OCLogs: 2016-01-31.log

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L6[00:21:43] <xarses> IMO ic2 is boring without GT

L7[00:22:06] <Kodos> The only positive thing I have to say about GT was the cover system

L8[00:22:09] <Kodos> That shit was glorious

L9[00:22:12] <Kodos> Fuck the rest of it

L10[00:22:16] <Kodos> But that cover system almost makes up for it

L11[00:22:23] <gamax92> almost

L12[00:23:59] <Kodos> I mostly liked the activity light cover

L13[00:24:21] <Kodos> I had a control panel that would show me when machines were free, working, or maintenance was needed

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L16[00:31:04] <Kodos> Project Red realllly needs an AIO download

L17[00:31:05] <Kodos> Holy shit

L18[00:42:18] <Kodos> Has anyone made any programs using the OS keypad yet

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L20[00:54:45] <Kodos> Dynamite!

L21[00:54:48] <Kodos> That's why I liked IC2

L22[00:54:54] <Kodos> The dynamite and remote

L23[00:55:04] <Kodos> Made mining and tunneling easier

L24[00:55:40] <xarses> really, not the drills or laser rifle?

L25[00:56:12] <Kodos> Nope, weapons aren't really something I care much about, since 90% of the time, I play in Peaceful with a hunger in peaceful mod on

L26[00:56:34] <Kodos> It lets me have the safety and creativity of creative, while still retaining the survival aspects of the game like food, health, oxygen, etc

L27[00:56:57] <xarses> well, those are both tools

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L29[00:59:35] <xarses> so, ya you missed some aspects of the mod

L30[01:00:07] <Kodos> Either way, what I really miss is detcord and fuse from Explosives+ back in 1.5.2 or 1.6.4, I can never remember

L31[01:06:25] <Kodos> Someone drug me and keep me asleep for 6 months

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L33[01:14:04] ⇦ Parts: minelayer (webchat@50.109.220.255) ())

L34[01:46:08] <Kodos> Upgraded my hidden door to now conceal a security door with a mag reader

L35[02:08:48] *** gAway2002 is now known as g

L36[02:11:13] <Kodos> Now if I just had something that worked slower than pistons, and sounded more techy

L37[02:15:49] <Dashkal> One of these days I'll get to play with those toys. But I moved versions.

L38[02:17:08] <Kodos> I'm assuming you're on 1.8?

L39[02:19:19] <Dashkal> Yepo

L40[02:19:30] <Dashkal> Started my playtest of a potential first 1.8 sandbox pack

L41[02:20:43] <Dashkal> Still a little light on content, but nearly to my threshold on that.

L42[02:20:55] <Dashkal> I need just a little more tech.

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L44[02:24:06] <Kodos> The one major thing lacking for me in 1.8 aside from OC addons, is the fact that OC is still on 1.5

L45[02:24:21] <Kodos> There's a dev build for 1.6, but I'm not sure how stable it is

L46[02:26:25] * Dashkal does a quick look at the files

L47[02:26:40] <Dashkal> All of my OC stuff says OC 1.5, for MC 1.7.x and 1.8.x both

L48[02:27:02] <Dashkal> Honestly, it's only there for stability testing anyway. There isn't anything worth automating to that level for me right now.

L49[02:28:15] <Kodos> Well, I mostly like 1.6 OC because of some new stuff for server racks

L50[02:28:19] <Kodos> Most notably Light Boards

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L52[02:28:46] <Dashkal> Not quite what I meant. I see no evidence of OC 1.6 right now. Where's it hiding?

L53[02:29:15] <Kodos> Jenkins

L54[02:29:26] <Dashkal> Ahh, ok.

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L58[02:36:12] <Kodos> Well, I just about have everything I need for my base to be built

L59[02:36:26] <Kodos> I wish a mod added a mushroom button with a mollyguard

L60[02:44:19] <Kodos> Ah well. Gn

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L78[04:53:51] <DeanIsaKitty> Mimiru: Do you still need help with C?

L79[04:58:18] <Inari> C!

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L86[05:38:44] <mpmxyz> Good Afternoon! Payonel, are you here?

L87[05:41:07] <Keanu73> Hi

L88[05:41:10] <Keanu73> I have a question

L89[05:41:14] <Keanu73> How can you loadstring stuff?

L90[05:41:15] <Keanu73> in OC?

L91[05:41:25] <Keanu73> Because it comes up with a error for me

L92[05:41:28] <Keanu73> when I try to loadstring

L93[05:42:13] <Skye> Keanu73, can you give us more information about what you're trying to do?

L94[05:42:21] <Keanu73> I am trying to execute code with loadstring

L95[05:42:42] <Keanu73> Screenshot might help:

L96[05:42:50] <Keanu73> http://prntscr.com/9x5oo3

L97[05:43:44] <Skye> hmmm

L98[05:43:56] <Skye> from what I can see, it doesn't have loadstring

L99[05:44:16] <Skye> which is confusing

L100[05:44:20] <Skye> because it must have it

L101[05:44:24] <Skye> to load files

L102[05:44:32] <DeanIsaKitty> Nah, that's loadfile.

L103[05:44:47] <Skye> wouldn't loadfile use loadstring?

L104[05:44:52] <DeanIsaKitty> Keanu73: Try load() and dofile()

L105[05:44:59] <DeanIsaKitty> dostring() <.<

L106[05:45:03] <Keanu73> Okay

L107[05:45:12] <Skye> DeanIsaKitty, why isn't loadstring implemented?

L108[05:45:25] <Keanu73> How do you use dostring()?

L109[05:45:48] <Vexatos> Keanu73, there is no loadstring in Lua

L110[05:45:49] <DeanIsaKitty> Skye: OpenOS implements loadfile via load().

L111[05:45:51] <Vexatos> there is load

L112[05:45:52] <Vexatos> loadfile

L113[05:45:53] <Vexatos> and dofile

L114[05:45:58] <Vexatos> loadfile loads a string

L115[05:46:02] <Vexatos> loadfile loads a file

L116[05:46:07] <Vexatos> dofile loads an executes a file

L117[05:46:33] <Skye> Vexatos, s/loadfile loads a string/load loads a string/

L118[05:46:45] <Vexatos> yea

L119[05:46:56] <Keanu73> There is loadstring in lua.

L120[05:47:17] <Keanu73> Oh wait.

L121[05:47:33] <Keanu73> nope

L122[05:47:40] <Keanu73> There is loadstring in lua. it says in the docs

L123[05:47:49] <Vexatos> http://www.lua.org/manual/5.2/manual.html

L124[05:48:01] <Vexatos> Got removed in 5.2

L125[05:48:19] <Keanu73> http://www.lua.org/pil/8.html

L126[05:48:19] <Vexatos> "Function loadstring is deprecated. Use load instead; it now accepts string arguments and are exactly equivalent to loadstring. "

L127[05:48:22] <Keanu73> Oh

L128[05:48:46] <Keanu73> Thanks mate

L129[05:51:59] <Saphire> Keanu73: why you needed it, though?

L130[05:52:08] <Keanu73> Remote robot control

L131[05:52:18] <Skye> C:\Users\skye>lua

L132[05:52:18] <Keanu73> from my tablet

L134[05:52:22] <Skye> > loadstring("print('but why can I do it here?')")()

L135[05:52:24] <Skye> but why can I do it here?

L136[05:52:26] <Skye> >

L137[05:52:28] <Skye> C:\Users\skye>

L138[05:52:46] <Keanu73> ^

L139[05:52:49] <Vexatos> Skye, deprecated means it's up to you to support it :P

L140[05:52:59] <Vexatos> OC doesn't support deprecated functions

L141[05:53:02] <Skye> ah

L142[05:53:14] <DeanIsaKitty> Skye: Furthermore OC has a 5.3 arch.

L143[05:53:21] <Vexatos> And a 5.2 one

L144[05:53:24] <Vexatos> 5.2 is standard

L145[05:53:26] <Skye> DeanIsaKitty, but it's not default, I think

L146[05:53:48] <DeanIsaKitty> Oh, I though it was default by now

L147[05:55:11] <Keanu73> Is it possible to set a name for a robot via Lua?

L148[05:55:14] <Keanu73> or only via an anvil

L149[05:56:37] <Keanu73> oh

L150[05:56:38] <Keanu73> it can't

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L162[07:12:20] <Gavle> Hello

L163[07:13:25] <g> Hallo

L164[07:18:14] <Gavle> how are you g?

L165[07:21:48] <g> I'm okay I guess

L166[07:21:54] <g> Do you need something?

L167[07:22:29] <Gavle> I do not need anything, just being polite

L168[07:22:38] <g> ah, okay

L169[07:22:44] <g> people don't tend to ask randoms about that on IRC

L170[07:22:53] <g> so I was wondering what you wanted

L171[07:22:53] <g> :P

L172[07:22:55] <Gavle> ah

L173[07:22:58] <Gavle> nothing :P

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L177[07:39:19] <Inari> Gavle: how are you?

L178[07:39:27] <Gavle> Inari, I am well

L179[07:39:29] <Gavle> what about you?'

L180[07:43:50] <Inari> im fine :p

L181[07:45:36] <Gavle> good to hear that Inari :)

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L187[07:59:45] <Keanu73> You know the OC IRC program?

L188[07:59:57] <Keanu73> Can you be on multiple channels at once and switch between them?

L189[08:00:01] <Gavle> Yes

L190[08:00:47] <Keanu73> How?

L191[08:00:56] <Gavle> use /join

L192[08:01:00] <Keanu73> I know /join, but

L193[08:01:07] <Keanu73> How do I switch between the channels?

L194[08:01:12] <Keanu73> so that I can talk in whatever one I want

L195[08:01:12] <Gavle> you use /join again

L196[08:01:16] <Keanu73> oh

L197[08:01:18] <Gavle> it toggles the channels

L198[08:01:20] <Keanu73> Okaty

L199[08:01:22] <Keanu73> I get it

L200[08:01:27] <Keanu73> thanks

L201[08:01:29] <Inari> #IntuitiveDesign

L202[08:01:33] <Keanu73> Also, I'm not on OC

L203[08:01:43] <Keanu73> You'll see a nick called Keanu73OC

L204[08:02:11] ⇨ Joins: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu)

L205[08:02:34] <Keanu73OC> Hai

L206[08:02:55] <Gavle> update your arch

L207[08:03:01] <Keanu73OC> wat?

L208[08:03:18] <Keanu73OC> meh

L209[08:03:36] <g> did someone actually make a usable oc irc client?

L210[08:03:41] <g> (that means, not an irssi port)

L211[08:03:45] <Keanu73OC> Yes..

L212[08:03:48] <Keanu73OC> It's a floppy.

L213[08:03:52] <g> ah, okay

L214[08:03:56] <Keanu73OC> Or you can cheat and download it off github

L215[08:04:03] <Keanu73OC> Which I did

L216[08:04:09] <Mimiru> There is also wocchat on OPPM

L217[08:04:14] <Mimiru> which is even better than the built in one

L218[08:04:22] <Keanu73OC> Maybe I'll try wocchat

L219[08:04:25] <Keanu73OC> is it like weechat?

L220[08:04:31] <Mimiru> IDK, never used it

L221[08:04:55] <Keanu73OC> lemme try it

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L224[08:05:40] <Keanu73OC> Woah.

L225[08:05:45] <Keanu73OC> Wocchat is so epic.

L226[08:05:52] <Mimiru> lol, rigt?

L227[08:06:00] <Keanu73OC> Just like my own IRC client

L228[08:06:07] <Mimiru> s/rigt/right/

L229[08:06:07] <Kibibyte> <Mimiru> lol, right?

L230[08:06:33] ⇦ Quits: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu) (Remote host closed the connection)

L231[08:06:40] <Keanu73> Oops..

L232[08:06:44] <Keanu73> Ran out of RF..

L233[08:06:51] <Keanu73> My friend accidentally closed the OC power feed

L234[08:06:59] <Gavle> XD

L235[08:07:49] <Keanu73> Booting up server..

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L238[08:08:11] <InariOC> fancy

L239[08:08:16] <Keanu73OC> Back C:

L240[08:08:29] <Mimiru> But yeah, wocchat was made by our very own gamax92

L241[08:08:41] <g> not even close to the coolest thing he's made

L242[08:08:45] <Inari> few things to complain about

L243[08:08:46] <Mimiru> heh

L244[08:08:49] <g> he made a screen for OC that can do 3D rendering

L245[08:08:54] <g> and it works in multiplayer

L246[08:09:03] <Inari> huh?

