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L1[00:05:10] ⇦ Quits: Vexatos (~Vexatos@port-92-192-11-11.dynamic.as20676.net) (Quit: Insert quantum chemistry joke here)
L2[00:05:23] <Amanda> 🎶 shot through the heart, with pure souffle, you give love a bad egg 🎶
L3[00:05:58] ⇨ Joins: S|h|a|w|n (~shawn156@c-76-25-73-212.hsd1.co.comcast.net)
L4[00:08:55] <dequbed> @"bad at vijya" if you help the guys over at https://github.com/unitystation/unitystation/ I'll go faster :P
L5[00:11:02] ⇨ Joins: Webchat570 (webchat@cpe7c9a54e16c63-cm7c9a54e16c61.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
L6[00:13:39] <Amanda> TIL dequbed's velocity is contingent on a github repo's commits
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L11[01:02:19] <duz.h​olger> I am a old cc coder I I want to know how the syntax for classes is on oc can somebody help
L12[01:03:06] <ThePi​Guy24> there are no classes, this is lua, there are only tables
L13[01:03:47] <duz.h​olger> So I can’t make my own class in oc?
L14[01:03:48] ⇦ Quits: t20kdc (~20kdc@cpc139384-aztw33-2-0-cust220.18-1.cable.virginm.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
L15[01:04:06] <ThePi​Guy24> you can use tables as if they were classes
L16[01:04:35] <duz.h​olger> Ahh how is the syntax for tables then
L17[01:07:36] <ThePi​Guy24> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/huyunosofe
L18[01:08:30] <duz.h​olger> Ok I see
L19[01:08:31] <ThePi​Guy24> there is ofcourse also assignment where you can do `testTable.key = "value"` or `testTable["key"] = "value"`
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L22[02:11:47] ⇦ Parts: Webchat570 (webchat@cpe7c9a54e16c63-cm7c9a54e16c61.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) (webchat.esper.net))
L23[02:14:55] <bad at​ vijya> you know what
L24[02:14:59] <bad at​ vijya> i might as well post this here
L25[02:15:02] <bad at​ vijya> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/amocegomol
L26[02:25:16] * Amanda wonders where her fairy fren went, looks around until she notices something ticklish on her belly, meows at Elfi, wonders how she ended up under her
L27[02:26:15] * Amanda shifts over, curls up next to Elfi, yawns
L28[02:30:31] <Amanda> Night nerds
L29[02:30:39] <Ocawes​ome101> night
L30[02:35:49] <Bra​mble> Ok, I haven't really played around with this mod and I also don't know lua but is it possible to "hack" another players computer using maybe lua exploits or something?
L31[02:45:10] <CompanionCube> no general exploits are known atm, but you could try hack whatever software they put it on it
L32[03:06:26] <bad at​ vijya> launch the big fuck
L33[03:30:06] * Elfi zzzzs beside Amanda
L34[03:42:16] ⇦ Quits: Thutmose (~Patrick@host-69-59-79-181.nctv.com) (Quit: Leaving.)
L35[04:07:59] <Forec​aster> %tonk
L36[04:07:59] <MichiBot> Yeah! Forec​aster! You beat Ko​dos's previous record of 11 hours, 16 minutes and 22 seconds (By 22 minutes and 18 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L37[04:08:00] <MichiBot> Forecaster's new record is 11 hours, 38 minutes and 41 seconds! Forecaster also gained 0.00444 (0.00037 x 12) tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #2. Need 0.07119894 more points to pass Compan​ionCube!
L38[04:28:49] <bad at​ vijya> so
L39[04:28:55] <bad at​ vijya> i now have xxh64 in pure lua
L40[05:01:44] <bad at​ vijya> https://github.com/Adorable-Catgirl/lua-xxh64
L41[05:02:40] <Z0id​berg> Izaya, I have an idea for an alternative to the whole web assembly / ecma thing
L42[05:03:03] <bad at​ vijya> JIT'd MIPS64?
L43[05:03:37] <Z0id​berg> No actually
L44[05:04:26] <Z0id​berg> while playing with Elixir a while back I discovered the usefulness of how macros work in Elixir, which isn't necessarily 100% unique but it's well layed out.
L45[05:04:26] <Z0id​berg> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/avagaqodoy
L46[05:04:40] <Z0id​berg> so when I use quote, it compiles to the AST but doesn't run
L47[05:05:29] <Z0id​berg> and it got me thinking. Javascript is kinda nice because it's human readable, to an extent. Web assembly is kinda sucky because it's literally bytecode and immediately complicated to implement and debug and not only that it's also noty human readable.
L48[05:06:31] <Z0id​berg> So, what if instead, web browsers confirmed to some sort of dynamically extensible AST that can manipulate the DOM instead, equipped with its own computing features for assisting with every day things. Math, serialization, etc.
L49[05:07:17] <Z0id​berg> writing transpilers to compile any language, including javascript or C or basic or python or whatever is relatively easy, given that the syntax of the language is easy to parse; Simply can be transformed into an AST that the browser can understand.
L50[05:07:48] <Z0id​berg> when visiting websites, you would be downloading representations of the AST in either human friendly formatted form or minified form, but definitely text.
L51[05:08:29] <Z0id​berg> It could possibly even be used to completely replace HTML, but that's not what I'm going for.
L52[05:09:15] <Z0id​berg> The goal is really just to present an easy to compile to , human readable interface to the browser's underlying capability to present web content.
