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L4[02:09:24] <CompanionCube> %tonk
L5[02:09:24] <MichiBot> Yay! Compan​ionCube! You beat Forec​aster's previous record of <0 (By 4 hours, 46 minutes and 13 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L6[02:09:25] <MichiBot> CompanionCube's new record is 4 hours, 46 minutes and 13 seconds! CompanionCube also gained 0.00477 tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #2. Need 0.1470838 more points to pass Forec​aster!
L7[02:11:31] <Ocawes​ome101> today
L8[02:11:34] <Ocawes​ome101> oops, disregard
L9[02:12:12] <Ocawes​ome101> today's cursed idea: voxel game engine, extensible through lua, where literally everything is defined through lua: blocks, items, dimensions, biomes, terrain generation, etc
L10[02:12:29] <Ocawes​ome101> oh also GUIs
L11[02:12:40] <ThePi​Guy24> thats not even cursed
L12[02:12:48] <simon816> so factorio meets minecraft?
L13[02:12:57] <Ocawes​ome101> sort of i suppose
L14[02:15:54] <Ocawes​ome101> if i knew more C i might try to write it :P
L15[02:16:22] <Ocawes​ome101> or if i could find a language that's got wider support for 3D things than Lua, and is not python
L16[02:16:57] <ThePi​Guy24> 3d things?
L17[02:17:35] <Ocawes​ome101> opengl 2 specifically
L18[02:19:05] <ThePi​Guy24> ah
L19[02:22:48] * Izaya gives Ocawesome101 minetest
L20[02:23:07] <Izaya> the only issue is the GUIs, formspecs kinda suck, but you can abuse them reasonably
L21[02:23:50] <Ocawes​ome101> prefers lua 5.3 over 5.1
L22[02:23:56] <Ocawes​ome101> by a lot
L23[02:23:58] <Izaya> understandable
L24[02:24:08] <Izaya> the upside of 5.1 is JIT
L25[02:24:13] <Ocawes​ome101> yeah
L26[02:24:33] <Ocawes​ome101> lua's still pretty fast and a lot of definitions would end up being static probably
L27[02:24:45] <Ocawes​ome101> so evaluate once at runtime and don't really process it again
L28[02:24:54] <Izaya> yeah
L29[02:25:10] <Ocawes​ome101> who am i kidding
L30[02:25:18] <Ocawes​ome101> lua is really fast for an interpreted language lol
L31[02:25:45] <Izaya> yup
L32[02:25:48] <Izaya> among the fastest
L33[02:25:57] <Izaya> JIT'd lua approaches C speed, which is neat, too
L34[02:26:41] <Ocawes​ome101> yes
L35[02:26:54] <Ocawes​ome101> wren seems interesting but also very niche
L36[02:27:07] <Ocawes​ome101> anyway i'll be afk for a few hours
L37[02:27:10] <Ocawes​ome101> \o
L38[02:27:17] <Izaya> o/
L39[02:27:38] <Izaya> > OOP
L40[02:27:40] <Izaya> oh no
L41[02:27:46] <Izaya> it's all prepositions and adverbs
L42[02:27:52] <Ocawes​ome101> don't worry i don't plan on doing anything serious with it
L43[02:32:32] * Amanda puts Izaya in the Web Scale-ifyer
L44[02:32:43] * Izaya starts outputting all NULLs
L45[02:32:52] * Amanda tucks in around Elfi while they cook
L46[02:33:08] <Amanda> Night nerds
L47[02:33:18] <Izaya> o/
L48[02:41:23] <CompanionCube> you know your government's lazy when apparently they couldn't be bothered to hit 'new file' when writing a congratulations message in an image and left a tiny bit of the previous text visible...
L49[02:42:06] ⇦ Quits: DBotThePony (~Thunderbi@31.220.170.28) (Ping timeout: 189 seconds)
L50[02:43:11] <ThePi​Guy24> the only time this government isnt incompetent is when it comes to infringing our rights
L51[02:45:07] <CompanionCube> (for bonus points, while it's not clearly visible, GIMP's 'Select by Colour' tool reveals the target of the previous text, and you can probably guesss who it is.)
