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L8[00:52:52] <tawny> has anybody here used the B9 aerospace vtol engines?
L9[00:53:07] <tawny> I'm trying to figure out how the heck any of the controls for them work but I can't make sense of it
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L24[02:23:49] <Iskierka> https://i.imgur.com/PiebfVx.mp4
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L28[02:26:38] <Althego> "i'm on fire"
L29[02:30:42] <Gasher[work]> happened last year, driver survived but car did not
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L33[03:04:00] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJDEsAy9RyM
L34[03:04:01] <kmath> YouTube - The WALKING WATER Mystery (in SPACE and SLOW MOTION!) - Smarter Every Day 160
L35[03:06:47] <Tank2333> Hi o/
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L48[04:25:21] <Blaank> What mod should I get to help automate or at least alert that new science is available?
L49[04:25:34] <Blaank> ForScience is not doing anything I can tell.
L50[04:25:46] <Blaank> The icon is green. when I click it, it's red. Nothing else happens.
L51[04:26:18] <Blaank> I have Jeb and a boatload of science experiments in orbit of minmus and none have activated or popped up anything. I'm still doing it all manually.
L52[04:27:29] <Blaank> Ok, something did happen, I have 10 stored science things in my crew pod. I must have missed it while in map view and it didn't expend any of the one-use experiments.
L53[04:29:44] <TheKosmonaut> There’s a mod called [x] Science!
L54[04:29:57] <Blaank> [x] science just said it catalogs stuff back at base.
L55[04:30:09] <Blaank> Didn't say anything about helping to perform unless I read it very wrong.
L56[04:32:05] <TheKosmonaut> Oh. You literally want a science harvester?
L57[04:32:09] <TheKosmonaut> Dunno about those
L58[04:32:32] <TheKosmonaut> There’s a mod somewhere that instantly gives you all KSC science
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L60[04:32:44] <Blaank> That's not what I mean
L61[04:33:17] <Blaank> I had a mod that had things pop up that I could click and it would run the experiment. [x] science sounds familiar but when I read the CKAN description it said it was about reading science back at base.
L62[04:33:24] <Blaank> Like a record keeping thing.
L63[04:33:41] <Blaank> And shows science you have already collected. Did I read it wrong?
L64[04:34:26] <Blaank> The Science Report and Checklist for KSP. [x] Science! keeps track of the science experiments you have completed and recovered to Kerbal Space Center. It also tracks science you have gathered which is held on vehicles and kerbals. No matter what game scene you are in, what you current vehicle is, [x] Science! always reports on all science held anywhere.
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L66[04:34:47] <Blaank> Nothing there about running experiements.
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L69[04:38:37] <TheKosmonaut> Blaank: it has a list, and when a potential science experiment can be run, a button shows up
L70[04:38:54] <TheKosmonaut> You click and it runs the experiment
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L72[04:44:27] <GlassYuri> japan life hack: don't have a hong kong dollar in your wallet
L73[04:45:06] <GlassYuri> I've mistaken it for both a 100 yen and 500 yen coin several times already
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L77[05:00:44] <girlbeach> http://www.triphile.com/2017/06/bamburg-hotel_16.html ,the 3rd picture is me
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L80[05:18:29] <Althego> lol
L81[05:20:53] <GlassYuri> I'm having trouble focussing on the breasts with that rack railway wye turnout next to them
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L83[05:37:01] <Althego> hehehe
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L98[06:44:15] <Fluburtur> I saw a crow chase a bunch of seaguls from a fointain so he could take a bath today
L99[06:44:20] <Fluburtur> nature is beautiful
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L109[08:00:42] <SkylineKSP> heyo
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L113[08:08:55] <transitbiker> bwoop
L114[08:09:06] <transitbiker> i am officially doing a livestream today
L115[08:09:11] <transitbiker> ksp
L116[08:09:12] <Fluburtur> nice
L117[08:09:29] <transitbiker> going to go through my most recent builds, and do a few more live
L118[08:09:45] <Fluburtur> I can send you a few new ones if you want
L119[08:10:30] <transitbiker> sure
L120[08:10:42] <transitbiker> just setting up now
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L124[08:13:27] <Fluburtur> I think I have 4 new planes for you to try
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L126[08:13:32] <transitbiker1> the hell?
L127[08:13:37] <Fluburtur> lel
L128[08:13:39] <Fluburtur> I think I have 4 new planes for you to try
L129[08:13:52] <transitbiker1> how do i ghost transitbiker?
L130[08:14:04] <Fluburtur> idk
L131[08:15:06] <transitbiker1> it said disconnected, no such device or address
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L134[08:15:17] <transitbiker1> ah brb
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L137[08:16:04] <transitbiker> ...
L138[08:16:31] <transitbiker> packet constipation
L139[08:17:19] <transitbiker> k let me finish setting up
L140[08:18:52] <transitbiker> Fluburtur, you should help me finish the guardian farm on empire mc
L141[08:19:23] <Fluburtur> yeah
L142[08:19:41] <transitbiker> spawn chamber needs fitting out, and the rest of the monument area needs do be dried out
L143[08:19:59] <transitbiker> i have the spawn chamber about half way done structurally
L144[08:20:30] <transitbiker> just needs the other half, roof, and the two layers of signs for water stop & lava stop
L145[08:20:57] <transitbiker> i have enough hoppers and chests for a decent storage system
L146[08:21:05] <transitbiker> but yes - time to skp
L147[08:21:09] <transitbiker> ksp
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L149[08:26:40] <transitbiker> live ksp https://gaming.youtube.com/user/ibook133/live
L150[08:40:23] <Fluburtur> im gonna fly my rc plane, will try to get back before the stream is over
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L160[09:12:12] <Fluburtur> back
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L162[09:16:50] <transitbiker> live ksp https://gaming.youtube.com/user/ibook133/live
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L164[09:22:49] <Fluburtur> don't forget to try my planes
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L168[09:29:43] <Althego> wait, is there a spacex launch today?
L169[09:29:56] <Fluburtur> yeah i think
L170[09:30:09] <Althego> or maybe after midnight as they usually do
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L172[09:40:17] <umaxtu> It got pushed to tomorrow
L173[09:42:34] <transitbiker> must've been a strong person, to push a whole rocket into another day
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L175[09:43:27] <Althego> lol
L176[09:43:32] <Althego> or rather heavy
L177[09:43:41] <Althego> causing it to have relativistic shift
L178[09:43:48] <transitbiker> neutron star man
L179[09:44:38] <transitbiker> showcasing my newest and wackiest craft live!! https://gaming.youtube.com/user/ibook133/live
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L181[09:47:09] <Blaank> Well, I just shocked myself. skipper > jumbo 64 > terrier > FL-T800 > assorted payload. 9.3 km/s empty. Not sure about mass to LKO. Would take testing. The kicker is 14,090 cost.
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L183[09:48:10] <Blaank> 15,690 cost. Forgot the fins
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L196[10:06:55] <Blaank> How do you transfer crew among the same ship?
L197[10:07:05] <transitbiker> who me?
L198[10:07:14] <Althego> right click transfer
L199[10:07:16] <Fluburtur> click on the hatch
L200[10:07:24] <Althego> or what was it, alt click on the door
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L202[10:07:25] <Blaank> What if I can't see the hatch I need them to go to?
L203[10:07:45] <Althego> you need to see at least the cabin for the right click
L204[10:07:48] <Althego> zoom in
L205[10:07:54] <Blaank> I have mk 1 spaceplane and a mk1 cabin
L206[10:08:19] <Althego> right click on the part and there must be an item somewhere with a button that says transfer
L207[10:08:36] <Blaank> ok, that does work.
L208[10:08:45] <Althego> annoying because i always click on the crew report thinking ah crew this must be it
L209[10:09:04] <Blaank> What's the dv in an EVA pack?
L210[10:09:12] <Althego> around 500 i have heard
L211[10:09:30] <Blaank> Nice, I can ignore this 90m/s rendezvous and jump it.
L212[10:09:44] <Blaank> Screw slowing down. You want rescue, you work for it.
L213[10:10:07] <Althego> hehe, martian style?
L214[10:10:20] <Blaank> I had a friend EVA to my ship while we were playing some really buggy multiplayer and he forgot the "half the distance is slowing down" thing.
L215[10:10:29] <Althego> haha
L216[10:10:41] <Blaank> Didn't help my ship was randomly jumping 2km in any direction.
L217[10:15:29] <Blaank> Save 65m/s dv not having to slow down. Cicularizing back at holding orbit and dropping down on next rescue contract.
L218[10:15:43] <Blaank> Pretty easy jump.
L219[10:15:53] <Blaank> I dislike not having 6 DOF during spacewalks.
L220[10:16:09] <Althego> press t?
L221[10:17:22] <Blaank> I remapped controls. Do you mean turn on jetpack?
L222[10:17:42] <Althego> i think the sas button now does something
L223[10:17:55] <Althego> decouples control from camera or something
L224[10:18:32] <Blaank> I know the camera is kind of gets stuck at 90 degrees up and 90 degrees down. It can't do a full orbit.
L225[10:18:50] <Blaank> A lot of game engines don't handle flipping over like that
L226[10:18:59] <Blaank> Like they literally can't do it.
L227[10:19:11] <Blaank> And some games can't even do 90 degrees up or down and lock at 89.
