OCLogs: 2018-01-10.log

Stuff goes here

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L7[00:22:21] <Mathuin> Okay, 'lock steering to up.' puts the ship into a spin. Anyone here know how to tell kOS to orient the ship straight up without this crazy tumbling?

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L27[02:45:50] * Arynnia materializes

L28[02:50:06] <Arynnia> Well, I'm about to find out if my upgrade was enough.

L29[02:50:15] <Arynnia> I've never been able to run KSP with all my mods in full res

L30[02:50:39] <Arynnia> but now I have 24 GB of RAM

L31[02:52:28] <Arynnia> KSS will do that to you xD

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L43[04:09:07] <sandbox> A Japanese astronaut has apologised for wrongly stating he has grown 9cm (3.5in) since arriving at the International Space Station (ISS) just over three weeks ago.

L44[04:09:07] <sandbox> Norishige Kanai said in fact he grew by 2cm, blaming "a measurement mistake".

L45[04:10:13] <Rolf> Arynnia: theres only 2 kinds of ram, not enough or not enough to max out ;)

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L48[04:13:04] <Arynnia> Rolf: I actually appear to be right in the middle

L49[04:13:12] <Arynnia> KSP is scraping by right under 100% of usage xD

L50[04:13:17] <Rolf> :)

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L67[06:47:46] <Fluburtur> look at this cat https://78.media.tumblr.com/78d50e91492361e4d6c9bd66c9af5393/tumblr_orui1rC8pi1u6kbs9o1_540.jpg

L68[06:54:14] <Mat2ch> Disappointing. Expected a huge truck. :D

L69[06:59:56] <Fluburtur> https://78.media.tumblr.com/90860da11ff961166b416ade5f867dae/tumblr_ozrswt32jE1vj38ulo1_540.jpg

L70[07:01:38] <Mat2ch> Crunchy.

L71[07:01:49] <Althego> argh

L72[07:01:52] <Mat2ch> But no, no further comment. I can't always encourage you to post memes ;P

L73[07:02:05] <Fluburtur> too bad

L74[07:02:19] <Althego> intestinate fluburtur

L75[07:02:26] <Fluburtur> btw all the crap I ordered for my heli shipped

L76[07:02:58] <Mat2ch> Cool

L77[07:03:00] <Mat2ch> show pics!

L78[07:03:14] <Mat2ch> I always wanted to have a heli. But it was too expensive and no place to fly it safely

L79[07:03:18] <Fluburtur> well I ordered it last night

L80[07:03:24] <Fluburtur> https://www.banggood.com/0_01g-500g-Electronic-Pocket-Mini-Digital-LCD-Gold-Weighing-Scale-Gram-p-1206787.html?rmmds=myorder&cur_warehouse=CN

L81[07:03:39] <Fluburtur> I guess the most interesting part is this https://www.banggood.com/Aglin-TREX-450-RC-Helicopter-Accessories-325MM-Main-Blade-p-938164.html?rmmds=myorder

L82[07:04:39] <Fluburtur> or that https://www.banggood.com/Aglin-TREX-450-RC-Helicopter-Accessories-325MM-Main-Blade-p-938164.html?rmmds=myorder

L83[07:04:50] <Fluburtur> I want to try all kinds of rc stuff

L84[07:05:05] <Fluburtur> I got planes and multirotors done already

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L86[07:05:41] <Fluburtur> so I have to do: cars, boats, tanks, helis, probably a lot of other stuff too

L87[07:06:36] <Fluburtur> I still want to build a intermeshing heli

L88[07:06:45] <Fluburtur> but probably won't be 100% 3d printed

L89[07:06:50] <Fluburtur> more like 80%

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L91[07:52:36] <ve2dmn> I'm getting flashback from 20 years ago

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L95[08:04:56] <sandbox> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashback_(1992_video_game)

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L99[08:19:54] <madmerlyn> another fine day has begun.

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L103[08:36:50] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: I'm scared now

L104[08:37:05] <madmerlyn> lol why

L105[08:37:08] <ve2dmn> I'm getting flashback from 20 years ago

L106[08:38:13] <Mat2ch> I getting flashdance flashbacks now.

L107[08:38:28] <ve2dmn> WHAT A FEEEEELING....

L108[08:39:56] * Mat2ch covers both ears (err, eyes)

L109[08:39:58] <Mat2ch> lalalaaaaaaaa

L110[08:40:00] <Mat2ch> I hear nothing!

L111[08:40:01] <Epi> i had a demo of it, was called Another World for me, good game

L112[08:40:42] <ve2dmn> Epi: that's a different game

L113[08:40:50] <sandbox> ^

L114[08:41:00] <ve2dmn> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Another_World_(video_game)

L115[08:41:41] <Epi> ah right, played both- i remember another world had a 2nd name, forgot i guess lol.

L116[08:42:08] <ve2dmn> I know, because I now have all* the Steam Achivement for that game :D

L117[08:42:21] <ve2dmn> * Except the secret one

L118[08:42:22] <Epi> ah it was 'out of this world', see almost identical to 'flashback' :D

L119[08:42:52] <Fluburtur> Mat2ch I asked my grandma if I could take the car to come to your place tomorrow but for some reason she didn't want

L120[08:42:59] <ve2dmn> Out of this world is just another world published under a different title for a different market

L121[08:43:44] <ve2dmn> https://steamcommunity.com/id/ve2dmn/stats/AnotherWorld/?tab=achievements

L122[08:46:39] <Epi> the demo blew my mind as a kid, looked so amazing. Played it on the Amiga

L123[08:46:57] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: 20 years ago, I was in the middle of the great Ice Storm of 1998

L124[08:47:04] <Mat2ch> Fluburtur: I can't imagine any reason why. :D

L125[08:47:17] <madmerlyn> it's 50F outside here right now :D

L126[08:47:20] <ve2dmn> Epi: It was too hard for me as a kid... yet I found it somewhat easy these days

L127[08:47:27] <Mat2ch> What's F? ;P

L128[08:47:33] <Epi> as a kid.. way to hard for me too

L129[08:47:50] <ve2dmn> Mat2ch: it's like K, except different strokes

L130[08:48:42] <ve2dmn> It's I+ 2 x - while K is I+ 1x \ and 1 x /

L131[08:48:43] <Mat2ch> With the difference that K can be easily understood by adding 273,15. ;P

L132[08:50:07] <ve2dmn> Also, F come from Roman, while K is from Greek

L133[08:51:18] <madmerlyn> mat2ch F = (9/5)C+32

L134[08:51:48] <Mat2ch> Too much for me to do in my head ;)

L135[08:51:52] <madmerlyn> so 50F = 10C

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L137[08:52:59] <ve2dmn> I use my own mental 'approximate Formula': 82<=>28, 61<=>16, 40<=>04

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L139[08:53:36] <madmerlyn> lol

L140[08:54:05] <ve2dmn> it's a 'good enough' estimate

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L142[08:54:40] <ve2dmn> And of course, -40=-40

L143[08:55:38] <Mat2ch> which is cold. Very very cold.

L144[08:55:48] <madmerlyn> you know one could make the argument that fahrenheit's base unit was more logical because water's freezing and boiling points are variable with pressure, while fahrenheit's bromide solution was self-stabilizing temperature

L145[08:56:02] <ve2dmn> Mat2ch: we call that 'last week's wind chill'

L146[08:57:27] <Mat2ch> madmerlyn: but that doesn't matter when talking about absolute temperatures. ;)

L147[08:57:47] <Mat2ch> ve2dmn: I'd be frozen rock solid by now.

L148[08:57:59] <madmerlyn> well units don't matter when dealing with absolutes, only accuracy

L149[08:58:09] <ve2dmn> then, you use K

L150[09:00:36] <Mat2ch> the 233 is cold and 313 pretty hot

L151[09:00:41] <Mat2ch> *then

L152[09:00:52] <Mat2ch> *very very very freaking cold

L153[09:01:02] <madmerlyn> morning Eric, I browsed your github after you posted yesterday, lot of neat python stuff in there

L154[09:02:09] <madmerlyn> we should just use Norse dark ages units, "It's approximately 'we didn't sacrifice enough slaves to Odin' degrees out"

L155[09:04:56] <ve2dmn> You do know part of the reason the US didn't go Metric, was that the ship carrying the official Kg at the time of Jefferson was pillage by pirates and never made it?