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L54[03:46:26] ⇨ Joins: Ocawesome101 (~ocawesome@38.65.248.215)
L55[03:46:30] <Ocawesome101> o/
L56[04:57:06] <De​jv> Hi I'm starting with mods OpenComputers.
L57[04:57:06] <De​jv> Unfortunately, nothing is shown on my screen.
L58[04:57:08] <De​jv> https://tinyurl.com/y6xmfvnn
L59[04:57:33] <Ocawesome101> hmm
L60[04:57:38] <Ocawesome101> do you have a gpu in your computer?
L61[04:58:04] <De​jv> https://tinyurl.com/y42bwowf
L62[04:58:17] <Ocawesome101> it appears you don't
L63[04:58:25] <De​jv> https://tinyurl.com/y48wcp8v
L64[04:58:44] <Ocawesome101> i think the item is called "Graphics Processing Unit (GPU)"
L65[04:59:36] <De​jv> Thanks! 🙂
L66[04:59:41] <Ocawesome101> no problem
L67[04:59:59] <Izaya> > TWO data cards
L68[05:00:04] <Izaya> watch out we got a hero over here
L69[05:00:15] <Izaya> or something I don't know the quote
L70[05:00:48] <De​jv> Can you recommend some basic resources for teaching? I would like to start by moving the item from the chest to the chest
L71[05:00:58] <Izaya> %pil
L72[05:00:58] <MichiBot> Iz​aya: https://www.lua.org/pil/contents.html#P1
L73[05:01:26] <Izaya> Programming in Lua is the book for learning Lua, and once you have a grasp of that, the wiki is what you'll want to hit up
L74[05:01:29] <Izaya> ~w transposer
L75[05:01:29] <ocdoc> http://ocd.cil.li/block:transposer
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L79[05:27:40] <Ocawesome101> so minetest works on the pinebook pro now :D
L80[05:28:04] <Ocawesome101> despite the mali GPU not being designed for full opengl, it seems to perform better using opengl rather than gles2 lmao
L81[05:36:04] <Izaya> jwz did full OpenGL on OpenGL ES
L82[05:36:09] <Izaya> for xscreensaver
L83[05:36:39] <Ocawesome101> panfrost directly supports most of gl3
L84[05:36:48] <Ocawesome101> maybe even all of it by now i'm not quite sure
L85[06:05:48] <Ocawesome101> so
L86[06:06:00] <Ocawesome101> remember this voxel idea i was talking about earlier?
L87[06:06:14] <Ocawesome101> i might be able to write it entirely in lua with some external libs
L88[06:06:29] <Ocawesome101> just have to uh, learn opengl
L89[06:06:39] <Ocawesome101> anyway i'm gonna go to bed now bye
L90[06:06:46] <Ocawesome101> \o
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L97[07:12:19] <CompanionCube> %tonkout
L98[07:12:19] <MichiBot> Yikes! Compan​ionCube! You beat your own previous record of 4 hours, 46 minutes and 13 seconds (By 16 minutes and 41 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L99[07:12:20] <MichiBot> Compan​ionCube has tonked out! Tonk has been reset! They gained 0.005 tonk points! plus 0.008 bonus points for consecutive hours! Current score: 1.55001992, Position #2 Need 0.1340838 more points to pass Forec​aster!
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L102[08:07:27] zsh sets mode: +v on Vexatos
L103[08:13:26] <ThePi​Guy24> %tonk
L104[08:13:28] <MichiBot> Waesucks! ThePi​Guy24! You beat Compan​ionCube's previous record of <0 (By 1 hour, 1 minute and 7 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L105[08:13:29] <MichiBot> ThePiGuy24's new record is 1 hour, 1 minute and 7 seconds! ThePiGuy24 also gained 0.00102 tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #6. Need 0.09711056 more points to pass Li​zzy!
L106[08:13:57] <ThePi​Guy24> should probably have left that a little longer
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L120[10:20:18] <dequbed> Izaya: TBF most JIT-compilation "approach C speed".
L121[10:20:36] <dequbed> Especially if you define "approach C speed" as loosly as *checks notes* all JIT-benchmarks do
L122[10:21:42] <20​kdc> it is pretty amazingly loose... did you know that Python running inside a non-translation RISC-V emulator is approaching JIT speed?