L247[08:09:05] <Inari> which mod is that in

L248[08:09:13] <DeanIsaKitty> gamax made a lot of shit ^^

L249[08:09:15] <g> he actually came onto my server and programmed a little animation to show it off for us

L250[08:09:15] <g> xD

L251[08:09:28] <Keanu73OC> Haha

L252[08:09:33] <InariOC> boo /notice doesnt work

L253[08:09:33] <InariOC> :p

L254[08:09:42] <g> use /quote for it

L255[08:09:43] <g> :P

L256[08:09:47] <InariOC> who the heck does that

L257[08:09:55] <g> people without /notice

L258[08:09:59] <InariOC> "no command "quote""

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L260[08:10:03] <g> ./raw?

L261[08:10:15] ⇦ Quits: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu) (Client Quit)

L262[08:10:20] <Inari> well that one works

L263[08:10:21] <Inari> :p

L264[08:10:40] * g looks at Keanu73

L265[08:10:41] <g> WOAH

L266[08:10:43] <g> I'M KEANU

L267[08:10:45] <Keanu73> XD

L268[08:10:45] <g> I KNOW KUNG FU

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L270[08:11:00] <Keanu73> How do you exit wocchat?

L271[08:11:06] <Keanu73> because erm

L272[08:11:08] <g> you don't

L273[08:11:10] <Keanu73> I had to terminate it

L274[08:11:12] <g> it's like the hotel california

L275[08:11:17] <g> you can check out any time you like

L276[08:11:20] <g> but you can never leave

L277[08:11:25] <Inari> EXTERMINATE!

L278[08:11:37] <Gavle> dalek!

L279[08:11:50] <g> extermeniren!

L280[08:12:21] <Gavle> S4 Season Finale reference

L281[08:12:45] <Mimiru> I went to bed at 4 AM... why am I up at 8?

L282[08:13:02] <DeanIsaKitty> Mimiru: Because you are a bit masochistic? :P

L283[08:13:12] <Inari> l-lewd

L284[08:13:39] <Inari> why did you go to bed at 4am when you supposedly were already ready for bed when have gotten back to work

L285[08:13:54] <Keanu73> Hehe

L286[08:13:58] <Keanu73> I added an alias to join

L287[08:14:00] <Keanu73> in the program itself

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L290[08:14:43] * Lizzy groans

L291[08:14:45] <Lizzy> /back

L292[08:14:46] <g> ah yes, the elusive /joindre

L293[08:14:49] <Lizzy> ¬)¬

L294[08:15:06] <Inari> i think lizzy broke

L295[08:15:34] <Keanu73> brb afk

L296[08:15:36] ⇨ Joins: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu)

L297[08:15:44] <Lizzy> Inari, lizzy not fully awake

L298[08:15:54] <Mimiru> Lizzy, I feel ya....

L299[08:15:59] * g buries Inari in a pile of shoes

L300[08:15:59] <Mimiru> roughly 3.5 hours of sleep

L301[08:16:04] <Mimiru> after being up for 20+ hours

L302[08:16:25] <Inari> gamax92: whats wocchat's license?

L303[08:17:06] <g> Inari: private license, there's nothing in the repo

L304[08:17:32] <Inari> ~oc internet

L305[08:17:33] <ocdoc> http://ocd.cil.li/api:internet

L306[08:18:34] *** Saphire is now known as sapphire

L307[08:18:49] <Keanu73> back

L308[08:19:03] *** sapphire is now known as Saphire

L309[08:20:43] ⇨ Joins: Tedster (~Tedster@host86-170-31-233.range86-170.btcentralplus.com)

L310[08:21:16] <Inari> sadly would need to modify wocchat to make it use an ingame-bouncer XD either that or could overwrite internet functiosn i guess

L311[08:24:16] ⇦ Quits: VikeStep (~VikeStep@101.184.165.77) (Quit: Leaving)

L312[08:34:33] <Inari> suggestion: allow to craft printed blocks with gunpowder to make them have tnt-like properties

L313[08:37:34] ⇦ Quits: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

L314[08:41:43] <Inari> well then... http://akari.in/pinky_A6NxY

L315[08:42:08] <Mimiru> o_O

L316[08:42:29] <Mimiru> I'm not saying that's a bad idea... but...

L317[08:42:33] <Inari> haha

L318[08:42:35] <Gavle> That's a lot of OC stuff

L319[08:42:45] <Inari> downloaded some minecraft map xD maybe it was for 1.8 or something :P

L320[08:42:50] <Mimiru> lol

L321[08:43:07] <Gavle> I should 3D print an entire base sometimes

L322[08:43:08] <Inari> the house is chuck full with OC blocks :D

L323[08:43:17] <Gavle> So that nothing is atually real, just 3D prints

L324[08:43:23] * vifino groans and flops on Lizzy

L325[08:43:32] * Lizzy pets vifino

L326[08:44:00] * vifino purrs

L327[08:44:18] <g> I'm surprised you two aren't in the main furry channels with the frequency with which you do things like that

L328[08:44:19] <g> :P

L329[08:44:48] <Lizzy> He's a cat, I'm a winged deamon

L330[08:45:03] <vifino> *angel

L331[08:45:07] <g> so you're a.. scaley?

L332[08:48:48] * Sangar waves lethargically

L333[08:49:06] <Gavle> Hello Sangar

L334[08:49:16] <Mimiru> HE LIVES

L335[08:49:17] <Inari> sangar is alive ;o

L336[08:49:21] * vifino googles "lethargically"

L337[08:49:38] * DeanIsaKitty hands Sangar a mug of extra strong coffee

L338[08:49:58] * Sangar sips. it's totally not effective

L339[08:50:02] <Sangar> but thanks for trying :P

L340[08:50:12] <DeanIsaKitty> Always :P <3

L341[08:50:32] <Sangar> uhhh...

L342[08:50:34] <Lizzy> Awwww *~*

L343[08:50:36] * Gavle hands Sangar some extremely strong stiumulants

L344[08:50:45] <vifino> I ship em!

L345[08:50:48] <vifino> :D

L346[08:51:04] <Sangar> %tell Magik6k you mean add a different slot type to the tablet? as in a new tablet tier/type or the existing one?

L347[08:51:04] <MichiBot> Sangar: Magik6k will be notified of this message when next seen.

L348[08:51:53] ⇦ Quits: Tedster (~Tedster@host86-170-31-233.range86-170.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 194 seconds)

L349[08:52:13] ⇨ Joins: Tedster (~Tedster@host86-170-31-233.range86-170.btcentralplus.com)

L350[08:54:11] <Sangar> hang on, when did the channel grow past 160 o.O

L351[08:54:23] <DeanIsaKitty> Sangar: While you were away :P

L352[08:54:31] <Gavle> whoo

L353[08:54:32] <Gavle> 163

L354[08:54:39] <Sangar> fair point. it did have enough time then :P

L355[08:57:07] <vifino> Image profile: (Updated) ESXi-6.0.0-20160104001-standard-customized (venom)

L356[08:57:08] <vifino> :D

L357[08:59:19] <Gavle> amI the 163rd person?

L358[08:59:27] <Gavle> do I win a million dollars?

L359[09:00:31] <vifino> You win a free kick, ask your nearest op to redeem.

L360[09:00:59] <gamemanj> which number am I, and what do I win?

L361[09:01:27] * Gavle looks at vifino

L362[09:01:29] <Gavle> :|

L363[09:01:37] <Sangar> someone write a log analyzer to figure out people's number, please

L364[09:01:50] <vifino> Gavle: What? I ws serious...

L365[09:01:57] <DeanIsaKitty> Do it yourself lazy useless ass :P

L366[09:02:04] * Gavle continues to stare at vifino

L367[09:02:05] <Sangar> oi

L368[09:02:06] <Gavle> :||

L369[09:02:13] <Vexatos> SANGAR

L370[09:02:16] <Vexatos> OC 1.6 when

L371[09:02:17] <Sangar> i'm finally doing stuff on oc again, don't call me lazy :X

L372[09:02:25] <Sangar> Vexatos, soon (tm)

L373[09:02:42] <DeanIsaKitty> Sangar: I will always call you lazy and useless, don't you realize? :P

L374[09:02:46] <Vexatos> Sangar, meanwhile http://i.imgur.com/lFHn1uN.png

L375[09:02:56] <Sangar> looking over issues one more time, will cherry pick the gc thing to release 1.5.22 proper, then i'll look into the port to 1.8 of oc 1.6

L376[09:03:02] <vifino> Gavle: I know I look nice, but you don't need to stare, really.

L377[09:03:23] <Sangar> Vexatos, looks like something from gregtech :P

L378[09:03:24] * Gavle removes eyes

L379[09:03:35] <vifino> Thanks, I appreciate it.

L380[09:03:41] <Vexatos> Sangar, I am making a concept for construction foam dissolver for greg right now

L381[09:03:45] <Gavle> no problem vifino

L382[09:03:47] <DeanIsaKitty> Vexatos: That is why you don't let a chemist write mods or games <.<

L383[09:03:54] <Vexatos> Sooo

L384[09:03:55] <Sangar> i was right? :O ermgurd

L385[09:03:59] <Vexatos> Yes you were

L386[09:04:04] <Vexatos> greg was asking for a recipe

L387[09:04:09] <Vexatos> so I give him a recipe

L388[09:04:12] <Sangar> amazing

L389[09:04:13] ⇦ Quits: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

L390[09:04:16] <Sangar> brb

L391[09:04:17] <gamemanj> DeanIsaKitty: it sounds like a great idea

L392[09:04:30] <Vexatos> DeanIsaKitty, you seen the Factum Opus booth on BTM?

L393[09:04:42] <DeanIsaKitty> Vexatos: Nope, wasn't on BTM

L394[09:04:45] <Vexatos> http://i.imgur.com/LMSdqHc.png

L395[09:04:59] <gamemanj> Vexatos: How are you making these complex graphs

L396[09:05:24] <gamemanj> "Aqua Regia Vera"... what

L397[09:06:11] <Vexatos> "Vera" means "true"

L398[09:06:20] <vifino> Away for a bit, see ya all!

L399[09:06:21] <gamemanj> Vexatos: so: "True royal water"

L400[09:06:24] <Vexatos> the Factorization Aqua Regia is made with Sulfuric acid

L401[09:06:32] <Vexatos> so it's not actually Aqua Regia

L402[09:07:51] <gamemanj> Vexatos: If Minechem ever got the ability to perform "realistic" chemical reactions, I know where they'd get the information from

L403[09:08:14] <Vexatos> any chem student, really

L404[09:15:25] <Sangar> DeanIsaKitty, and i'll always complain about it :P

L405[09:15:31] <DeanIsaKitty> Sangar: :3

L406[09:16:10] <Vexatos> Wouldn't "lazy" and "useless" fit to a cat like DeanIsaKitty much better >_>

L407[09:16:26] <DeanIsaKitty> Vexatos: Nobody ever said that I am NOT useless and lazy :P

L408[09:16:29] <Lizzy> Vexatos, add adorable in there and you have DeanIsaKitty

L409[09:16:36] * Lizzy hides

L410[09:16:42] <Izaya> Nooooooooooooo

L411[09:16:57] <DeanIsaKitty> Izaya: Am I that bad? <.<

L412[09:17:09] <Vexatos> it's like "appealing"

L413[09:17:09] <Vexatos> and

L414[09:17:12] <Vexatos> s/ea/a/

L415[09:17:12] <Kibibyte> <Vexatos> it's like "appaling"

L416[09:17:14] <Vexatos> :P

L417[09:17:16] <Izaya> http://www.dumbingofage.com/2016/comic/book-6/02-that-perfect-girl/get/ this is the latest page D:

L418[09:18:47] <Izaya> Time to sleep I guess

L419[09:21:24] <vifino> Night, Izaya.

L420[09:21:26] <vifino> o/

L421[09:21:32] <Izaya> \o

L422[09:21:58] <DeanIsaKitty> Night o/

L423[09:22:26] <vifino> Vexatos: DeanIsaKitty isn't useless tho.

L424[09:30:59] <Mimiru> Sangar a fix for 1.6 screens crashing if you login while looking at them would be appreciated :p

L425[09:34:07] <Sangar> yeah, working down up, currently trying to get immibis microblocks not error on startup in dev env to reproduce another issue. how i missed mod dev.

L426[09:37:54] <Vexatos> Sangar, meanwhile Computronics was fully ported to 1.8

L427[09:37:54] <Vexatos> >_>

L428[09:38:11] <Gavle> whoo!

L429[09:38:19] <Sangar> yey!