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L157[09:06:12] <EricPoehlsen> visual studio

L158[09:06:18] <ve2dmn> So the US choose between Dutch and British Units instead (Which were the units used by states)

L159[09:06:26] <EricPoehlsen> ... gna should press [win] before

L160[09:07:32] <EricPoehlsen> ve2dmn: that is a nice story - unfortunatly the truth is that the law contained a 'voluntary' clause

L161[09:08:32] <EricPoehlsen> madmerlyn: thanks a lot of started and never finished projects

L162[09:09:15] <madmerlyn> that reminds me, the reason there were 2 Voyagers is because when they approached Nixon for approval and told him the last time there was a planetary alignment that would allow visiting all the outer planets, Jefferson was president

L163[09:09:25] <madmerlyn> so Nixon said "we better do 2 then"

L164[09:10:52] <ve2dmn> What's the distance of Voyage 1 & 2 now? (Relative to the sun)

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L166[09:11:31] <EricPoehlsen> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voyager_2

L167[09:12:02] <madmerlyn> I believe 2 is beyond the heliopause and 1 is out near it

L168[09:12:18] <ve2dmn> 116AU for Voyager 2

L169[09:12:20] <madmerlyn> I find it interesting that 2 actually launched weeks before 1

L170[09:15:55] <Mat2ch> Fluburtur: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_Ch70KkMtE

L171[09:15:56] <kmath_> YouTube - Marble Machine X part 22 - MARBLE DIVIDER

L172[09:16:06] <madmerlyn> Voyager 2 is also the only probe to visit Neptune or Uranus AFAIK, it's a shame we can't fund exploration enough to do more out there

L173[09:17:24] <ve2dmn> I wonder if it's possible to do 'on the cheap' with a solar sail as propulsion

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L176[09:21:59] <ve2dmn> I know the planetary society had a Cubesat solarsail deployement test, but I didn't follow what happened with the project

L177[09:22:49] <madmerlyn> the Japanese solar sail project has no info beyond it was supposed to wake up from hibernation like 2 years ago that I've been able to find :/

L178[09:22:55] <madmerlyn> IKAROS or whatever

L179[09:23:16] <ve2dmn> clever name

L180[09:23:43] <madmerlyn> from wiki JAXA expects the 5th wake up of IKAROS in the northern hemisphere winter of 2016.

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L182[09:23:53] <madmerlyn> and when I went to the JAXA site there was nothing except that same info

L183[09:25:11] <madmerlyn> apparently it achieved all of its scientific primary objectives back in 2010 though so maybe they just stopped signaling it

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L185[09:26:31] <madmerlyn> or it never came back online and they just didn't want to talk about it, lol

L186[09:26:47] <ve2dmn> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LightSail_2

L187[09:27:00] <ve2dmn> Gonna be launch as secondary payload on Falcon Heavy

L188[09:27:20] <Mat2ch> or be part of a big fireball!

L189[09:27:49] <ve2dmn> either way, it should be interesting to watch

L190[09:27:55] <EricPoehlsen> hmm anyone familiar with unity ... will it cost performance if I add a transform to the game object I export as .mu for the game?

L191[09:28:07] <madmerlyn> wait.. on the test launch?

L192[09:28:20] <ve2dmn> no. STP-2

L193[09:28:23] <madmerlyn> ah

L194[09:28:29] <ve2dmn> so, Test launch #2

L195[09:28:42] <EricPoehlsen> My model was to big so I wonder if I should import a rescaled version in Unity to export a new .mu

L196[09:28:53] <madmerlyn> apparently they sent 1 up already and it failed, went up on an ELA launch

L197[09:29:00] <madmerlyn> err ULA

L198[09:29:44] <madmerlyn> that's the great thing with cubesats though, they're cheap

L199[09:30:00] <madmerlyn> well relatively speaking heh

L200[09:30:09] <madmerlyn> PS losing the first one isn't a major setback though

L201[09:31:59] <Mat2ch> anyway. SpaceX says they'll launch FH soon after their static fire test at the end of this week

L202[09:32:07] <Mat2ch> What's your bet? I say Sunday

L203[09:32:30] <madmerlyn> so according to that LightSail wiki it's actually going to be the third FH launch?

L204[09:32:42] <madmerlyn> oh nvm

L205[09:32:47] <madmerlyn> learn2read merlyn

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L208[09:35:45] <Fluburtur> https://78.media.tumblr.com/8b8ad2d7132c681738daa5d5e73bda7f/tumblr_njdppiKTDK1u4nbmvo1_540.jpg

L209[09:36:36] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: btw, I think I have enough notes to make a 'test' Rendez-vous script tonight

L210[09:37:06] <madmerlyn> nice

L211[09:37:32] <madmerlyn> I tried to do some work on my Mun base last night, but game decided it was going to be an 'everything lags for no reason' kinda night

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L213[09:37:49] <ve2dmn> The logic is simple enough, but I just want to be sure the script doesn't do anything stupid like leave the SOI or make the PE lower then the ground

L214[09:37:54] <madmerlyn> even relaunching the game it was running poorly, I just ran a full package update on pacman and shut the computer off at that point heh

L215[09:38:18] <ve2dmn> Blame Meltdown?

L216[09:40:52] <madmerlyn> lol

L217[09:40:56] <Fluburtur> Mat2ch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_Ch70KkMtE

L218[09:40:56] <kmath_> YouTube - Marble Machine X part 22 - MARBLE DIVIDER

L219[09:41:03] <madmerlyn> I dunno, it had been at least a week since my last kernel update

L220[09:41:26] <madmerlyn> I don't do a pacman update every day anymore, usually about once a week

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L222[09:42:10] <madmerlyn> I did compile an update for discord off AUR without rebooting prior to launching KSP so maybe something got gummed up there with the old version still being in cache or something I dunno

L223[09:42:18] <madmerlyn> I was tired and didn't feel like investigating

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L225[09:42:23] <madmerlyn> if it's slow again tonight I'll dig around

L226[09:45:37] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: https://www.epicgames.com/fortnite/forums/news/announcements/132642-epic-services-stability-update

L227[09:46:36] <madmerlyn> yeah I've read it affects CPU intensive backend services the most, so servers are having the worst time of it

L228[09:47:20] <ve2dmn> the more context switches, the worst the impact is

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L230[09:49:00] <ve2dmn> because what the patches do is flush the entire cache eveytime the control goes from the Kernel to a User process

L231[09:49:49] <ve2dmn> in the case of a virtual machine, everything is a 'user process' to the Hypervisor...

L232[09:50:17] <madmerlyn> yeah I'm not sure how the patch is/will affect my system at home

L233[09:50:31] <madmerlyn> it's an arch install so I don't have a lot of unnecessary stuff installed

L234[09:51:09] <madmerlyn> mostly just the base system, + Gnome and deps, a few things for programming, and games

L235[09:54:20] <ve2dmn> it's less about what's installed and more about what's running. If it makes a lot of system call, it might impact the performance

L236[09:54:57] <madmerlyn> well of course, but I'm saying there's nothing unnecessary there so shouldn't be a lot of stuff running

L237[09:55:08] <ve2dmn> right, sorry

L238[09:55:10] <madmerlyn> beyond the usual stuff for the desktop, networking, etc.

L239[09:55:26] <technicalfool> gotta wonder how games consoles will cope.

L240[09:55:50] <technicalfool> it's not like youo can do a quick upgrade, and you can bet several titles are already running right up against hardware limits.

L241[09:55:50] <ve2dmn> technicalfool: probably won't patch

L242[09:56:10] <ve2dmn> it's only an issue if you can run 3rd party code

L243[09:56:20] <technicalfool> Hah, and leave a hole open for people to potentially run arbitrary software on? On a games console?

L244[09:56:48] <madmerlyn> after the PSN hack years ago consoles became even more locked up than they were before

L245[09:56:49] <technicalfool> yeah, isn't "you can run whatever you like with elevated privileges" the whole point?

L246[09:57:06] <madmerlyn> even though the hack didn't come from a PS, network security became a huge focus for them

L247[09:57:15] <ve2dmn> So The'll wall-up the system even more. Like not being able to run unsigned code that isn't from 'the online market-store-place-thingy'

L248[09:57:39] <technicalfool> But that's already the case.

L249[09:57:50] <ve2dmn> expect more of the same

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L252[09:58:07] <madmerlyn> TBH I'm kinda disappointed in MS for not capitalizing on that, PSN was in shambles after the hack and yet here we are in 2018 with Sony leading the pack again

L253[09:58:28] <technicalfool> it's MS. They don't know what to do when they don't have a 98% monopoly.

L254[09:59:00] <madmerlyn> after the hack I believe PSN was completely offline for an entire quarter

L255[09:59:49] <madmerlyn> like how did that not translate into MS becoming the only console worth buying, that was also around the time that Sony pulled Linux support from the PS3 and shafted a whole bunch of people who were into that

L256[10:00:07] <madmerlyn> so much bad press and all they could do was Kinect?

L257[10:00:22] <ve2dmn> technicalfool: MS of 2001 is IBM of 1984. Giant companies used to being too successful that they lost the agility to move quick

L258[10:00:34] <madmerlyn> it's like they were trying to score the Wii crowd, when they should've had their sights on the super pissed off PS crowd

L259[10:01:42] <technicalfool> hah, Kinect was not exactly a stellar launch either. It was going to be a high tech item that could determine exactly which finger you were holding up to it. What ended up being released was a crappy overpriced webcam with most of the work being done on the Xbox.

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L261[10:02:05] <technicalfool> and then trying to insist people use Kinect. Like no.