L123[10:22:50] <t20kdc> ...it's approaching it from "dreadfully slow" to "dreadfully slow"
L124[10:27:02] ⇦ Quits: surferconor425 (sid77899@hathersage.irccloud.com) (Ping timeout: 194 seconds)
L125[10:32:07] <Vexatos> dequbed, "within one order of magnitude across all benchmarks" usually checks that for me
L126[10:39:45] <dequbed> Vexatos: Even when the benchmarks ignore a) Warmup time b) "statistic" outliers where some random chance made the VM never optimize well c) the actually rather common cases where optimization passes make the output /slower/?
L127[10:40:24] <Vexatos> well "benchmarks" are usually performance benchmarks
L128[10:40:37] <dequbed> Yes?
L129[10:40:39] <Vexatos> that's what most people mean when they say benchmarks
L130[10:40:47] <Vexatos> meaning they measure execution time of some heavy calculation
L131[10:40:54] <Vexatos> obviously warmup time isn't relevant for that
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L133[10:41:08] <Vexatos> if you do a latency benchmark e.g. "run a small program 1000 times"
L134[10:41:18] <Vexatos> that would be much more telling for warmup time for example
L135[10:42:01] <Vexatos> c) can easily be mitigated by just testing all optimization levels
L136[10:42:02] <dequbed> Ah yes the faibled "My workload definitely does not suffer this problem" argument that 9 times out of 10 is actually an argument out of ignorance.
L137[10:42:11] <SquidDev> %tonk
L138[10:42:11] <MichiBot> Blast! Squi​dDev! You beat ThePi​Guy24's previous record of 1 hour, 1 minute and 7 seconds (By 1 hour, 27 minutes and 37 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L139[10:42:12] <MichiBot> SquidDev's new record is 2 hours, 28 minutes and 44 seconds! SquidDev also gained 0.00292 (0.00146 x 2) tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #3. Need 0.24258183 more points to pass Compan​ionCube!
L140[10:42:19] <Vexatos> I mean how many websites do you see where warmup time is tested
L141[10:42:26] <Vexatos> if people cared about it it'd be there, no?
L142[10:42:26] <ThePi​Guy24> pythish is faster than "native" python
L143[10:43:05] <dequbed> Vexatos: You assume that people *actually* care that their program is slower/faster than X. They don't. They care about "is this fast enough on the hardware I have to meet SLA" and if no, they buy bigger hardware.
L144[10:43:18] <Vexatos> depends
L145[10:43:21] <dequbed> Which is one reason why most benchmarks are dogshit.
L146[10:43:26] <Vexatos> where I work has literally the biggest hardware you can buy
L147[10:43:30] <Vexatos> language matters a lot
L148[10:43:37] <dequbed> Vexatos: No and no.
L149[10:43:49] <Vexatos> I just applied for access to the largest supercomputer of northern germany
L150[10:43:59] <dequbed> You *don't* have the biggest hardware you can buy and *language* matters less than good programming.
L151[10:44:12] <dequbed> You can make C super slow. Hell, you can make *FORTRAN* slow.
L152[10:44:14] <Vexatos> I am pretty sure you cannot get that much bigger than that
L153[10:44:24] <dequbed> Vexatos: Yes but you can always buy bigger.
L154[10:44:55] <Vexatos> not really. it's a big problem with research to need more hardware but not have the money for it
L155[10:44:58] <ThePi​Guy24> if you wanna be stupid, run scratch on the supercomputer :p
L156[10:45:08] <dequbed> Most supercomputers are programmed using Julia, FORTRAN or Python, at least in the ET world. Julia and Python are not performant in the slightest. With Supercomputers something else matters entirely.