L430[09:39:06] <Sangar> oh yey. immibis core seems to have a hard dep on ic2 <_>

L431[09:45:21] <Vexatos> Sangar, .gitignore "fix" because IDEA decided to add all the files in my dev env anyway and I think it's stupid to have a blacklist .gitignore so I turned it into a whitelist

L432[09:46:09] <Sangar> "all the files"?

L433[09:46:27] <Sangar> i always found whitelist gitignores kinda annoying to work with, tbh

L434[09:46:41] <Vexatos> why

L435[09:46:52] <Vexatos> it's rarely that you add a file to root

L436[09:47:01] <Vexatos> and want to add it to the repo

L437[09:47:05] <Sangar> but when it happens i'm almost guaranteed to forget adding it

L438[09:47:10] <Vexatos> but most people cloning the repo

L439[09:47:18] <Vexatos> will have some OS-specific files on there

L440[09:47:58] <Sangar> such as? (that weren't in the .gitignore)

L441[09:52:33] <Vexatos> for me it was the output dir

L442[09:53:13] <DeanIsaKitty> Vexatos: Let me tell you about our lord and saviour the global .gitignore.

L443[09:53:37] ⇨ Joins: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu)

L444[09:54:49] <Vexatos> DeanIsaKitty, it's just that my output dir is different per-project

L445[09:54:56] <Vexatos> in MC 1.8 it's /classes

L446[09:55:05] <Vexatos> in 1.7.10 it's /build/classes

L447[09:55:09] <Vexatos> etc

L448[09:57:33] <Negi> I should probably get around to learn Java or Scala someday.

L449[09:58:10] <Sangar> how did you manage to make it /classes in 1.8 o.O

L450[09:58:44] <Vexatos> Sangar, that's default

L451[09:58:54] <Vexatos> when running "gradlew idea"

L452[09:59:17] <Sangar> it's not for me >_> still in build/classes

L453[09:59:32] <Vexatos> just accept the PR already >_>

L454[10:02:23] <Sangar> :P

L455[10:12:55] ⇦ Quits: mpmxyz (webchat@p4FEC766B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Web client closed)

L456[10:14:52] <Izaya> Sleep or install arch?

L457[10:15:24] <Izaya> that is, the second copy on my laptop

L458[10:15:54] <DeanIsaKitty> You need Sleep...

L459[10:16:08] <Izaya> also anyone know a good way to dry hair?

L460[10:16:41] <DeanIsaKitty> Hair dryer?

L461[10:17:36] <Gavle> Izaya, blazing pyrotheum

L462[10:18:07] <Izaya> Don't have one plus loud

L463[10:18:16] <DeanIsaKitty> Leaf blower?

L464[10:18:31] <Gavle> remove the hair entirely

L465[10:18:51] <Mimiru> Sangar, updating server to test the screen fix

L466[10:18:52] <Izaya> Don't have one, even louder

L467[10:18:56] <Lizzy> a belt sander

L468[10:19:21] <Izaya> in hindsight asking here was pointless

L469[10:19:36] <DeanIsaKitty> Izaya: Headbanging :3

L470[10:19:37] <Sangar> Mimiru, thanks!

L471[10:19:42] <gamax92> what DeanIsaKitty said

L472[10:19:56] <Izaya> Now that could work

L473[10:20:36] <DeanIsaKitty> Izaya: Need music? :P

L474[10:21:06] <Izaya> Well QotSA is a bit slow to be practical

L475[10:21:32] <DeanIsaKitty> Izaya: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcstjQ-WuVU

L476[10:21:33] <MichiBot> DeanIsaKitty: Kreator - Violent Revolution [HQ Audio] | length: 4m 57s | Likes: 734 Dislikes: 7 Views: 118367 | by Optr3e's June

L477[10:22:25] <DeanIsaKitty> Alternatively https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qw2LU1yS7aw

L478[10:22:25] <MichiBot> DeanIsaKitty: Slipknot - Before I Forget [OFFICIAL VIDEO] | length: 4m 2s | Likes: 199328 Dislikes: 3751 Views: 42535822 | by Slipknot

L479[10:22:33] <gamax92> >_<

L480[10:22:56] <DeanIsaKitty> gamax92: Want trashier metal? :3

L481[10:24:47] <gamax92> I don't listen to metal

L482[10:25:05] <DeanIsaKitty> You should really start to :P

L483[10:25:48] ⇦ Quits: surferconor425|Cloud (uid77899@id-77899.tooting.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)

L484[10:26:03] <gamax92> Nah I'm fine

L485[10:29:24] <Mimiru> Sangar, java.lang.IllegalArgumentException: unsupported viewport resolution

L486[10:29:27] <Mimiru> \o/

L487[10:29:36] <Mimiru> Oh.. Received a badly formatted packet.

L488[10:29:44] <Mimiru> then unsupported res

L489[10:29:50] <Sangar> wat

L490[10:30:10] <Sangar> how do you manage to get these, i couldn't reproduce it (and didn't get that either)

L491[10:30:14] <gamax92> see, nobody likes viewport

L492[10:30:19] <gamax92> not even Java

L493[10:30:21] ⇨ Joins: Jezza (~Jezza@185.44.151.105)

L494[10:30:40] <Mimiru> Sangar, http://hastebin.com/inefajayuq.hs full crash

L495[10:30:50] <Mimiru> wait

L496[10:30:53] <Mimiru> yes...

L497[10:30:54] <Mimiru> that's it

L498[10:30:57] <Mimiru> that's the crash

L499[10:30:59] <Mimiru> but theres more

L500[10:31:29] <Mimiru> http://hastebin.com/luyaficuta.hs is spammed to the console

L501[10:31:29] <EnderBot2> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anwy2MPT5RE

L502[10:32:14] <gamax92> but wait, there's more?

L503[10:32:33] <Sangar> huh. custom resolution set?

L504[10:32:51] <Sangar> if so, what? also on what screen tier?

L505[10:32:54] <Mimiru> Shouldn't be... I was looking at a /oc_sc spawned computer

L506[10:32:56] <Mimiru> so T2

L507[10:32:59] <Sangar> o.O

L508[10:33:09] <Sangar> why do i not get this :/

L509[10:33:24] <DeanIsaKitty> Mimiru / Snagar, Java version differences maybe?

L510[10:33:40] <Sangar> that's... super unlikely :P

L511[10:34:01] <DeanIsaKitty> Well, Its Java... Compile once .. Debug everytime again.

L512[10:34:10] <Mimiru> :P

L513[10:35:01] ⇦ Quits: AlexisMachina (uid57631@id-57631.charlton.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)

L514[10:36:14] *** Keridos|away is now known as Keridos

L515[10:38:14] <Sangar> \o/ suddenly reproducable. i don't even

L516[10:38:24] <gamax92> D: no no no

L517[10:38:25] * Mimiru turboshrugs

L518[10:38:27] <gamax92> viewport must be dead

L519[10:38:39] * Sangar deads gamax92

L520[10:38:47] * gamax92 dies to death

L521[10:38:55] * DeanIsaKitty revives gamax92

L522[10:39:01] <Sangar> noo

L523[10:39:04] <Sangar> undeads if anything

L524[10:39:16] <gamax92> !deads

L525[10:39:23] <DeanIsaKitty> Sangar: I'm a medic, not a mad doctor, sorry <.<

L526[10:40:21] <gamax92> question: USER/PASS systems that tell you which was wrong, or ones that just tell you something was wrong

L527[10:41:07] <DeanIsaKitty> which was wrong lets people extract usernames, make brute force far easier & ppl use the same password so you can do a reverse lookup if you cracked one.

L528[10:41:32] <gamax92> exactly my reasoning, I don't entirely understand why it exists

L529[10:42:18] <DeanIsaKitty> Because lusers want useability and comfort over security.

L530[11:01:22] <Sangar> Mimiru, please try again with the next build!

L531[11:01:25] <Sangar> i'm hopeful

L532[11:01:34] <Mimiru> Sangar, it'll be a few, but will do

L533[11:01:42] <Sangar> thanks

L534[11:03:22] ⇦ Quits: GUIpsp (~GUIpsp@c-75-73-112-194.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) (Ping timeout: 186 seconds)

L535[11:08:49] ⇨ Joins: GUIpsp (~GUIpsp@c-75-73-112-194.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)

L536[11:12:47] <Mimiru> Testing now Sangar

L537[11:15:09] <Mimiru> Sangar, no crashy crashy

L538[11:15:54] <sugoi> holy crap, it's Sangar

L539[11:16:01] <Mimiru> Yep \o/ works

L540[11:17:23] <gamax92> sugoi: you did see this btw, right? https://gist.github.com/iamgreaser/8d5aa475497fde68ae72

L541[11:17:40] <sugoi> i'm actually reading github notifications atm

L542[11:17:43] <sugoi> that's on the list

L543[11:17:45] <sugoi> not there yet

L544[11:20:41] <sugoi> Vexatos: hi

L545[11:20:49] ⇨ Joins: Dimensional (~kvirc@40.134.242.242)

L546[11:21:02] <sugoi> gamax92: nvm, that was not on the list :) ok, reading that

L547[11:21:45] <Vexatos> .-.

L548[11:22:25] <sugoi> gamax92: that is a great start. i'm actually working on one myself

L549[11:22:30] <sugoi> Vexatos: i've been thinking about term

L550[11:22:34] <sugoi> and the big multi term thing

L551[11:22:42] <sugoi> i think "we"'ve gone about this all wrong

L552[11:22:50] <sugoi> let me explain...

L553[11:23:01] <gamax92> sugoi: I didn't write that :P

L554[11:23:15] <sugoi> gamax92: i didn't mean to imply i thought you did, thanks greaser|q (i assume)

L555[11:24:34] <sugoi> Vexatos: i think term should be considered just another io driver, like file io, but to screen and keyboard. there could be a term manager lib, secondary to term lib, that can be loaded to handle multiple terms, floating terms, etc

L556[11:25:04] <Vexatos> hmm

L557[11:25:09] <sugoi> but the default term, like the default stdout stdin, is "opened" on the primary gpu and keyboard

L558[11:25:21] <sugoi> just like io.open, we could provide term.open (or similar)

L559[11:25:51] <sugoi> to provide creating sub terms, but, i'd put the work back to mpmxyz to make a term manager

L560[11:27:12] ⇨ Joins: mpmxyz (webchat@p4FEC766B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)

L561[11:27:14] <sugoi> anyways, this way i could make term very simple, and any further advances would need to be in a /lib/termmgr.lua or somesuch

L562[11:27:24] <mpmxyz> Good evening!

L563[11:27:31] <sugoi> mpmxyz: welcome!

L564[11:27:33] <sugoi> :)

L565[11:27:38] <sugoi> mpmxyz: i'm payonel

L566[11:28:01] <mpmxyz> Ah.

L567[11:28:26] <mpmxyz> I wouldn't have found you. ;-)

L568[11:28:39] <sugoi> Vexatos: also, i'm down to 74,750 bytes free on boot (that's 181,250 allocated)

L569[11:29:14] <Vexatos> mhm

L570[11:29:17] <sugoi> and it's a good low ram boot, MOST users won't load in the delayed items

L571[11:29:48] <Sangar> Mimiru, hooray!

L572[11:29:56] <sugoi> Sangar: welcome back :)

L573[11:29:57] <Sangar> sugoi, heya, yeah, i'm alive again, more or less :P

L574[11:30:06] ⇨ Joins: sciguyryan (~sciguyrya@37.48.81.227)

L575[11:30:06] <Sangar> will work through mails in a bit

L576[11:30:22] <Vexatos> OC 1.6 when :3

L577[11:30:32] <gamax92> never

L578[11:30:32] <sugoi> Sangar, mpmxyz: so i think mpmxyz and I should discuss a different approach to multi term

L579[11:30:39] <Vexatos> "you know you are slow when Computronics goes 1.8 before you do"

L580[11:31:05] <Vexatos> .openprg

L581[11:31:05] <Inari> Sangar: were you ill or something?

L582[11:31:16] <Vexatos> Inari, it's called addiction

L583[11:31:20] <Vexatos> you know

L584[11:31:21] <Sangar> Inari, nah, just needed a break from mc

L585[11:31:24] <Vexatos> sitting there, coding OC

L586[11:31:28] <Vexatos> and suddenly Diablo

L587[11:31:39] <Inari> what abuot diablo

L588[11:31:48] <mpmxyz> sugoi: What's your idea?