L53[05:21:30] <CompanionCube> https://www.heise.de/news/Gericht-zwingt-Mailprovider-Tutanota-zu-Ueberwachungsfunktion-4972460.html D:
L54[05:22:20] <CompanionCube> Z0idberg: isn't that just 'what if webassembly was an AST'
L55[05:23:19] <bad at​ vijya> hmm
L56[05:23:21] <bad at​ vijya> pretty soon
L57[05:23:28] <bad at​ vijya> if i figured out how lz4 worked
L58[05:23:34] <bad at​ vijya> we could get lz4 in pure lua too
L59[05:23:38] <bad at​ vijya> wairt
L60[05:23:39] <bad at​ vijya> *wait
L61[05:23:45] <bad at​ vijya> lz4 uses xxh32
L62[05:24:22] <bad at​ vijya> or
L63[05:24:23] <bad at​ vijya> does it?
L64[05:24:39] <Z0id​berg> in a way, yes CompanionCube, but it's not web assembly, and web assembly is kind of a failure.
L65[05:24:52] <Z0id​berg> and if it does grab ahold, it will be a mess.
L66[05:25:35] <Z0id​berg> also, per your url I was reading, what happens when the government finds that every user on that email server then all of a sudden uses PGP
L67[05:25:47] <Z0id​berg> and encrypts all of their email content
L68[05:25:47] <Z0id​berg> XD
L69[05:26:09] <Z0id​berg> "oh hey we got the data decrupted.. wait.. its still encrypted... wat"
L70[05:27:29] <CompanionCube> That's the government's problem.
L71[05:27:37] <bad at​ vijya> AS PER MY LAST EMAIL
L72[05:27:57] <bad at​ vijya> https://tinyurl.com/yy65q99x
L73[05:28:17] <Z0id​berg> lol...
L74[05:28:43] <Z0id​berg> so its funny that this made the news
L75[05:29:07] <Z0id​berg> because now that its made the news nobody is going to continue to send blackmail emails to that company unless they are 100% sure that there is no way for them to trace it back
L76[05:29:21] <Z0id​berg> good job media
L77[05:31:04] <duz.h​olger> hmm did i misunderstand something https://tinyurl.com/y4aokgpl
L78[05:31:05] <duz.h​olger> https://tinyurl.com/yyfe9b6w
L79[05:37:00] * Michiyo blinks
L80[05:37:03] <Michiyo> Uhh.
L81[05:37:13] * Michiyo blinks again
L82[05:38:06] <Michiyo> Yes, I think you've misunderstood a lot.
L83[05:38:47] <duz.h​olger> Ok how did class (cc) not translate into oc tables
L84[05:39:56] <duz.h​olger> Remember I am use to cc coding and oc coding is kinda new to me
L85[05:42:52] <Z0id​berg> Ok.. wth are you doing.
L86[05:42:59] <Michiyo> I assume you're talking about this: https://www.computercraft.info/wiki/Class
L87[05:43:10] <duz.h​olger> Yes
L88[05:43:19] <Michiyo> Which.. what you've done is.. nothing like any of those examples.
L89[05:43:27] <Z0id​berg> sigh.
L90[05:44:29] <duz.h​olger> I know but to change from class to table is a major switch for me
L91[05:44:45] <Z0id​berg> Ok. If you want OOP, first define OOP.
L92[05:44:57] <duz.h​olger> Oop?
L93[05:45:13] <Z0id​berg> IF you can't do that then you shoud probably figure that out first before even attempting it
L94[05:45:13] <Michiyo> CC's classes ARE tables.
L95[05:46:52] <Z0id​berg> Lua is a language that doesn't provide you native OOP support, but provides you with all the tools you need to implement it in the way you would like. there's more than one way to do that. With that said if you are doing OOP style in Lua you really, REALLY should understand what it is and how it works, first.
L96[05:47:24] <Z0id​berg> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-oriented_programming
L97[05:47:59] <duz.h​olger> What did I do wrong then I am rusty and use to cc a long time ago
L98[05:48:37] <Z0id​berg> It's hard to tell, but it looks to me like you were blindly trying to translate CC's implementation of classes under the hood into table form for use in OC, which is definitely not the way to do it
L99[05:48:52] <duz.h​olger> I know it garbage code but I need to learn
L100[05:48:55] <Z0id​berg> there is a reason why CC hides all of that
L101[05:49:17] <Z0id​berg> ok. That's fair, but I'm going to ask you, "what" do you need to learn
L102[05:49:20] <Z0id​berg> what specifically
L103[05:49:37] <Z0id​berg> Because I don't think using classes is actually going to help you, yet.
L104[05:49:44] <Z0id​berg> In fact I think it's going to set you backwards.
L105[05:50:58] <duz.h​olger> I need to make a mutliple entry password lock aka a single computer there can open multiple locks dependent of the pin code
L106[05:51:13] <duz.h​olger> Via rednet
L107[05:51:18] <Z0id​berg> Ok.
L108[05:51:50] <Z0id​berg> So forget everything you know about classes. Eventually, if you want an OOP approach, it will come to you natively, but it's going to make things way too complicated
L109[05:52:22] <Z0id​berg> So to my understanding, you want to have a system where you can enter one of many passwords, and each password will do something different, correct?
L110[05:52:33] <duz.h​olger> So for instance if Amanda writes her pin it opens her lock but if I write my pin it opens my lock
L111[05:52:41] <Z0id​berg> yep
L112[05:53:59] <Z0id​berg> Ok. Without concern for security or maintainability first, just to get something working, perhaps what you should do is have a table of passwords that are equal to various values, for example they could be numbers, each being an ID number for example that opens a different lock.
L113[05:54:21] <Z0id​berg> you could start by making the program take your input and print out which value it equates to.
L114[05:54:46] <Z0id​berg> this could easily be done by having a table at the top of your program that represents each person.
L115[05:54:53] <Z0id​berg> or each password
L116[05:58:21] <duz.h​olger> Eksample?
