the handle bars and someone to pilot the craft leveled

L558[14:00:58] <mischief> god damnit

L559[14:01:03] <mischief> one little bump and boom

L560[14:01:06] <Althego> for example i have the atmo thingie on the science plane 3 right behind the ladder of the cockpit of the scientist. can go out, collect all data at moderate speeds, because the instruments prevents the scientist from falling off

L561[14:03:45] ⇨ Joins: Olympic1 (Olympic1!~Olympic1@ptr-cdbjg9ka3lu1skn13m6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be)

L562[14:06:19] <JVFoxy> heh

L563[14:06:58] <JVFoxy> build a flying box... launch it into high alttitude, eva kerbal, get crew report while eva... parachute down

L564[14:09:14] <Althego> build a flying carpet

L565[14:09:59] <JVFoxy> well maybe 'crib'. incase kerbal doesn't stand up in time and slides off the edge

L566[14:16:53] <mischief> god damnit i can't get the plane to take off again

L567[14:17:04] <mischief> it just starts wobbling before it even gets off the ground

L568[14:24:11] <mischief> damn thing bounces for no reason too

L569[14:24:46] <JVFoxy> maybe consider a redesign?

L570[14:25:13] <mischief> i've tried so many things xD

L571[14:25:38] <Althego> change wheel altitude a bit

L572[14:25:42] <Althego> not on all 3

L573[14:25:53] <Althego> at least that seemedto help me with the bouncing

L574[14:25:58] <mischief> i tried the small landing gears

L575[14:26:00] <mischief> moved them around

L576[14:26:09] <mischief> also tried fixed landing gears in the rear

L577[14:26:14] <JVFoxy> the first level, landing gear suck totally

L578[14:26:29] <JVFoxy> I can take off with them, but landing is another matter entirely... even at the slowest

L579[14:26:39] <JVFoxy> you trying to build a plane right?

L580[14:26:51] <JVFoxy> just any plane or you looking for doing a specific mission?

L581[14:27:00] <mischief> any plane

L582[14:27:11] <mischief> (that doesn't wobble, bounce, can take off, etc)

L583[14:27:42] <JVFoxy> well... if its just to get a plane flying, may help to start off with something simple

L584[14:30:22] <mischief> i'm not really doing anything complicated

L585[14:30:31] <JVFoxy> also.. almost forgot, do you set what fuctions your control surfaces do?

L586[14:31:16] <mischief> no

L587[14:32:08] <JVFoxy> ok... disabling certain functions, means all the surfaces will try to do everything at once.. could also cause problems.

L588[14:32:31] <JVFoxy> you have surfaces on the back of your wings... so when you try to pick up, they may deflect the wrong way

L589[14:33:11] <mischief> as soon as i get any speed the plane just tilts off to one side

L590[14:33:13] <mischief> it's over from there

L591[14:35:32] <mischief> haha

L592[14:35:39] <mischief> it might help if i put the wheels the right direction.

L593[14:36:26] <JVFoxy> mm...

L594[14:36:33] <JVFoxy> try something like this? its simple.. 19 parts

L595[14:36:33] <JVFoxy> https://imgur.com/a/nyJDhLz

L596[14:36:34] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/d5V08gR.jpg

L597[14:36:55] <JVFoxy> just take care not to put engines directly head of the elevators

L598[14:37:25] <mischief> did you set that front wheel to inverted

L599[14:37:33] <mischief> nd the back too i guess

L600[14:37:56] <JVFoxy> no.. those are on there un touched for most part

L601[14:38:12] <JVFoxy> I did shift the nose up a little into the body so it would level the plane on teh ground

L602[14:39:09] <JVFoxy> the back wheels are on the tube part, not the wings. the were set mirrored and snapped. then I pulled them to the sides with the displays tool and snap off.

L603[14:45:02] <mischief> why?

L604[14:46:11] <JVFoxy> I guess a carry over from old times..?

L605[14:46:12] <mischief> my plane is virtually identical to yours

L606[14:46:21] <mischief> except i'm using swept wings since thats all i have really

L607[14:46:27] <JVFoxy> used to have to be vary careful with how landing gear were placed

L608[14:46:38] <mischief> about 5 seconds after applying thrust my plane just tilts over and crashes

L609[14:46:44] <JVFoxy> wings are same.. I just swing them forwards

L610[14:47:33] <JVFoxy> screen shot.. see whats going on? that sounds rather bad..