L262[10:02:24] <madmerlyn> they further bungled it by trying to kill the secondhand market with Xbone

L263[10:02:37] <madmerlyn> something they had to completely scrap before launch

L264[10:02:47] <technicalfool> oh there's a bunch of companies and people trying to kill second hand games.

L265[10:02:55] <madmerlyn> instead of focusing on competition they were aiming at all the wrong markets heh

L266[10:03:12] <ve2dmn> I have to find that video again... "OUR Sails are not high enough! If we drop the connect, you could Sail higher!"

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L268[10:06:00] <madmerlyn> MS could take a 5% cut on any transactions that way, let the users completely determine the secondhand value of the game, and no one feels like MS is just trying to force them into the $60 pricepoint

L269[10:06:37] <madmerlyn> could even enforce like a 3 month restriction on new releases

L270[10:07:14] <madmerlyn> would've allowed their design goal of diskless and provided a better platform for digital distribution without all the fallout of attacking the secondhand market

L271[10:07:34] <madmerlyn> Gamestop would've been pissed, but who cares lol

L272[10:08:55] <madmerlyn> the only real red flag I would see with a platform like that is people getting their accounts hacked and their libraries liquidated

L273[10:09:37] <madmerlyn> but if games could only be sold for non-transferrable account credit that removes some of the impetus for doing that beyond just grief

L274[10:11:46] <technicalfool> eh, I'd avoid company scrip, myself :P

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L276[10:12:22] <ve2dmn> I don't own either consoles because I prefer Pc gaming anyway

L277[10:12:43] <ve2dmn> playing an FPS with a controller is... HERESY!

L278[10:12:52] <Althego> or just plain stupid

L279[10:13:09] <technicalfool> or... the only option

L280[10:13:23] <technicalfool> because not everyone has a KB/mouse attached to their playstation.

L281[10:13:28] <ve2dmn> but things like Super Meat Boy is unplayable without a Controller

L282[10:14:51] <madmerlyn> I have an Xbone, there's no masterrace, we're all gamers :D

L283[10:15:12] <ve2dmn> technicalfool: people can do what they want, but I would rahter not play a FPS then play with a controller.

L284[10:15:13] <madmerlyn> also, I prefer FPS on controller

L285[10:15:20] <ve2dmn> HERESY!

L286[10:15:25] <madmerlyn> ergonomics

L287[10:15:38] <ve2dmn> TV must be nice though

L288[10:15:46] <madmerlyn> having my hand locked onto a mouse near constantly is just yuck

L289[10:15:49] <technicalfool> oh youo can prefer an FPS on a controller. You'll just not do as well as an equally skilled player using a mouse.

L290[10:16:01] <madmerlyn> in a game like KSP I have the accuracy of the mouse but I don't have to have a deathgrip on it to be competitive

L291[10:16:51] <technicalfool> though I fail to see the difference between having a deathgrip on a mouse, and having a deathgrip on a controller. "Nintendo Thumb" is not something induced by gripping mice.

L292[10:17:09] <madmerlyn> Xbox controller is actually rather comfortable

L293[10:17:19] <technicalfool> I do have one, yes.

L294[10:17:42] <technicalfool> (and a PS4 controller)

L295[10:17:57] <technicalfool> (the Kinect can stay in its box)

L296[10:18:15] <madmerlyn> maybe it's a personal thing, but I can hold an Xbox controller for 2 hours without any discomfort, 2 hours playing Battlefield or soemthing on PC with a mouse and my wrist hurts

L297[10:18:24] <Fluburtur> Mat2ch looks like my custom chargung board works

L298[10:18:40] <Fluburtur> now I need to isolate it with hot glue and glue all that to a board

L299[10:19:14] <madmerlyn> some electronic grade foam would be better for isolation than hot glue

L300[10:19:31] <technicalfool> tell that to Apple.

L301[10:20:29] <Fluburtur> madmerlyn you know me

L302[10:21:00] <madmerlyn> hot glue has a tendency to drift when it gets hot :P

L303[10:21:07] <madmerlyn> electronics often get hot

L304[10:21:55] <Fluburtur> eh

L305[10:21:59] <Fluburtur> this wont get hot

L306[10:22:14] <ve2dmn> I don't think I'll get a PS4 or XBone any time soon. I can't think of any exclusives that would fit my playstyle

L307[10:22:18] <Althego> drift

L308[10:22:29] <Althego> did you know that the record of contuinous drifting is 8 hours

L309[10:22:44] <Fluburtur> I want to see the wheels after that

L310[10:22:44] <technicalfool> but is it multi-track train drifting?

L311[10:22:45] <madmerlyn> start with monster truck tires, finish with bike tires?

L312[10:22:49] <Althego> and they refilled the tank in the middle

L313[10:23:06] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obkLDeO58Wo

L314[10:23:06] <kmath_> YouTube - Watch the ALL-NEW BMW M5 refuel mid-drift to take TWO GUINNESS WORLD RECORDS™ titles

L315[10:23:20] <Althego> this is almost kerbal

L316[10:23:27] <madmerlyn> how do you refuel a vehicle that is constantly moving in a state of low traction?

L317[10:23:43] <Althego> with an other one

L318[10:23:47] <Althego> doing the same

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L320[10:24:47] <technicalfool> well it would be a BMW wouldn't it?

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L322[10:25:05] <madmerlyn> *sigh* I think the median age on subreddit has declined this year. How does a post "Am I the only one that things that the interior of the pods looks cozy af??" have 13 upvotes

L323[10:25:19] <madmerlyn> that's the definition of low effort posting

L324[10:25:52] <technicalfool> also there are various videos showing people climbing out of windows or doors or whatever and controlling a drift while walking alongside the car. There is of course also a wonderful video showing someone doing that and then getting dragged under the wheels. So it's not exactly safe, but definitely possible to up-end a jerry can into the tank while driftintg.

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L326[10:30:15] <madmerlyn> according to this, I should be doing my gravity turns at 1km altitude with a pitch of 30 degrees, that's pretty insane

L327[10:30:19] <madmerlyn> https://www.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpaceProgram/comments/7p9pht/i_used_krpc_to_perform_over_300_automated/

L328[10:30:36] <technicalfool> that sounds wrong unless you're flying a spaceplane.

L329[10:30:57] <madmerlyn> 300 automated launches with 1.69 TWR aerodynamic rocket

L330[10:30:59] <technicalfool> oh, 30 degrees from vertical?

L331[10:31:04] <madmerlyn> I'm guessing so

L332[10:31:07] <technicalfool> in which case that's probably about right. :P

L333[10:31:16] <madmerlyn> 30 degrees at 1km seems really early to me

L334[10:31:23] <technicalfool> nah, not since 1.0

L335[10:31:25] <madmerlyn> I'm lucky if I'm doing 5 degrees at that point

L336[10:31:49] <madmerlyn> guess I could do some sounding of my own now that I know kOS heh

L337[10:32:16] <madmerlyn> could increase payload capacity on the launches I can't fit in a mk3

L338[10:32:37] <ve2dmn> ha, he had an TWR of 1.69

L339[10:32:45] <ve2dmn> my rocket have usually lower TWR

L340[10:33:16] <madmerlyn> I usually aim for 1.5 or so, sometimes I'll have more pad TWR if I'm using SRBs or something on first stage

L341[10:33:38] <madmerlyn> like it might be 1.9TWR on the pad, but after 40s it drops down to like 1.3 when I stage the SRBs

L342[10:35:40] <ve2dmn> more data is needed

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L344[10:36:35] <madmerlyn> I don't use the SpaceY liquid engines much but I love the SpaceY SRBs for first stages

L345[10:36:44] <Fluburtur> Mat2ch https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/186186471202357249/400689384359329793/DSC_8167.JPG

L346[10:36:56] <madmerlyn> I use the NFE the most, I don't have NFLV though

L347[10:37:04] <Althego> intelli bi power

L348[10:37:28] <madmerlyn> depending on the weight etc. I'll either use a stock engine or a NFE engine, generally if I want it to be cheaper I go stock, if it's going to be recovered I go NFE

L349[10:37:36] <madmerlyn> or if it's going to be reused a lot

L350[10:37:41] <madmerlyn> like an orbital tug

L351[10:38:31] <madmerlyn> that battery doesn't look like a joke :P

L352[10:38:34] <Althego> at least not orbital thug :)

L353[10:38:48] <Fluburtur> yeah

L354[10:38:52] <Fluburtur> 4s 2.2 amps hours

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L356[10:41:04] <madmerlyn> so I wonder if putting a very lightweight bell on a baking soda bottle rocket would provide any significant thrust gain over the default ~22mm "nozzle"

L357[10:41:33] <madmerlyn> the shape of the bottle itself kinda provides its own CD scheme

L358[10:44:32] <madmerlyn> or maybe instead of baking soda and vinegar I should go straight to alcohol and air :O

L359[10:45:19] <madmerlyn> I could rig up an igniter with an old spark plug I'm sure

L360[10:46:59] <halcyon_b> Hey folks - anyone seens issues with new KSP installations from Steam on Windows 10?

L361[10:47:20] <ve2dmn> new install?