L228[10:19:19] <Althego> hehe gimbal lock
L229[10:19:27] <Blaank> Probably causes math to go crazy and divide by zero or something.
L230[10:20:09] <Althego> ok not an actual gimbal lock, but the same problem, 2 axes happen to fall in the same direction and you lose a dof
L231[10:27:11] <transitbiker> axes? :D
L232[10:27:35] <Althego> axis plural axes
L233[10:27:39] <Althego> i learned that from matlab :)
L234[10:27:45] <Althego> many years ago
L235[10:28:09] <Althego> kind of annoying actually
L236[10:28:57] ⇨ Joins: tawny (~tawny@pool-72-66-36-135.washdc.east.verizon.net)
L237[10:34:01] <Blaank> I wish old tiers of tourist contracts would hang around. I really drop them after they start asking to land on Mun and Minmus.
L238[10:37:36] ⇦ Quits: darsie (~username@84-114-73-160.cable.dynamic.surfer.at) (Ping timeout: 207 seconds)
L239[10:38:25] <transitbiker> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OE1aS91yvQ
L240[10:38:25] <kmath> YouTube - La Grange, KY - Virtual Railfan LIVE
L241[10:39:42] <Althego> what, i was expecting zz top
L242[10:39:56] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vppbdf-qtGU
L243[10:39:56] <kmath> YouTube - ZZ Top - La Grange
L244[10:40:07] <Blaank> Check yo staging.
L245[10:40:58] <Blaank> >launch probe.
L246[10:41:23] <Blaank> >throttle up engines, mash stage one, hit SAS ........ hit SAS ..... rapidly hit SAS and it doesn't turn on.
L247[10:41:36] <Blaank> oh god, no sas on the stayputnik
L248[10:41:46] <Althego> i take tourists to mun while i go to collect science and take rookies there for xp
L249[10:42:11] <Blaank> Once I get jumbo64 this is going to get easier.
L250[10:42:25] <Blaank> Right now I have to tape two of those half sized ones together and I have no mainsails.
L251[10:43:23] <Blaank> KER and MJ for all is not working. Installed everything via CKAN.
L252[10:43:36] <Blaank> MJ works but KER does not.
L253[10:43:50] <Althego> you dont need ker if you have mj
L254[10:44:40] <Blaank> Having both is the best
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L257[10:47:32] <Fluburtur> I should stop hitting myself with doors
L258[10:48:05] <Althego> lol
L259[10:48:10] <Althego> imagine that scene
L260[10:48:26] <Fluburtur> i try to pass doors faster than I open or close them
L261[10:48:53] <Blaank> 525 m/s in drag losses. ouch.
L262[10:49:08] <Althego> you are standing in the middle of a workshop. two doorframes are to your left and right side. and you start to fling the doors in the frames towards you so that they hit you, while screaming
L263[10:49:10] <Blaank> Got a ton of random parts sticking off this thing and plowed through atmos with a really bad tipover
L264[10:49:20] <Fluburtur> heh
L265[10:54:40] <Blaank> 3.7 km/s to LKO. I feel bad.
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L267[11:01:27] <Althego> hehe
L268[11:05:13] <Blaank> I love low drag darts. Kickback with a tiny probe on top in a fairing.
L269[11:05:33] <Blaank> 56.6 m/s drag losses and broke atmos
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L271[11:08:18] ⇨ Joins: sasamj (uid193032@id-193032.brockwell.irccloud.com)
L272[11:10:43] <Blaank> And I forgot to deploy the antennae.
L273[11:10:48] <Blaank> it's dead jim
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L275[11:15:37] ⇨ Joins: dreadkopp (~dreadkopp@p200300C403DDFF002989B87B41FEAAEC.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L276[11:17:02] ⇨ Joins: GuestBanana (webchat@cpe-74-70-204-91.rochester.res.rr.com)
L277[11:18:21] <GuestBanana> when you don't have anything to say and you just want to spread joy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfjHJneVonE
L278[11:18:21] <kmath> YouTube - Verka Serduchka - Dancing Lasha Tumbai (Ukraine) 2007 Eurovision Song Contest
L279[11:19:24] <Althego> lol
L280[11:20:19] <dreadkopp> hey guys :) haven'T played KSP in a while and seemed to have forgot about everything i learned about SSTOs :P anyone can point me to design flaws: https://imgur.com/a/HauPL since i am hitting a speedwall at about 325 m/s ):
L281[11:20:56] <Althego> the engines
L282[11:21:03] <Althego> tried afterbuerner?
L283[11:21:22] <Althego> but even then, i would recommend the old turbojets, or better, the rapiers
L284[11:21:32] <Althego> because those have higher maximum airbreathing speed
L285[11:21:37] <Althego> and cut the nukes to 1
L286[11:21:45] <Althego> they are heavy
L287[11:22:27] <Althego> with 4 of those engines on afterburning you should be able o go supersonic
L288[11:22:32] * GuestBanana takes notes as an SSTO noob
L289[11:22:44] <Althego> but as i said, best is rapier
L290[11:22:57] <Althego> takeoff is hard, but then they giveso much when supersonic
L291[11:23:05] <dreadkopp> stripped the nukes completely to reduce weight but that did not help. rapiers not unlocked yet (next stage for research ceneter is pretty expensive haha (
L292[11:23:21] <Althego> then the turbojets
L293[11:23:27] <Althego> i always forget their name wheesley or what
L294[11:24:01] <dreadkopp> D-30F7 ? had those on before... performed even worse than the panters in wet/afterburn mode :P
L295[11:24:08] <Althego> no
L296[11:24:23] <dreadkopp> ah, the j-33 wheesley ...
L297[11:24:23] <Althego> the big black things
L298[11:24:47] <Althego> 2 of that should put a plane this size to around 1200 m/s
L299[11:24:51] <Blaank> Rapiers are super expensive so don't throw them away on career mode.
L300[11:24:54] <dreadkopp> no big black things here haha :P the wheesleys are relatively small and white :P
L301[11:24:57] <Althego> or even up to 1300
L302[11:25:21] ⇨ Joins: Ezriilc (~Ezriilc@173.168.39.49)
L303[11:25:31] <Althego> heh i forget their name
L304[11:25:42] <Althego> then whiplash
L305[11:25:53] ⇨ Joins: Shoe17 (uid40690@id-40690.charlton.irccloud.com)
L306[11:25:54] <Blaank> Yeah, whiplash are good.
L307[11:25:56] <Althego> to me they are forever the turbojets
L308[11:26:04] <Blaank> I like that everything got a name.
L309[11:26:07] <Blaank> Makes it a lot easier.
L310[11:26:11] <Althego> yes it helps
L311[11:26:32] <Blaank> And I've come to accept that in nearly every case, Reliant > Swivel.
L312[11:26:44] <dreadkopp> lemme check my tech tree really quick :P
L313[11:26:59] <GuestBanana> except in early career/science when you can't pitch very well
L314[11:27:03] <dreadkopp> need those atomic lighbulbs again haha.
L315[11:27:08] <Althego> also did you try running the afterburner on these?
L316[11:27:27] <dreadkopp> https://imgur.com/M2o0o55 https://imgur.com/gw52NW3 https://imgur.com/VdQud8P
L317[11:27:28] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/M2o0o55.png
L318[11:27:33] <Blaank> As soon as you get elevron 1, you are good forever.
L319[11:27:36] <Althego> but whatever the number of engines these will not get you to more than, hmm i dont remember maybe more than 700 m/s
L320[11:27:44] <Blaank> Until you get to the 3.75m anyway.
L321[11:28:25] <Blaank> I do not recognize those engines.
L322[11:28:29] <Blaank> Also, nice wings.
L323[11:28:31] ⇨ Joins: K3|Chris (~ChrisK3@h-9-55.A357.priv.bahnhof.se)
L324[11:28:50] <dreadkopp> Interstellar extended mod
L325[11:29:14] <dreadkopp> currently this is New Horizons + Interstellar extended and a few other mods i cannot remember XD
L326[11:29:30] ⇨ Joins: JCB (webchat@S0106a84e3f5d6a13.vs.shawcable.net)
L327[11:29:34] <GuestBanana> Okay, who put "check yo stagin" on the chat banner?
L328[11:29:49] <Althego> you know what i challenge myself to a half hour ssto
L329[11:29:57] <dreadkopp> haha :)
L330[11:30:00] <GuestBanana> I just found out about those shirts today and am regretting not buying them
L331[11:30:09] <Althego> check yo stagin?
L332[11:30:20] <Althego> ah yes that
L333[11:30:45] <GuestBanana> video in case peeps didn't understand: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoBIaM-nBeI
L334[11:30:45] <kmath> YouTube - Check.... Check.. Check.
L335[11:30:52] <GuestBanana> alright gotta eat lunch
L336[11:30:56] <GuestBanana> sayonara
L337[11:30:58] <dreadkopp> problem is currently i need some cheap reusable ssto otherwise i cannot get enough money to proceed research XD Or i could grind contracts for like 20h ... but that won'T be any fun :P
L338[11:30:59] ⇦ Quits: GuestBanana (webchat@cpe-74-70-204-91.rochester.res.rr.com) (Quit: Web client closed)
L339[11:32:10] ⇨ Joins: fhmiv (~fhmiv@2620:149:5:1b04:1195:3e37:6e6c:dcf1)
L340[11:32:45] <Blaank> Leave sats in orbit and do the science from X missions for cash.