L117[05:59:16] <Z0id​berg> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/igayinepuk
L118[06:00:03] <duz.h​olger> Ahh I think I see
L119[06:00:05] <Z0id​berg> you could change it around to match the type of data, or even function callbacks you wanted
L120[06:00:13] <Z0id​berg> for rednet use or something
L121[06:02:10] <Z0id​berg> But you see you didn't need any kind of crazy table or anything
L122[06:02:14] <Z0id​berg> just a simple data structure
L123[06:02:33] <Z0id​berg> this data structure can be reused directly in other functions you make
L124[06:02:45] <Z0id​berg> no OOP
L125[06:03:30] <Z0id​berg> I will tell you right now 90% of the time in the real world when I see people use OOP it is absolutely unnecessary.
L126[06:04:01] <Z0id​berg> people like to use it like a swiss army knife to do everything
L127[06:24:10] <Z0id​berg> so hows it look now @duz.holger
L128[06:25:07] <duz.h​olger> Argh. Don’t se it give me a few might have put it upside down or made a major snafu give me a sec to screen dump
L129[06:26:39] <duz.h​olger> https://tinyurl.com/y2m49tyl
L130[06:27:39] <Michiyo> %pil
L131[06:27:40] <MichiBot> Mic​hiyo: https://www.lua.org/pil/contents.html#P1
L132[06:30:03] <Z0id​berg> that's a great resource
L133[06:30:25] <Z0id​berg> anyways, one thing, are you using OpenOS? because if so then you don't need to be sending gpu commands for this
L134[06:30:53] <Z0id​berg> but whatever.
L135[06:33:15] <Michiyo> There are a number of issues here besides using gpu.* methods.
L136[06:33:22] <Z0id​berg> so you're accessing the table weird.
L137[06:33:41] <Michiyo> For instance. you're checking if input==passwords... which means your input is equal to the password table
L138[06:33:49] <Z0id​berg> ^^
L139[06:33:57] <duz.h​olger> I know I just don’t see it it’s like new world to me sigh
L140[06:34:02] <Michiyo> You LIKELY want to check if the table contains your input
L141[06:34:30] <Michiyo> https://www.lua.org/pil/2.5.html Table documentation
L142[06:35:16] <Michiyo> Your password is the "key" to the table, and your door id is the "value" of the table, so you want to check if the passwords table contains the key that is your password
L143[06:35:46] <Michiyo> Also your whole "Wrong" logic is.. wrong. Check if the table contains your password, if not print that, and continue.
L144[06:37:01] <Michiyo> An easy way to check if your table has a key is
L145[06:37:07] <Michiyo> function has_key(table, key)
L146[06:37:07] <Michiyo> return table[key]~=nil
L147[06:37:07] <Michiyo> end
L148[06:37:33] <Michiyo> has_key(passwords, "somestring")
L149[06:38:05] <Michiyo> it'll either return the "value" of that entry if that password exists, or nil.
L150[06:38:37] <Michiyo> the value, in this case being 1, 0, or 2.
L151[06:41:02] <luc​soft> no oop is love
L152[06:43:58] <CompanionCube> how likely is z0idberg to slap me if i bring up oop libraries if you want that
L153[06:44:02] <Z0id​berg> also you could probably do some magic with the bundledoutput equating to some value in the table.
L154[06:44:26] <Z0id​berg> but don't worry about that for now
L155[06:44:42] <Z0id​berg> meh
L156[06:45:03] <Z0id​berg> usually when I want to do oop in Lua which is very rare I use the closure method.
L157[06:46:02] <CompanionCube> iirc there's actually one in oppm lol
L158[06:46:09] <Z0id​berg> i.e.
L159[06:46:10] <Z0id​berg> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/qorocopaka
L160[06:46:17] <Z0id​berg> its faster than tables but uses more memory
L161[06:46:31] <Z0id​berg> though I don't ever need it
L162[06:46:52] <luc​soft> new idea: hardware accelerated oppm card 😄
L163[06:47:08] <Z0id​berg> i.e.
L164[06:47:09] <Z0id​berg> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/anaquqanax [Edited]
L165[06:47:12] <Z0id​berg> ...
L166[06:47:18] <Z0id​berg> what are you soni?
L167[06:47:22] <luc​soft> so no register its just uses all the repo stuff
L168[06:48:09] <luc​soft> what
L169[06:48:37] <Z0id​berg> i.e.
L170[06:48:37] <Z0id​berg> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/ipiyixunod [Edited]
L171[06:49:00] <Z0id​berg> i.e.
L172[06:49:00] <Z0id​berg> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/cocivilihi [Edited]
L173[06:58:50] <Z0id​berg> the only additional hardware system I really wanted to work on was on card firmware that runs on a separate lua stack
L174[06:59:01] <Z0id​berg> it was an idea I wanted to implement for a small networking system
L175[06:59:36] <Z0id​berg> but I have other things to do
L176[07:00:01] <Z0id​berg> +
L177[07:03:37] <Mic​hiyo> https://oc.cil.li/topic/682-passworded-boor/ looks like you were basing your code on this and it went wrong fast. Learning from others is great, but it is important to have the basics down too
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L179[08:37:42] zsh sets mode: +v on Vexatos
L180[08:41:37] <ThePi​Guy24> boor
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L191[13:21:58] <Amanda> %splash a to-be-unnamed sleeping fox with mutable redstone potion
L192[13:21:58] <MichiBot> You fling a mutable redstone potion (New!) that splashes onto a to-be-unnamed sleeping fox. a to-be-unnamed sleeping fox turns into a dragon girl until have some bacon.