L362[10:47:21] <madmerlyn> none that I've heard of

L363[10:48:06] <halcyon_b> Yeah, new install. Ran fine on the laptop before, but it's been reimaged since then. Works fine on my Arch Linux system.

L364[10:48:57] <halcyon_b> I've tried backrevving to 1.30 and 1.22, but they both seem to have problems, which makes me think it might be a graphics driver or possibly new hardware issue. Thought I would ask just in case there was something going on with the latest build.

L365[10:49:00] <ve2dmn> I have both Ubuntu and Win10. Runs fine for me...

L366[10:49:05] <madmerlyn> I have troubles any time I launch with steam overlay on

L367[10:49:12] <madmerlyn> it makes my KSP crash a lot

L368[10:49:35] <madmerlyn> I just launch directly from executable instead of through steam

L369[10:50:42] <halcyon_b> I tried that a couple times without much luck. I would just install Arch or Ubuntu on there but they don't handle Bumblebee/Optimus very well, even now

L370[10:51:22] <halcyon_b> Maybe that's more of a user problem though.

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L373[11:00:07] <Mat2ch> Fluburtur: it makes me a bit happy to see it's still getting used

L374[11:00:15] <Fluburtur> yeah

L375[11:00:20] <Fluburtur> it was in my friend's basement

L376[11:00:29] <Fluburtur> I will give him back his charger then

L377[11:00:38] <Fluburtur> but yours doesn't count the mah refilled sadly

L378[11:01:08] <Mat2ch> I thought it does

L379[11:01:29] <Fluburtur> I will have to make sure

L380[11:03:06] <Fluburtur> uh yeah im discharing a battery and there is a counter on the top right I think it's mah

L381[11:03:12] <Fluburtur> but doesn't do mah for each cell

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L384[11:06:02] <madmerlyn> oo you could do butane with soda like cocacola, if you have a right to flip it quickly

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L386[11:06:10] <madmerlyn> rig*

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L392[11:21:37] <Mat2ch> Fluburtur: could the other do that?

L393[11:21:43] <Fluburtur> yeah

L394[11:21:57] <Fluburtur> becaue it doesn't use the main leads for charge, only the balance leads

L395[11:21:59] <Mat2ch> woah. It must have discharged through the balancer then

L396[11:22:09] <Fluburtur> but since yours has a separated balance board it can't

L397[11:22:52] <Mat2ch> yeah. I bought mine one year too early :|

L398[11:23:01] <Fluburtur> heh

L399[11:23:12] <Mat2ch> the version released the year after had the balancer integrated

L400[11:23:13] <Fluburtur> well at least it works

L401[11:23:40] <Mat2ch> I bought it at a time where LiPos weren't that common yet.

L402[11:23:44] <Fluburtur> how old is that charger even

L403[11:24:04] <Mat2ch> Do you really want me to take a look at very old invoices? ;P

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L405[11:24:49] <Fluburtur> eh just the approximate year will do

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L407[11:25:36] <Fluburtur> also when I select the discharge option does it discharge it to storage level?

L408[11:28:53] <Mat2ch> 2007? 2008?

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L410[11:29:24] <Mat2ch> No, it discharges it to a voltage. Iirc this is configurable

L411[11:29:58] <Fluburtur> eh

L412[11:30:06] <Fluburtur> I only found the discharge amp

L413[11:30:13] <Fluburtur> and battery type

L414[11:30:20] <Fluburtur> guess I will have to go get the manual

L415[11:30:39] <Mat2ch> well, it's ten years when I read that manual

L416[11:30:49] <Mat2ch> And I'm not sure if I ever used the discharge option at all

L417[11:31:29] <Fluburtur> I rarely fully discharge the batteries when using them

L418[11:31:38] <Mat2ch> The LiPos back then were very sensitive

L419[11:31:39] <Fluburtur> and not patient enough for using the lamp

L420[11:32:13] <Mat2ch> there's no memory effect in lipo accumulators

L421[11:32:28] <Mat2ch> doesn't matter if you charge them at 33 % or at 50 %

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L423[11:32:50] <Fluburtur> eh

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L425[11:32:58] <Fluburtur> it damages them to leave them charged a long time

L426[11:33:02] <Fluburtur> I killed a few like this

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L429[11:34:55] <Mat2ch> eh, other way round. Best storage capacity is around 75 %. They dislike it a bit more to store them at 100 %, but if you store them too low their self-discharge will destroy them definitely

L430[11:35:10] <Fluburtur> eh

L431[11:35:17] <Fluburtur> apparently 3.7v is best

L432[11:35:26] <Fluburtur> and put them in the fridge

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L435[11:46:57] <Mat2ch> Fluburtur: https://www.propwashed.com/lipo-storage-voltage/

L436[11:46:59] <Mat2ch> long read

L437[11:47:02] <Mat2ch> but worth it

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L439[11:47:14] <Fluburtur> alright I will look at that

L440[11:48:44] <Mat2ch> also the paper he cites is about Li-Ion which imho can't be directly applied to LiPos

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L442[11:49:22] <Fluburtur> I guess li-ion are made to last long when charged

L443[11:49:39] <Fluburtur> otherwise im in a abd situation becaseu the ones in my mini wing have been charged for like a month

L444[11:49:42] <Mat2ch> Eh, the paper he cites begs to differ :)

L445[11:49:56] <Mat2ch> but it's only a fraction

L446[11:50:14] <Mat2ch> I hate the internet for not having good sources for their claims

L447[11:50:32] <Mat2ch> everybody is talking about the lipo storage charge, but nobody has any data to verify those claims

L448[11:50:44] <Mat2ch> and many are just writing what they have heard somewhere

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L450[11:51:06] <Fluburtur> well they come from the factory at 3.7 so I trust that

L451[11:52:03] <Mat2ch> if you're producing lots and lots of lipos... would you sell them fully charged or sell them at a minimum charge level to save energy/money? ;)

L452[11:52:38] <Fluburtur> I guess they put it at that level for safe storing and transporting

L453[11:52:57] <madmerlyn> actually I don't think the cost of electricity is the issue, batteries, even lithium ones are more stable when charged around 50%, they ship them partially charged because of that

L454[11:53:03] <Fluburtur> and I know that keeping batteries fully charged have killed a few of mine too so I wouldn't do that

L455[11:53:17] <madmerlyn> this is according to my former boss who worked in EE for like 30 years

L456[11:53:40] <Mat2ch> true.

L457[11:54:17] <Mat2ch> Fluburtur: how long do you store your accumulators? Month?

L458[11:54:23] <madmerlyn> flub I'm looking at doing something like this before I do a serious hobby rocket https://www.instructables.com/id/The-Ultimate-Altimeter-A-compact-Arduino-altimeter/

L459[11:54:32] <Fluburtur> sometimes a few weeks

L460[11:54:48] <madmerlyn> except instead of putting it in a case I'll come up with something a little more rocket friendly

L461[11:54:49] <Fluburtur> looks like a fun project

L462[11:55:00] <Mat2ch> still shouldn't damage them. Hrm

L463[11:55:01] <madmerlyn> it's accurate to within 1 ft/0.3m

L464[11:55:16] <Fluburtur> put one of those 2.4ghz radio modules to talk with a ground station

L465[11:55:21] <madmerlyn> wonder if I could put some other telemetry on it like a temperature sensor

L466[11:55:55] <madmerlyn> stick it on a hobby rocket that goes like 100m up and measure the temperature

L467[11:56:18] <madmerlyn> the temp sensor would have to be exposed to air before chute deployment though

L468[11:57:22] <madmerlyn> although if the temp sensor and altimeter are both running on the same controller could just have temp sensor exposed and have the device pull like 3 readings after altimeter peaks, that way it gets readings when velocity is the lowest and there's not as much air moving around it

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L470[11:58:15] <Fluburtur> I guess taking readings at a regular interval and calculating vertical speed could be fun

L471[11:58:21] <Fluburtur> you could do graphs

L472[11:58:26] <madmerlyn> yes

L473[11:59:19] <madmerlyn> some of the hobby rockets I'm finding are pretty inexpensive too, but small, I'm thinking I'll be limited on space if I try to pack my telemetry in the nose

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L475[11:59:29] <madmerlyn> otherwise I could try to radially mount it and balance it

L476[11:59:41] <Fluburtur> make a candy rocket?