L341[11:33:04] <Blaank> I have a probe with a thermometer parked in orbit of an landed on each body.
L342[11:33:31] <Blaank> How fast did those shirts sell out?
L343[11:34:15] <dreadkopp> science -> cash might even work ... lemme see
L344[11:35:21] <Blaank> That's a bad idea unless you are maxed out.
L345[11:35:45] <JCB> you could do achievments...
L346[11:36:01] <JCB> its a little bit of cash... at least
L347[11:38:26] ⇨ Joins: stratochief (~quassel@108.162.146.236)
L348[11:40:57] <Althego> so first try of the minimalistic ssto, lets call it the minimalistic
L349[11:43:06] <JCB> ssto just to get to space or you had something specific in mind?
L350[11:43:32] <dreadkopp> JCB: i need roughly 2.5 Mio to continue :P
L351[11:43:57] <dreadkopp> i could shoot some probes to other planets / moons but that won't be enough
L352[11:44:43] <JCB> ... Mio?
L353[11:48:13] ⇨ Joins: riocrokite (Mibbit@28.105-65-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be)
L354[11:48:27] <Mathuin> Add the Field Research contract pack, it'll help you round out corner cases in your research collection for cash.
L355[11:50:01] ⇨ Joins: McKaby (~Forgon@95.148.116.109)
L356[11:51:06] <Althego> first try made it to 2100
L357[11:51:10] <Althego> need a bit more fuel
L358[11:51:19] <Althego> break, 9 mintes remaining
L359[11:52:59] <JCB> k... though 2100 what..?
L360[11:53:30] <JCB> I've mostly just been messing with ideas, kind of lost my drive a bit to push into the game like I used to
L361[11:54:15] ⇨ Joins: MalkContent (~MalkConte@p4fdce366.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
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L364[11:57:23] <Althego> m/s
L365[11:57:25] <Althego> continuing
L366[11:57:46] ⇨ Joins: slubman (~quassel@2001:910:1024:0:5dcd:64a:5d2a:728a)
L367[12:01:12] <JCB> ah...
L368[12:01:55] ⇦ Quits: riocrokite (Mibbit@28.105-65-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
L369[12:02:01] <JCB> curious what engines
L370[12:03:11] <Mathuin> JCB: most of my game interest lately has gone meta. Learning about addons and how to write them, looking at kRPC and kOS, that sort of thing.
L371[12:04:33] <Althego> this reached orbital speed, but too flat trajectory, majbe i try again
L372[12:05:22] ⇨ Joins: GuestBanana (webchat@cpe-74-70-204-91.rochester.res.rr.com)
L373[12:05:57] <Althego> heh almost
L374[12:06:15] <Althego> looks like the challenge will fail, because i dont have time for another ascent in the half an hour
L375[12:06:47] <JCB> I haven't gotten the latest... jsut been lazy
L376[12:07:48] <JCB> I've a few sessions going, and a sandbox that's pretty much blank at this moment. I find myself mostly messing with aircraft, the occasional lander or probe idea.. the past while been sick so has killed a lot of motivation
L377[12:09:09] <Blaank> 1.1 km/s at 9km is really hard.
L378[12:09:22] <Mathuin> Part testing mission?
L379[12:09:33] <Blaank> haul a twin board to 6-9km at 1km/s
L380[12:09:40] <Blaank> May end up dropping it.
L381[12:09:47] <Blaank> From pogo launch
L382[12:09:52] <Althego> why is it that in ksp how wings look natural they never work correctly
L383[12:11:43] <JCB> just the way they are modeled..
L384[12:11:54] <JCB> everyone's got their own thoughts on stock vs FAR...
L385[12:12:18] <dreadkopp> making progress... now i need to stop it from exploding XD
L386[12:12:19] <dreadkopp> https://imgur.com/a/qw4vJ
L387[12:12:19] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/zxOQzDY.png
L388[12:12:33] <UmbralRaptor> Lear would be so confused by KSP.
L389[12:13:06] <Blaank> Got the contract done. 10 1/3 fuel kickbacks.
L390[12:14:13] <JCB> I've a few designs that look alright
L391[12:15:59] <Althego> lol now it made it easily with mroe fuel. my ascent was indeed wrong. reached 1400 on the 2 turbojets
L392[12:16:40] <Blaank> Thin frontal profile will do you wonders on planes.
L393[12:17:07] <Blaank> Eliminate as many external parts as you can.
L394[12:17:25] <Blaank> Fairings and payload bays pay for themselves in reduced drag.
L395[12:17:32] <Althego> let's see how it fared for reentry
L396[12:17:38] ⇦ Quits: K3|Chris (~ChrisK3@h-9-55.A357.priv.bahnhof.se) (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92-rdmsoft [XULRunner 35.0.1/20150122214805])
L397[12:17:54] <JCB> don't know... I did alright with a MK3 as a cockpit.. though 1t cargo capacity
L398[12:18:31] <Blaank> SSTOs typically have crap cargo. You have to make superb designs with nukes and rapiers to get 30 tons and stuff.
L399[12:18:47] <JCB> mind you... 4 whiplash engines and a pair of swivels... sure the rapiers do wonders but always felt kind of cheaty
L400[12:19:41] <JCB> I wouldn't know.. most of my ssto's are small.. the Dakota was really meant as a crew transfer to a LKO station with maybe some resuply if I used inventory mod
L401[12:19:41] <Blaank> Rapiers are the best engines past mach 1.7 or so.
L402[12:20:01] <JCB> I tried large sized SSTO's in earlier games, game either struggled or wings just blew off
L403[12:21:03] <JCB> did make a really nice cargo plane.. small though. wish I could figure out a way to make a little base that can be transported out
L404[12:24:01] <Althego> decelaring rapidly. trajectory too short for landing, but survives, and has lot of fuel to make it back
L405[12:24:32] <Mathuin> Recently saw a video (probably posted here or reddit) where the cargo taken to orbit was actually part of the middle of the SSTO.
L406[12:24:44] <Mathuin> Orange tank IIRC but could work with other things.
L407[12:27:31] <Blaank> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqA678R7D_8 If you want to feel bad about how bad you are, htere you go.
L408[12:27:31] <kmath> YouTube - Building a Single-Launch Duna Base Using an SSTO! - KSP
L409[12:27:39] <Mathuin> Goodness.
L410[12:28:03] <Blaank> Dude is crazy.
L411[12:28:42] <dreadkopp> 46km@1700 m/s .... that's some improvement ... those TORY nuclear ramjets seem broken for me though ...
L412[12:29:10] <Blaank> 14 rapiers, 5 nukes, 30 tons to Duna's surface and back.
L413[12:29:23] <Althego> haha hazardish
L414[12:29:25] <Blaank> Mod parts throw everything off.
L415[12:29:26] <Althego> is really good
L416[12:29:33] <Blaank> He's better than Scott.
L417[12:29:35] <Althego> too bad he is not thrustworthy anymore
L418[12:29:40] <Blaank> What happened?
L419[12:29:46] <Althego> he cheated in two videos
L420[12:29:46] <JCB> one of his creations
L421[12:29:51] <JCB> oh.. two now
L422[12:29:53] <Blaank> which ones?
L423[12:29:54] <JCB> meh..
L424[12:29:58] <Blaank> And how?
L425[12:29:58] <JCB> tilt wing one of htem
L426[12:29:58] <Althego> and matt lowne (another crazy good) and other pointed it out
L427[12:30:38] <JCB> I've been debating on doing a video or two of my own
L428[12:31:02] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiW7-IEQCTqS9l7223whHZA/videos
L429[12:31:08] <Althego> i recommend matt lowne too
L430[12:31:42] <Althego> it was the tilt wing and the one tank to tylo and back i think
L431[12:31:58] <Blaank> And what kind of cheats?
L432[12:32:02] <Althego> there is a video about these with him on matt lowne
L433[12:32:14] <Blaank> Link?
L434[12:32:30] <Althego> the tilt wing was, he built it in one ksp version ,didnt work in the one he actually flew it
L435[12:32:34] <Althego> so he modified the mass of parts
L436[12:32:56] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EkhJRv33_Y
L437[12:32:56] <kmath> YouTube - Interview with Hazard-ish
L438[12:33:10] <Althego> i dont remember exactly the tylo one
L439[12:33:23] <Althego> it was something along the lines it was almost working
L440[12:34:10] <JCB> egh.. parts mod'n
L441[12:34:23] <Blaank> eeeesh, Hazardish, I thought you were better than that.
L442[12:34:28] <JCB> lol.. probably would have been easier to just drop gravity a little
L443[12:34:34] <GuestBanana> oh not this again
L444[12:34:35] <Blaank> plain old infinite fuel on one of them.
L445[12:35:40] <GuestBanana> one of my favorite things about the ksp community is that there is little to no drama
L446[12:36:21] <GuestBanana> the worst thing I've ever seen is the CKAN vs. RoverDude escalation
L447[12:36:51] <Althego> landed succesfully
L448[12:36:58] <JCB> ugh drama... people still having to shoo away those 'flatearthers'?