L193[13:25:48] <Forec​aster> sigh
L194[13:26:02] <Amanda> hgis
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L196[15:06:36] * t20kdc wakes up
L197[15:10:31] <t20kdc> %splash Amanda with mutable redstone potion
L198[15:10:31] <MichiBot> You fling a mutable redstone potion that splashes onto Amanda. Amanda turns into a dragon girl until have some bacon.
L199[15:15:31] <Amanda> D:
L200[15:28:09] <luc​soft> wait until it burns https://bocken.gavle.se/kamera/
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L203[16:55:23] <Ko​dos> %tonk
L204[16:55:24] <MichiBot> Kapow! Ko​dos! You beat Forec​aster's previous record of 11 hours, 38 minutes and 41 seconds (By 1 hour, 8 minutes and 42 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L205[16:55:25] <MichiBot> Kodos's new record is 12 hours, 47 minutes and 24 seconds! Kodos also gained 0.0138 (0.00115 x 12) tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #4 => #3. (Overtook SquidDev) Need 0.31665156 more points to pass Forec​aster!
L206[17:01:35] <Forec​aster> dammit
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L208[17:07:56] <SquidDev> Nooo.
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L210[17:10:42] ⇨ Joins: Joe_ (webchat@mobile-107-77-217-85.mobile.att.net)
L211[17:10:45] <Joe_> Hello
L212[17:10:55] <Forec​aster> %hello
L213[17:10:57] <MichiBot> Forec​aster: Hello! Welcome to #oc! The one and only opencomputers channel! Please ask your questions directly (dont ask to ask) and provide error/code examples! (Use pastebin.com if theyre more than one line!) Dont mind the random conversation you might have walked into.
L214[17:13:56] <Joe_> So I’m currently running a computer with open computer mod, some of the members have obtained creative mode items and thus forth a debug chip. They then coded in a way to change their game mode without perms with a tablet. Any idea how they did this?
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L216[17:14:06] <Joe_> Server*
L217[17:14:39] <B​ob> they grabbed a debug chip from the creative menu
L218[17:14:54] <B​ob> iirc you can disable in configs cant you ?
L219[17:15:14] <Forec​aster> I believe so
L220[17:15:43] <Joe_> But I found out after they took the debug chip, they somehow got creative mode with a tablet
L221[17:15:48] <luc​soft> https://tinyurl.com/y2gmphu8
L222[17:15:50] <luc​soft> yes
L223[17:16:04] <Joe_> yeah but like, how did they do it?
L224[17:16:20] <Izaya> debug cards run commands
L225[17:16:20] <luc​soft> you the only op on this server?
L226[17:16:23] <Forec​aster> the debug card can execute commands
L227[17:16:33] <Joe_> oh okay lol
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L229[17:17:08] <SquidDev> Bye :(.
L230[17:17:08] <Izaya> Ayy, they had a trans-lunar anomaly in their trans-lunar injection and now they're off course
L231[17:17:36] <Izaya> I knew a guy that went by TMA, for Trans-Munar Anomaly
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L234[17:30:54] <Ar​iri> Izaya: https://www.reddit.com/r/spaceengineers/comments/k97ekh/my_transport_ship_is_complete_ready_to_take_off/
L235[17:37:29] <dequbed> Izaya: what
L236[17:42:04] ⇨ Joins: jootloops (~jootloops@c-174-57-195-167.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
L237[17:43:40] <luc​soft> ❤️ https://tinyurl.com/yyqml8gq
L238[17:43:45] <luc​soft> GitHub darkmode
L239[17:45:01] <ThePi​Guy24> noice
L240[17:53:12] <Izaya> dequbed: Apollo 24 had premature booster ignition for their TMI burn
L241[17:54:36] <Izaya> uh, TLI
L242[17:54:39] <Izaya> Fuckin KSP
L243[17:55:03] <Izaya> ergo they had a trans-lunar anomaly :D
L244[17:58:51] <Izaya> Ariri: I like that you can really hear the stresses on the vehicle
L245[17:59:46] <Ariri> Yes. The moving bits are also nicely done, landing gear and cargo ramp in particular
L246[18:02:14] <Izaya> It's not a very practical vehicle, however.
L247[18:02:54] <Izaya> I know it's rocket engineering rather than rocket surgery but there's so much unnecessary weight
L248[18:05:13] ⇦ Quits: jootloops (~jootloops@c-174-57-195-167.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
L249[18:05:53] <Izaya> I still want a pass-through hinge
L250[18:06:41] ⇨ Joins: jootloops (~jootloops@c-174-57-195-167.hsd1.nj.comcast.net)
L251[18:07:06] <Izaya> Like, it's a rotor, but it has a tunnel through the middle, and the connection points are on the sides
L252[18:07:19] <bad at​ vijya> i want swing wing
L253[18:07:32] <Izaya> So you could have a rotating segment like in any good sci-fo
L254[18:07:32] <bad at​ vijya> [sad danger zone noises]
L255[18:07:39] <Izaya> Sci-fi
L256[18:07:54] <Izaya> Having to spin the whole vehicle is lame
L257[18:09:36] <Izaya> If modding SE was less cancerous I'd do it myself
L258[18:11:13] <bad at​ vijya> okay
L259[18:11:16] <bad at​ vijya> enough is enough
L260[18:11:19] <bad at​ vijya> gajim is awful
L261[18:11:23] <bad at​ vijya> i need to make my own XMPP client
L262[18:12:11] ⇨ Joins: Inari (~Pinkishu@p4fe7ef31.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L263[18:12:55] <bad at​ vijya> this garbage is literally unusable
L264[18:18:26] <dequbed> Izaya: I was afraid for a minute there that I missed a new moon mission going on :'D
L265[18:18:50] <Izaya> Fortunately not
L266[18:19:04] <Izaya> tfw will never be an astronaut
L267[18:19:21] <dequbed> I'd much rather be a Kosmonaut anyway :)
L268[18:19:52] <Izaya> Well, that was the implied alternative
L269[18:20:21] <Izaya> But alas, no dice either way, comrade
L270[18:29:46] <dequbed> Either way, want a hug? :P
L271[18:31:53] ⇦ Quits: bauen1 (~bauen1@aftr-62-216-207-249.dynamic.mnet-online.de) (Remote host closed the connection)
L272[18:41:21] <Inari> Just be a Spaceonaut
L273[18:46:38] <Ariri> Astrofox
L274[18:51:45] ⇦ Quits: jootloops (~jootloops@c-174-57-195-167.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) (Remote host closed the connection)
L275[18:54:54] <Forec​aster> %sip
L276[18:54:55] <MichiBot> You drink a shimmering weather potion (New!). A sudden craving for soup occupies Forecaster's thoughts until someone stabs them.