L477[11:59:53] <Fluburtur> and if yu

L478[12:00:10] <Fluburtur> if you make a ground station with radio link you can get live readings

L479[12:00:18] <Fluburtur> and backup in case the rocket doesn't survive

L480[12:00:49] <madmerlyn> my only concern with radial mount is the tube itself could get pretty warm using a hobby SRB engine

L481[12:01:08] <Fluburtur> eh I don't think they ge that hot

L482[12:01:11] <madmerlyn> in the nose you have all the wadding insulating everything from the heat

L483[12:01:29] <Fluburtur> but they do have a part that burns upward to eject the chute

L484[12:02:11] <madmerlyn> that's another thing, instead of using explosive chutes.. couldn't you possibly do something springloaded if you have an arduino with an altimeter on board

L485[12:02:18] <Fluburtur> yeah

L486[12:02:32] <madmerlyn> soon as it detects altitude is no longer increasing, turn a tiny servo or something to unlatch the spring mechanism

L487[12:03:04] <Fluburtur> or use a gyro to keep it upright and do a suicide burn with another smaller rocket

L488[12:03:09] <Fluburtur> and land powered

L489[12:03:10] <madmerlyn> lol

L490[12:03:25] <Fluburtur> I mean if you get it within a few meters per seconds low enough it will "land"

L491[12:03:25] <madmerlyn> I think with all hobby solid engines that would be very difficult to pull off

L492[12:03:35] <Fluburtur> well tey are well documented

L493[12:03:42] <Fluburtur> with burn time and thrust

L494[12:04:11] <EricPoehlsen> finding the right ones is the hard thing and getting the math right

L495[12:04:23] <madmerlyn> yeah but even with a 150 gram rocket you're talking about a pretty crazy gyro to keep it upright, especially with fins on the bottom of it

L496[12:04:32] <Fluburtur> but you would have to stabilise a unstable rocket

L497[12:04:52] <Fluburtur> so you could have fins on the back controlled by servos and the retroboost rocket on the nose

L498[12:04:59] <Fluburtur> this way the rocket is going nose down when landing

L499[12:05:10] <madmerlyn> lol now you're getting into the realm of not really a hobby rocket :P

L500[12:05:12] <Fluburtur> eh any mpu6050 will do the job

L501[12:05:50] <madmerlyn> I just want to do something fun with the girls, shoot a rocket up a few hundred feet, and get some data from the airspace up there that can be logged or graphed

L502[12:06:15] <Fluburtur> yeah

L503[12:06:22] <Fluburtur> but is that kebal enough?

L504[12:06:27] <madmerlyn> yes.

L505[12:06:29] <EricPoehlsen> yes

L506[12:06:35] <Fluburtur> I need to make a nose land rocket in ksp now

L507[12:06:35] <EricPoehlsen> and you start small

L508[12:07:12] <madmerlyn> yeah I want to build a flight telemetry unit that can be fitted on multiple rockets

L509[12:07:38] <madmerlyn> something light, gets at least altitude if nothing else, and is easy to remove and fit if and when I get bigger rockets

L510[12:07:54] <Fluburtur> yeah

L511[12:08:01] <madmerlyn> I'm thinking maybe I could do temperature and barometric pressure in addition to altitude without too much mass

L512[12:08:12] <madmerlyn> they make lots of tiny sensors for arduino and RPi stuff

L513[12:08:13] <Fluburtur> so like arduino nano, thermometer, barometer and nrf024l

L514[12:08:37] <madmerlyn> run it all off like a 40maH lipo

L515[12:09:00] <Fluburtur> well with a refresh time of like 100ms it could last like 10 minutes

L516[12:09:01] <madmerlyn> should be able to do several launches on a single charge

L517[12:09:17] <Fluburtur> transmit to an arduino on the ground with a sd card thiny to log all the data

L518[12:09:20] <Fluburtur> and a screen

L519[12:09:25] <madmerlyn> well that altimeter design I linked earlier says 6h if you don't light up the segments

L520[12:10:06] <madmerlyn> if I'm doing RF transmission that'll bring the battery life down but eliminate the need for any LED segments, would probably still install them as a redundancy if the transmission fails though

L521[12:10:22] <madmerlyn> but could have them not light up unless a switch is flipped to conserve battery

L522[12:10:29] <Fluburtur> you probably need a way to store the data too

L523[12:10:42] <Fluburtur> if the arduino reboots it's gone unless you do some clever stuff

L524[12:11:51] <madmerlyn> if it's 150 grams or less mass though even if the chute doesn't deploy I think everything would survive

L525[12:12:05] <Fluburtur> yeah it will just need a stiff frame

L526[12:12:15] <Fluburtur> and that everything doesn't fall on it with too much inertia

L527[12:12:38] <madmerlyn> I mean most of the rocket bodies I've been looking at are just cardboard tubes, I could easily replace a body with reinforced paper towel tube

L528[12:12:49] <Fluburtur> yeah

L529[12:12:55] <Fluburtur> I have a few aluminium foil tubes

L530[12:12:56] <madmerlyn> I think the body is the most common casualty in a hobby rocket

L531[12:13:02] <Fluburtur> those are smaller diameter but rather thick

L532[12:13:34] <madmerlyn> paper towel roll with 2 layers of mesh tape probably all you need for a rocket

L533[12:13:46] <Fluburtur> yeah

L534[12:13:53] <madmerlyn> maybe run a little wax on the inside of the tube to fireproof it

L535[12:14:13] <Fluburtur> then something like that http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3495/4570689848_f18ab372e5.jpg

L536[12:14:31] <madmerlyn> that looks heavy lol

L537[12:14:35] <Fluburtur> yeah

L538[12:14:40] <Fluburtur> more like art than rocket stuff

L539[12:14:50] <madmerlyn> it looks like something you'd put in a big boy rocket

L540[12:14:52] <Fluburtur> but the fancy round avionics bays

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L542[12:15:00] <madmerlyn> one of those 50lb rockets heh

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L546[12:17:29] <madmerlyn> you know that might not be a terrible idea though, have it go in the tube on top of the wadding but below the chute etc

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L548[12:17:46] <madmerlyn> I just don't want the sensors insulated inside the rocket

L549[12:24:07] <madmerlyn> oh hey, flub check this out https://www.adafruit.com/product/1893

L550[12:24:14] <madmerlyn> barometer + altimeter in 1

L551[12:24:56] <Deddly> An altimeter works on the same principle as a barometer, so that's not so strange :)

L552[12:24:57] <madmerlyn> and has a temperature sensor that's accurate between 1 and 3 C

L553[12:25:19] <Althego> i would still like a pitot static system with an adc better :)

L554[12:25:19] <Deddly> Nice and tiny though

L555[12:26:17] <madmerlyn> that thing has all 3 sensors I'm looking for in 1, granted 1-3C is not that good accuracy, but for a first avionics unit I think it's good enough

L556[12:37:42] <ve2dmn> you could also add a GPS module: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/14030

L557[12:37:58] <Fluburtur> what was it? keep it simple?

L558[12:38:11] <Fluburtur> I guess thermometer and barometer are good enough

L559[12:38:20] <Fluburtur> you can get 3 readings with a barometer alone

L560[12:38:26] <madmerlyn> more avionics aren't as complicated as engineering a retrothrust landing lol

L561[12:38:30] <Fluburtur> presure, altitude and vertical speed

L562[12:39:27] <madmerlyn> according to that sparkfun page the gps records altitude too, so you could keep both readings and compare

L563[12:39:36] <Fluburtur> yeah

L564[12:39:48] <Fluburtur> not sure which one is more accurate however

L565[12:40:31] <ve2dmn> that GPS board is open hardware btw

L566[12:40:38] <ve2dmn> I just noticed the logo

L567[12:41:18] <madmerlyn> oo that module has the microSD on it too

L568[12:41:24] <madmerlyn> that solves the storing data problem

L569[12:42:34] <madmerlyn> that + the barometer based altimeter would get me 2 separate readings of altitude and speed to average out for accuracy

L570[12:42:48] <madmerlyn> in addition to temperature and pressure readings

L571[12:44:03] <ve2dmn> I have 2 arduino for that kind of project... they are still sitting on a shelf

L572[12:44:19] <madmerlyn> it's been a while since I've worked with arduino

L573[12:44:33] <madmerlyn> I did a custom daisy-chain capable pumpkin light deal for halloween like.. 7 years ago

L574[12:44:38] <ve2dmn> I also have 3 rPI and about 8 orangePi

L575[12:44:46] <madmerlyn> had 3 jack o lanterns all synced to the same light pattern

L576[12:45:13] <madmerlyn> but now they have random color LED pucks for jack o lanterns for like $2

L577[12:45:26] <madmerlyn> I do think the quality of mine was better though

L578[12:45:42] <madmerlyn> did some random number fun to make it look like a proper flame flicker and etc.

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L580[12:46:16] <madmerlyn> actually think it was more like 5 years ago because it was after I moved into the house

L581[12:46:34] <madmerlyn> I've only got 2 RPis though, 1 2nd and 1 3rd gen

L582[12:46:54] <madmerlyn> and I own 1 legit arduino and have several homebrewed ones

L583[12:47:31] <madmerlyn> the pumpkin light project was done on ATtiny85s, bare bones didn't even have full components of an arduino

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L585[12:48:13] <ve2dmn> I run my own micro-server at home for small things

L586[12:48:34] <ve2dmn> It's screwed behind my monitor, because the rPi is small enough :)

L587[12:48:51] <Mathuin> If I have to migrate to Kubernetes, I'm going to have to build a Beowulf cluster of RPis. :-(

L588[12:49:33] <ve2dmn> At least it's a cheap Beowolf cluster

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L590[12:50:08] <madmerlyn> my home server I believe is running a 4th gen Atom or something

L591[12:50:23] <madmerlyn> was a barebones bookshelf type deal I bought, thing is pretty small

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L593[12:51:03] <Mathuin> No longer really have a "server", just a Synology that runs LDAP and NFS and such for two.