L611[14:48:45] <mischief> hm

L612[14:48:54] <mischief> i think turning on sas has something todo with it :|

L613[14:48:58] <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds like most of my planes :p

L614[14:49:12] <JVFoxy> SAS should be ok on or off

L615[14:49:45] ⇦ Quits: Althego (Althego!~Althego@86ff4179.dsl.pool.telekom.hu) (Quit: HMI Module Alpha Humana on approach to Space Station Mercury)

L616[14:49:47] <JVFoxy> I mean.. I could try to do a 'step-by-step' tutorial..

L617[14:49:50] <Eddi|zuHause> SAS can be trouble sometimes

L618[14:50:12] <Eddi|zuHause> maybe try taking off without SAS, and turn it on once you have liftoff?

L619[14:50:38] <JVFoxy> I guess what isn't really obvious is how I setup the control surfaces, a few settings on the landing gears

L620[14:50:53] <Eddi|zuHause> last few times i tried entirely without SAS, and use trim to stay stable in the air, but i'm afraid i forgot how to do that

L621[14:51:27] <JVFoxy> trim is 'alt' and directional control

L622[14:51:44] <Eddi|zuHause> yes, and alt is right shift

L623[14:51:46] <JVFoxy> reset trim is alt+x in standard pc config

L624[14:52:35] <JVFoxy> mischief if you want.. I could see about setting up a stream video on how I built it

L625[14:52:46] <Eddi|zuHause> i also tend to have trouble staying straight on the runway

L626[14:53:11] <Eddi|zuHause> it's usually easier to turn and slide off the runway, then take off on the grass

L627[14:53:41] <mischief> i'm getting really pissed off honestly

L628[14:53:43] <mischief> xD

L629[14:53:53] <mischief> Eddi|zuHause: yeah but half the time it swerves

L630[14:54:09] <mischief> if i try to correct it, the plane swerves the other way..

L631[14:54:10] <JVFoxy> hold on... let me get the video going

L632[14:54:38] <Eddi|zuHause> try correcting with fine control?

L633[14:54:56] <Eddi|zuHause> and definitely without SAS

L634[14:55:04] <Eddi|zuHause> and disable the reaction wheels in the cockpit

L635[14:56:22] <mischief> that might help

L636[14:56:25] <mischief> lets see

L637[14:57:15] <Eddi|zuHause> and possibly switch of the control surfaces that turn left/right while on the ground

L638[14:57:19] <Eddi|zuHause> *off

L639[14:57:34] <Eddi|zuHause> only turn with the wheels

L640[14:58:46] <JVFoxy> if i showed you video would it help?

L641[14:59:01] <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, reaction wheels don't mix well with rover controls, they tend to want to turn the opposite way

L642[14:59:40] <mischief> JVFoxy: i hope so

L643[14:59:55] <mischief> i've been at this like 2 hours

L644[15:01:46] <JVFoxy> trying to find where the video link is.. just sec

L645[15:03:21] <JVFoxy> ok here we go.. see if this works

L646[15:03:22] <JVFoxy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV82Z2qSCMs

L647[15:03:22] <kmath> YouTube - KSP - Helping build planes

L648[15:03:30] <JVFoxy> let me know when you are in there

L649[15:03:48] <mischief> watching

L650[15:06:49] <mischief> your mic is extremely quiet

L651[15:07:36] <mischief> bit of white noise but i can hear you now

L652[15:07:41] <mischief> oh

L653[15:07:43] <mischief> feedback xD

L654[15:15:17] <mischief> hm

L655[15:15:23] <mischief> maybe my dirt runway is too uneven

L656[15:15:50] ⇨ Joins: Supernovy (Supernovy!~Supernovy@202.36.179.100)

L657[15:15:59] <Supernovy> Evening, Gentlemen.

L658[15:16:12] <JVFoxy> which version you playing?

L659[15:16:39] <mischief> latest career mode

L660[15:16:55] <JVFoxy> runway should be smooth... it used to be pretty bumpy in early versoins.

L661[15:17:09] <mischief> it's dirt in early career mode

L662[15:17:11] <JVFoxy> was there anything you didn't understand?

L663[15:17:16] <JVFoxy> ya..

L664[15:17:20] <mischief> nope, i got it

L665[15:17:33] <mischief> how did you activate part rotate/linear move mode?