L449[12:37:23] <Althego> hehe
L450[12:37:50] <Althego> the infinite fuel was an accident
L451[12:37:56] <Althego> that ship was capable
L452[12:38:00] <GuestBanana> worse: people that have some sort of divine holy order which only permits them to use stock
L453[12:38:02] <Althego> it was just left on after testing
L454[12:38:16] <Althego> i use stock only, except for ker
L455[12:38:16] <Mathuin> I *like* "only stock" performance parts.
L456[12:38:30] <Mathuin> I do like software enhancement stuff like MJ and KER.
L457[12:38:41] <Mathuin> But for actual building I use stock only.
L458[12:39:29] <GuestBanana> I haven't used mods yet, but I'm OPEN to it and will not actually bully and/or other people due to their decision
L459[12:39:45] <JCB> I'm not /just stock/ .. I've used mods before. Just... things keep changing so much, gets to be a bit of a headache at times
L460[12:39:46] <GuestBanana> *and/or exclude
L461[12:39:52] <dreadkopp> without mods it's only half as fun though
L462[12:39:55] <ve2dmn> I like Stockalike :D
L463[12:39:55] <dreadkopp> imho
L464[12:40:00] <Mathuin> I wouldn't bully anyone, I'm just less impressed with their success if they use additional parts outside stock.
L465[12:40:21] <dreadkopp> i try to use mods that keep it balanced though
L466[12:40:29] <JCB> I've always thought, within reason...
L467[12:40:55] <GuestBanana> i've heard the /r/kerbalspaceprogram discord is kind of rude in that manner, but i haven't actually seen it
L468[12:41:05] <Mathuin> But there are those who think I suck because I let GravityTurn and MechJeb take care of the details of ascent, and ForScience the clicky-on-the-science stuff.
L469[12:41:08] <dreadkopp> New Horizons just for a new experience (some contracts are broken but besides that it's really nice). KSPIE is well balanced imho
L470[12:41:53] <Althego> ok, it took 1 hour, but here it is the minimalistic ssto http://warpology.com/k/minimalistic.png
L471[12:41:55] <ve2dmn> GuestBanana: I guess the rule for most people is: "If it doesn't break the immersion, the mod is ok"
L472[12:42:06] <dreadkopp> mechjeb for stats and auto execution of nodes. node calculation broken with new horizons anyways :P
L473[12:42:09] <JCB> I would'nt mind getting a few utils for helping with designing... maybe the one mod that gives clouds..
L474[12:43:06] <dreadkopp> Althego: two panthers and a swivel, righty ?
L475[12:43:16] <Althego> no, 2 turbojets
L476[12:43:18] <Althego> whats its name
L477[12:43:22] <dreadkopp> ah..
L478[12:43:25] <Mathuin> Oh, pretty mods are also fine with me. :-)
L479[12:43:34] <Althego> the whiplash
L480[12:43:38] <dreadkopp> haven't unlocked those yet afaik :P
L481[12:43:51] <Althego> then i say you are better off not building an ssto
L482[12:44:05] <Althego> and also the shock nose cones
L483[12:44:08] <GuestBanana> I don't want to create any drama either, but YT has been oozing with it this year
L484[12:44:19] <dreadkopp> how much Δv in LKO ?
L485[12:44:24] <GuestBanana> lemme revise that statement
L486[12:44:30] <Althego> not much, around 700
L487[12:44:34] <Althego> one of the engines was starving with the lesser intakes
L488[12:44:43] <dreadkopp> oh
L489[12:44:59] <GuestBanana> I don't want to create any more of it, but YT has been oozing with drama this year
L490[12:45:00] <JCB> I've done some early career ssto's, though they were sorta more rocket with wings, ala cruise missile style
L491[12:45:45] <Gasher> as usual, ssto does not imply relying on lift at all
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L493[12:47:50] <JCB> early games, I did a rocket, used the aerospike engine, and drop tanks...
L494[12:48:22] <GuestBanana> just got to see it because awful internet
L495[12:48:23] <GuestBanana> good job JCB
L496[12:48:45] <JCB> was a polar probe launcher. the last tank was used as structure for antenna and the engine.
L497[12:49:20] <JCB> mind you.. early games.. prior to heat modeling
L498[12:49:36] <JCB> can still do it but fairings are needed and gets a tad more.. complicated
L499[12:49:58] <Gasher> i'd say with KER its easy to make an SSTO :)
L500[12:49:58] <Althego> the problem with sstos in the game and in real life, we can make them realtively easily but then there is no payload, just as on this onw
L501[12:50:19] <Gasher> well yeah, i'm not saying it would be good or efficient
L502[12:50:39] <Gasher> just a large blob of empty tanks and engines orbiting
L503[12:50:49] <GuestBanana> DuoDex: I don't know if you're on or not, but I was surfing reddit and noticed how many subreddits you moderate (including KSP and a few Paradox titles). Good job, sir/madam, keep it up!
L504[12:51:01] <Althego> i wonder if other people are annoyed by the phrase "dark side of the moon" when they mean the "far side of the moon"
L505[12:51:12] * UmbralRaptor is
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L507[12:53:33] <JCB> eh.. I'm not surprised there'd be alot of people saying SSTO's are just a waste of time and money.. probably still feeling a little burned from the space shuttle project..
L508[12:54:13] <Althego> that was not an ssto
L509[12:54:18] <Althego> that is why it failed
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L511[12:54:37] <Althego> had to be assembled every time, and complete engine maintenance in all 3 ssmes
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L513[12:56:02] <JCB> ok maybe thinking spaceplane but still.. people thought it was a waste
L514[12:56:19] <JCB> then again... people think going to space is a waste too but eh
L515[12:56:40] <Mathuin> If we cannot have a SSTO in the sense that one craft going up into orbit and back with all the pieces still attached, the SpaceX approach is a good substitute.
L516[12:57:02] <dreadkopp> falcon 9 is kinda ssto
L517[12:57:08] <JCB> LKO vs earth low orbit... velocity needed is pretty big jump.. 2200m/s vs something like 7.8km/s....
L518[12:58:19] <UmbralRaptor> dreadkopp: uh
L519[12:59:03] <UmbralRaptor> JCB, Althego: also, X-33 and DC-X dieing.
L520[13:00:22] <dreadkopp> UmbralRaptor: yeah... DSTO XD ...
L521[13:00:42] <dreadkopp> BFR should be SSTO though, shouldn'T it ?
L522[13:01:56] <ve2dmn> I wonder what Backcronym they will find for BFR
L523[13:03:05] <JCB> that BFR he wants to use to go to mars with.. ya ... I dn't know about that.
L524[13:03:39] <JCB> 100 people a shot... that small a living space for.. what good portion of a year? Sure they thought that through fully?
L525[13:05:39] <Althego> big falcon rocket
L526[13:05:43] <Althego> that is its official name
L527[13:05:53] <Althego> although everybody thinks something else :)
L528[13:06:11] <dreadkopp> having 'deorbit now' and 'depress cabin' button that close to each other might not be the best idea: http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/images/dragon/interior_6.jpg
L529[13:06:52] <Althego> i remember when i read about bfg in doom (the original), the text contained something like, yes that is what you think it is, and i couldnt find it out
L530[13:07:06] <Althego> but hey i was like 12
L531[13:08:21] <JCB> dreadkopp maybe they just indicators?
L532[13:08:41] <Althego> hehe
L533[13:09:00] <JCB> mind you... I recall some issue pilots had with a certain aircraft autopilot not too long ago
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L535[13:09:08] <dreadkopp> would have assumed some fancy touchscreen buttons. indicator for cabin depressurisation that small isn'T the best idea either XD
L536[13:09:31] <Althego> cabin fire
L537[13:09:38] <Althego> is that a command too?
L538[13:09:47] <ve2dmn> Althego: you made me read the Doom wikipedia page...
L539[13:09:47] <JCB> kind of why I thought indicator
L540[13:09:56] <ve2dmn> ... and this graph is interesting: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doom_(1993_video_game)#/media/File:Doom_clone_vs_first_person_shooter.png
L541[13:10:10] <Althego> yes, for years it was doom clone
L542[13:10:23] <Althego> they were really clones
L543[13:10:30] <Althego> not too bad but not good either
L544[13:10:30] <ve2dmn> No only for the look, but for the fact that the title says 'Usenet posts'
L545[13:10:40] <Althego> except maybe heretic and hexen
L546[13:10:58] <JCB> wonder if quake had any effect on things when it came out... ooh true 3d maps
L547[13:11:04] <Althego> and descent was completely separate even then
L548[13:11:20] <JCB> aw... I really liked Descent ;)
L549[13:11:24] <Althego> descent was true 3d maps too. the only thing was not 3d are the powerups
L550[13:11:40] <JCB> lol.. 3d controls..
L551[13:11:44] <JCB> learned to finger dance
L552[13:12:04] <JCB> mind you.. keypad really helped a lot. forget playing on laptop without
L553[13:12:44] <ve2dmn> I played with a joystick...
L554[13:12:51] <ve2dmn> (Decent, no doom)
L555[13:13:14] <ve2dmn> but the sticks seems to have died with the popularity of gamepad
L556[13:13:24] <JCB> was mostly keyboard myself.. did have flight stick but had troubles figuring out button configs
L557[13:13:55] <JCB> also ugh.. early days of trying to strafe with mouse, turn with keyboard.. lol
L558[13:14:09] <Althego> hehehe
L559[13:14:13] <JCB> but hey.. we were learning what worked and what didn't
L560[13:14:21] <ve2dmn> I still think that playing an FPS with a gamepad is a heresie
L561[13:14:27] <Althego> hehe
L562[13:14:36] <JCB> mm... analog stic
L563[13:15:29] <JCB> can't say I ever did fps without a mouse.. though do recall a gensis game or two which tried fps
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L566[13:16:28] <Mathuin> I was at a party once where someone played GTA with DDR pads.