L594[12:51:27] <ve2dmn> run a small home server on a EEEpc laptop once. Has it's own battery and integrated keyboard/screen

L595[12:51:42] <Fluburtur> Mat2ch yeah your charger does countthe mah

L596[12:54:05] <madmerlyn> I don't have LDAP at home heh

L597[12:54:11] <madmerlyn> I run Samba and NFS though

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L599[12:54:50] <madmerlyn> got a big 5TB USB3 drive hooked up to the server, holds all our media and etc., server also runs Plex

L600[12:55:14] <madmerlyn> the external USB is actually about the same size as the server its plugged into heh

L601[12:55:26] <ve2dmn> +1 for Plex

L602[12:55:33] <ve2dmn> even if I don't use it anymore

L603[12:55:39] <madmerlyn> it's hooked up to the LR TV for emergency troubleshooting

L604[12:55:59] <madmerlyn> had a couple instances where I had to manually run fsck after a power outage to get it to boot up to where I could SSH in

L605[12:56:18] <Mathuin> My home NTP server was a laptop years ago

L606[12:56:31] <madmerlyn> TV has like 3 HDMI inputs on it though so I just have the server on HDMI3

L607[12:56:35] <Mathuin> Worked better than you think with a hardware clock attached.

L608[12:56:50] <ve2dmn> Mathuin: all you need is a GPS receiver really

L609[12:56:58] <Mathuin> Motorola M12 Oncore was mine

L610[12:57:14] * Mathuin may be mentioned in the committers for that driver

L611[12:57:27] <Mathuin> My first experience with writing drivers, lots of fun.

L612[12:57:49] <Fluburtur> madmerlyn if you use a radio link you could activate the rocket by radio

L613[12:57:56] <ve2dmn> was there any good documentation?

L614[12:58:11] <madmerlyn> I'd need to rig something to the igniter for that

L615[12:58:25] <Fluburtur> a beefy transistor and a 9v battery

L616[12:58:33] <Fluburtur> doesn't even need to stay on the rocket

L617[12:58:47] <Mathuin> The documentation was adequate, and the rest wasn't too too hard to figure out.

L618[12:59:24] <ve2dmn> Mathuin: because there is an interesting talk on CCC of this year (few weeks ago) about finding secret x86 instructions

L619[13:00:21] <Mathuin> That was a huge thing way back in the day.

L620[13:00:26] <Mathuin> But the x was smaller then.

L621[13:00:43] * Mathuin used to have an 80186 on a controller board

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L623[13:06:46] <madmerlyn> I wonder if a tic tac container would be a suitable enclosure for radially mounted avionics

L624[13:07:19] <madmerlyn> could add one to the other side with sand or something as a ballast to even out the weight on the rocket

L625[13:08:03] <madmerlyn> or wire out some of the sensors and split them up to divide the weight evenly

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L627[13:08:37] <madmerlyn> I've got a kitchen scale that I believe is accurate enough to balance out the containers

L628[13:23:25] <ve2dmn> Mathuin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrksBdWcZgQ

L629[13:23:25] <kmath> YouTube - Breaking the x86 Instruction Set

L630[13:23:36] <ve2dmn> it was blackhat, not the CCC

L631[13:25:09] <Althego> this was an amazing presentation

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L633[13:29:07] <madmerlyn> if I did a RF transmission for telemetry data I could do like 100ms polling and just have it transmit every 10th cycle or something to reduce battery usage on the radio

L634[13:29:22] <madmerlyn> send 1 big packet every second instead of 10 small ones

L635[13:34:37] <madmerlyn> https://i.imgur.com/Wk3GYqH.mp4

L636[13:36:32] <Althego> at least it wasnt a crt

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L643[14:09:11] <madmerlyn> mid afternoon slump

L644[14:14:38] <Fluburtur> I should ask my uncle if he has a aerograph

L645[14:16:22] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: lack of caffeine

L646[14:23:13] <madmerlyn> I suppose I should start working on R&D for landing reusable vertical rockets again

L647[14:23:48] <madmerlyn> I feel like I can't go much bigger than an orange tank with mk3 without my plane getting ridiculous and a reusable vertical would enable me much larger payloads

L648[14:24:02] <madmerlyn> especially with the space 5m tanks etc.

L649[14:24:08] <madmerlyn> spaceY*

L650[14:24:36] <ve2dmn> how do you that without the game de-spawn the other parts of the rocket?

L651[14:24:45] <madmerlyn> SSTO

L652[14:25:24] <madmerlyn> I'm also not opposed to using 2STO with cheap SRBs on first stage, my focus is on cost per ton of payload not 100% reusability

L653[14:25:51] <ve2dmn> make sense

L654[14:26:16] <madmerlyn> right now up to 32t I can do under 7k/ton to Munar surface, and I think LKO is around 850

L655[14:26:25] <madmerlyn> with my Excalibur plane that is

L656[14:27:06] <madmerlyn> I think my best cost per ton LKO on vertical rockets is 1500, but I don't currently have any that I've extensively landed for recovery

L657[14:28:03] <ve2dmn> I maxime for dV, so I do a lot of 3,4 or 5 stages rockets or Aspergus staging

L658[14:28:21] <madmerlyn> I think if I scrap the whole landing on the launchpad part of it and settle for the 2% loss I can get a decent cost per ton

L659[14:29:09] <madmerlyn> well my lifters are always targeted at just putting XX tons in orbit

L660[14:29:20] <madmerlyn> at minimal cost

L661[14:29:34] <ve2dmn> look into the tracker Admin strategy. I'm pretty sure it's not worth it, but it might be if you re-use everything and don't land at KSc

L662[14:29:59] <madmerlyn> well with trajectories mod I think I can land pretty darn close to launchpad

L663[14:30:21] <madmerlyn> possibly even close enough to get 100%, if you're in the launchpad's biome but not on the pad does it still count for 100%?

L664[14:30:24] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baSSm3pgyvU

L665[14:30:24] <kmath> YouTube - Scrapheap Bandits!

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L667[14:38:51] <Fluburtur> I moved the defective water deflector forward

L668[14:39:06] <Fluburtur> this means I have an excuse to drive the canadair on water tomorrow

L669[14:39:21] <Althego> when are you going to fly it?

L670[14:39:33] <Fluburtur> maybe this weekend

L671[14:40:06] <Althego> hah marble machine video

L672[14:41:11] <Althego> with music montage

L673[14:43:07] <Althego> that is not wood...

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L675[14:53:32] <ve2dmn> ...that's a space station

L676[14:54:00] <madmerlyn> I wonder if there would be much demand for setting up smart homes in my area

L677[14:54:17] <madmerlyn> I've had an Echo in my kitchen for a year and my family loves it

L678[14:55:12] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: I don't see that thing getting popular here... but of course there's a major language barrier to break first

L679[14:55:32] <madmerlyn> aren't you in Canada?

L680[14:55:49] <ve2dmn> Yes

L681[14:56:07] <madmerlyn> a lot of French in your region or what? I thought English was pretty universal up there

L682[14:56:26] <oren> madmerlyn: he's pobably a qwebecker

L683[14:57:17] <madmerlyn> and I imagine Amazon's AI knows French too

L684[14:58:18] <ve2dmn> From my experience it, we are too small a market for anyone to care

L685[14:58:40] <madmerlyn> you're not the only territory that speaks French though

L686[14:58:50] <madmerlyn> there's that whole France place..

L687[14:58:51] <ve2dmn> yes, but the accent is a big barrier

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L689[14:59:20] <madmerlyn> well apparently Alexa doesn't do French https://www.engadget.com/2017/11/15/amazon-alexa-prime-music-canada/

L690[15:00:53] <ve2dmn> Which explain why I've never seen the device

L691[15:01:47] <ve2dmn> (never looked into getting one. I have Google Now on my phone and I don't even use it)

L692[15:02:05] <madmerlyn> the one in the kitchen is primarily just for hands free music control

L693[15:02:28] <ve2dmn> You have a subscription?