L666[15:17:57] <mischief> yeah this is KSP 1.4.4.2215 for windows

L667[15:18:04] <Eddi|zuHause> i'm sure there are tons of hotkeys that the game fails to properly inform you about

L668[15:18:08] <JVFoxy> 1 is placement, 2 is displacement, 3 is rotating

L669[15:18:33] <mischief> oh god damnit

L670[15:18:38] <mischief> my runway wasn't upgraded to level 2

L671[15:18:41] <mischief> might help :)

L672[15:19:00] <mischief> ill build a new ship after lunch with my new knowledge and try again

L673[15:19:02] <mischief> thanks JVFoxy

L674[15:22:05] <JVFoxy> alright.. hope it helps

L675[15:22:25] <oren> I nver bother upgrading the runway

L676[15:22:37] <oren> just go out to the grass and take off

L677[15:22:44] <JVFoxy> thats ok

L678[15:22:48] <APlayer> That's actually smart

L679[15:22:56] <oren> the grass is perfectly flat anyway and doesn't have seams

L680[15:22:57] <Eddi|zuHause> i never managed to hit the runway on landing

L681[15:22:58] <APlayer> The grass is smoother than the runway

L682[15:23:04] <JVFoxy> though I thoguth they fixed the bumpiness on the runway even for level 1

L683[15:23:26] <APlayer> Oh, I had two or three runway landings. Most of them were a set of a few bounces rather than a landing, though

L684[15:24:08] <Eddi|zuHause> ksc island landing is the worst

L685[15:24:08] <JVFoxy> it takes a bit of practice to get the landing right... knowing about your vessel's behaviors does help a bit.

L686[15:24:30] <oren> Eddi|zuHause: although now it has its own biome

L687[15:24:49] <Eddi|zuHause> haven't been there in like 3 major versions

L688[15:24:56] <APlayer> Since I'm not a plane guy and none of my winged atmospheric craft got used for longer than, say, a week of real time, that is out of the question

L689[15:25:05] <JVFoxy> I can do the island ok..

L690[15:25:12] <JVFoxy> what I have troubles with is landing on the main runway from the water

L691[15:25:32] <KrazyKrl> Make sure the front doesn't fall off.

L692[15:25:38] <JVFoxy> I know it sits high... its the slope up to it that throws me off, come down to it too low

L693[15:25:59] <Eddi|zuHause> RIP front fell off guy.

L694[15:26:12] <APlayer> One thing I did have fun with for some time, though, was building a small and extremely quick jet craft with tiny solid rockets that could be launched separately, and piggyback riding that on one of the large stock aircraft. Launch, separate planes in the air, and chase the large one with the fighter jet

L695[15:26:25] <oren> JVFoxy: I have notes somehwere about exactle the height of various flat areas on kerbin

L696[15:26:31] <APlayer> https://imgur.com/a/iaFv7

L697[15:27:58] <oren> JVFoxy: if you note down what the altimeter reads on the runway you can come in at the right height

L698[15:27:59] <JVFoxy> I was going to do a thing for flat spots on the mun.. then noticed how tiny they were

L699[15:28:06] <APlayer> (Also notice the decoupler between the cabin and the plane trunk. I /never/ fly planes without an emergency parachute landing system, and I end up aborting, like, every third plane flight)

L700[15:28:22] <mischief> oren | the grass is perfectly flat anyway and doesn't have seams

L701[15:28:30] <mischief> oren: then why does my plane bounce and swerve and shit

L702[15:28:43] <APlayer> Because my takeoff and landing maneuvers are the /worst/

L703[15:28:46] <oren> mischief: probably landing gear problems

L704[15:28:57] <JVFoxy> the radar altimeter helps, though sadly its inside the cockpit of piloted craft.. so eh..

L705[15:29:06] <APlayer> mischief, sorry, please keep the language clean...

L706[15:29:28] <JVFoxy> I actually do quite alright landing just visually... think its more that I use the water as a guide then get put off when the slopes hit me.

L707[15:29:29] <oren> JVFoxy: no I mean when you are on the run way, the main altimeter reads 74

L708[15:30:04] <JVFoxy> I've a video of my jump jet landing around, mountain, highlands and grasslands then runway.. no problems fidning height by looking

L709[15:30:27] <JVFoxy> oren ya but it also depends on height of cockpit too..