L567[13:16:31] <Mathuin> Lots of exercise.
L568[13:17:11] <JCB> I still recall that hex ring sega tried out... like the pad but could measure leg and arms when you stuck them out
L569[13:17:34] <JCB> then we learned.. more is not always better
L570[13:18:37] <Mathuin> I learned that from the DDR version with the hand wand thing
L571[13:21:24] <JCB> ah ya.. they called it the motion controller or.. activator.. http://sega-addicts.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Picture-122.png
L572[13:21:42] <JCB> think an arcade machine or two tried using a version of it...
L573[13:23:25] <ve2dmn> I just learned that there is gonna be a Dwarf Fortess presentation from the main programmer in my own town : https://www.reddit.com/r/dwarffortress/comments/7javqo/just_a_reminder_tarns_talk_in_montreal_is_today/
L574[13:23:54] <ve2dmn> I don't know where he's from, but he's getting a taste of the Montreal weather
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L576[13:25:06] <ve2dmn> It's the first big snow fall of the season
L577[13:25:11] <Althego> made into orbit with panthers, but only 170 m/s remaining
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L584[13:38:22] <Althego> at 16 km the panthers give enough thrust to maintain a graceful glide
L585[13:40:58] <oren> Panther/Poodle SSTO is a great option
L586[13:42:16] <Althego> waste of around 500 m/s
L587[13:44:25] <Althego> no, i will not build another laythe ssto
L588[13:46:18] <Althego> i could probably go to eeloo with a gravity assist
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L591[14:01:55] <Blaank> I hate SSTOs.
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L593[14:01:58] <Blaank> No boosters.
L594[14:03:17] <Althego> you can add some cheap solid boosters and that is a valid compromise
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L596[14:04:34] <UmbralRaptor> …
L597[14:04:59] <UmbralRaptor> Attaching SRBs to your SSTO is blasphemous.
L598[14:05:27] <Althego> then it is not an ssto
L599[14:05:41] <Althego> but loses only the cheap parts
L600[14:06:10] <Althego> or maybe drop tanks
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L606[14:08:15] <tawny> you can put the srbs on there and then not drop them?
L607[14:10:27] <Althego> that is tupid, those are heavy
L608[14:10:35] <Althego> you want to drop them
L609[14:10:53] <Althego> or not use them at all
L610[14:11:53] <dreadkopp> dang it. needs every inch of runway to take off and flips @35km ... but i looks soo good XD https://imgur.com/a/P9Job
L611[14:12:00] <Althego> hehe
L612[14:12:11] <Althego> what is its takeoff speed?
L613[14:12:17] <Althego> interesting shape
L614[14:12:30] <Blaank> Change the drain rates on the tanks so the front one drains later.
L615[14:12:47] <Blaank> You need to check the CoM and CoL with all tanks empty to ensure it doesn't shift too much.
L616[14:12:58] <Althego> or better, design it so that whatever the fuel level it is stable
L617[14:13:15] <Blaank> My guess is fuel drains out of the front and makes CoM move back and then it becomes unstable.
L618[14:13:24] <Althego> doesnt do that anymore
L619[14:13:33] <dreadkopp> Blaank: nearly no fuel drained at that point Althego: ~120 m/s at the dropoff at the end of the runway. drops to 65m height then ascends :P
L620[14:13:44] <Blaank> It drains everywhere evenly but depending on where the tanks are the CoM can still shift a lot.
L621[14:14:22] <dreadkopp> guess i will just grind some missions for the 1.5 Million K$ i need for next development stage :(
L622[14:14:25] <Blaank> Does it have air intakes underneath?
L623[14:14:45] <dreadkopp> nope, just on top
L624[14:14:55] <Blaank> Drag is out of line with thrust. It flips.
L625[14:14:57] <dreadkopp> and a version with two additional ones on the side
L626[14:15:30] <dreadkopp> weird i can go 1.3km/s @15 km though and @ 35 km it flips ..
L627[14:15:35] <Blaank> Put the shock cone intake on the front instead of a nose cone. then put two round fuel tanks on the sides and attach the wing to them.
L628[14:15:51] <Blaank> And shock cone on the front of them.
L629[14:15:53] <dreadkopp> no shock cone intake yet ;)
L630[14:16:07] <Blaank> SSTO are kind of a joke without them.
L631[14:16:10] <Althego> at 35 km it shouldnt flip
L632[14:16:13] <Althego> too little atmosphere
L633[14:16:17] <Blaank> CoT not behind CoM
L634[14:16:26] <Blaank> Will still turn. Shouldn't cartwheel.
L635[14:18:15] <Althego> there is a reason i try to make my planes not too long, the fuel balance
L636[14:18:29] <Althego> wait
L637[14:18:32] <dreadkopp> CoT / CoL / CoM should be fine: https://imgur.com/a/GqmFT
L638[14:18:32] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/yfDjaDb.png
L639[14:18:35] <Althego> which direction does it move?
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L641[14:18:38] <Althego> left/right?
L642[14:18:43] <Althego> that is engine starwed
L643[14:18:48] <Althego> hah
L644[14:18:51] <Althego> what are you doing here?
L645[14:18:59] <Althego> look at the fuel requirements met
L646[14:19:06] <Blaank> As fuel drains, the CoM is going to move backwards.
L647[14:19:07] <Althego> there is a percentage in the right click menu
L648[14:19:33] <Althego> and one side was less than 100%
L649[14:19:34] <dreadkopp> nope. flips over. + there is like no fuel drained at this point since the two nervs are running for like 30 secs
L650[14:19:38] <Althego> with the normal intake
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L652[14:19:59] <dreadkopp> the two jet engines are nuclear and will just heat air basically without fuel drain
L653[14:20:30] <Blaank> Nuclear jets.
L654[14:20:32] <Althego> haha cheater engine
L655[14:20:45] <Blaank> What direction does it flip?
L656[14:20:50] <Blaank> Backflip or side?
L657[14:21:09] <dreadkopp> backflip
L658[14:21:24] <Blaank> Did it flip right as you turned off the nuclear jets?
L659[14:21:40] <dreadkopp> i just let them burn out though....
L660[14:21:43] <Althego> haha
L661[14:21:44] <Althego> wait
L662[14:21:47] <Althego> the nuclear engines
L663[14:21:55] <Althego> are they thrusting through the center of mass?
L664[14:21:58] <Blaank> Their thrust and gimballing were counteracting the drag on the upper intakes.
L665[14:22:04] <Blaank> When they turn off, you flip.
L666[14:22:14] <Blaank> Drag is out of line of thrust.
L667[14:22:29] <Blaank> Gotta move those overhead intakes to the side, then slap the wings on them.
L668[14:22:41] <dreadkopp> aye :)
L669[14:24:50] <dreadkopp> totally makes sense if one thinks about it haha ;)
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L671[14:26:20] <GuestBanana> hey everyone
L672[14:27:55] <UmbralRaptor> Grim Fandango is free on GOG.
L673[14:28:42] <GuestBanana> never heard of it, googling now
L674[14:28:48] <GuestBanana> thanks
L675[14:29:00] <Althego> ksp is off 24 instead of 40 eur
L676[14:29:27] <GuestBanana> Oh, you haven't got the right deal, mister
L677[14:29:38] <GuestBanana> I got it a year ago for $13.
L678[14:29:46] <Althego> i got it in 2014
L679[14:30:00] <Althego> best buy ever
L680[14:30:59] <Mathuin> Grim Fandango is a game by the guy behind DoubleFine. I think it was done while he was still at LucasArts, because I was able to buy it when I contracted at Lucasfilm.
L681[14:31:48] <Mathuin> This version is "Remastered" whatever that means and it will run on Linux.
L682[14:31:53] <Blaank> Matt Lowe keeps talking about eye surgery.
L683[14:32:03] <Althego> yes that was weird
L684[14:32:50] <Mathuin> Wrt DF: I really like Broken Age, I really hate what they did to SpaceBase DF-9.
L685[14:32:58] <Mathuin> So I'm conflicted on giving them money.
L686[14:33:16] <Mathuin> Not so conflicted on free, though. :-)
L687[14:34:06] <Blaank> Grim Fandango is legendary and old.
L688[14:35:26] <sandbox> 20 years old
L689[14:35:37] <Althego> a good old game
L690[14:35:46] <sandbox> give or take a year
L691[14:36:40] <GuestBanana> Blaank: In case you didn't know, Matt's an eye doctor
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L693[14:36:51] <Blaank> I figured that out pretty quickly.
L694[14:37:20] <GuestBanana> but he's a brit that's also an eye doctor, so that changes things up
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L697[14:40:11] <sandbox> huh?
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L700[14:59:22] ChanServ sets mode: +o on Supernovy
L701[14:59:35] <Supernovy> Evening, Gentlemen.
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L703[15:00:52] <GuestBanana> In that case, good evening to you too, Supernovy.