L277[18:55:20] <Forec​aster> ohno
L278[18:58:36] <Michiyo> %stab @Forecaster
L279[18:58:36] <MichiBot> Mic​hiyo is trying to stab @Forec​aster! They have 5 minutes if they want to attempt to %defend against it!
L280[18:58:59] <Forec​aster> I would defend, but I would also like to stop thinking about soup
L281[18:59:23] ⇨ Joins: Vexaton (~Vexatos@port-92-192-90-227.dynamic.as20676.net)
L282[18:59:23] zsh sets mode: +v on Vexaton
L283[19:02:15] ⇦ Quits: Vexatos (~Vexatos@port-92-192-11-11.dynamic.as20676.net) (Ping timeout: 204 seconds)
L284[19:11:09] <Sap​hire> translunar.anomaly would make amazing domain name
L285[19:16:52] <ThePi​Guy24> aww it isnt an actual tld
L286[19:18:01] <ThePi​Guy24> now can someone bribe the icann to make it one :p
L287[19:23:43] <bad at​ vijya> i have icbmlaunch.site
L288[19:24:41] <ThePi​Guy24> nice
L289[19:56:46] <Amanda> @ThePiGuy24 Sure, just lend me 200,000$
L290[19:57:00] <Amanda> and I'll get righ ton that
L291[19:57:12] <Forec​aster> I have $10 and a ball of yarn
L292[19:57:25] * Michiyo "borrows" $200,000 from @"Forec​aster" and gives it to Amanda
L293[19:57:50] <Forec​aster> I'm not sure why you think I'd have that much money
L294[19:58:48] <Michiyo> Well, you don't anymore.. do you?
L295[19:59:15] <Michiyo> Also, you're now $199,990 in debt. Sorry
L296[20:24:50] <Ar​iri> @bad at vijya https://youtu.be/J-ng0NwpkN0
L297[20:24:51] <MichiBot> "That's a shakey landing!" | length: 18s | Likes: 4,963 Dislikes: 53 Views: 164,476 | by Blazededge RZ | Published On 8/11/2020
L298[20:26:30] <bad at​ vijya> heh
L299[20:26:34] <bad at​ vijya> i love this
L300[20:26:46] <Forec​aster> oh glob, I've become an american post-student
L301[20:28:41] <bad at​ vijya> brrrrrrt
L302[21:02:41] <bad at​ vijya> hm
L303[21:02:47] <bad at​ vijya> what engine should i use if i make plane game
L304[21:02:56] <bad at​ vijya> leaning towards unity because
L305[21:02:57] <bad at​ vijya> ya know
L306[21:03:01] <bad at​ vijya> easy enough
L307[21:03:11] <ThePi​Guy24> Godot
L308[21:03:31] <ThePi​Guy24> GDScript is pretty easy to learn
L309[21:03:45] <ThePi​Guy24> you can also use C# if you wanna
L310[21:04:28] <CompanionCube> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EoqKQZlW8AAnCVC?format=jpg&name=large looking at this 70s poster is disappointing the modern day
L311[21:04:49] <ThePi​Guy24> that is a cringe
L312[21:05:06] <ThePi​Guy24> this is why the country is fucked now
L313[21:06:14] <CompanionCube> of course it's cringe, it's a poster from literal fascists
L314[21:07:10] <CompanionCube> which is why the similarity is Too Damn High
L315[21:07:25] <bad at​ vijya> >godot targets haiku
L316[21:09:07] <ThePi​Guy24> godot can build for anything provided you can find or make a template to build for the desired platform
L317[21:18:02] <bad at​ vijya> h a i k u
L318[21:18:14] <bad at​ vijya> run plane game on pentium 3 machine
L319[21:18:18] <bad at​ vijya> (how)
L320[21:19:20] <CompanionCube> sounds cool
L321[21:20:17] <ThePi​Guy24> well you can run modern linux on a pentium 3 :p
L322[21:21:51] <ThePi​Guy24> im pretty sure as long as something supports GLES2 or higher, with maybe some effort, godot can be made to build for it
L323[21:23:53] <dequbed> @ThePiGuy24 hey now Germany would have done great if you and the Russians didn't beat it to pulp. You can't blame it entirely on the fascists :P (/s because important.)
L324[21:26:34] <ThePi​Guy24> ~~western countries~~ the UK and the US have a habit of getting into other peoples business that they have no right to be in :p (see most wars the US or UK has been in the last 50 years or so)
L325[21:29:32] <Inari 「オ​兄デレ」「狐っ娘」> https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/706414255934537748/785962473731129404/unknown.png this is why I have trust issues
L326[21:31:14] <dequbed> CompanionCube, why does London have a cable car? It's flat as a pancake you don't have hills, not to speak of mountains. CompanionCube, I just .. what even is this city?