L710[15:30:31] <Eddi|zuHause> i used a mod that made the height show height above ground in surface mode, and height above sea level in orbit mode

L711[15:30:53] <JVFoxy> there isn't much in the way of runway guidance unless you have kerbinside..

L712[15:31:21] <Eddi|zuHause> i tried some runway alignment mod, but it didn't really help with actually aligning with the runway :p

L713[15:31:39] <JVFoxy> I used to take wheeled probes in sandbox mode, drive them beyond the runway, have them as distance markers to reference by

L714[15:32:00] <Eddi|zuHause> i was told people put flags down

L715[15:32:22] <Eddi|zuHause> but whenever i tried that, the game told me the runway was now occupied

L716[15:32:33] <JVFoxy> not on the runway

L717[15:32:37] <JVFoxy> you have to go out past the slope

L718[15:32:43] <Eddi|zuHause> yes

L719[15:32:53] <Eddi|zuHause> apparently i wasn't far enough

L720[15:33:17] <JVFoxy> for my markers.. I think was 250 meters... and 1km out

L721[15:37:50] <JVFoxy> derp... so youtube still processing the stream video.. do I keep...?

L722[15:40:26] <mischief> is there a way to lock pitch?

L723[15:40:50] <mischief> JVFoxy: its already up for me, i reviewed it

L724[15:41:59] <JVFoxy> lock pitch?

L725[15:42:04] <JVFoxy> mean as in trim or ..?

L726[15:42:30] <mischief> so i don't have to hold s to keep my nose up

L727[15:43:01] <JVFoxy> with SAS on... just push it up a little past..

L728[15:43:13] <mischief> sas is on

L729[15:43:16] <JVFoxy> off you use pitch trim with alt key and s or w

L730[15:43:21] <JVFoxy> alt and x resets it all

L731[15:43:39] <JVFoxy> weird... video still saying in proccessing, not showing up on my page yet. You probably still on the page from stream I'm guessing

L732[15:49:18] <mischief> okay

L733[15:49:19] <mischief> i flew

L734[15:49:23] <mischief> i crashed

L735[15:49:35] <mischief> maybe i will go back to rocket building now :p

L736[15:50:08] <mischief> rocket building is *easy* compared to that

L737[15:52:02] <Eddi|zuHause> planes take forever to get decent at flying. and then i stop playing the game for a while, and i have to start from scratch

L738[15:53:52] <JVFoxy> heh.. well considering I've been into flying and even student pilot with some hours dual now...

L739[15:54:06] ⇨ Joins: Supercheese (Supercheese!~Superchee@static-50-37-114-58.mscw.id.frontiernet.net)

L740[15:55:48] <Eddi|zuHause> something i found annoying while flying planes is, if you have SAS on, it doesn't follow the curvature of the planet

L741[15:56:01] <Rolf> Eddi|zuHause: yea

L742[15:56:05] <Eddi|zuHause> so you have to still tilt the nose every now and then

L743[15:56:17] <Rolf> I wonder if same is true for real planes

L744[15:56:29] <Rolf> earth is a lot bigger so maybe thats less of a problem

L745[15:56:47] <Eddi|zuHause> i'm sure real autopilots consider the altimeter

L746[15:57:44] <Eddi|zuHause> (that is probably even easier to measure than your direction in space)

L747[15:58:23] <Rolf> yeah. in fact I wonder if auto pilot uses that

L748[15:58:43] <JVFoxy> real autopilots reference alttitude usually

L749[15:59:00] <JVFoxy> they can also do rate of descent/assent

L750[15:59:38] <JVFoxy> think there is a mod.. not sure which, that allows you to set surface or orbit modes for SAS

L751[16:00:12] <JVFoxy> also sorry, ended up deleting the video... I wanna edit it anyways, cut out the delays

L752[16:00:17] <Rolf> nice

L753[16:03:43] <Eddi|zuHause> somehow in recent version of vlc, the "resize window to video" feature got broken

L754[16:05:16] ⇦ Quits: esspapier (esspapier!~esspapier@80-109-207-2.cable.dynamic.surfer.at) (Ping timeout: 182 seconds)

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L756[16:05:38] <JVFoxy> I gave up using VLC to convert my mp4s to avi...

L757[16:05:52] <JVFoxy> seeing as moviemaker refuses to even see mp4..