L589[11:31:51] <Sangar> well, d3 i was done with in < one week :P then came the unity side project

L590[11:31:53] <^v4> Vexatos, http://v4.pixeltoast.tk/paste/X2Rpf.html

L591[11:31:54] <Inari> slashdiablo resets on feb 12

L592[11:32:02] <Inari> d3 isnt worht to play and d2 bnet is pointless

L593[11:32:03] <Sangar> then catching up with series :P

L594[11:32:03] <sugoi> mpmxyz: these thoughts kept me up much of the night :) but i feel i cam to an epiphany

L595[11:32:15] <Sangar> d3 is actually a lot of fun by now

L596[11:32:20] <Sangar> in short bursts :X

L597[11:32:37] <Inari> eh, disagree :p and only if they'd finally add anoptjon to turn of mob flashing i would try again

L598[11:32:45] <Inari> d2 <3

L599[11:32:50] <Inari> Sangar: what side project? ;o

L600[11:32:53] <Sangar> mob flashing?

L601[11:33:07] <sugoi> mpmxyz: anyways, term should be thought of as an io driver for the screen&keyboard

L602[11:33:12] <Inari> mobs flashing white when you hit them ors o

L603[11:33:28] <sugoi> mpmxyz: it should be as simple as a file descriptor you get from io.open

L604[11:33:32] ⇦ Quits: Jezza (~Jezza@185.44.151.105) (Ping timeout: 189 seconds)

L605[11:33:34] <Sangar> i... couldn't say. too many mobs and pfx :P

L606[11:33:40] <Vexatos> sugoi, term.main?

L607[11:33:47] <Inari> well its incredibly annoying /disorienting when you notice

L608[11:33:47] <Vexatos> and not as a function, as a field

L609[11:33:50] <Inari> esp with e.g. belial

L610[11:33:51] <Vexatos> using metatable

L611[11:33:55] <sugoi> and just like stdin/stdout - the system gets a default one

L612[11:33:57] <Sangar> Inari, side project: https://youtu.be/4DDun-5LA74

L613[11:34:04] <Vexatos> what do you think?

L614[11:34:53] <sugoi> Vexatos: i'd rather process data keep the term, just like process data keeps stdin/stdout

L615[11:35:14] <sugoi> and then all child procs inherit the same term

L616[11:35:27] <Inari> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQSd0LkzRcI#t=2m05s <- belial lightshow

L617[11:35:28] <MichiBot> Inari: Diablo III: Act 2 Final Boss Battle - Belial | length: 3m 11s | Likes: 48 Dislikes: 4 Views: 49912 | by m0rph

L618[11:35:30] <sugoi> but term.main as a shortcut to what io calls core_stdout and core_Stdin, that'd be fine

L619[11:35:40] <Vexatos> well I'd guess term.main woudl be like io.stdout

L620[11:36:01] <sugoi> anyways, mpmxyz - multi term and x,y,w,h based terms, are cool

L621[11:36:11] <sugoi> mpmxyz: but i dont think term should manage them

L622[11:36:16] <Inari> Sangar: marshing cubes?

L623[11:36:19] <Sangar> Inari, huh, never noticed that :X too many other effects i guess

L624[11:36:23] <Sangar> Inari, yes

L625[11:36:34] <mpmxyz> Where should it that managed?

L626[11:36:35] <Inari> nice

L627[11:36:47] <Inari> any reason fro the fog?

L628[11:36:50] <mpmxyz> *Where should that be managed?

L629[11:36:58] <sugoi> mpmxyz: /lib/termmgr.lua <- that's where you could take care of focus, and swaping

L630[11:37:12] <Gavle> what is the difference between a managed and unmanaged HDD?

L631[11:37:16] <sugoi> mpmxyz: a term is 'in focus' when it is run, when its coroutine is running

L632[11:37:28] ⇨ Joins: Kodos (webchat@108-226-6-195.lightspeed.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net)

L633[11:37:28] zsh sets mode: +v on Kodos

L634[11:37:39] <Kodos> o/

L635[11:37:43] <mpmxyz> What is term then?

L636[11:37:44] <sugoi> and keep a list of all terms could be in a termmgr

L637[11:37:55] <sugoi> mpmxyz: to the user, same as io

L638[11:37:58] <sugoi> just like i say io.read

L639[11:38:10] <sugoi> but what does that really mean? the system is manageing a std term

L640[11:38:15] <sugoi> can i open a new term? yes

L641[11:38:18] <sugoi> term.open

L642[11:38:26] <sugoi> and that could be a floating, sub term

L643[11:38:31] <sugoi> attached to a new gpu, or an existing one

L644[11:38:35] <sugoi> a new screen, or an existingo ne

L645[11:38:48] <sugoi> but I (a user script) would manage that term

L646[11:38:55] <gamax92> sugoi: here's a question.

L647[11:38:59] <sugoi> just like I (a user script) would manage the fd i get from io.open

L648[11:39:12] <sugoi> gamax92: ok

L649[11:39:12] <gamax92> sugoi: how fast does an exclamation mark have to flash to properly get your user's attention?

L650[11:39:40] <sugoi> haha, .25<x<.5 s ?

L651[11:39:52] <sugoi> maybe closer to .25

L652[11:39:57] <gamax92> probably not .5 ...

L653[11:40:02] <gamax92> 2Hz :P

L654[11:40:06] <sugoi> ha

L655[11:40:23] <gamax92> I'll use 8

L656[11:40:40] <sugoi> mpmxyz: so i'd do all the term changes i am proposing, then you'd start consuming it for termmgr

L657[11:41:06] <sugoi> mpmxyz: this is just my proposal, i really think my idea is getting close to the RIGHT answer, but your feedback is of course what i'm looking for :)

L658[11:41:39] <sugoi> mpmxyz: getting "naive" user scripts to use the "current" active term can be done just like io.write/read "just work"

L659[11:41:50] <sugoi> and i'll make sure that works

L660[11:41:54] <Skye> sugoi, what about edit.lua

L661[11:41:58] <sugoi> because that's probably more my area

L662[11:42:05] <sugoi> Skye: what about it?

L663[11:42:13] <gamax92> optimize edit :P

L664[11:42:16] <Skye> it uses GPU stuff, IIRC

L665[11:42:29] <sugoi> yeah and probably it should go through term

L666[11:42:32] <sugoi> Skye: that's a good point

L667[11:42:34] <sugoi> so does more

L668[11:42:39] <sugoi> i have those on my list to review

L669[11:42:40] <gamax92> why would it go through term >_>

L670[11:42:47] <gamax92> more sure, but edit no

L671[11:42:59] <sugoi> gamax92: rather than getting gpu directly

L672[11:43:13] <Skye> sugoi, maybe emulate the GPU?

L673[11:43:18] <sugoi> think of term (the next term, not the current) like stdout/stdin

L674[11:43:19] <Skye> :P

L675[11:43:37] <sugoi> Skye: so that gpu is really a handle for the "current" gpu?

L676[11:43:39] <gamax92> sugoi: isn't that what it currently is?

L677[11:43:43] <sugoi> defined by the current "term" ?

L678[11:43:51] <mpmxyz> sugoi: So if I do io.write or print it would forward to a term object and this term object would forward the data to a window manager?

L679[11:44:13] <mpmxyz> *term manager

L680[11:44:13] <sugoi> gamax92: gpu doesn't switch like io stdout can switch, that's kind of what i'm trying to work towards

L681[11:44:25] <Skye> sugoi, well, so that old programs can run without taking over the whole screen

L682[11:44:34] <sugoi> Skye: very good poin

L683[11:44:35] <sugoi> t

L684[11:44:40] <Skye> make the wrapper minimal

L685[11:44:44] <gamax92> virtual terminals :D

L686[11:44:50] <gamax92> I'm kidding

L687[11:44:59] <Skye> so by default, you can just forward stuff to the real GPU

L688[11:45:10] <Skye> so greaser|q's demos still work

L689[11:45:16] <sugoi> mpmxyz: in openos 1.6, ALL writes already getted piped correctly, and stdout on the tty goes to term.drawText

L690[11:45:32] <sugoi> Skye: yeah

L691[11:45:42] <sugoi> mpmxyz: also, no idea what "getted" is :)

L692[11:45:47] <sugoi> i was editing my text as i wrote

L693[11:45:54] <Skye> but, if there are more than one term side by side, emulate the GPU

L694[11:46:16] <gamax92> I still fail to see why edit would have to be through this, sure edit could ask term what GPU to work on, but then for performance sake, have it just access the GPU directly

L695[11:46:48] <Skye> gamax92, but you can have two programs running side by side

L696[11:47:14] <sugoi> gamax92: i'm just saying, just like a process doesn't know if stdout is term, or if stdout is a file ... a user script should "just work"

L697[11:47:35] <gamax92> Skye: cool, but does a linux terminal do this, or the shell?

L698[11:47:42] <gamax92> no you throw something like screen or tmux up to do that

L699[11:47:50] <gamax92> it doesn't have to be a built in feature of the shell

L700[11:47:55] <gamax92> or the terminal

L701[11:47:56] <sugoi> right+++

L702[11:47:59] <Skye> gamax92, it's not part of the shell

L703[11:48:00] <sugoi> that's my issue

L704[11:48:04] <sugoi> i agree gamax92

L705[11:48:07] <gamax92> Skye: "or the terminal"

L706[11:48:14] <Skye> but

L707[11:48:16] <sugoi> thats why i want term management out of term

L708[11:48:26] <Skye> it should be made easy to be abstract it away

L709[11:48:35] *** kirby|gone is now known as mrkirby153

L710[11:48:49] <sugoi> yeah, Skye -- and i'll do that by making term api (e.g. term.open)

L711[11:49:24] <sugoi> now, where to store the "current" term for a process, maybe process.data (JUST LIKE io is currently done)

L712[11:49:53] <sugoi> but swapping io stdin stdout is NOT handled by /lib/io

L713[11:49:57] <sugoi> in fact, the shell does that

L714[11:50:03] <sugoi> or popen too

L715[11:50:06] <sugoi> but io doesn't care

L716[11:50:10] <sugoi> i want the same for term

L717[11:51:24] <gamax92> I wish I could tell steam to fuck off and just let me install something regardless of platform

L718[11:51:32] <sugoi> mpmxyz: so io.write, io.stdout():write, io.output():write, term.write -- all call term.drawText (when stdout is default)

L719[11:51:50] <mpmxyz> Do i understand it correctly that this change basically makes terms to streams? And that the visualization is moved to another place?

L720[11:52:15] <sugoi> that sounds correct

L721[11:52:22] <gamax92> huh that reminds me I need to go look at that in lua

L722[11:52:38] <sugoi> mpmxyz: so my thinking, let me start a new term, and then i'll share it with you to start your new termmgr (or whatever you want to call it)

L723[11:52:57] <sugoi> mpmxyz: but note that termmgr would not be loaded by boot

L724[11:53:01] ⇦ Quits: cpup (~cpup@32.218.118.27) (Ping timeout: 194 seconds)

L725[11:53:07] <sugoi> not until a user wants to use it, requires it

L726[11:53:14] <sugoi> mpmxyz: and then just ping me with api issues

L727[11:53:38] <mpmxyz> And how do you see something on the screen in the first place?

L728[11:53:39] <sugoi> mpmxyz: similar to how stdout is "default" until you pipe processes (e.g. via popen or via shell prompt)

L729[11:53:57] <sugoi> mpmxyz: the "core_term" is a full screen term

L730[11:54:05] <sugoi> on the primary components

L731[11:54:14] <sugoi> but term won't "manage" switching or adding

L732[11:54:23] <sugoi> nor will it care about "focus"

L733[11:54:33] <gamax92> io.input?

L734[11:54:53] <mpmxyz> Will be done by term manager.

L735[11:55:04] <mpmxyz> Or the default term.

L736[11:55:13] <mpmxyz> (ignore my fast words...)

L737[11:55:21] <sugoi> what is the question?

L738[11:55:34] <mpmxyz> In the default mode there won't be the concept of a "focus".

L739[11:55:51] <mpmxyz> It is introduced by the term manager.

L740[11:55:52] <gamax92> so io.write(), io.read(), io.input():read(), io.output():write(), io.stdin:read(), io.stdout:write(), and term.write

L741[11:56:08] <gamax92> term.read may be a thing, don't remember

L742[11:56:15] <Gavle> it is

L743[11:56:20] <sugoi> gamax92: it is a thing, in this rework i'm going to look at making it play nice

L744[11:56:41] *** Keridos is now known as Keridos|away

L745[11:56:56] <gamax92> sugoi: oh don't mind me, was just reading liolib.c

L746[11:56:58] <DeanIsaKitty> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtQUJMBH8uE :3

L747[11:57:00] <MichiBot> DeanIsaKitty: Adele - Hello (metal cover by Leo Moracchioli) | length: 6m 3s | Likes: 141579 Dislikes: 3423 Views: 7231714 | by Frog Leap Studios

L748[11:57:07] <sugoi> gamax92: oh i see

L749[11:57:23] <sugoi> mpmxyz: yes

L750[11:57:34] <gamax92> which ... the standard streams also apparently cannot be closed?