L157[10:45:40] <Vexatos> All the stuff we will be running on this supercomputer is written in C, C++, and Fortran
L158[10:45:56] <Vexatos> that's what all HPC chemistry software is written in
L159[10:46:23] <Vexatos> noone could afford the performance loss from python
L160[10:46:35] <ThePi​Guy24> wonder if i could make a scratch to cpp compiler :Thonk:
L161[10:46:54] <Vexatos> of course good programming is important
L162[10:47:19] <Vexatos> but there are some things python just cannot do faster than C, there's a reason all python maths libraries are written in C
L163[10:47:43] <dequbed> Except the ones written in FORTRAN of course ;)
L164[10:47:47] <Vexatos> well yea
L165[10:48:05] <Vexatos> C and fortran are like one entity for me
L166[10:48:10] <Vexatos> they always appear as a pair
L167[10:48:27] <dequbed> Vex anyway I love you but this is obviously you just trying desperately to argue against me for the sake of arguing. And I don't want to deal with that right now. Maybe tomorrow.
L168[10:48:41] <Vexatos> well I am arguing against you because I disagree
L169[10:49:04] <Vexatos> You always use the benchmarks that are relevant to you
L170[10:49:10] <Vexatos> and for some use cases, warmup time is actually irrelevant
L171[10:52:10] <Forec​aster> What, you can't do that, this is the internet, you can only argue for bad reasons, it's the law
L172[10:52:54] <Forec​aster> At least based on how most internet dwellers do it
L173[10:53:00] <dequbed> Forecaster this *is* an argument for bad reasons.
L174[10:53:04] <Forec​aster> %sip
L175[10:53:05] <MichiBot> You drink a slimy spice potion (New!). Forecaster feels slightly faster.
L176[10:53:15] <Vexatos> @Forecaster oh, sorry
L177[10:53:27] <Vexatos> uh
L178[10:53:34] <Vexatos> I don't like you and you probably smell bad!!!!
L179[10:53:50] <dequbed> Don't worry, I still love you Vex :p
L180[10:54:33] <Vexatos> you can't just say any argument with you is an argument for bad reasons you know :I
L181[10:54:40] <Vexatos> that's not how arguments work
L182[10:55:38] <dequbed> Vexatos: Honey, don't. I don't want to argue with you, for real.
L183[10:55:42] <Vexatos> you went from arguing about language speed to arguing about quality of benchmark only to disagree with me on that too, and now you want to stop arguing
L184[10:56:23] <Izaya> Play stupid games, win stupid prizes
L185[10:56:41] <Izaya> explicitly not addressed at anyone :)
L186[10:56:52] * dequbed slaps Izaya with a trout
L187[10:59:06] <Vexatos> you need to accept that there are other uses in the world. I don't have an SLA to meet, research never ends. we use the biggest hardware we can buy with the money we have because the faster our calcs are done, the faster we can start our next ones. And if our calcs take weeks to run, noone would give half a care about things like warmup time. In my case, optimization levels matter a lot and benchmarks always are tested on all
L188[10:59:06] <Vexatos> optimization levels prior to actually installing the software. But also all programs we use on there are written in C++ and fortran because they are either old or really need that extra performance. Also, frankly noone with a brain would want to write scientific python
L189[10:59:57] <Vexatos> I am not saying that warmup time is an irrelevant benchmark but if it was relevant to most people then benchmark websites would have it
L190[11:00:28] <Vexatos> maybe one should introduce such a thing
L191[11:00:35] <Vexatos> for like the benchmarksgame
L192[11:02:08] <dequbed> https://xkcd.com/386/
L193[11:03:46] <Vexatos> don't disagree with people and then complain if they disagree with you :P
L194[11:22:09] <t20kdc> warmup time is very important for user applications - it's much less important for server applications unless warmup time is incredibly severe
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L201[12:45:41] * Amanda yawns, stretchies
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L204[13:34:54] <Snai​lDOS> ok
L205[13:40:26] <Izaya> nok
L206[13:48:06] <Webchat425> i managed to get the natives to error some more
L207[13:48:54] <Webchat425> i got eris and jnlua to compile individually, but the gradle script to compile them both together does not work
L208[13:57:15] <Webchat425> Is it possible to get the native libraries to compile on java 8?
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L211[14:08:22] <Zaprit> Okay, now I have an actual irc client
L212[14:08:49] <ThePi​Guy24> telnet is the best irc client
L213[14:11:36] <Zaprit> I am using pidgin
L214[14:11:39] <Zaprit> but ok
L215[14:18:49] <bre​ad™> imagine using pigdin
L216[14:19:00] <bre​ad™> this was made by weechat gang
L217[14:33:31] <dequbed> Imagine using a client that you didn't write. Pff.