L758[16:06:03] <JVFoxy> any case.. gotta do an errand...bbl

L759[16:06:15] <Eddi|zuHause> the window size flickers a few times on starting the video before it gets the right size, and when the video ends while in fullscreen, dragging a new video in will start that video in fullscreen, and exiting fullscreen then will not resize the window

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L761[16:17:03] ⇦ Quits: Dozeman979 (Dozeman979!~D^man@2601:47:4180:854:7456:93ce:f479:d1ab) (Ping timeout: 194 seconds)

L762[16:18:25] ⇦ Quits: Gasher (Gasher!~Gasher@broadband-46-188-123-160.2com.net) (Quit: Gasher)

L763[16:26:59] ⇨ Joins: Tank2333 (Tank2333!~Tank2333@p5DDAAA60.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)

L764[16:27:09] <Tank2333> hi

L765[16:27:10] <Mod9000> Hello, Tank2333

L766[16:27:26] <Tank2333> Hi Mod9000

L767[16:27:27] <Mod9000> How are things?

L768[16:52:18] <mischief> why are fixed landing wheels so bouncy

L769[16:52:59] <Supercheese> default spring values are not well-tuned for interplanetary landings

L770[16:53:06] <Supercheese> heck, they don't even work well on Kerbin

L771[16:53:08] <JVFoxy> always found them rather fragile. :\

L772[16:53:12] <Supercheese> try messing with the spring/damper settings

L773[16:53:14] <mischief> this is just sitting on kerbin

L774[16:53:23] <mischief> not even launched or use any engine or anything

L775[16:53:26] <mischief> my ship just bounces

L776[16:53:30] <Supercheese> oh that

L777[16:53:34] <JVFoxy> fix gear usually only good for very tiny craft

L778[16:53:38] <Supercheese> are you updated to the latest version?

L779[16:53:47] <Supercheese> there was a bug with landing gear in 1.4.2 IIRC

L780[16:54:02] <JVFoxy> supercheese oh.. which bug is that?

L781[16:54:04] <mischief> 1.4.4

L782[16:55:00] <Supercheese> https://wiki.kerbalspaceprogram.com/wiki/1.4.3#Bugfixes

L783[16:55:05] <Supercheese> " Fix suspension for wheels and legs when vessel coming off rails from bouncing.

L784[16:55:05] <Supercheese> Fix landing legs sometimes exploding on contact with ground."

L785[16:55:47] <Supercheese> excessive explodiness / bounciness

L786[16:56:00] <Supercheese> it does seem like the bounciness was never fully solved though

L787[16:56:19] <JVFoxy> oh wait.. landing leg or landing strut?

L788[16:56:20] <Supercheese> there were further tweaks in 1.4.4

L789[16:56:37] <Supercheese> the biggest bug affected landing struts exploding

L790[16:56:40] <mischief> the item called LY-01 Fixed Landing Gear

L791[16:56:45] <mischief> is the item i am complaining about

L792[16:56:47] <Supercheese> but excessively bouncy wheels/legs were also a problem

L793[16:56:49] <JVFoxy> ok ya... LY-01.. >.<

L794[16:57:01] <Supercheese> and evidently still are

L795[16:57:05] <JVFoxy> I just gave up on them in favour the next tier

L796[16:57:23] ⇨ Joins: Dozeman979 (Dozeman979!~D^man@2601:47:4180:854:7456:93ce:f479:d1ab)

L797[16:57:39] <JVFoxy> but then I found the toothpic landing legs had an issue of acting like they impaled the mun surface and kept the craft from settling properly

L798[16:57:46] <Supercheese> Yeah I think it's still a problem: https://www.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpaceProgram/comments/91qxxa/seriously_what_us_this_the_kraken_dance_or_what/

L799[16:58:29] <JVFoxy> not so much issue with those legs.. just the very tiny ones

L800[16:59:35] <Supercheese> hilarious video though

L801[16:59:45] <Supercheese> Stop! Kraken time.

L802[16:59:49] <mischief> okay

L803[16:59:53] <JVFoxy> they acted like the end of the leg had a hidden stake in the end. went into the ground, so the little probe craft would just sit propped up on one leg. sometimes would sway back and forth on it

L804[16:59:55] <mischief> my kerbal explorer works :)

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L812[17:32:32] <mischief> ok

L813[17:32:43] <mischief> got surface sample, eva report, science jr from almost every building

L814[17:35:07] <mischief> 22 stored data :)

L815[17:35:13] <mischief> lets see how much science i got

L816[17:36:04] <UmbralRaptop> Should be estimatable based on what it was saying when you collected it. Sadly KSC science multipliers are like 0.3.