L327[21:31:32] <CompanionCube> i'm not a londoner, Skye is closer :p
L328[21:33:42] <dequbed> CompanionCube: Yes but still. Also, while on the topic why did you re-elect the angry lemon for mayor after he /opened a cable car over the themse/?!
L329[21:33:59] <CompanionCube> (huh, the black-and-white version has more posters: https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/woman-talking-to-a-black-man-by-a-doorway-covered-in-general-election-picture-id74948966?s=2048x2048)
L330[21:34:22] <CompanionCube> dequbed: fucking beats me, brexit and the appearance of charisma/competence?
L331[21:39:23] <dequbed> CompanionCube: Also you know I'm a foreigner. We have a simplified version of the UK: There's London, the city of london where all of our money is, Wales where all the sheep live, Scotland which is lound, yells a lot and makes good whisky, and the part of Ireland that looks a lot like you just can't let go. That's it. So I'm totally going to blame you on all the things Londoners get wrong. Still love you though <3
L332[21:39:40] <CompanionCube> :D
L333[21:41:15] <dequbed> Inari: https://320volt.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/counterfeit-capacitor-sahte-kondansator-sahte-malzeme.jpg
L334[21:41:30] <Inari> Rude
L335[21:56:28] *** Vexaton is now known as Vexatos
L336[22:02:24] <ben_mkiv> wew
L337[22:02:51] <ben_mkiv> wonder if that is real or fake
L338[22:03:04] <ben_mkiv> one could think that the materials are cheaper than assembling this monster
L339[22:04:40] <Ar​iri> Bamboozled
L340[22:04:41] <dequbed> ben_mkiv: 6800uF@50V sell at 7 EUR a pop.
L341[22:05:26] <ben_mkiv> not at aliexpress ;)
L342[22:05:36] <ben_mkiv> which is probably the one on the pictures^^
L343[22:05:43] <dequbed> About if that is fake, I would not put it beyond an unscrupulous salesperson to do something like that especially if they knew they can't be sued like /when they use aliexpress/
L344[22:06:20] <dequbed> But, I have never had any cap derated *this* much. Then again I prefer to use reliable and verifiable supply chains.
L345[22:07:30] <bad at​ vijya> time to install the unity SDK
L346[22:07:34] <bad at​ vijya> a
L347[22:07:36] <ben_mkiv> http://diy-fever.com/misc/fake-capacitors/
L348[22:07:43] <B​ob> unity oof
L349[22:07:49] <B​ob> why do this to yourself
L350[22:07:55] <bad at​ vijya> because i'm making plane game
L351[22:08:00] <bad at​ vijya> UE4 kinda sus
L352[22:08:06] <Inari> wdym
L353[22:08:08] <bad at​ vijya> cryengine tools don't build on linux
L354[22:08:09] <Inari> Unity is pretty neat
L355[22:08:22] <ben_mkiv> how is UE4 sus?
L356[22:08:24] <ThePi​Guy24> yeah but it aint open source
L357[22:08:29] <bad at​ vijya> i just
L358[22:08:33] <Inari> Certainly better than trying to figure out whatever UE4 sees as documentation
L359[22:08:37] <bad at​ vijya> don't trust it
L360[22:08:47] <ThePi​Guy24> UE4 requires way more system resources than it has any right to
L361[22:08:53] <Inari> So
L362[22:08:59] <Inari> Whats a good opensource engine with editor then?
L363[22:09:04] <ThePi​Guy24> Godot
L364[22:09:08] <Inari> Hah
L365[22:09:24] <Inari> Thats... pretty so-so, last I checked
L366[22:09:41] <bad at​ vijya> i'm doing lots of 3d fun so
L367[22:10:05] <ThePi​Guy24> sure, its not perfect, but for what it is, its getting close
L368[22:10:49] <Inari> Dunno
L369[22:10:53] <Inari> Feels like everyone kinda likes godot
L370[22:10:57] <Inari> then tries to make a game with it
L371[22:10:59] <Inari> and gives up on it
L372[22:11:02] <Vexatos> godot is very nice
L373[22:11:03] <ThePi​Guy24> no licensing, engine + build templates are < 500MB, builds fast and is performant in the editor, and is capable of good graphics
L374[22:11:16] <Vexatos> well
L375[22:11:19] <Vexatos> compared to the alternatives
L376[22:11:27] <bad at​ vijya> i'll try godot ig
L377[22:11:31] <ThePi​Guy24> Ariri: have you considered that that might be due to the person making the game rather than the engine itself?