L694[15:02:32] <madmerlyn> we just say "Alexa, play Octane on SiriusXM" and boom I'm jamming some hard rock while I wash the dishes

L695[15:02:49] <madmerlyn> well AFAIK you don't have to have prime for Alexa, but yes I have Prime

L696[15:03:06] <madmerlyn> the free 2 day shipping alone makes Prime a no brainer for me, I buy a lot of stuff on Amazon heh

L697[15:03:22] <madmerlyn> and they've had a couple decent streaming exclusives

L698[15:03:56] <madmerlyn> I have a small amplifier and 2 bookshelf speakers set up on top of the cabinets in my kitchen hooked up to the Echo

L699[15:04:30] <ve2dmn> Prime is only a recent thing in Canada

L700[15:04:36] <madmerlyn> my wife was plugging in with a 3.5mm cable to a bookshelf speaker on top of the microwave before, but somehow she constantly has problems with her cell phones (even after getting her newer ones, ugh)

L701[15:04:59] <madmerlyn> and offloading the music to the echo dot has made her life so much better heh

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L703[15:06:01] <ve2dmn> I wish we could get YoutubeRed

L704[15:06:13] <ve2dmn> Or the selection on netflix

L705[15:06:26] <ve2dmn> Or GoogleFi

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L707[15:07:13] <madmerlyn> as far as netflix goes you can think the studios who own the content for that garbage

L708[15:07:24] <ve2dmn> *sigh*

L709[15:07:42] <madmerlyn> Pai's recent shenanigans don't help that situation either

L710[15:07:46] <ve2dmn> same reason I will never be able to get QI

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L712[15:10:12] <ve2dmn> current selection of Netlfix in canada: 5,219 releases

L713[15:11:07] <ve2dmn> Which is much better then the catalog available in, say, Finalnd (about 3000)

L714[15:12:38] <ve2dmn> It's a bit annoying. Thing like google voice never came back...

L715[15:13:03] <ve2dmn> (because the company Google acquired, GrandCentral, was available in Canada)

L716[15:13:56] <Althego> https://twitter.com/mcwm/status/951190881293357058

L717[15:13:57] <kmath> <mcwm> Lol at all the phones being held hostage in this charging station that currently has no power and so no way of open… https://t.co/EemFGhVuYC

L718[15:13:58] <madmerlyn> maybe I should make a mk3 cargo plane like this? lol https://i.redd.it/duoawf5lm18y.jpg

L719[15:14:28] <Fluburtur> what in hell is that

L720[15:14:47] <madmerlyn> "Largest aircraft concept Beriev Be-2500P 'Neptune'"

L721[15:15:10] <madmerlyn> the canards with top mounted engines though, lol

L722[15:15:27] <madmerlyn> wing stabilizers AND 2 tailplanes

L723[15:15:55] <Althego> looks like too much drag

L724[15:16:11] <madmerlyn> which is why you have jets on the canards :P

L725[15:17:06] <madmerlyn> then there's this thing, the Kalinin K-7 https://i.redd.it/bvhtvooylvbz.jpg

L726[15:17:21] <madmerlyn> is that supposed to be a literal flying fortress?

L727[15:17:32] <madmerlyn> assuming it is capable of flight..

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L732[15:23:24] <Supernovy> Evening, Gentlemen.

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L734[15:25:33] <riksolo> \o

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L736[15:37:24] <madmerlyn> evening Novy

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L739[15:43:19] <Phantom_Hoover> hey, so i'm wondering where you're supposed to store propellants in KSP interstellar?

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L741[15:43:32] <Phantom_Hoover> i've seen videos where they have a fuel tank but i don't see them in the VAB

L742[15:43:40] <APlayer> 'evening, guys!

L743[15:43:47] <madmerlyn> wut up AP

L744[15:45:08] <APlayer> Still working properly, providing internet access to dozens of devices! :P

L745[15:45:11] <madmerlyn> TIL stock atmo changes based on latitude and time of day

L746[15:45:25] <madmerlyn> I should KSPRC data from a barometer :P

L747[15:46:25] <madmerlyn> or at least that's what people on reddit would have me believe

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L754[16:02:22] <Fluburtur> I need to tell my friend to get proper batteries fro his radio

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L759[16:29:38] <Phantom_Hoover> seriously, anyone know how to store e.g. hydrogen in ksp interstellar?

L760[16:33:41] <Phantom_Hoover> does it include fuel tank parts or no??

L761[16:35:37] <APlayer> I am sure it does

L762[16:37:42] <Phantom_Hoover> i don't see them

L763[16:37:50] <Phantom_Hoover> so i don't see any sensible way of storing hydrogen

L764[16:41:37] <Mathuin> The fuels include antimatter, deuterium, and tritium among others. All of those are hydrogen of a kind.

L765[16:41:45] <Mathuin> (this is from the wiki's homepage)

L766[16:42:10] <Mathuin> The latter two can be stored in the "Deuterium Tritium Tank".

L767[16:43:00] <Mathuin> From the wiki page on Antimatter -- "Antimatter is a non-stack separated resource, similar to monopropellant." Unsure what that really means at the end of the day.

L768[16:43:14] <Mathuin> It's stored in "Antimatter Containment Devices".

L769[16:43:17] <Mathuin> Hope that helps!

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L771[16:51:18] <Phantom_Hoover> Mathuin, it doesn't really, i want to know how to store plain old hydrogen

L772[16:51:22] <Phantom_Hoover> plain old remass hydrogen

L773[16:51:47] <Phantom_Hoover> there's a big radial cryostat but nothing conveniently inline

L774[16:51:52] <Phantom_Hoover> and it seems like there should be

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L777[16:57:42] <Mathuin> Phantom_Hoover: I do not see any support for plain old hydrogen.

L778[16:57:50] <Mathuin> Like, at all.

L779[16:58:01] <Mathuin> I do not use the mod. I read the wiki for two minutes. That's all I got. :-)

L780[16:58:50] <Phantom_Hoover> it's definitely there! the radial cryogenic fuel tank X11 stores LH2

L781[16:59:17] <Phantom_Hoover> aha https://github.com/sswelm/KSP-Interstellar-Extended/tree/abcf448d6ffeaf50a23389d05970fad574a55dba/GameData/WarpPlugin/Parts/FuelTank/InterstellarFuelTank

L782[16:59:24] <Phantom_Hoover> none of these parts are in my game! wtf is going on

L783[17:03:14] <ve2dmn> Phantom_Hoover: check the science facility

L784[17:03:29] <Phantom_Hoover> i can't see them even in a sandbox save!

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L787[17:19:21] <Mathuin> Do you have the files in your GameData

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L789[17:26:02] <Phantom_Hoover> y... let me check

L790[17:35:28] <Phantom_Hoover> Mathuin, yeah, they're definitely there

L791[17:35:32] <Phantom_Hoover> just not getting loaded?

L792[17:36:40] <Mathuin> Do they have any tech tree limits, or module manager tweaks?

L793[17:37:34] <Phantom_Hoover> tech tree limits shouldn't matter, right? they're not showing up in sandbox!

L794[17:38:25] <Mathuin> Yeah, that would not explain sandbox.

L795[17:38:35] <Phantom_Hoover> just started a fresh sandbox save, no sign of the fuel tanks

L796[17:38:44] <Mathuin> It's a pain, but creating a brand new KSP install with just Interstellar might be interesting.

L797[17:39:34] <Phantom_Hoover> that's literally what this is

L798[17:39:46] <Phantom_Hoover> i have only installed interstellar, its prerequisites, and mechjeb

L799[17:39:53] <ve2dmn> Phantom_Hoover: something is wrong with the part. A look inside the log files will probably tell you why, but it might be easier to re-install the game and re-install the mod

L800[17:40:19] <ve2dmn> Installed Manually or via CKAN?

L801[17:41:16] <Phantom_Hoover> checked the log

L802[17:41:18] <Phantom_Hoover> '[ERR 23:37:26.916] Cannot find a PartModule of typename 'InterstellarFuelSwitch''

L803[17:41:21] <Phantom_Hoover> ve2dmn, manually

L804[17:42:02] <Phantom_Hoover> following install isntructions here https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/155255-131-ksp-interstellar-extended-kspie-1166-30-12-2017-support-release-thread/&

L805[17:42:10] <ve2dmn> Something is not installed correctly, or you are missing a dependance

L806[17:42:51] <Phantom_Hoover> i'd sorta guessed that but i've followed the install instructions exactly afaict

L807[17:43:45] <Phantom_Hoover> is there any way i can inspect the ckan dependency lists?

L808[17:44:27] <ve2dmn> https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/106243-131-interstellar-fuel-switch-ifs-2102/

L809[17:44:45] <ve2dmn> Interstellar Fuel Switch is a different thing

L810[17:45:38] <Phantom_Hoover> yes

L811[17:45:54] <Phantom_Hoover> but the interstellar mod author hasn't listed it as a dependency which seems like incompetence on their part

L812[17:49:02] <Phantom_Hoover> installing it did fix everything, though

L813[17:49:02] <ve2dmn> According to CKAN, it depends on Community Ressource Park, Module Manager, Tweakscale, Heat Control and the Core plugin of Intertellar Fuel Switch (not the complete mod)

L814[17:49:58] <Phantom_Hoover> ugh what's community resource pack

L815[17:50:42] <Fluburtur> im thinking about installing rss in a separate instal

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L818[17:52:39] <ve2dmn> Phantom_Hoover: it's the fuel definitions

L819[17:53:38] <ve2dmn> made externally (as part of RoverDude's stuff) so that they would be the same in all mods

L820[17:53:59] <ve2dmn> if the fuels works in your game, it probably came pre-packaged

L821[17:54:25] <Phantom_Hoover> it's not obviously broken but might as well install it right?