L817[17:36:29] <mischief> https://i.imgur.com/bk7lOpT.jpg

L818[17:36:35] <mischief> my ghetto cart :))

L819[17:37:37] <mischief> 7.5 science per materials study and 9.0 science per surface sample

L820[17:38:03] <mischief> 139.2 science :D

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L826[17:47:42] <Tank2333> what a design hehe

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L831[17:52:50] <UmbralRaptop> Yay!

L832[17:59:25] <Draconiator> as soon as I finish installing what I'm installing....I'ma make a shipyard inspired by the ones in Freelancer.

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L835[18:06:00] <ve2dmn> *sigh*

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L837[18:08:57] <ve2dmn> seems I missed all the fun

L838[18:14:25] <mischief> not yet

L839[18:14:32] <mischief> i'm making a communication satellite :-)

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L841[18:29:10] <mischief> my antennas keep breaking off at launch

L842[18:32:14] <mischief> it seems like around 45m/s they just snap off :/

L843[18:34:08] <Wastl2> Were those antennas retracted?

L844[18:34:17] <mischief> yes.

L845[18:34:47] <mischief> wait.

L846[18:34:49] <mischief> what the heck

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L848[18:35:36] <mischief> they were extended but their orientation made them look retracted :/

L849[18:36:04] <mischief> visual bug maybe

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L856[18:45:55] <Draconiator> https://i.gyazo.com/80ec982f4867e245b8e8f70e92df5a7d.jpg - Happppppyyyyyy with how it came out.

L857[18:46:37] <mischief> https://i.imgur.com/7OeMpM2.jpg

L858[18:46:40] <mischief> shes up :D

L859[18:47:05] <mischief> looking good Draconiator

L860[18:47:10] <mischief> how'd you get that thing up there?

L861[18:47:46] <Draconiator> Hyperedit

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L865[19:14:30] <Rokker> Zarthus: do you guys think you got the spammers handled

L866[19:15:06] <Zarthus> "handled".

L867[19:15:26] <Zarthus> it's up to channels to set preventative measures if they are being hit

L868[19:15:51] <Zarthus> we can currently only mitigate it after the crime, which doesn't really solve anything

L869[19:15:59] <Zarthus> because they have like a bazillion different hosts.

L870[19:16:02] <Rokker> hmmm

L871[19:16:29] <Rokker> Zarthus: have you guys tried telling them that this isnt freenode yet?

L872[19:16:40] <Zarthus> they do it on every network

L873[19:17:04] <Zarthus> freenode, esper, they'd send an IM to the Smart Fridge in your apartment if they could

L874[19:17:56] <Rokker> that would be entertaining rbh

L875[19:18:01] <Rokker> tbh

L876[19:24:18] <mischief> grrr

L877[19:24:22] <mischief> i'm in polar orbit

L878[19:24:27] <mischief> why doesn't this mission complete :(

L879[19:25:11] <mischief> what is 'reasonable deviation'

L880[19:26:56] <UmbralRaptop> Unsure. But as a silly check, it's possible to be going the 'wrong way'

L881[19:27:07] <mischief> i just realized that

L882[19:27:09] <mischief> that is dumb

L883[19:27:15] <mischief> how would i know for sure

L884[19:28:35] * UmbralRaptop would need to double check the UI on how it shows inclination.

L885[19:29:20] <Supernovy> I believe it swirls around the orbit in the direction you're meant to go. Whether the angle is 90 or 270 would depend on where the reference point is.

L886[19:30:02] <UmbralRaptop> the bright to faded transition?

L887[19:30:30] * mischief curses under his breath

L888[19:30:35] <mischief> there is in fact a swirly.

L889[19:30:53] * mischief reverts flight

L890[19:31:08] <Supernovy> I don't know how to describe it except as a swirly.

L891[19:31:13] <UmbralRaptop> That this happens moderately often suggests that the UI needs some work.

L892[19:31:55] <Supernovy> bright-to-faded is only on the craft's orbit I think

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L897[20:00:22] <Draconiator> https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=swirly

L898[20:08:02] <Tank2333> that doesnt sounds fun

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L900[20:11:14] <Tank2333> can one suddenly get too old for first person shooter games?