L378[22:11:32] <ben_mkiv> it's like 1% of unity games that archive good graphics
L379[22:11:35] <Inari> Not that you really should need sourcecode
L380[22:11:38] <Vexatos> unity is bad if you code on your own, and pure suffering as soon as there are more than 1 person in the project
L381[22:11:38] <ben_mkiv> probably even less
L382[22:11:47] <Vexatos> unreal is nice but l i c e n s e
L383[22:11:55] <Ariri> Wha>
L384[22:11:56] <Inari> What makes Unity bad? Seems pretty good
L385[22:12:09] <ThePi​Guy24> Ariri: sorry i meant Inari
L386[22:12:19] <Ariri> OhISee
L387[22:12:19] <Vexatos> for one it's fundamentally incompatible with git because almost everything is stored in whack binary formats
L388[22:12:37] <Vexatos> secondly you are kinda forced into a certain tool to collaborate with others on a unity project
L389[22:12:38] <Inari> @ThePiGuy24 just saying that so far everyone who seemed to try using it went that way xD
L390[22:12:44] <Vexatos> and it's absolute suffering to use
L391[22:12:44] <ben_mkiv> honestly, even if epic takes 5%... they give you good tools and... badummtsss a epic engine
L392[22:12:59] <Vexatos> basically if unity had its own git but it's not actual version control and more like a dropbox folder
L393[22:13:01] <Vexatos> except worse
L394[22:13:02] <Inari> Vexatos: not sure waht you mean
L395[22:13:09] <ben_mkiv> unreal has git integration tho
L396[22:13:13] <Inari> scenes are textfiles, anims are text files, assets are just whichever format they are
L397[22:13:15] <Inari> scripts are cs
L398[22:13:27] <ThePi​Guy24> unreal may be good, but its not fun to use when the editor runs at < 20 fps on my hardware
L399[22:13:28] <Vexatos> Cruor could tell you about all the suffering he went through
L400[22:13:33] <Vexatos> doing his bachelor thesis with unity
L401[22:13:35] <ben_mkiv> but unreal also uses binary files for everything but source
L402[22:13:58] <Inari> Not sure what he did then
L403[22:14:01] <Inari> 🤔
L404[22:14:29] <Inari> UE4 is good if you enjoy digging through lots of weird C++ code to figure out how to do things
L405[22:14:40] <ben_mkiv> bullshit
L406[22:14:59] <ThePi​Guy24> the UE4 blueprints are fairly easy to learn ad fun to play around with
L407[22:15:04] <bad at​ vijya> i half expected to be digging through C++ anyways
L408[22:15:15] <Vexatos> it's inconceivable to me how people manage to make entire programs in unity
L409[22:15:17] <ThePi​Guy24> hmm somethig is fucky with my n key
L410[22:15:17] <ben_mkiv> you wont find c++ in unity tho :P
L411[22:15:17] <bad at​ vijya> i've fucked around with the Source SDK some
L412[22:15:18] <Vexatos> without dying inside
L413[22:15:19] <bad at​ vijya> lmao
L414[22:15:20] <Inari> Maybe it's better now, but I recall trying to figure out how to generate meshes at runtime in UE4
L415[22:15:21] <Inari> was a PITA
L416[22:16:49] <ThePi​Guy24> ok good fixed my key
L417[22:16:52] <ThePi​Guy24> fuck
L418[22:16:56] <ThePi​Guy24> guess i didt
L419[22:16:58] <ThePi​Guy24> aaa
L420[22:17:01] <ben_mkiv> what hardware do you use if you get ~20fps?
L421[22:17:06] <dequbed> Hey Vexatos have you dabbled in fluid or thermal transmission simulation?
L422[22:17:12] <Vexatos> uh
L423[22:17:15] <Vexatos> technically yes
L424[22:17:17] <ThePi​Guy24> integrated graphics on a laptop
L425[22:17:18] <Vexatos> but that was long long ago
L426[22:17:27] <Inari> Can't seem to find those binary files you mean though
L427[22:17:31] <Vexatos> like as in "10 grade in school" long ago
L428[22:17:39] <Inari> Everything seems to be unity's variant of YML
L429[22:17:41] <Vexatos> I did an internship at the ESA
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L431[22:17:52] ⇨ Joins: michiyo (~michiyo@znc.michiyo.me)
L432[22:17:57] <Vexatos> and learnt some basic thermal fluid simulation
L433[22:18:03] <Vexatos> for rocket tanks
L434[22:18:05] <dequbed> Is OpenFOAM any good? :P
L435[22:18:15] <Vexatos> idk I used some program that costs 10 grand per PC
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L437[22:18:35] <ThePi​Guy24> mmm tastes like tasty capitalsim
L438[22:18:37] <dequbed> Ah okay
L439[22:18:40] <ThePi​Guy24> *capitalism
L440[22:18:48] <Vexatos> I don't really do simulations, quantum chemistry doesn't have much of that
L441[22:19:00] <Vexatos> I sometimes do BOMD simulations but those are the exception
L442[22:19:02] <dequbed> @ThePiGuy24 Programmers want to eat as well.
L443[22:19:13] <ben_mkiv> because any result is valid in quantum chemistry?
L444[22:19:20] <Vexatos> no
L445[22:19:28] <Vexatos> because you don't need to simulate in quantum chemistry
L446[22:19:31] <Vexatos> a result is always accurate
L447[22:19:34] <ThePi​Guy24> 10 grand is a significant portion of a yearly wage
L448[22:19:39] <Vexatos> within the limit of your incomplete method
L449[22:19:42] <ThePi​Guy24> and thats per pc
L450[22:20:09] <Vexatos> normal geometry optimizations give you the average geometric structure of a molecule
L451[22:20:14] <Vexatos> across all time
L452[22:20:27] <Vexatos> so ignoring temperature entirely
L453[22:20:29] <ThePi​Guy24> say a lab installed it on 50 pcs, thats 500k
L454[22:20:47] <Vexatos> @ThePiGuy24 it's pocket change for airbus :P
L455[22:20:59] <dequbed> @ThePiGuy24 From reasonably personal experience that's not much money for software used for engineering. That software is heinously expensive to develop because it's not just writing code, it's also the entire research and validation.
L456[22:21:18] <Vexatos> the program had some 50 physical parameters to tweak
L457[22:21:26] <ThePi​Guy24> yes, but there are worse examples
L458[22:21:27] <Vexatos> including being able to set gradients on all of those
L459[22:21:36] <Vexatos> which is relevant for rocket tanks
L460[22:21:39] <Vexatos> because stuff like gravity changes
L461[22:21:49] <Vexatos> which doesn't normally happen
L462[22:21:50] <bad at​ vijya> what the fuck am i doing with this engine
L463[22:22:08] <ThePi​Guy24> watch tutorial or read documentation
L464[22:22:17] <dequbed> @ThePiGuy24 hardly. You don't get rich with engineering software. You get rich with Internet of shit, making management happy and the actual heavy hitters like big data.