L751[11:57:36] <sugoi> mpmxyz: if you feel you need "focus" that should be termmgr

L752[11:57:47] <sugoi> gamax92: yes

L753[11:57:56] <gamax92> yeah, it spats "cannot close standard file"

L754[11:58:38] <sugoi> mpmxyz: but "focus" might just be process.data.term

L755[11:58:56] <sugoi> i want to build more of this code out before i commit to that detail

L756[11:59:18] ⇨ Joins: cpup (~cpup@32.218.119.214)

L757[11:59:23] <sugoi> mpmxyz: also, "termmgr" is _my_ name for it, feel free to name it how you like

L758[12:00:21] <mpmxyz> I'm currently thinking about the bigger pictures: multiple programs running in parallel

L759[12:00:42] <mpmxyz> I'd like to avoid redundant implementations of similar ideas.

L760[12:01:01] <sugoi> mpmxyz: yes, which is why i think we should work together on this rework

L761[12:01:10] <sugoi> i'll write the initial term code, and have you consume and review it

L762[12:01:48] <mpmxyz> If the concept of a "focus" is in the term manager, how does edit.lua know which events it should listen to?

L763[12:02:07] <sugoi> by "listen" do you literally mean event.listen ?

L764[12:02:11] <sugoi> or event.pull ?

L765[12:02:27] <mpmxyz> Both are valid.

L766[12:02:35] <sugoi> but imo...they can't both be valid

L767[12:02:43] <sugoi> maybe - but

L768[12:03:06] <sugoi> my first thought is, event.listen is looow level, if a script really wants to know about everything, they they're going to "hear" other process events

L769[12:03:23] <gamax92> computer.pullSignal is lower :3

L770[12:03:31] <sugoi> :)

L771[12:03:50] <sugoi> mpmxyz: but a process can just use term api naively

L772[12:04:00] <sugoi> and the "current" term will be given

L773[12:04:05] <gamax92> something that does multi processes should also be overwriting the event api to separate certain events

L774[12:04:08] <sugoi> termmgr is in charge of creating MORE terms

L775[12:04:18] <sugoi> but we can use metatable redirection to grab the correct term

L776[12:04:19] <Kodos> Alll the terms

L777[12:04:35] <gamax92> Kodos: study them hard, quiz next week

L778[12:04:41] <Kodos> Ugh

L779[12:04:45] <Kodos> I haven't even had my caffeine for the day

L780[12:04:48] <Kodos> And you spring a quiz on me

L781[12:05:07] <Kodos> Lucky for me, I found 3 bucks, so that's another fountain today whenever I have dinner

L782[12:05:40] <sugoi> mpmxyz: think of stdout -- io doesn't know about multiple streams, it just uses the process data's stdout

L783[12:05:45] <gamax92> I can't get this patcher to work on system for some reason, but it works if I tell it to make a separate file that I can have the os migrate into the system

L784[12:05:55] <sugoi> mpmxyz: and io has no "io mgr", the shell code does

L785[12:06:56] <sugoi> which, btw, is all delay loaded :)

L786[12:08:46] <sugoi> mpmxyz: so if i use process data ( i think i will ) then /boot/term will create a fullscreen term (term.open) and assign it to process.data.term

L787[12:09:17] <sugoi> then (maybe, thinking this through) all term api will first get the current term via process.data as well (which is what io.write does to get stdout)

L788[12:09:53] <mpmxyz> Is the term just one stream or multiple streams?

L789[12:10:03] <sugoi> it's a r/w stream

L790[12:10:07] <sugoi> i dont see a need for multiple

L791[12:10:11] <sugoi> do you you see a need?

L792[12:10:28] <mpmxyz> in, out, err

L793[12:10:32] <gamax92> I see the light, it tells me to dump boot.img and edit the kernel cmdline

L794[12:10:32] <gamax92> brb

L795[12:10:38] <mpmxyz> I'm just asking.

L796[12:10:51] <sugoi> hmmm

L797[12:10:56] <Kodos> So, can someone get me up to speed on the current discussion

L798[12:11:13] <sugoi> Kodos: /lib/term.lua rewrite

L799[12:11:47] <sugoi> Kodos: separating out "multiple term management" from "default boot fullscreen term"

L800[12:11:53] <Gavle> I have an issue

L801[12:11:55] <sugoi> and thinking of lib/term more like a file stream

L802[12:12:05] <sugoi> mpmxyz: my thinking is for err, no

L803[12:12:10] <gamax92> s/a i/a ti/

L804[12:12:16] <gamax92> ... fuck you kibi

L805[12:12:24] <Gavle> I'm trying to do f:write("local rc = require("rc")")

L806[12:12:27] <sugoi> mpmxyz: io fds are scalable for any number of fds, the user can create more

L807[12:12:35] <Gavle> and it says that there is a missing ) near rc

L808[12:12:42] <gamax92> Gavle: escape your quotes

L809[12:12:48] <Gavle> what?

L810[12:12:56] <gamax92> either use '' or [[]] for the outer ones, or put backslashes behind the inner ones

L811[12:13:07] <Gavle> ah, thank you

L812[12:13:13] <mpmxyz> sugoi: stdout == stdin == stderr as default?

L813[12:13:49] <sugoi> mpmxyz: well right now, stderr is just a stream that changes foreground font color then calls term.drawText

L814[12:13:50] <Gavle> most wonderful Mr. gamax92, it worked

L815[12:14:01] <sugoi> so there is no "err term"

L816[12:14:17] <sugoi> mpmxyz: also, right now, i have no way for the user to redirect stderr

L817[12:14:24] <sugoi> mpmxyz: unless they know how process.data works

L818[12:14:26] <gamax92> make sure you properly change color and unchange.

L819[12:14:29] <Gavle> crap

L820[12:14:36] <Gavle> I have a corrupted boot script

L821[12:14:48] <sugoi> gamax92: aye

L822[12:14:54] <gamax92> unlike Sangar >_.

L823[12:15:07] <Kodos> o_O

L824[12:15:20] *** rakiru|offline is now known as Kasen

L825[12:15:21] <sugoi> well, i didn't change the existing code, are you saying i should pcall the drawText :)

L826[12:15:25] <sugoi> that'd probably be a good idea

L827[12:15:28] <gamax92> sugoi: no

L828[12:15:31] <sugoi> gamax92: ok?

L829[12:15:50] <gamax92> before (dunno if it's been fixed) term would change your foreground color setting

L830[12:16:02] <mpmxyz> Gavle: use an OpenOS disk for your rescue. (temporarily remove your hdd during booting)

L831[12:16:15] <Gavle> mpmxyz, yep

L832[12:16:16] <gamax92> so it'd go from saying (I'm a palette color) to I'm a #RRGGBB color that happens to match the palette entry

L833[12:17:21] * Gavle flips table

L834[12:17:30] <sugoi> i dont know the right fix for that :)

L835[12:17:30] <DeanIsaKitty> %flip gamax92

L836[12:17:32] <MichiBot> DeanIsaKitty: (╯°□°）╯︵ⵒ6xɐɯɐɓ

L837[12:17:45] <Gavle> if you preceed a file with a . it places it in front of all the other files

L838[12:17:52] <gamax92> ˙noʎ pןnoɔ ʍoɥ

L839[12:17:59] <Gavle> which means my boot script loads before the libs it needs

L840[12:18:15] <gamax92> Gavle: correct

L841[12:18:35] <Gavle> this is annoying

L842[12:18:40] <sugoi> mpmxyz: i'll consider multiple term fds

L843[12:18:49] <gamax92> then don't put the file with a dot in the beginning?

L844[12:18:54] <mpmxyz> setForeground/setBackground also return the palette index

L845[12:19:02] ⇦ Quits: Keanu73OC (~keanu73oc@ns310999.ip-94-23-41.eu) (Remote host closed the connection)

L846[12:19:18] <gamax92> right, it was setForeground

L847[12:19:27] <Gavle> gamax92, I want the file with a dot in the beginning

L848[12:19:36] <gamax92> Gavle: then suffer the consequences

L849[12:19:38] <sugoi> mpmxyz: how do you feel about this?

L850[12:19:47] <Gavle> ugh

L851[12:19:48] <Gavle> fine

L852[12:20:41] <sugoi> mpmxyz: also, is there an email i should use? you can email me at payonel@hotmail.com

L853[12:20:59] <sugoi> mpmxyz: or should/can we just make a separate github issue in your fork to discuss/collaborate

L854[12:21:36] <Gavle> whoo

L855[12:21:39] <mpmxyz> sugoi: Just let me create a n email address...

L856[12:21:40] <Gavle> I fixed it

L857[12:22:27] <sugoi> mpmxyz: if you dont already have an anon email or such, github issue discussion on your fork sounds like a simple idea

L858[12:22:43] <sugoi> i wouldn't want to use a new email addy for you just for this :)

L859[12:22:51] <sugoi> but, it's your choice, of course

L860[12:24:31] * Lizzy boops DeanIsaKitty

L861[12:24:41] <mpmxyz> Let's do it on github. My E-Mail provider doesn't give me the option to work on the account settings without Javascript...

L862[12:24:56] * DeanIsaKitty boops Lizzy

L863[12:24:59] <gamax92> sugoi: pshu flei at teh sakct tpo (to be rtrednue), cetear mttbelaae fro flei hnlseda

L864[12:25:00] <Lizzy> \o/

L865[12:25:22] <Gavle> well, my file works now

L866[12:26:09] ⇨ Joins: surferconor425|Cloud (uid77899@id-77899.tooting.irccloud.com)

L867[12:26:51] <Gavle> time to break it some more

L868[12:26:55] <Gavle> *ahem* work on it

L869[12:27:17] * Saphire long ago stopped trying to keep track of this channel and people there

L870[12:27:29] <gamax92> Saphire: you're one to talk

L871[12:27:41] <Saphire> ?

L872[12:28:06] <sugoi> mpmxyz: https://gist.github.com/iamgreaser/8d5aa475497fde68ae72

L873[12:28:15] <sugoi> mpmxyz: comment on it, we'll discuss there

L874[12:28:35] <sugoi> (comment on it / +watch)

L875[12:29:50] <sugoi> mpmxyz: sorry wow

L876[12:29:52] <sugoi> wrong clipboard

L877[12:29:58] <sugoi> https://github.com/payonel/OpenComputers/issues/1

L878[12:31:06] <sugoi> ok i have to run now (afk)

L879[12:31:07] * Gavle looks at ls.lua

L880[12:31:16] * Gavle dies under the weight of code

L881[12:31:28] <sugoi> Gavle: ls openos 1.5 had some issues with .prefix

L882[12:31:39] <sugoi> ls for openos 1.6 is smarter and correct

L883[12:31:49] <Gavle> it did?

L884[12:31:51] <Gavle> what issues?

L885[12:32:15] <sugoi> i dont recall it all, i've been working on this stuff for months and i finished ls a while ago

L886[12:32:30] ⇨ Joins: AlexisMachina (uid57631@id-57631.charlton.irccloud.com)

L887[12:32:40] <sugoi> Gavle: what in ls were you hoping to find?

L888[12:32:59] <Gavle> sugoi, I was just poking around with how it displays files beginning with .

L889[12:33:23] <sugoi> Gavle: filesystem.list(path) doesn't care about . -- i.e. it'll return them all the same

L890[12:33:33] <Gavle> ok

L891[12:33:39] <sugoi> openos 1.6 ls does not display them, unless you -a, --all

L892[12:33:49] <Gavle> same with openOS 1.5

L893[12:33:53] <sugoi> i dont remember the nuances of the old ls

L894[12:34:21] <Gavle> I'm just poking around in the code

L895[12:34:40] <sugoi> coo, well, i'm out

L896[12:34:41] <sugoi> o/

L897[12:34:43] * sugoi is afk

L898[12:35:23] <Gavle> I think I found what I'm looking for, but I need to understand how it works XD

L899[12:38:27] <Gavle> and my first two random stabs failed

L900[12:38:34] <Gavle> so I actually have to understand it now XD

L901[12:41:41] <Kodos> Welcome to what was my world 2 years ago, Gavle

L902[12:41:56] <Gavle> :)

L903[12:42:04] <Gavle> Do you know how ls.lua works perchance?

L904[12:43:29] <Kodos> In what context?

L905[12:43:55] <Gavle> I want to add a slight edit so that a particular file would remain invisible

L906[12:44:05] <Kodos> Why not prefix it with .