L901[20:13:13] <UmbralRaptop> Possibly

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L903[20:23:32] <Draconiator> I like OLD first person shooters so :P

L904[20:26:44] <UmbralRaptop> old like gears of war, or old like marathon?

L905[20:26:50] <UmbralRaptop> <_<

L906[20:28:27] <Supercheese> Halo original probably

L907[20:28:31] <JVFoxy> doom ;P

L908[20:28:36] <Supercheese> oh sheesh

L909[20:28:38] <Supercheese> that's not old

L910[20:28:41] <Supercheese> that's Paleolithic

L911[20:28:59] <Supercheese> primordial

L912[20:29:52] <JVFoxy> you said old.. but now /how/ old

L913[20:30:10] <JVFoxy> nintendo duke nukem was actually pretty fun...

L914[20:30:15] <JVFoxy> multiplayer

L915[20:31:28] <UmbralRaptop> Duke Nukem 3D is way worse than you remember. Probably all of the Build engine games, really. =\

L916[20:34:43] <JVFoxy> there is always golden eye for n64.... could be worse

L917[20:37:51] <Tank2333> well its just that tried Fortnite (because i have a 13 year old nephew) and ragequited and i tried to pick up Fallout 4 again but i ragequited that too...

L918[20:38:40] <Draconiator> Wolfenstein 3D old

L919[20:38:45] <UmbralRaptop> Hrm

L920[20:38:54] <JVFoxy> heh ROTT

L921[20:39:00] <Tank2333> i didnt played fallout in like 1 1/2 years or so, i guess i need a few hours to even get used to the terrible UI

L922[20:39:18] <UmbralRaptop> Most recent FPS by release date I played was Ziggurat.

L923[20:39:28] <Tank2333> never heard of it

L924[20:39:29] <JVFoxy> friend lent me Halo 4...

L925[20:39:46] <UmbralRaptop> Tank2333: Anyway, try out an old ID game and see how it feels?

L926[20:40:01] <JVFoxy> then complained, said I was the only person he knew of that had a 360 but no gold membership.. its not even my box. Friend from ireland couldn't take it back home with him. :\

L927[20:40:36] <UmbralRaptop> ow

L928[20:40:50] <Tank2333> well i played Farcry 1 a bit lately and serious sam 3 or so with my friends and that went okay :)

L929[20:42:34] <Tank2333> i always felt the Xbox online membershipt thing was a ripoff, but sony does that now too? that you have to pay to play online?

L930[20:43:32] <JVFoxy> you see the live action Uncharted fan clip Nathan Fillion did?

L931[20:43:57] <JVFoxy> Halo 4.. you have to have online gold membership in order to play Spartan Ops.. it seems

L932[20:44:12] <Tank2333> also i feel like i cant be bothered to learn all these meta game mechanics in these new age PvP shooters

L933[20:44:12] <oren> Augh. Again, my ballistic missile landed in the wrong biome

L934[20:49:00] <oren> https://imgur.com/a/jDIK3h1 MAYBE THIS TIME??!?

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L936[20:51:01] <oren> it's really hard to aim thisbecause I forgot to add trajectories mod

L937[20:53:23] <oren> UUU YES this is the badlands

L938[20:53:25] <Tank2333> is that with real sized planets?

L939[20:53:38] <oren> no, it's just kerbin

L940[20:54:10] <Tank2333> why bother with ballistic? for fun?

L941[20:54:37] <oren> because I dont wanna fly a plane for that long

L942[20:56:04] <JVFoxy> hmm... to pole and back, 1 hour 20 minutes twin juno power...

L943[20:56:43] <JVFoxy> I think I got it down with a trio of the first tier fan jets.. wheezlies I think they were?

L944[20:57:04] <JVFoxy> ... down to 40 minutes.. I could go faster but, then you just burning fuel for little tain

L945[20:57:06] <JVFoxy> gain

L946[20:57:45] <UmbralRaptop> physwarp?

L947[20:58:03] <oren> I already hit the poles with these missiles. those are easy because there

L948[20:58:16] <oren> 's no adjeustment due to kerbin spin

L949[20:58:30] <JVFoxy> well... north and south, then there are the caps and tundra

L950[20:59:24] <JVFoxy> tundra is just one bio... think it was caps or the other than that is another bio.. then you have north and south.. think its the ice itself over water

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L952[21:00:23] <oren> the main problem my current launch stack has is that I don't have a probe body with SAS yes

L953[21:00:27] <oren> yet

L954[21:01:06] <JVFoxy> staypuntnick.. or however it's spelled?