L704[15:01:41] <Althego> night
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L709[15:47:17] <USB4> Anyone here a modder?
L710[15:47:23] ⇨ Joins: nallar (~nallar@81.187.229.141)
L711[15:48:58] <USB4> Ive made a turbojet with a fin to be a control surface, however its rotating the control surface forwards and backwards instead of left and right. Does anyone know how to change this short of what Im guessing id have to do in turning the part in unity first?
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L713[15:56:13] <SnoopJeDi> USB4, you might want #kspmodders
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L715[15:59:06] <USB4> #kspmodders
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L719[16:21:01] <taniwha> no, not kspmodders, kspmodding
L720[16:21:13] <taniwha> kspmodders hasn't been about ksp modding for a long time :(
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L722[16:25:26] <USB4> damn
L723[16:25:32] <USB4> well then Il try taht
L724[16:25:50] <USB4> thanks
L725[16:27:36] <USB4> I guess both none of these are particularly alive are they.
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L748[17:52:19] <Fluburtur> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/372444178510249998/390288518053888031/25289284_1864363873875725_3281809733371717980_n.png
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L750[17:55:13] <Fluburtur> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJvaet-4T5k
L751[17:55:14] <kmath> YouTube - Nuclear Reactor Pulse and Startup Compilation 2017
L752[17:58:05] <TheKosmonaut> Mmmm. That inviting blue glow.
L753[17:58:43] <TheKosmonaut> Thanks mr Cerenkov
L754[17:59:40] <Fluburtur> those ultrafast startups and stops are interesting
L755[17:59:52] <Fluburtur> and some comments are very informative on this one
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L760[18:07:12] <Ferdz> Hey everyone, I was hoping to get some assistance with nuclear engines when using interstellar extended mod. Seems my engines do not cool down when going into timewarp :/
L761[18:07:56] <Ferdz> efficiency just keeps dropping till I can barely get any thrust
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L764[18:24:02] <taniwha> do you have sufficient radiators?
L765[18:25:13] <Ferdz> I believe I do, all the numbers are green when looking in the helper when building taniwha
L766[18:25:38] <taniwha> then no clue, I've never used the mod
L767[18:27:49] <Ferdz> Any recommendations of late game mods that could make the game more interesting?
L768[18:29:09] <Supernovy> There was a couple of ones that teleport/warp/whatever ships around if you build the infrastructure
L769[18:31:33] <Ferdz> Oh yeah I did see a video about something like that
L770[18:31:41] <Ferdz> Like a warp gate could be very cool
L771[18:34:08] ⇨ Joins: iplop (~Iplop@24.214.58.115)
L772[18:34:17] <Ferdz> Another question, in this video (and many others) Matt https://youtu.be/GYrw_OHuvQY is able to physical timewarp while thrusting, how is he able to do that? I only see to be able to activate real timewarp when in space
L773[18:34:17] <kmath> YouTube - KSP: Capturing a Magic Asteroid!
L774[18:38:21] <Supernovy> What do you mean? alt-> does physwarp in space, apart from some mods, you can't do on-rails warp while accelerating.
L775[18:39:03] <Ferdz> Oh I didn't know there was a shortcut for it, always just clicked the arrows
L776[18:46:02] <dreadkopp> hmmm.. anyone can help me with this contract maybe? last thing i need to match is having my vessel on a crash course with kerbin. i am pretty sure i have:) https://imgur.com/a/wqn5K
L777[18:46:03] <kmath> https://i.imgur.com/vnx2G6Q.png
L778[18:46:24] <dreadkopp> even warping to atmosphere reentry does not trigger the contract :/
L779[18:55:21] <Supernovy> It probably doesn't like being on an escape trajectory
L780[18:56:19] <dreadkopp> ah okay... let me try ... so much ∆v wasted :(
L781[18:56:21] <Supernovy> either propulsive capture or aerocapture then have the periapsis below zero
L782[18:56:26] <Supernovy> might work
L783[18:59:35] <dreadkopp> you where right :) once in a orbit around kerbin breaking for a orbit with periapsis <70km contract was completed :) still took me ~900 m/s :/
L784[18:59:44] <Ferdz> Does it matter if an ssto's center of gravity is above the center of mass?
L785[19:00:59] <tawny> those are mostly the same thing unless your ssto is really large, I think
L786[19:01:09] <dreadkopp> center of gravity == center of mass unless i am stupid or you broke physics ;)
L787[19:01:16] <Ferdz> crap I meant the center of lift*
L788[19:01:23] <Ferdz> center of lift is below the center of mass
L789[19:01:29] <tawny> haha
L790[19:01:53] <Ferdz> didn't break physics, just my brain
L791[19:01:57] <dreadkopp> Ferdz: well you might run into trouble in low to zero gravity
L792[19:01:59] <tawny> that means it'll be more maneuverable than stable
L793[19:02:34] <Ferdz> It seems to get above the athmosphere
L794[19:02:35] <tawny> if your center of lift is below and also behind the center of mass, that should be a little safer
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L796[19:03:19] <tawny> also if your engines have a strong enough twr they can kinda overpower any irregular lift
L797[19:03:34] <tawny> but if they have a high twr then that also means your ssto can carry a much higher payload so
L798[19:03:51] <Ferdz> hmmm
L799[19:04:57] <Ferdz> Is there a technique to attach more engines to an mk3 engine mount? Tried with bicouplers but their clipping destroyed my engine :(
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L802[19:06:14] <Ferdz> I guess bicouplers and moving them can work
L803[19:09:18] <Ferdz> https://ferdz.is-going-to.space/d9e11a.jpg seems like this could work
L804[19:12:06] <Iskierka> https://i.imgur.com/CNXwuxj.jpg
L805[19:12:28] <Ferdz> Update, it didn't work lol
L806[19:15:53] <Ferdz> Is there a way to skip one of those career missions?
L807[19:16:14] <Ferdz> docking around the sun doesn't seem fun at all
L808[19:18:48] <taniwha> docking around the sun is easier than docking around Minmus
L809[19:19:35] <Ferdz> I know, that's why i say it's not fun :p
L810[19:20:13] <taniwha> find a way other than difficulty to make it fun
L811[19:20:36] <Ferdz> I'm trying to do it over SSTOs
L812[19:20:54] <Ferdz> Got my 3rd design to gilly
L813[19:21:27] <taniwha> that makes only the getting into space part fun
L814[19:21:40] <Ferdz> Any suggestions?
L815[19:22:00] <taniwha> give the mission a purpose other than fulfilling a contract
L816[19:23:27] <Supernovy> surface attach them, with a BZ-52 or a couple engine types can be directly surface attached.
L817[19:24:56] <Ferdz> What's surface attaching exactly?
L818[19:25:42] *** mikeprimm is now known as zz_mikeprimm
L819[19:26:19] <Supernovy> attaching something to the surface of a part rather than its stack nodes
L820[19:26:32] <Ferdz> Hmmm
L821[19:26:40] <Supernovy> the aerospike and the vector can be surface attached, perhaps some others
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L823[19:29:10] <Ferdz> Are there any inline stabilizers for mk2 or mk3?
L824[19:29:38] <Supernovy> stabilisers as in what? fins? reaction wheels?
L825[19:30:36] <Ferdz> reaction wheels
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L827[19:34:29] <Supernovy> the mk2 drone core has reaction wheels in it, otherwise you'll have to put regular reaction wheels in cargo bays.
L828[19:35:03] <JCB> Heh.. I made a lander probe with the Mk2 drone core...
L829[19:35:31] <JCB> called it hte 'cricket' because it had legs sticking out and little rocket motors on the side parts
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L831[19:40:53] <Ferdz> I've been in space for a few days now and randomly the rapier engines overheat, anybody know why? https://ferdz.is-going-to.space/8ecd9b.png
L832[19:41:03] <Fluburtur> https://78.media.tumblr.com/20f1d92436685309e86337dfe1b2ed89/tumblr_oyc145p3WB1r42s8uo1_540.png
L833[19:41:08] <Fluburtur> james heilman
L834[19:41:12] <Fluburtur> james heal man
L835[19:42:31] <UmbralRaptor> Would you believe that the first one pings mods?
L836[19:42:53] <Fluburtur> because of an arrangment of four particular letters?
L837[19:43:02] <UmbralRaptor> yeah
L838[19:43:53] <Fluburtur> makes sense I guess
L839[19:45:23] * UmbralRaptor arbitrarily blames the engine troubles on mods, even though it might be a bug.
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L841[19:47:18] <JCB> too clsoe to nuclear engines maybe? shrug.. heh, otherwise no idea
L842[19:49:15] <JCB> also.. noticed you seem to be missing a rapier engine on the ring cluster
L843[19:49:42] <JCB> er.. n/m.. seem to be missing two.. >_<
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L845[19:54:46] <Supernovy> sometimes it's hot in space.
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L849[19:58:53] <Scolar_Visari> Sons and daughters of Kerbin: Kerbal Kerbal Kerbal Kerbal Kerbal Khameleon! You launch and burn, you launch and bu-uuuurn!
L850[20:03:08] <taniwha> *groan*
L851[20:03:35] <UmbralRaptor> ?
L852[20:03:40] <taniwha> (though I did like the song back in the day)
L853[20:04:12] <taniwha> UmbralRaptor: Culture Club, iirc
L854[20:05:27] <Scolar_Visari> taniwha: It was all I could come up with that was distinctly apolitical.