L465[22:22:29] <ThePi​Guy24> program now, question life choices later
L466[22:22:31] <Vexatos> my group pays €1000 a year for one specific bad program
L467[22:22:36] <Vexatos> not because we use it
L468[22:22:39] <Vexatos> but because why not
L469[22:22:39] <bad at​ vijya> uh huh
L470[22:22:44] <Vexatos> I tried learning it for a month and it sucked
L471[22:22:46] <Inari> you get rich with steam hits made in Unity
L472[22:22:48] ⇨ Joins: bauen1 (~bauen1@aftr-62-216-207-249.dynamic.mnet-online.de)
L473[22:22:51] <dequbed> Vexatos: Gravity is everything but constant
L474[22:22:57] <Vexatos> but we asked for it in the proposal and it was granted so why not
L475[22:23:00] <ThePi​Guy24> mmm asset flips
L476[22:23:08] <Inari> Nah
L477[22:23:11] <Inari> flips aren't hits
L478[22:23:20] <Inari> You get a good amount for the investment, but you don't get rich
L479[22:23:21] <Vexatos> dequbed, on earth you tend to simulate a system at constant gravity
L480[22:23:32] <Inari> Make a Phasmophobia or so
L481[22:23:37] <dequbed> Vexatos: Not in engineering that actually has to take gravity into account :P
L482[22:23:42] <Vexatos> well
L483[22:23:45] <Vexatos> that is what I said...
L484[22:23:54] <bad at​ vijya> i want to make an arcadey plane game
L485[22:23:57] <dequbed> Like civil engineering Vex.
L486[22:24:09] <Vexatos> has constant gravity at any point in space
L487[22:24:18] <bad at​ vijya> "you have 290 missiles but only 2 flares"
L488[22:24:20] <bad at​ vijya> "have fun"
L489[22:24:41] <Vexatos> gravity doesn't change over time in anything on earth
L490[22:24:45] <Vexatos> it's only relevant in aerospace
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L495[22:27:36] <dequbed> Vexatos: And civil engineering, metrology, and probably a few more I don't know about. Since I'm not y'know, omniscient.
L496[22:28:54] <Vexatos> gravity can only change over time if you have a moving object
L497[22:29:18] <Vexatos> something moving a significant amount or distance too
L498[22:29:34] <dequbed> No, not really. But even *if* that doesn't make it a constant you don't have to tweak.
L499[22:29:39] <Vexatos> well yes really
L500[22:29:53] <Vexatos> gravity is only based on the distance between two objects
L501[22:30:01] <Vexatos> so unless the distance changes significantly, gravity won't
L502[22:30:26] <dequbed> That is an approximation that is only valid if the size of the objects is much smaller than their distance.
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L504[22:30:36] <dequbed> Case in point, not valid for earth and anything on it.
L505[22:30:39] <Vexatos> which is the case for almost anything on earth
L506[22:30:47] <Vexatos> the gravity is different all around the world but it is usually assumed constant
L507[22:30:53] <Vexatos> at any particular point in space
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L509[22:31:00] <Vexatos> so you just punch in a number and go with it
L510[22:31:04] <Vexatos> instead of setting a gradient
L511[22:31:42] <dequbed> Not if you actually have to take it into account Vex. Yes, if you build a house 9.81m/s^2 is good enough. So is pi is 3.141. But that is not always the case, examples provided above.
L512[22:32:05] <Vexatos> uh
L513[22:32:08] <Vexatos> that's not what I said
L514[22:32:15] <Vexatos> of course you have to take into account your altitude
L515[22:32:17] <Vexatos> and the different gravity
L516[22:32:24] <Vexatos> but it's still constant at any particular altitude
L517[22:32:56] <Vexatos> it won't change over time
L518[22:33:13] <Vexatos> unless you expect the earth to lose a significant portion of its mass over the course of your simulation
L519[22:34:53] <dequbed> Vexatos: okay two things: a) we're talking past each other again b) unrelated to my point, unrelated to yours, if you need precision metrology where you need actual forces applied on a non-moving object something like e.g the position of the moon is relevant.
L520[22:35:35] <dequbed> Also with civil engineering on dam scales. Gravity (force-equilibrium that is) is very important and not very constant :P
L521[22:35:36] <Vexatos> yes but the gravity of the moon is set separately
L522[22:36:31] <Vexatos> and yes we are talking past each other because for some weird reason you are talking about gravity changing across space instead of time which I acknowledged 15 minutes ago while also talking about simulations where time and not space is the important variable
L523[22:36:48] <Vexatos> you don't need to do simulations to show something across space
L524[22:36:53] <Vexatos> you can do optimizations then
L525[22:38:30] <Vexatos> at work I only change variables across space and never across time for example, I rarely do simulations
L526[22:38:47] <Vexatos> taking the gravity of the moon into account is important for dam projects but I also mentioned that
L527[22:39:11] <Vexatos> but that is pretty much the only thing where you have a mass large enough to really have an effect
L528[22:40:20] <dequbed> Sure sure. How many zeros does your weight scale have?
L529[22:40:38] <Vexatos> yes
L530[22:40:53] <dequbed> Then it takes gravity changes over time into account.
L531[22:40:57] <Vexatos> My work only calculates things as single particles in a vacuum at 0K
L532[22:41:00] <dequbed> Not in space. Over time.
L533[22:41:13] <Vexatos> that's a bit easier
L534[22:41:21] <Vexatos> well it's harder in the whole rest though
L535[22:41:28] <Vexatos> but it's not simulations
L536[22:43:59] <Vexatos> there are simulations you can do with quantum chemical calculations
L537[22:44:04] <Vexatos> but those are absurdly expensive
L538[22:44:21] <Vexatos> and then you can take stuff like temperature and electric/magnetic field changes into account
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