L907[12:44:11] <Kodos> Or are you wanting to make a completely hidden file

L908[12:44:18] <Gavle> because that would place it first, and that would break it

L909[12:44:28] <Kodos> Place it first? What do you mean

L910[12:44:51] <Gavle> if I do .101_whee, it would appear first in the /boot directory

L911[12:45:02] <Gavle> which would load it before the libraries 101_whee needs to work

L912[12:45:06] <gamax92> Kodos: on the ascii table, . has a lower value than numbers and letters, and therefor gets sorted first

L913[12:45:33] <Gavle> so, I want to patch ls.lua so that whee.lua doesn't show up

L914[12:45:47] <Kodos> Hm

L915[12:45:50] <Kodos> Let me fire up my MC

L916[12:45:54] <Kodos> What OC version are you using

L917[12:46:39] <gamax92> Gavle: https://github.com/MightyPirates/OpenComputers/blob/master-MC1.7.10/src/main/resources/assets/opencomputers/loot/OpenOS/bin/ls.lua#L49

L918[12:46:59] <gamax92> you'd change that from (else) to (elseif f ~= "whee.lua")

L919[12:47:36] <Gavle> Kodos 1.7.10 21.41

L920[12:47:45] <Gavle> gamax92, let me check to see if it works

L921[12:48:00] ⇨ Joins: Doty1154 (~Doty1154@2601:648:8002:c1a1:bcde:2227:1e7c:5f29)

L922[12:48:04] <Kodos> Okay, so 1.5 OC

L923[12:48:08] ⇦ Quits: Doty1154 (~Doty1154@2601:648:8002:c1a1:bcde:2227:1e7c:5f29) (Remote host closed the connection)

L924[12:48:48] <Kodos> (I'm still waking up so pretend I typed out enormous praise for 1.6 here, along with instructions to download the dev builds, link in the topic)

L925[12:49:28] ⇨ Joins: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com)

L926[12:49:37] <gamax92> wow Kodos, such enormous praise for 1.6, thanks for telling me where to get the builds

L927[12:50:20] <Kodos> https://gyazo.com/6d7f415a660bf97dbba0b4710c214aa3

L928[12:50:35] <Gavle> gamx92, it worked!

L929[12:50:41] * Gavle cheers

L930[12:50:47] <gamax92> Gavle: but do you understand why?

L931[12:50:50] <Gavle> thank you for your help too Kodos

L932[12:51:01] <Gavle> gamax92, I'm going to examine why now

L933[12:51:01] * Kodos is too tired to understand what he did

L934[12:51:08] <Gavle> Kodos, you tried

L935[12:51:13] <Gavle> that's what you did

L936[12:51:29] <Kodos> Gavle: If you need what gamax told you to do ELI5'd, let me know

L937[12:51:31] <Kodos> That much I can do

L938[12:51:39] <Gavle> ELI5'd?

L939[12:51:46] <Kodos> Explain Like I'm 5

L940[12:51:49] <Kodos> aka layman's terms

L941[12:51:58] <gamax92> Gavle: ls.lua gets a list of files (local list, reason = fs.list(path)) and then sorts them into a list of a directories and a list of files (tsd and tsf)

L942[12:52:27] <Gavle> about what I expected it to do :P

L943[12:52:46] <gamax92> so in the path where it normally goes: if this is a directory then put it in tsd, else tsf. instead of otherwise defaulting to tsf, we also do a check if it's not the file we want to hide

L944[12:53:38] <Kodos> gamax92: Theoretically, could you either A) hide a directory and its contents that way, or B) hide a table of filenames?

L945[12:53:52] <Gavle> Kodos, pretty sure you can hide everything that way XD

L946[12:54:13] <Kodos> Me: 'ls -a' Computer: "No, fuck you."

L947[12:54:41] <Gavle> XD

L948[12:54:58] <Gavle> also, is there a way to append text to a file in the middle?

L949[12:55:07] <Gavle> I'm assuming io.open(file, a)

L950[12:55:15] <Kodos> a just appends to the end

L951[12:55:17] <Kodos> That's what appending is

L952[12:55:21] <Gavle> ah

L953[12:55:33] <Gavle> io.open(file, w)?

L954[12:55:43] <gamax92> that erases your existing file

L955[12:55:44] <Kodos> That, iirc, will overwrite the file

L956[12:55:47] <Kodos> Ya

L957[12:55:51] <Gavle> :|

L958[12:55:58] <Kodos> There's no way that I know of to put it in the middle, without complicated bullshit

L959[12:56:13] <Gavle> "a+": append update mode, previous data is preserved, writing is only allowed at the end of file.

L960[12:56:28] <Gavle> wouldn't that indicate that "a" could do something other than the end?

L961[12:56:36] <Kodos> ~w io.open

L962[12:56:36] <ocdoc> http://www.lua.org/manual/5.2/manual.html#pdf-io.open

L963[12:56:59] <Gavle> that's where I got my quote from :)

L964[12:57:12] <Kodos> %g define append

L965[12:57:14] <MichiBot> Kodos: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/append - Append | Define Append at Dictionary.com: "to add as a supplement, accessory, or appendix; subjoin: to append a note to a

L966[12:57:14] <gamax92> I think that just means you can't seek around

L967[12:57:39] <Gavle> what?

L968[12:57:40] <gamax92> where as with just "a", you could seek to the middle of a file and destroy whatever was there

L969[12:57:47] <Gavle> that's what I want

L970[12:57:56] <gamax92> you sure?

L971[12:58:36] <Gavle> I want to go to the middle of a file, and tack on a small piece of extra info

L972[12:58:43] <gamax92> writing xyz: [abcde|fghijklmnop] -> [abcdexyz|ijklmnop]

L973[12:59:00] <Gavle> uh

L974[12:59:01] <gamax92> note what happened to fgh, it was overwritten.

L975[12:59:10] <Gavle> that's not what I want

L976[12:59:13] <gamax92> exactly.

L977[12:59:16] <Gavle> I want to save fgh

L978[12:59:45] <Gavle> I thought append would let you do that?

L979[13:00:03] <gamax92> I'm not sure how to do that besides reading the entire file, splitting it in two pieces, adding the extra content, and then writing the entire thing again

L980[13:00:14] <Kodos> ^ aforementioned complicated bullshit

L981[13:00:14] <gamax92> lemme check just to be sure though.

L982[13:00:34] <Gavle> ok

L983[13:00:42] <Gavle> thank you for checking gamax92 :)

L984[13:01:20] <gamax92> nope it overwrote

L985[13:01:23] <Gavle> dangit

L986[13:01:28] <Gavle> even in mode a?

L987[13:01:40] <gamax92> yeah

L988[13:01:41] <Gavle> what if it adds to the end of a line?

L989[13:02:06] <Gavle> 99% sure that doesn't make a difference, but *shrug*

L990[13:02:12] <gamax92> Gavle: lines are a terminal idea, files are just blobs of bytes

L991[13:02:25] <gamax92> \n is just a byte, and to a terminal it marks a line

L992[13:02:31] <Gavle> yeah :(

L993[13:02:47] <Gavle> It seems a shame that you can't just add stuffs

L994[13:03:43] <Gavle> and I really don't want to read, split, add, reassemble

L995[13:03:46] <gamax92> to be honest when I did it in mode "a" the seek failed

L996[13:03:59] <Kodos> I still need to update my reactor program and make it fancy

L997[13:04:04] <gamax92> it put fgh at the end of the file, despite me telling it to put it in the middle of the file

L998[13:04:06] <Kodos> Only redrawing the bits that change

L999[13:04:22] <Kodos> gamax92: is that a bug, or a lua limitation

L1000[13:04:38] <gamax92> I ran this from standard lua

L1001[13:05:03] <Kodos> Ah

L1002[13:05:20] <Gavle> :(

L1003[13:05:58] <Kodos> But yeah, I need to update my reactor program, now that light boards work with it

L1004[13:06:28] <Gavle> I should figure out how to read and split this file

L1005[13:07:11] <Mimiru> oh shit...

L1006[13:07:11] <Mimiru> https://scontent-dfw1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfl1/v/t1.0-9/12661913_894960003951506_2690826643765939532_n.png?oh=6f51668923a4b95d2a578fb73e017123&oe=5727910B

L1007[13:12:58] <Gavle> with f:seek, can offset be a negative number?

L1008[13:13:15] <Kodos> Jesus fuck

L1009[13:13:19] <Kodos> CH got rekt

L1010[13:13:27] <gamax92> Gavle: think so

L1011[13:13:33] ⇨ Joins: sivael (webchat@user-31-175-19-143.play-internet.pl)

L1012[13:13:45] <sivael> o/ Hello everyone:)

L1013[13:13:48] <gamax92> hey

L1014[13:14:05] <sivael> I have a problem - I can't seem to be able to turn a robot on by another robot, how do YOu do that?

L1015[13:14:16] <Gavle> you can't

L1016[13:14:18] <gamax92> I don't?

L1017[13:14:40] <sivael> oh. okay

L1018[13:15:16] <sivael> so, how does one robot destroy another robot?

L1019[13:15:21] <Gavle> mine it

L1020[13:15:47] <sivael> hm. tried, but doesn't work. By mining You mean use a pickaxe on the other robot?

L1021[13:15:55] <Gavle> yes

L1022[13:15:59] <Gavle> r.swing()

L1023[13:16:26] <sivael> ah... I was doing .use();

L1024[13:16:31] <sivael> sool.

L1025[13:16:38] <vifino> I'm back!

L1026[13:16:44] * vifino throws himself at Lizzy

L1027[13:16:45] <gamax92> I'm gamax92

L1028[13:16:57] <vifino> gamax92!

L1029[13:17:02] * Lizzy oofs and falls backwards with vifino

L1030[13:17:11] <vifino> :3

L1031[13:17:16] <Lizzy> :3

L1032[13:17:58] <sivael> okay; Then one last thing - can a robot create another robot? - meaning can it fill all the slots in the assembler and create a robot and retrieve it and then place it?

L1033[13:18:17] ⇦ Quits: mpmxyz (webchat@p4FEC766B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Web client closed)

L1034[13:18:58] ⇦ Quits: MrRatermat (~ratermat@host81-131-89-67.range81-131.btcentralplus.com) (Ping timeout: 186 seconds)

L1035[13:19:32] <sivael> *I'm thinking of doing something like a "robot wars" thing wehere two people write programs to their robots and those robots then mine, build more robots etc...

L1036[13:21:12]

<jhagrid7> Hmm that would be cool.

L1037[13:21:42] <Gavle> gamax92, I'm hard at work on splitting files XD

L1038[13:21:44] <Gavle> but I must go

L1039[13:22:16] *** Gavle is now known as Gavle|Away

L1040[13:29:59] <sivael> how can you destroy a drone?

L1041[13:30:34] <gamax92> TNT

L1042[13:31:11] <Mimiru> You break it.

L1043[13:31:13] <Mimiru> :p

L1044[13:32:49] <sivael> uh... tried...

L1045[13:32:52] <sivael> 1mo

L1046[13:32:54] <gamax92> Mimiru: did you integrate the code into the existing class?

L1047[13:33:03] <Inari> sivael: use a scrench?

L1048[13:33:09] <Mimiru> gamax92, wah?

L1049[13:33:33] <sivael> nothing, unless there's a special way of doing that?

L1050[13:33:46] <sivael> ah, shift-scrench

L1051[13:33:55] <Saphire> Heh

L1052[13:34:22] <Saphire> Add that into the tooltip of those new fancy "side tooltip"

L1053[13:34:22] <gamax92> Mimiru: sometimes it's easy to work, like when I was patching Natura, it required me to simply remove two instructions

L1054[13:34:27] <gamax92> and bam bug fixed

L1055[13:34:36] <Mimiru> gamax92, what..?

L1056[13:35:05] <gamax92> when Natura tried to grow a certain type of tree, it would ignore if it actually grew or not and always remove the sapling

L1057[13:35:06] <Mimiru> I feel like I'm missing context.

L1058[13:35:51] <Mimiru> yeah.. I'm just going to go with missing context

L1059[13:36:06] <gamax92> context? what context?

L1060[13:36:07] <Kodos> You know what would be awesome

L1061[13:36:30] <Mimiru> I have no idea what the fuck you're asking me about

L1062[13:36:41] <Mimiru> So.. yes, a lack of context.

L1063[13:36:43] <sivael> Yeah; If I added an API for turning things on/off like computers or robots, would it be a good addition?