L218[14:38:41] <dequbed> In case the tone wasn't obvious: /s.
L219[14:38:53] <Amanda> M-x butterfly
L220[14:39:58] * dequbed sends Amanda elisp into infinite recursion
L221[14:41:31] <SquidDev> M-x butterfly doesn't do IRC, but there's at least three emacs modes which do.
L222[14:41:48] <Zaprit> emacs it crunch
L223[14:41:51] <Zaprit> 6y
L224[14:41:54] <Zaprit> crunchy
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L229[15:06:16] <Amanda> SquidDev: if you did it rapid and precice enough, you could cause the cosmic rays to swap the bits in a network card's RAM!
L230[15:11:40] <SquidDev> Fairly sure that's what rcirc does behind the hood.
L231[15:26:05] <Forec​aster> %sip
L232[15:26:06] <MichiBot> You drink a stirring ocean potion (New!). Forecaster sees the sky briefly flash solid dark blue then go back to normal.
L233[15:26:15] <Forec​aster> Ohno
L234[16:45:45] <Forec​aster> %tonk
L235[16:45:46] <MichiBot> Golly! Forec​aster! You beat Squi​dDev's previous record of 2 hours, 28 minutes and 44 seconds (By 3 hours, 34 minutes and 49 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L236[16:45:47] <MichiBot> Forecaster's new record is 6 hours, 3 minutes and 34 seconds! Forecaster also gained 0.01074 (0.00358 x 3) tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #1.
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L238[16:49:51] <Forec​aster> https://youtu.be/E1KkQrFEl2I
L239[16:49:51] <MichiBot> How Large Can a Bacteria get? Life & Size 3 | length: 11m 5s | Likes: 45,821 Dislikes: 275 Views: 460,280 | by Kurzgesagt – In a Nutshell | Published On 10/11/2020
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L241[17:10:10] <Michiyo> great the stats page output is broken
L242[17:10:26] <Michiyo> the stats DB works though... but it doesn't output a working page
L243[17:18:55] <Michiyo> https://drive.pc-logix.com/s/M6D4DmM4zq65yaC Whelp...
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L245[17:44:15] <Ko​dos> Lol wow
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L247[17:48:04] <IdotMaster1> e
L248[17:48:07] <IdotMaster1> hi
L249[17:48:11] <IdotMaster1> hello
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L255[18:03:58] zsh sets mode: +v on jackie
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L260[19:00:35] <boba​srty> plasma decided to crash while im in school so i had to figure out how to run plasma again
L261[19:02:12] <Ocawes​ome101> oof
L262[19:02:17] <Ocawes​ome101> ctrl-alt-backspace kills X
L263[19:02:24] <Ocawes​ome101> which should be set to auto restart on anything sane
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L265[19:07:30] <bad at​ vijya> yes @Ocawesome101
L266[19:07:39] <Ocawes​ome101> ?
L267[19:07:48] <bad at​ vijya> ctrl-alt-backspace
L268[19:08:03] <Forec​aster> dammit, why does this keep happening https://tinyurl.com/y4b7uvbq
L269[19:08:26] <Ocawes​ome101> ctrl-alt-backspace is nice
L270[19:20:25] <CompanionCube> isn't it usually disabled these days
L271[19:23:56] ⇦ Quits: ben_mkiv (~ben_mkiv@200116b814f5410065c97d178ba4e680.dip.versatel-1u1.de) (Ping timeout: 194 seconds)
L272[19:26:28] <ThePi​Guy24> can confirm it doesnt work on ubuntu 19.10
L273[19:28:01] <Ocawes​ome101> works on arch
L274[19:32:29] ⇨ Joins: Zaprit (~Zaprit@valtek.uk)
L275[20:01:34] <Amanda> ubuntu disables it, because trolls kept telling people it would solve random problems in their support channels
L276[20:02:59] <ThePi​Guy24> ah yes
L277[20:03:13] <ThePi​Guy24> now how to undisable
L278[20:03:28] <Amanda> moddify /etc/X11/Xorg.conf probably
L279[20:03:49] <Amanda> or if you're lucky it'll be a file under there that gets loaded in as part of a batch
L280[20:10:38] <Vexatos> ubuntu has it in the keyboard settings
L281[20:10:38] <Vexatos> IIRC
L282[20:28:10] <Forec​aster> sigh, great
L283[20:28:23] <Forec​aster> something broke in my MichiBot environment
L284[20:28:50] <Forec​aster> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/umajibugib
L285[20:28:50] <Forec​aster> This again
L286[20:30:59] <ThePi​Guy24> i blame tim apple because scapegoats
L287[21:08:03] <Michiyo> Oh... @"Forec​aster" umm
L288[21:08:09] <Michiyo> That MIGHT be my fault?