L955[21:01:39] <oren> yeah

L956[21:02:06] <JVFoxy> I find that one is mostly good for sounding rockets or ground vehicles...

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L958[21:02:39] <oren> I've been using it for my first set of satellites

L959[21:03:20] <JVFoxy> its ok.. long as you don't mind constantly fine tuning the flight

L960[21:04:01] <oren> And also, knowing my rocket can fly without SAS means I can put bill or bob on top of it NP

L961[21:04:02] <JVFoxy> no reaction wheels unless you add them... sort of why I think they good for ground based stuff

L962[21:06:44] <oren> yeah, the bavaria-1 stack has all gimbaling engines to avoid that

L963[21:07:36] <JVFoxy> I usually use the swivel for a lot of my stuff...

L964[21:07:43] <JVFoxy> other than second stage

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L969[21:34:28] <Tank2333> bavaria-1?

L970[21:34:45] <UmbralRaptop> bavari~1

L971[21:35:04] <Tank2333> what is that?

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L973[21:40:40] <Tank2333> Ok im trying out the new Rimworld version, wish me luck ^^

L974[21:42:22] <MoscowMeow> good luck

L975[21:42:44] <umaxtu> is 1.0 out?

L976[21:44:38] <oren> Tank2333: it's the name I use for one of my launchers

L977[21:45:06] <Tank2333> no but the unstable puplic test,

L978[21:45:22] <umaxtu> ah ok

L979[21:45:28] <Tank2333> i think he released it a month ago or so

L980[21:45:47] <Tank2333> the list of changes is like 4 pages long

L981[21:47:52] <oren> https://imgur.com/MBWweLXhttps://imgur.com/MBWweLXhttps://imgur.com/MBWweLXhttps://imgur.com/MBWweLX ok trying to relearn how to fly vtols

L982[21:47:52] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/MBWweLX.jpg

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L987[21:54:57] <oren> how do I land

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L991[22:00:51] <umaxtu> oren, hit the ground slowly

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L993[22:14:34] <mischief> oren: carefully.

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L999[22:27:12] <Draconiator> https://i.gyazo.com/95943ed2871380de4c535313724653d6.png - Yep, my download speed says we're still living in the future, lol

L1000[22:28:33] <umaxtu> I top out at about a quarter of that

L1001[22:28:55] <umaxtu> though, gigabit fiber is slowly working its way towards me

L1002[22:32:19] <mischief> ok. plan is to get a probe around the mun and a lander on and off it at the same time.

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L1006[23:08:59] <GlassYuri> ...apparently you can bring back a deleted twitter account including all past tweets and followers

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L1009[23:16:44] <UmbralRaptop> Deleted, or something else? (suspended, deactivated, etc)

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L1012[23:28:02] <mischief> that's odd

L1013[23:28:15] <mischief> i could have swore i put a satellite around the mun and it's not there now..

L1014[23:28:46] <JVFoxy> ... reverted?

L1015[23:28:54] <mischief> nope.

L1016[23:29:05] <mischief> i gotta redo the mission anyway since my mun lander crashed on reentry

L1017[23:29:15] <mischief> but the satellite i sent on the same trip should have lived

L1018[23:29:18] <mischief> pretty odd

L1019[23:29:30] <GlassYuri> UmbralRaptop, well the account disappeared two months ago and came back today, and when I went to follow it again I noticed that I was already following

L1020[23:30:33] <GlassYuri> I didn't even know that it was possible to deactivate an account

L1021[23:31:26] <JVFoxy> if the satellite was place on same mission as lander, and you reverted because lander crashed, it pulls everything back to before the start of o the mission

L1022[23:31:52] <JVFoxy> if you go back to something already in flight, it doesn't let you revert...

L1023[23:37:09] <JVFoxy> ok.. that is sad... tutorial video I streamed earlier, the recording only ended up saving the first 2 minutes then cuts out

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L1025[23:42:45] <UmbralRaptop> ow

L1026[23:45:38] <JVFoxy> suppose I could just redo it if was really up to it..

L1027[23:59:59] ⇨ Joins: Althego (Althego!~Althego@51B6212B.dsl.pool.telekom.hu)