L1064[13:37:01] *** Sangar changes topic to 'Forums: https://oc.cil.li/ | Wiki: http://ocd.cil.li/ | Latest version: 1.5.22 | Dev Builds: http://ci.cil.li/ | Channel Rules: https://oc.cil.li/index.php?/topic/171- | Stats: https://www.theender.net/stats/oc.html | Discord: https://discord.gg/0hVukoQ2KYifZFCA'

L1065[13:37:09] <gamax92> oh you're still here Sangar

L1066[13:37:15] <gamax92> please give input to what sivael said

L1067[13:37:23] <Sangar> more like again

L1068[13:37:47] <Sangar> api thing?

L1069[13:38:20] <gamax92> Sangar: if someone leaves and comes back without people knowing, did they really leave at all?

L1070[13:38:30] <Sangar> yes

L1071[13:38:48] <gamax92> :|

L1072[13:39:49] <Sangar> start/stop api, what's wrong with ((MachineHost)blah).machine().start()/stop() ?

L1073[13:40:42] <sivael> well; I'm trying to make a thing, where robots reproduce and mine and all that

L1074[13:40:51] <sivael> and I don't see a way of turning a robot on with another robot

L1075[13:40:56] <Sangar> use

L1076[13:41:00] <Sangar> sneaky use that is

L1077[13:41:06] <sivael> Oh.

L1078[13:41:52] <sivael> good to know:P

L1079[13:42:52] <Sangar> was the easiest and still consistent way :P note that a computer directly adjacent to a robot should be able to power it up via api

L1080[13:42:58] <Sangar> (since players also can do that)

L1081[13:45:56] <sivael> hm. it returned false

L1082[13:46:19] <sivael> ok, now it works, thanks :)

L1083[13:49:13] * Lizzy sighs

L1084[13:49:36] * Inari catches Lizzy's sigh and sells it on ebay

L1085[13:50:00] <Kodos> Sangar, any word on #1594? (I think that's my issue number)

L1086[13:50:03] <Lizzy> not many people are able to make me really angry just by saying something but my step-dad knows how to hit the nail right on the head

L1087[13:50:12] <Kodos> Lizzy: Fuck that guy

L1088[13:50:20] <Lizzy> yup

L1089[13:50:21] <Inari> what did he say Oo

L1090[13:51:14] ⇦ Quits: Negi (~Poireau@2a01:e34:ef13:4150:e2ca:94ff:fe1f:76e0) (Ping timeout: 198 seconds)

L1091[13:51:32] * vifino hugs Lizzy

L1092[13:51:33] <Lizzy> well, my rooms a bit messy at the moment. he comes in here with a condesending tone telling me it's a shithole (it's not, there's a few boxes on the floor, that it) and he wants it to be clean if they put it on the market

L1093[13:51:56] ⇨ Joins: Negi (~Poireau@2a01:e34:ef13:4150:e2ca:94ff:fe1f:76e0)

L1094[13:52:05] <Inari> riiight

L1095[13:52:24] <Inari> sounds like a lovely person :p

L1096[13:52:44] <Lizzy> because someone is totally going to not buy a house because of the contents of one of the current occupants' room

L1097[13:53:17] <Sangar> Kodos, i haven't touched anything mc in the last two weeks, except for finalizing 1.5.22 today, so nothing new :P

L1098[13:53:36] <Inari> luckily i am comparatively lucky with parents :P but i'd still wish mine were better haha

L1099[13:54:12] <Lizzy> my mum's not too bad, she would just ask nicely if i could clean it up at some point

L1100[13:55:02] <Lizzy> I kept my cool though, I know from experience that arguing back is useless because he never fucking listens

L1101[13:55:37] ⇦ Quits: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com) (Quit: geeettttttt dunked on!!!)

L1102[13:56:22] <Saphire> undertale is everywhere, even quit messages :/

L1103[13:56:24] <Lizzy> also the places where my mother and step-dad are thinking of moving if there's one in their price range are not anywhere near to easily get public transport to my workplaces so if/when they do move i'll be going to my dad's

L1104[13:56:32] ⇨ Joins: Anmelax (~alex@176.4.98.247)

L1105[13:57:12] ⇦ Quits: Anmelax (~alex@176.4.98.247) (Client Quit)

L1106[13:58:57] ⇨ Joins: Anleax (~alex@176.4.98.247)

L1107[13:59:22] ⇦ Quits: Anleax (~alex@176.4.98.247) (Client Quit)

L1108[13:59:42] <Lizzy> I need to get an Expences spreadsheet going or something

L1109[14:00:37] ⇦ Quits: sciguyryan (~sciguyrya@37.48.81.227) (Remote host closed the connection)

L1110[14:00:48] <Inari> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18783800/html5test/famf.mp4 i wish my family was more like this haha :P

L1111[14:02:06] <Kodos> Sangar, that's fine, was just wondering :3

L1112[14:02:07] <Lizzy> I have been debating on and off whether to move out of my mother's and go to my dads but i don't want to be a financial burden to him

L1113[14:02:36] <gamemanj> Inari: "at Senpai's house" *immediately gets out the yandere detector just in case*

L1114[14:02:47] <Inari> lol

L1115[14:02:52] <sivael> Heh, thank You all, it is certainly possible to do what I'm aiming to do, so thanks for the help; I'll be doing this one with a friend soon(tm)

L1116[14:03:05] <gamemanj> Inari: Which anime is this, anyway

L1117[14:03:11] <Inari> non non biyori (repeat)

L1118[14:03:56] ⇨ Joins: brandon3055 (~Brandon@122.129.140.1)

L1119[14:05:18] <gamemanj> Inari: well, I didn't see any yandere tendencies apart from the mention of a senpai, which if not meant in a yandere sense is probably something else... hhmmm

L1120[14:09:46] <sivael> can robots have some kind of HP?

L1121[14:10:06] <sivael> and IDK; maybe armor upgrades?

L1122[14:12:05] <Inari> gamemanj: it is :P i mean she makes tons of plushies of her, but not much more really xD

L1123[14:12:36] <gamemanj> "i mean she makes tons of plushies of her, but not much more really xD"

L1124[14:13:01] * gamemanj immediately hears the Yandere Detector going off, danger level 1 (Minimal), yandere level #1.INF

L1125[14:14:51] ⇦ Quits: brandon3055 (~Brandon@122.129.140.1) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

L1126[14:16:23] <gamax92> !

L1127[14:16:28] <gamax92> gamax92: wtf is that #1.INF from

L1128[14:16:34] <gamax92> I've seen this before

L1129[14:17:15] <gamemanj> Everybody knows yandere levels are measured using floating point numbers

L1130[14:24:36] ⇦ Quits: Pixelblox (~Pixelblox@cpc8-roth8-2-0-cust95.17-1.cable.virginm.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

L1131[14:30:26] <Inari> lol

L1132[14:30:52] <Inari> http://i.imgur.com/OQOge71.gif

L1133[14:31:15] <Inari> inb4 thats lizzy, vifino and dean

L1134[14:31:26] <gamemanj> ...

L1135[14:31:35] <gamemanj> Presumably dean would be the cat?

L1136[14:31:45] <vifino> I'm sure DeanIsaKitty loves to watch.

L1137[14:33:35] ⇨ Joins: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com)

L1138[14:34:57] <Inari> http://imgur.com/gallery/ssG8Lvb Oo

L1139[14:36:14] * gamemanj watches in horror as his yandere detector sees the content... and melts

L1140[14:36:38] <Inari> hows that realted to yandere

L1141[14:37:11] <gamemanj> well, think about it... the main character of that gif goes through and chops themself into little pieces

L1142[14:37:17] <gamemanj> just to arrive at the target destination

L1143[14:40:31] ⇨ Joins: Temportalist (uid37180@id-37180.charlton.irccloud.com)

L1144[14:42:32] <Inari> still doesnt sound particularly yandere related

L1145[14:42:33] <Inari> but sure :P

L1146[14:49:37] ⇨ Joins: brandon3055 (~Brandon@122.129.140.1)

L1147[14:49:44] <Skye> beep

L1148[14:49:59] <greaser|q> boop

L1149[14:50:48] <Skye> blop

L1150[14:51:18] <DeanIsaKitty> Inari: ^^

L1151[14:52:23] <Inari> http://imgur.com/gallery/XN9D1IH Oo

L1152[14:53:16] <DeanIsaKitty> What is it with boys being so adverse at homosexuality anyway?

L1153[14:57:18] ⇨ Joins: VanillaBean (~VanillaBe@c-98-232-42-143.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)

L1154[14:57:49] <Turtle> Because 'in general' being gay is seen as showing feelings and not being a manly man

L1155[14:57:55] <Turtle> and men can't show feelings, that'd be weird

L1156[14:58:20] <DeanIsaKitty> Ah

L1157[14:58:51] <vifino> I'm proud to not be a manly man then :D

L1158[14:58:56] * Skye sets society on fire

L1159[14:59:06] * vifino sets fire on fire

L1160[14:59:22] * Skye sets the fire on the fire on fire

L1161[14:59:47] * vifino sets fire on the fire located on the fire on fire

L1162[14:59:54] <sivael> what about the rain?

L1163[14:59:55] <sivael> :P

L1164[15:00:04] * vifino sets rain on fire

L1165[15:00:11] * Skye sets the fire on the rain on fire

L1166[15:01:09] * sivael sets the fire on rain :D

L1167[15:01:19] * vifino sets the Skye on ducktapeovermouth

L1168[15:01:27] <sivael> Also, is it difficult to enable robots to have HP and take damage ?

L1169[15:01:44] <vifino> duct tape, even

L1170[15:01:47] <vifino> duck tape :D

L1171[15:01:50] <Skye> mmmmmmmmmm

L1172[15:01:53] <Skye> ductape

L1173[15:01:55] <Skye> mmmmfff

L1174[15:02:04] * gamemanj attaches a large CRT serial console to vifino, and reads what it says

L1175[15:02:05] * vifino pats Skye

L1176[15:02:12] <Skye> mmmm

L1177[15:02:13] <Skye> ff

L1178[15:02:26] <VanillaBean> hi, i put http://pastebin.com/ZM9z5jFa into usr/bin but I can't access shortCropper from the interactive lua environment, even though I can access other libraries I put in that directory

L1179[15:03:24] <VanillaBean> I assume there's an error somewhere in the file but don't know where

L1180[15:03:47] <Skye> VanillaBean, try to run the file as a program

L1181[15:03:52] <Skye> it will show any errors

L1182[15:04:08] <Skye> also restart the computer

L1183[15:06:45] <VanillaBean> can't find inventory_controller it seems.......<goes to research>

L1184[15:08:07] <sivael> huh. is the robot a tile entity or an entity in world?

L1185[15:14:03] <VanillaBean> is local ic = require("inventory_controller")

L1186[15:14:03] <VanillaBean> incorrect?

L1187[15:16:47] <Kodos> yes

L1188[15:16:50] <Kodos> You're looking for

L1189[15:17:04] <Kodos> local component = require("component") local ic = component.inventory_controller

L1190[15:17:38] <VanillaBean> ok, thanks

L1191[15:17:58] <VanillaBean> that's right, because robot is aliased

L1192[15:18:17] <VanillaBean> so require("robot") works

L1193[15:22:38] <sivael> ok, I've found the answer, a robot is a tileentity which makes it difficult to have any form of "HP" running on them, thanks anyway:)

L1194[15:22:51] <sivael> can two robots communicate if they're adjacent?

L1195[15:23:01] <Kodos> No, but you can use a wireless network card to do it

L1196[15:23:05] <sivael> kk

L1197[15:23:08] <Kodos> Or if you're -just- wanting two, use a linked card

L1198[15:23:19] <Antheus> .-.

L1199[15:23:49] <gamemanj> If you want to waste time, you could transmit your data over bundled cable

L1200[15:24:29] <sivael> the idea is to have "friendly" and "hostile" robots

L1201[15:24:31] <sugoi> if i have 2 screens on a computer, can i point the gpu to a different screen?

L1202[15:24:41] <sugoi> the screens are not a multiblock

L1203[15:24:58] <sivael> and let them "fight"

L1204[15:25:29] <sugoi> ~w gpu

L1205[15:25:29] <ocdoc> http://ocd.cil.li/component:gpu

L1206[15:25:53] <sugoi> hm ok

L1207[15:38:46] ⇦ Quits: Vexatos (~Vexatos@p200300556E6CB71678395BBEEBBD46CB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: I guess I have to go now. Bye ✔)

L1208[15:45:27] <sugoi> gamax92: why did galve (sp?) need a boot file to be hidden?