L289[21:09:15] <Michiyo> @Forec​aster try grabbing 'https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Vexatos/Selene/master/selene/lib/selene/init.lua',
L290[21:09:16] <Michiyo> 'https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Vexatos/Selene/master/selene/lib/selene/parser.lua'
L291[21:09:23] <Michiyo> and putting them in src/main/resources/jnlua/selene
L292[21:10:00] <Vexatos> what did I breakeded
L293[21:10:58] <Forec​aster> I will try that tomorrow
L294[21:11:16] <Sap​hire> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/660678054603128832/775829818959986769/unknown.png uhhhhh
L295[21:11:20] <Sap​hire> Excuse me what the fuck?
L296[21:12:44] <Sap​hire> Wait does it count fucking vram
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L299[21:23:17] <CompanionCube> lol: https://twitter.com/MattLech/status/1326269079481692163/photo/1
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L306[22:58:08] <Amanda> %choose halcuinate or irradiate
L307[22:58:08] <MichiBot> Ama​nda: Pretty sure I'd want you to go with "halcuinate"!
L308[22:58:19] * Amanda eyes MichiBot with suspicion
L309[22:58:30] <Amanda> Why does she want me to be lost in a story.. WHAT ARE YOU PLANNING MICHIBOT!?
L310[22:59:20] <MichiBot> Absolutely nothing Amanda ^_^
L311[22:59:30] <Amanda> Oh, okay
L312[22:59:39] * Amanda tucks in around Elfi, loads up her stories
L313[22:59:50] <MichiBot> Enjoy!
L314[23:00:24] * Elfi snuggles in beside Amanda and draws on her tiny mothtop
L315[23:00:28] <Amanda> %choose hero or compassion
L316[23:00:28] <MichiBot> Ama​nda: Wait, what was the question again? Uhh... "compassion"?
L317[23:00:43] * Amanda nods, loads up the story containing compassion
L318[23:13:05] <CompanionCube> %tonk
L319[23:13:05] <MichiBot> Consarn it! Compan​ionCube! You beat Forec​aster's previous record of 6 hours, 3 minutes and 34 seconds (By 23 minutes and 45 seconds)! I hope you're happy!
L320[23:13:06] <MichiBot> CompanionCube's new record is 6 hours, 27 minutes and 19 seconds! CompanionCube also gained 0.0028 (0.0004 x 7) tonk points for stealing the tonk. Position #2. Need 0.1420238 more points to pass Forec​aster!
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L322[23:24:27] <CompanionCube> Izaya: today on apple's wara against is users is the latest ARM Macs, the exact thing doesn't need spelling ot
L323[23:40:44] <20​kdc> ...did they really make ARM Macs
L324[23:41:09] <20​kdc> or is this just a nightmare and I can wake up from it
L325[23:42:54] <CompanionCube> https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2020/11/introducing-the-next-generation-of-mac/
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L327[23:53:47] <Izaya> CompanionCube: ARM powered laptops are cool but why would I get those over a Pinebook Pro tbh
L328[23:53:56] <CompanionCube> ikr
L329[23:54:14] <CompanionCube> imagine dealing with apple's secure boot BS, and then having to probably RE the hardware yourself
L330[23:55:05] <Izaya> I feel like at least the PBP would have a comfier keyboard if still no worthwhile pointing device
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