L855[20:05:38] <Scolar_Visari> And it's Kulture Klub now!
L856[20:06:02] <tawny> kareful with those k's, if you add another one it'll stop being apolitical very very fast
L857[20:06:13] <taniwha> Just because C is redundant is no reason to go changing every instance to a K :P
L858[20:06:26] <taniwha> tawny: heh
L859[20:06:31] <Scolar_Visari> THE "K" MUST FLOW
L860[20:06:40] <tawny> I remember my middle school had a culinary club
L861[20:06:49] <tawny> they named it the kid's cooking club
L862[20:06:56] <tawny> except... they replaced the c's with k's
L863[20:07:07] * Scolar_Visari glares at, "Kethane". "No reason to go changine every instance to a K" indeed. That wasn't even an "C"!
L864[20:07:08] <tawny> somehow not a single person saw a problem with that
L865[20:07:08] <taniwha> ... that would have gone down well
L866[20:07:18] <taniwha> Scolar_Visari: not me!
L867[20:07:24] <UmbralRaptor> Mmm… Kumin, Kapsaicin,…
L868[20:07:31] <tawny> until they eventually pulled the club a year or two later
L869[20:07:33] <taniwha> UmbralRaptor: missed one :P
L870[20:07:41] <tawny> kapsaisin?
L871[20:07:43] <Scolar_Visari> UmbralRaptor: It also works for Kuiche?
L872[20:07:51] <Scolar_Visari> tawny: It's that saucy stuff.
L873[20:07:55] <UmbralRaptor> taniwha: it's pronounced differently though.
L874[20:08:14] <taniwha> kapsikum is how I hear it
L875[20:08:35] <UmbralRaptor> Paprika looks like this already happened.
L876[20:08:53] <taniwha> more like it was never converted to a c in the first place
L877[20:08:58] <Scolar_Visari> Ice Kream.
L878[20:09:01] <Scolar_Visari> Kustard.
L879[20:09:06] <Scolar_Visari> Kookies.
L880[20:09:13] <Scolar_Visari> MY WORK HERE IS DONE.
L881[20:10:26] <UmbralRaptor> Kaffeine
L882[20:10:44] <UmbralRaptor> Tumerik
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L884[20:12:54] <Scolar_Visari> It's gone pale! https://3c1703fe8d.site.internapcdn.net/newman/csz/news/800/2017/nasasjunopro.gif
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L886[20:13:56] <UmbralRaptor> And shrinking =(
L887[20:14:10] <Scolar_Visari> Don't worry, Red Spot Jr. will surely grow up to take its place!
L888[20:14:44] <Scolar_Visari> Albeit in the wrong hemisphere.
L889[20:15:23] <taniwha> juno pro? did NASA stick a gopro on juno?
L890[20:16:21] <Scolar_Visari> taniwha: That sounds about right.
L891[20:17:11] * Scolar_Visari notes JunoCam gets less than two megapixels.
L892[20:18:30] <Scolar_Visari> Mind you, JunoCam was originally expected to die a lot sooner than its current projection courtesy of Juno's less killtacular orbit.
L893[20:18:31] <taniwha> the pixel stretching is quite evident on the sides
L894[20:19:04] <taniwha> "pixel stretching? FAKE, FAKE!"
L895[20:20:08] <taniwha> (to me, rather than fake, it indicates how the photos were put together to get the nice animation)
L896[20:20:33] <Scolar_Visari> Obviously any artifacts on here are alien spacecraft https://www.missionjuno.swri.edu/Vault/VaultOutput?VaultID=12626&t=1508962497
L897[20:21:24] <taniwha> there's a scary monster in the bottom left!!!
L898[20:21:25] <taniwha> ;)
L899[20:22:01] <Scolar_Visari> Here be monsters! . . . And a sea of metallic hydrogen.
L900[20:26:22] * Scolar_Visari ponders the recent glut of terrible World War II articles by National [dis]Interest
L901[20:26:50] <Scolar_Visari> For example: "How Nazi Germany Could Have Won World War II: Not Declaring War on America?"
L902[20:27:31] <Scolar_Visari> You know what would have made that a reasonably accurate article title? "How Nazi Germany Could Have Won World War II: Develop a Time Machine?"
L903[20:28:34] <tawny> how nazi germany could have won world war II: not being nazis
L904[20:29:08] <Scolar_Visari> tawny: Command & Conquer Red Alert already covered that base.
L905[20:29:13] <tawny> haha
L906[20:29:23] <JCB> there is no winning at work, just loosing. The best outcome is from not starting a war at all...
L907[20:29:34] <JCB> erg.. no winning at war... I mean.. shoot
L908[20:30:09] * Scolar_Visari would really like to see an alt-history book where Hitler ends up living a peaceful life as a rural water color artist.
L909[20:30:27] <Scolar_Visari> JCB: What an odd game. The only way to win is to immediately surrender.
L910[20:30:34] <Alanonzander> JCB, The only winning move is not to play
L911[20:31:07] <Supernovy> Can they ever go for another war?
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L913[20:31:21] <Scolar_Visari> Supernovy: World War I what ifs aren't nearly as entertaining.
L914[20:31:24] <Supernovy> Like "what if the charge of the light brigade was successful"
L915[20:31:48] <Scolar_Visari> Supernovy: Like the horses magically escape getting shot?>
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L917[20:32:21] <Supernovy> Scolar_Visari: Says you. Italy, the Ottomans, and the miracle at marne are all fertile soil for whatiffery
L918[20:33:51] <Scolar_Visari> Here's a plausible what-if: The specter of Bismarck possesses German aristocracy and they decide not to help Austria in its Balkan shenanigans, avoiding a general war.
L919[20:34:06] <Scolar_Visari> And by, "specter of Bismarck" I mean, "they all suffered an attack of common sense."
L920[20:34:46] <JCB> not really just surrender...
L921[20:35:27] <Scolar_Visari> Or what if Franz Joseph actually read the Serbian response to his ultimatum and was all like, "Wow, I guess we really don't need to invade them after all."
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L923[20:36:08] <Scolar_Visari> Or Tsar Nicholas went, "You know . . . The Balkans aren't worth risking a general war over."
L924[20:36:22] <JCB> we all talk about how the war affected us... what about them? A few articles say, they'd rather forget, a part of history seems they wish never happened
L925[20:36:55] <Scolar_Visari> And, of course, France decided, "You know, we didn't even LIKE Alsace-Lorraine!"
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L927[20:37:55] <ConductingCat> Or Franz Ferdinand didn't ride around with the top down on his convertable after a bomb went off nearby.
L928[20:37:57] <Scolar_Visari> JCB: World War I's one of those interesting cases where virtually ever major power involved could've prevented an escalation into a general, open ended war and elected not to.
L929[20:38:15] <Supernovy> France looks nice a slim without it anyway.
L930[20:38:29] <Scolar_Visari> ConductingCat: Or, better yet, decided one attempted murder was enough for one week and called it a day and drove home.
L931[20:39:04] <Scolar_Visari> Supernovy: They sound like Germans, anyway.
L932[20:39:14] <Supernovy> or "Ferdinand's driver remembers the way back from the hospital" or "Princip's suicide pill wasn't past expiry"
L933[20:39:51] * Scolar_Visari should go back in time and give the driver a navigation system and GPS network to operate it with.
L934[20:40:05] <Scolar_Visari> "To avoid certain death, TURN RIGHT in 50 meters."
L935[20:41:11] <Supernovy> "what if at least one nation ignored Belgium"
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L938[20:41:47] <Scolar_Visari> Psht, the United Kingdom probably should've mentioned Belgium to Germany at some point prior to the mobilization.
L939[20:42:10] <JCB> hm... ok so probe launched from circular bay works.. was worried maybe orientation mighta have messed with core's facing.. now to get enough power, fuel to reache minmus...
L940[20:42:26] <Scolar_Visari> "Oh yeah, if you ratters dare invade that Low Counties and look funny at our majestic island from across the Channel, we might decide to intervene."
L941[20:43:30] <Scolar_Visari> No one cares what Italy does.
L942[20:43:59] <ConductingCat> Italy hasn't mattered in centuries.
L943[20:44:14] <Supernovy> Italy cared what Germany did, though.
L944[20:44:31] <JCB> been sorta reading on the evolution of civilization during the roman times and on.. (starting from about 55BC in france-UK area)
L945[20:44:52] <Supernovy> in the prelude to Albion?
L946[20:45:24] <Scolar_Visari> ConductingCat: Not quite true, their nominal GDP's the eighth largest in the world, coming ahead of Brazil, Canada, South Korea and Russia. They're just more a super power now than two former super powers!
L947[20:45:50] <Scolar_Visari> JCB: Lots of Celts, than somewhat fewer Celts.
L948[20:46:15] <JCB> something like that.. says there wasn't much to go by prior to 55BC in the area...
L949[20:46:53] <JCB> it was a book I picked up salvaged during a friend's move. been on my shelf for a while, figured was something to read while had a few moments
L950[20:46:55] <Scolar_Visari> JCB: Probably because the Celts were a less centralized lot, though the British Celts didn't really leave/get exterminated as some older histories liked to suggest.
L951[20:47:35] <ConductingCat> More like assimilated.