L822[17:54:27] <ve2dmn> https://github.com/BobPalmer/CommunityResourcePack/tree/master/FOR_RELEASE/GameData/CommunityResourcePack

L823[17:55:34] <ve2dmn> like I said. it's probably already there

L824[17:57:34] <ve2dmn> Well... time to turn thoses notes into code

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L829[18:29:59] <Mathuin> Whoa, PS4 KSP, I don't know if that would drive me insane or not.

L830[18:36:47] <ve2dmn> Mathuin: you didn't know?

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L832[18:41:08] <Mathuin> I stopped caring about consoles in general quite some time ago, alas. :-(

L833[18:41:18] <ve2dmn> I like my switch.

L834[18:41:43] <ve2dmn> I have 1h in transit everyday, so it's a perfect toy to play with.

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L836[18:46:20] <Mathuin> Hard to game while pedaling a bicycle.

L837[18:50:01] <ve2dmn> that's my summer transit. And it's 1h, again

L838[18:50:43] <Mathuin> Mine's only fifteen minutes or so, about to start it now, but it's dark and that's less fun.

L839[18:51:02] <Mathuin> But, the wife got an email that they're opening up more parking permits, so maybe we'll drive to work more often.

L840[18:51:40] <ve2dmn> I would bike more, but I hate beeing 'in my head' with nothing to think for an hour.

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L844[18:56:12] <Mathuin> I need the exercise as much as I need to not think while I bike. Time to ride. :-)

L845[18:58:35] <ve2dmn> ok, that's funny.

L846[18:58:47] <ve2dmn> I ran kOS timewarp...

L847[18:59:36] <ve2dmn> And while everything worked, the first trigger managed to run before the timewarp began.

L848[19:00:08] <ve2dmn> So the ship disengaged the clamps, but stayed suspended in mid-air while the warp was running

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L850[19:07:32] <Fluburtur> "The Bombardier 415 can scoop water from sites as shallow as 2 metres"

L851[19:07:36] <Fluburtur> well that's not too bad

L852[19:09:09] <Fluburtur> and those are the doors for letting the water out http://www.oognok.ca/415/doors.jpg

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L854[19:18:11] <ve2dmn> Well, code isn't working...

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L859[19:32:52] *** Drowningpreventionman979 is now known as Dman979

L860[19:37:43] <ve2dmn> madmerlyn: I failed. Code doesn't work :/

L861[19:37:56] <madmerlyn> ULTIMATE DISHONOR

L862[19:39:06] <madmerlyn> I'm landing another base module https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/377130428991012864/400825851664662528/unknown.png

L863[19:39:53] <ve2dmn> Although, my 'drawing vectors on the screen' worked :D

L864[19:41:09] <ve2dmn> It's just that I tried to warp to below accending node for a target ship... and warped to DN instead

L865[19:41:23] <madmerlyn> I always am amazed when my mun script lowers my periapsis to 10km in a fraction of a second full throttle burn lol

L866[19:49:55] <ve2dmn> found the issue... I think

L867[19:50:25] <ve2dmn> now comes the harder part: Rendez-vous

L868[19:52:24] <madmerlyn> my landing script once again overshot by 2.5km, not sure what's going on

L869[19:52:31] <madmerlyn> sending the forklift to get it :P

L870[19:54:59] <ve2dmn> I'm not sure how, in code, I can find where the 2 orbits are closest

L871[19:58:08] <ve2dmn> once I have a single point 'matching' in both orbits, it becomes easy to create an encouter

L872[20:14:03] <ve2dmn> I think it will be simpler to just 'create' that point instead of trying to find it

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L877[21:00:04] <Mathuin> ve2dmn: your code leverages readings from the accelerometer and the gravioli detector, right?

L878[21:06:20] <ve2dmn> it did yes

L879[21:06:35] <Mathuin> Is it worth increasing teh cost of your vessel by 9k ?

L880[21:06:36] <ve2dmn> not the new code

L881[21:06:46] <Mathuin> oh what does the new code do?

L882[21:07:09] <ve2dmn> it uses a simple approximation based on orbit speed :)

L883[21:07:14] <Mathuin> ah!

L884[21:10:28] <ve2dmn> I tried to optimise it with as much input as I could and eventually gave up because I was not seeing major improvements

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L886[21:17:59] <ve2dmn> right now trying to write a rendez-vous script... it's a bit more tricky then I had envisioned

L887[21:19:56] <Draconiator> Whew that was odd...one of my USB Drives had like 4 partitions on it....all normal now

L888[21:20:31] <ve2dmn> Virus?

L889[21:20:39] <ve2dmn> Cosmic ray?

L890[21:20:44] <Mathuin> cached image

L891[21:21:00] <ve2dmn> Too much rum?

L892[21:21:10] <Mathuin> ENORUM

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L894[21:22:22] <ve2dmn> Soon my code will be a mess and will require refactoring

L895[21:22:38] <Mathuin> Hrm. 'set steering to <blah>.' will set your steering to something, is there a way to get the current something?

L896[21:23:02] <ve2dmn> Steering is a variable, no?

L897[21:23:41] <Mathuin> I think so. My rocket's burning and kOS is not multi-threaded so I'm waiting :-)

L898[21:25:27] <ve2dmn> https://ksp-kos.github.io/KOS/structures/misc/steeringmanager.html?highlight=steeringmanager

L899[21:26:59] <ve2dmn> also https://ksp-kos.github.io/KOS/structures/misc/steeringmanager.html#attribute:STEERINGMANAGER:SHOWSTEERINGSTATS

L900[21:28:59] <ve2dmn> I wish there was an easier way to work with 'raw' vectors in kOS

L901[21:29:18] <ve2dmn> I can't add a node via a vector, for example.

L902[21:30:03] <ve2dmn> I have to find the angle between the ship position and the vector, calculate the time it will take me to get there and add the node using the raw future timestamp

L903[21:31:21] <Mathuin> That's a little frustrating.

L904[21:31:26] <Mathuin> Nice find re: steering manager.

L905[21:31:29] <Neal> I see something called saveMD5 in persistent.loadmeta. What happens if I change some values in my save?

L906[21:31:41] <Neal> I hope it doesn't hash check all the saves..

L907[21:32:00] <ve2dmn> Neal: I tweak my save all the time

L908[21:32:07] <ve2dmn> never had an issue

L909[21:32:23] <Neal> which file do you usually modify?

L910[21:32:46] <Neal> I'd specifically like to remove the extra kerbin antenna locations and have only KSC

L911[21:33:08] <ve2dmn> persistent.sfs

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L913[21:33:17] <Neal> yeah that looks more like it

L914[21:33:24] <ve2dmn> or make a named Quicksave and change that

L915[21:33:31] <ve2dmn> MOD-F5

L916[21:34:21] <ve2dmn> I'm not sure you can remove theses locations btw...

L917[21:34:46] <Neal> there was an adv setting when I was making the save where you could disable the extra ones

L918[21:34:53] <Neal> found it in persistent.sfs

L919[21:34:59] <Neal> enableGroundStations = True

L920[21:35:11] <ve2dmn> I know you can chnage it in the difficulty

L921[21:35:23] <Neal> you can do that from ingame?

L922[21:35:29] <ve2dmn> so it's an opition, I'm just not sure you can tweak it more then that

L923[21:35:31] <Neal> like after the save has been made?

L924[21:35:41] <ve2dmn> not once the game is made, no

L925[21:36:22] <Neal> yeah its possible to turn off the extra groundstations by setting "enableGroundStations" to false with a text editor.

L926[21:37:22] <Neal> sorry that was a mess of a conversation

L927[21:37:29] <ve2dmn> no

L928[21:38:03] <ve2dmn> Just make sure to do a copy of the save if you even modifiy anything more

L929[21:38:22] <ve2dmn> It saved me in the past

L930[21:40:18] <Neal> I need to close out of notepad++ before I start cheating and giving myself more money

L931[21:41:00] <Neal> too late I'm bumping up ScienceGainMultiplier

L932[21:41:13] <ve2dmn> Neal: install KEI instead

L933[21:42:46] <Neal> does that one give you science for all of kerbin's biomes or just the spacecenter area?

L934[21:43:01] <ve2dmn> Space Center

L935[21:43:23] <ve2dmn> one button 'collect all KSC science'

L936[21:44:38] <ve2dmn> You could get it all my running around with a kerbal, but I find it tedious

L937[21:44:48] <ve2dmn> better to send the interns instead :D

L938[21:45:22] <Neal> I need a kerbal MIRV

L939[21:45:38] <Neal> warhead breaks apart to spread kerbals far and wide to take measurements

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L941[21:49:30] <Neal> boy am I glad the save parameters aren't obfuscated

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L957[23:19:49] <Caithloki> hey guys, i am trying to find the mod that generates income from completeing certain goals, like having functioning spaces or land bases will increase yearly income well stranded or dead kerbals will lessen it, ive gone through a ton of mod pages but cant find it

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L959[23:23:59] <Caithloki> never mind found it, was state funding

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