L952[20:47:39] <Supernovy> I've read that they celts came to the British isles from northern Iberia, which makes me wonder if they're related to the Basque.
L953[20:48:02] <Scolar_Visari> Supernovy: That would make the later Spanish attempts at invading Britain all the more entertaining.
L954[20:48:55] <Scolar_Visari> ConductingCat: To varying degrees. Quite a bit of archaeological evidence supports a surprising little change in British life.
L955[20:49:20] <Supernovy> Well what happened to the Picts?
L956[20:49:42] <JCB> Mind you.. the book I have dates to about late 60s-early 70s... I'm sure there are a lot of gaps that weren't filled story wise
L957[20:50:04] <Scolar_Visari> Supernovy: They didn't like the fact that the Roman soldiers wore socks with sandals. Savages.
L958[20:50:22] * Scolar_Visari notes that there were Roman influences beyond the fortified frontier, however.
L959[20:50:24] <JCB> I never got that myself..
L960[20:50:42] <JCB> socks because.. ugly toe nails or?
L961[20:51:11] <Scolar_Visari> It's cold.
L962[20:51:36] <Scolar_Visari> Hadrian's Wall and related fortifications were rather too northernly for your typical Italian's liking.
L963[20:52:23] <Scolar_Visari> See . . . SOCKS WITH SANDALS! http://www.antoninewall.org/sites/default/files/Auxiliary%202.jpg
L964[20:52:32] <Scolar_Visari> Though not a Legionnarie, of course.
L965[20:53:43] <JCB> ugh.. no pants... just a skirt?
L966[20:53:55] <Scolar_Visari> JCB: Trousers were for Non-Roman Barbarians.
L967[20:54:22] <TheKosmonaut> Absolutely_barbaric.jpg
L968[20:54:30] <JCB> was going to say... get much of a draft with those things?
L969[20:55:37] <ConductingCat> Scots seem to manage.
L970[20:56:07] <Scolar_Visari> The capes did help.
L971[20:56:43] <Supernovy> There was another wall even further north, but they abandoned that when they realised all they got for their troubles was more Scotland.
L972[20:58:04] <Scolar_Visari> "You know, Hadrian, why do we even bother with Northern Brittania? There's literally one sunny day a year, it's not good farm land and, as daft as this may sound, I don't think the natives much like us."
L973[20:59:50] ⇦ Quits: Distractedman979 (~D^man@2601:47:4180:854:69d6:1f59:7e3d:908f) (Ping timeout: 186 seconds)
L974[21:10:14] <Scolar_Visari> Aha! Realistic armor for once! http://i.imgur.com/nwDYoFL.jpg
L975[21:14:10] ⇨ Joins: Kevin (~kevin@99-96-59-46.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net)
L976[21:15:14] * Scolar_Visari ponders if the face covering of the helmet was decorated with a mustache as was common with Japanese armor.
L977[21:18:27] * Scolar_Visari also ponders if there would be any fantasy games where character art freely depicts pox scars on men and women and a distinct lack of makeup for adventurers.
L978[21:24:11] <Scolar_Visari> "You character caught a case of the bloody flux after spending too much time in the siege camp. Roll to see if you die!"
L979[21:24:16] ⇦ Quits: icefire (~icefire@24.115.202.68.res-cmts.pbg.ptd.net) (Read error: -0x1: UNKNOWN ERROR CODE (0001))
L980[21:25:37] <ConductingCat> Roll constitution for pooping blood.
L981[21:26:13] <tawny> I think we all just sorta accept that there's some unspoken magic in all those settings that makes disease way less terrible so that we don't have to think about it
L982[21:26:15] <Scolar_Visari> "Good save! Your character survives, but you must spend the rest of the campaign fighting without underwear.
L983[21:26:49] <Scolar_Visari> tawny: So instead of suffering days of agonizing bowel pains, you just keel over and die in the outhouse?
L984[21:27:02] <tawny> haha
L985[21:27:33] <Scolar_Visari> "What happened to our mage?" "Mage? Oh, yeah, Vitrivius. He caught blood flux and just died on the can."
L986[21:28:35] <Scolar_Visari> "Should've let our party healer bleed em' and balance out those humors. Always said Vitrivius had too much yellow bile."
L987[21:36:42] <Scolar_Visari> This sounds like something that would meld well with a game like Mordheim. How awesome would it be to have a chance of characters dying without ever getting them into a fight!?
L988[21:41:48] <JCB> I'm sure there's been many a character who's gotten drunk at the bar, looking for a quest, only to get killed for a stupid comment.
L989[21:45:18] ⇦ Quits: Shoe17 (uid40690@id-40690.charlton.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
L990[21:46:30] <Scolar_Visari> "Alright, you roll to hit on the barmaid and . . . receive a critical failure that results in the owner of the establishment offering a free night's worth of ale to whoever kills the braggart trying to pick up his daughter."
L991[21:48:26] <Scolar_Visari> Teehee http://bogleech.com/comics/galactic.png
L992[22:06:04] <taniwha> things we can be fairly certain about any advanced aliens we meet:
L993[22:07:02] <taniwha> they're very likely to be carbon-based (carbon chains are most suitable for organic chemistry)
L994[22:07:46] <taniwha> (also, the CNO cycle in stars means carbon, nitrogen and oxygen will be quite prevalent)
L995[22:08:15] <taniwha> they're likely to be oxygen "breathers" (for reasons of energy production)
L996[22:08:44] <taniwha> they most likely will have appendages that are capable of making and using tools
L997[22:09:38] <Scolar_Visari> What if they bought the Synthetic Dawn and/or Utopia DLC and have become machine overlords?
L998[22:09:44] <taniwha> they will very likely will have sensory organs that can detect stellar objects from their native habitat
L999[22:10:10] <taniwha> (to inspire their creativity)
L1000[22:10:41] <taniwha> Scolar_Visari: then they won't be alien lifeforms :)
L1001[22:10:54] <taniwha> (instead, they'll be alien machine overlords)
L1002[22:11:47] <taniwha> though nothing a tungsten-carbide-tipped spear can't handle ;)
L1003[22:12:15] <Scolar_Visari> Can tungsten-carbide-tipped spears handle charged particle beams?
L1004[22:13:33] <taniwha> gotta hitcha first :)
L1005[22:13:41] <Scolar_Visari> Huh, its over? That was unexpected.
L1006[22:14:14] * Scolar_Visari uses tachyon lance against machine age primitives . . . IT'S SUPER EFFECTIVE!
L1007[22:14:37] <taniwha> on a slightly more serious note, go check out Horizon Zero Dawn. Fears of machines exterminating humans will dissipate pretty quickly.
L1008[22:15:07] <taniwha> (machines devastating human civilization is another matter, though)
L1009[22:15:09] <Scolar_Visari> But I don't haz playstation.
L1010[22:15:23] <taniwha> surely you have a friend that does
L1011[22:15:29] * Scolar_Visari notes one can play strictly benevolent machine empires in Stellaris well enough.
L1012[22:15:46] <Scolar_Visari> No I don't. Playstation people don't have friends!
L1013[22:16:55] <taniwha> more like "[name your console] people don't have friends" people don't have friends ;)
L1014[22:18:40] <Scolar_Visari> They're part of a sick cult and must be brought back into the fold of the one TRUE gaming system: The desktop computer.
L1015[22:18:55] <taniwha> running Linux ;)
L1016[22:19:10] <Scolar_Visari> Those who will not repent and take up the banner of Windows 10 will be annihilate in the coming crusade!
L1017[22:19:21] <taniwha> actually, the One True Gaming System is a PDP-11 running Unix
L1018[22:19:49] ⇦ Quits: Blaank (~chatzilla@c-68-52-80-127.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
L1019[22:20:01] <Scolar_Visari> Tabletop games being a somewhat lesser form of heresy.
L1020[22:20:59] <taniwha> at least, I think it was a PDP-11. might have been a lower number
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L1022[22:22:49] <Scolar_Visari> Now that I think about it, playing a benevolent machine empire in Stellaris was about the most fun I had after playing a benevolent order of psionic alien monks
L1023[22:22:57] <taniwha> http://www.unix.org/what_is_unix/history_timeline.html
L1024[22:24:02] <taniwha> ah, PDP-7
L1025[22:26:24] <Scolar_Visari> "Please, do not shoot at the Servi-bot Caretakers! We only wish to move you to a safe, secure location away from the inpending extra-dimensional invaders where you organics will know happiness and love as you have never known them before!"
L1026[22:27:17] <Scolar_Visari> "For your safety, all political rights will also be relinquished. We apologize for any inconveniences during the transition period!"
L1027[22:39:46] <Scolar_Visari> Oh boy, Maximum Ride's on Netflix.
L1028[22:39:57] * Scolar_Visari ponders if there's a button that makes certain movies permanently un-watchable.
L1029[22:45:48] * Scolar_Visari goes off to watch something that will have a smaller chance of causing a terminal illness.
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L1035[23:06:18] <jeans> I got my "Check Yo Stagin'" shirt today. =D
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L1048[23:43:42] <JCB> Huh... didn't know he was a pinball fanatic... https://twitter.com/Cmdr_Hadfield/status/933748206873251842
L1049[23:43:42] <kmath> <Cmdr_Hadfield> I splurged on a pinball machine. Not sure what attracted me. https://t.co/cDMaet4Tww
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