L1209[15:48:07] <gamax92> sugoi: I don't know :P

L1210[15:48:39] <gamax92> because lawl hiding a file from ls or putting a dot infront of it = MAXIMUM FBI LEVEL SECURITY

L1211[15:49:07] <vifino> ~/.gamax92

L1212[15:49:15] <sugoi> maybe they were a windows user that thinks 'hidden' is a file attribute

L1213[15:53:26] <gamax92> freshly downloaded game from Steam

L1214[15:53:36] ⇦ Quits: Keanu73 (~Keanu73@host-78-148-136-72.as13285.net) (Quit: Gotta go to bed or something. See ya!)

L1215[15:53:41] <gamax92> files are already corrupt and need to be redownloaded

L1216[15:54:07] <sugoi> :/

L1217[15:54:12] <sugoi> that's never happened to me

L1218[15:54:54] <gamax92> I don't mean like it had to redownload the entire game

L1219[15:55:05] <gamax92> but it's like, I go to do a validate and it's like 4 files are corrupt

L1220[15:55:48] ⇦ Quits: surferconor425|Cloud (uid77899@id-77899.tooting.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)

L1221[16:03:20] *** Mystia_Lorelei is now known as SleepingFairy

L1222[16:11:37] ⇦ Quits: sivael (webchat@user-31-175-19-143.play-internet.pl) (Quit: Web client closed)

L1223[16:14:19] ⇦ Quits: cpup (~cpup@32.218.119.214) (Ping timeout: 194 seconds)

L1224[16:18:49] ⇦ Quits: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

L1225[16:22:44] ⇨ Joins: asie (~asie@asie.pl)

L1226[16:22:44] zsh sets mode: +v on asie

L1227[16:22:48] <asie> just in here briefly

L1228[16:22:53] <asie> releasing something long-overdue in a sec

L1229[16:25:48] <Kodos> No one's forcing you to leave...

L1230[16:26:42] <asie> Kodos: doesn't matter

L1231[16:26:55] <asie> https://github.com/ChenThread/ice

L1232[16:26:57] <asie> ^ the BTM video codec

L1233[16:27:21] <Mimiru> asie, you're welcome to stay here

L1234[16:27:38] <asie> did i ever say I'm not?

L1235[16:27:56] <Mimiru> I'm just saying...

L1236[16:27:59] <asie> Sangar: https://github.com/ChenThread/ice

L1237[16:28:37] <sugoi> greaser|q: you around?

L1238[16:29:44] <asie> sugoi: won't be for the next 6-8 hours?

L1239[16:29:48] <asie> maybe less, maybe more

L1240[16:30:22] <sugoi> asie: thanks :) btw, are you the bc dev?

L1241[16:30:25] <gamax92> at times, I just have to murder pulseaudio and restart it, and then my studdery audio streaming goes away

L1242[16:30:30] <gamax92> asie isn't anymore

L1243[16:31:32] <asie> not anymore

L1244[16:31:33] <asie> yeah

L1245[16:31:36] <asie> AlexIIL is now

L1246[16:31:56] <sugoi> i just wanted to say thanks for your work

L1247[16:32:04] <asie> no problem

L1248[16:32:09] <asie> i might be leaving modding altogether, though.

L1249[16:32:14] <asie> it's a shame but i really really need to move on

L1250[16:32:20] <DeanIsaKitty> asie: Again, you should really.

L1251[16:32:45] <sugoi> i can't believe mc and modding are still around :)

L1252[16:32:58] <asie> sugoi: me neither

L1253[16:33:15] <asie> especially with our very welcoming community, awesome documentation and total cooperation across all mods

L1254[16:33:16] <asie> :)

L1255[16:33:27] <asie> i can't believe we've kept this up for so long :)

L1256[16:37:11] ⇨ Joins: cpup (~cpup@32.218.119.214)

L1257[16:37:26] *** Lathanael is now known as Lathanael|Away

L1258[16:38:26] <sugoi> #lua 1

L1259[16:38:26] <|0xDEADBEEF|> > 1

L1260[16:39:41] <gamax92> sugoi: yes, 1 is 1

L1261[16:41:05] <Kodos> So uhh, I found this in a mod license

L1262[16:41:07] <Kodos> "So-called Alpha versions of this Mod, may contain a mechanism to limit the duration in which they can be used"

L1263[16:41:26] <sugoi> #lua a=nil;f=function() return false end;b="foo";return a or f() and b or nil

L1264[16:41:27] <|0xDEADBEEF|> > nil

L1265[16:41:35] <sugoi> #lua a=nil;f=function() return true end;b="foo";return a or f() and b or nil

L1266[16:41:36] <|0xDEADBEEF|> > foo

L1267[16:41:48] <sugoi> #lua a="bar";f=function() return true end;b="foo";return a or f() and b or nil

L1268[16:41:48] <|0xDEADBEEF|> > bar

L1269[16:42:04] <sugoi> Kodos: ha, which mod?

L1270[16:42:09] <Kodos> Intangible

L1271[16:42:14] <asie> what

L1272[16:42:15] <Kodos> The new mod from Emoniph

L1273[16:42:20] <asie> okay let's decompile

L1274[16:42:45] <Kodos> "4. Derivative Works / Modification This Mod may not be decompiled, reproduced and/or modified under any circumstances without prior written permission of the Owner. This Mod is not open source."

L1275[16:43:31] <DeanIsaKitty> Kodos: Unless you have to click "I accept" before you're able to download, EULA's are worth the paper they're written on.

L1276[16:43:57] <Kodos> So all mods' licenses are moot if you download from Curse?

L1277[16:43:59] <sugoi> well even then

L1278[16:44:10] <asie> DeanIsaKitty: i don't think it works like that

L1279[16:44:30] <sugoi> ^ (that's what i'm saying by "even then")

L1280[16:44:32] <asie> okay, no mechanism found

L1281[16:44:38] <DeanIsaKitty> asie: Actually I checked because of reasons. Its really really hard to enforce an EULA.

L1282[16:44:53] <Kodos> I'm pretty sure it's more of a "by downloading this, you automatically accept this license"

L1283[16:45:01] <sugoi> the main thing is that a EULA can't make up rules

L1284[16:45:15] <Inari> DeanIsaKitty: but but

L1285[16:45:17] <Inari> they arent written on paper

L1286[16:45:22] <DeanIsaKitty> Inari: Exactly

L1287[16:45:22] <asie> by the way

L1288[16:45:24] <asie> intangible has an API

L1289[16:45:27] <asie> which you cannot use

L1290[16:45:38] <asie> as to use the API you most likely are going to end up using IDEA's built-in decompiler

L1291[16:45:48] <asie> or another one, to get the API files out

L1292[16:46:01] <sugoi> e.g. you can't have a eula that says "you cannot return this for a refund" in countries where refund is protected by law

L1293[16:46:08] <sugoi> my point is, eula can't make stuff up

L1294[16:46:08] <asie> also

L1295[16:46:10] <asie> Intanginble

L1296[16:46:14] <asie> REQUIRES PERMISSION FOR MODPACK INCLUSION

L1297[16:46:16] <asie> I mean

L1298[16:46:18] <asie> "It's 2016!"

L1299[16:46:36] <asie> Worse, no exception for Curse either.

L1300[16:46:45] <asie> They are not enforced, but Curse did point out they do plan on enforcing those later on

L1301[16:47:00] <DeanIsaKitty> Kodos: I'm not sure how the situation is in the US but in germany if it says "you automatically agree by doing X" its gets on thin legal ice really really quick.

L1302[16:47:08] <asie> Germany is very picky with legalese.

L1303[16:47:12] <asie> But it's more an exception than a rule.

L1304[16:47:33] <Kodos> All I know is Emoniph wrote the license like that, I have enough respect for them to oblige by it

L1305[16:47:59] <DeanIsaKitty> Kodos: You can oblige to a license without being legally forced to do so, you know?

L1306[16:48:38] <Kodos> Right, but a license is still something you legally have to follow. Doesn't mean everyone will, but they are subject to legal shit if the licenser wants to bother

L1307[16:48:42] <asie> The T&C doesn't actually state when it applies.

L1308[16:49:01] <DeanIsaKitty> Kodos: Depends. A license is a legal document. If you don't sign it you don't have to follow it.

L1309[16:49:28] <sugoi> even if you sign, lincenses can't make up legal requirements

L1310[16:49:44] ⇨ Joins: primetoxinz (~primetoxi@ip68-107-226-229.hr.hr.cox.net)

L1311[16:49:47] <Kodos> I'm just gonna go play minecraft. I don't have the patience for this conversation right now

L1312[16:49:47] <asie> even the MIT mentions it applies to any person obtaining a copy of the software

L1313[16:49:52] <DeanIsaKitty> sugoi: By extend permitted with local law stands in every license ever for a reason.

L1314[16:49:59] <DeanIsaKitty> Kodos: Sure, have fun.

L1315[16:50:33] <DeanIsaKitty> sugoi: To the extend permitted by (...) actually.

L1316[16:51:42] <xarses> the best way to deal with shitty licenses is to tell the author publicy and then tell every one else to stop using the software because the license is shit

L1317[16:52:09] <asie> i might write up a blog post about it

L1318[16:52:15] <asie> as this license is not just ugly, it's broken

L1319[16:52:19] <DeanIsaKitty> xarses: Yeah of course. Shitty licenses are shitty but propietary software is sadly still a thing ^^

L1320[16:53:26] <xarses> and what you are describing is considered a "click wrapper" (by [using|installing] you accept the license) and are very enforcable in the US, but there are down sides by it being single sided

L1321[16:54:01] <DeanIsaKitty> xarses: Again, I'm not an expert on US law, I would have to as a lawyer for that.

L1322[16:54:29] <xarses> (wife is a software license sepcializing lawyer in CA, USA)

L1323[16:54:56] <DeanIsaKitty> xarses: Then you have infinitely more knowledge about that topic than I do ^^

L1324[16:55:09] <xarses> my knowledge is still not legal advice

L1325[16:55:17] <xarses> I am not a lawyer disclaimer (TM)

L1326[16:55:54] <Mimiru> IANAL? :P

L1327[16:56:18] <xarses> still the best way to deal with shit licenses (from the OSS side) is to publicly discuss it

L1328[16:56:32] <DeanIsaKitty> I am not a doctor disclaimer ™

L1329[16:57:03] <xarses> and to never use code with shit licenses, including re-implmenting stuff just to get a clean license

L1330[16:57:18] <DeanIsaKitty> clean room design ^^

L1331[16:57:29] <xarses> basically

L1332[16:57:29] * g quietly nudges the glowstone project

L1333[16:57:33] <DeanIsaKitty> Yeah, the last part is very likely the most effective there is.

L1334[16:57:47] <DeanIsaKitty> Because it hits the companies where it hurts: Right in the wallet.

L1335[16:58:00] <xarses> well, be careful of the API

L1336[16:58:13] <xarses> ie Oracle V Google

L1337[16:58:16] <g> APIs can't be copyrighted, so.. not worried there

L1338[16:58:22] <DeanIsaKitty> g: They can sadly

L1339[16:58:23] <g> the US is the only place where it can so far

L1340[16:58:26] <xarses> in the US, they are

L1341[16:58:32] <xarses> by common law

L1342[16:58:36] <xarses> not real law

L1343[16:58:47] <Kubuxu> g: every where they can, API is just piece of source code.

L1344[16:58:51] <DeanIsaKitty> g: Glowstone is written by a texan ;)

L1345[16:58:53] <xarses> TPP proposes that they are

L1346[16:59:02] <Kubuxu> I can have my proprietary API.

L1347[16:59:08] <g> DeanIsaKitty: I know who it's written by and where it's going :P

L1348[16:59:17] <Inari> sad part is

L1349[16:59:20] <g> I op both the channels and help out with glowstone++

L1350[16:59:23] <Inari> if its a good software, people wont just not use it

L1351[16:59:23] <Inari> :p

L1352[16:59:28] <DeanIsaKitty> Kubuxu: Actually we're talking about the API as in definiton on paper, not even the implementation

L1353[16:59:44] <g> the implementation can be owned

L1354[16:59:45] <Kubuxu> Also broken/stupid license is worst than no license at all, IMHO

L1355[16:59:48] <g> that's fair

L1356[16:59:58] <Kubuxu> Then it is just documentation/specification.

L1357[17:00:04] <g> but the definition? it's an idea, and almost an abstract one

L1358[17:00:10] <DeanIsaKitty> Kubuxu: And that can be copyrighted in the US.

L1359[17:00:31] <g> Kubuxu, well, no license is just "fuck off it's mine", so

L1360[17:00:50] <Kubuxu> yeah, and broken license places people in bad spots.

L1361[17:00:54] <xarses> not exactly

L1362[17:01:03] ⇦ Quits: h3po (~h3po@aftr-5-146-248-99.unity-media.net) (Quit: Leaving.)

L1364[17:01:13] <gamax92> I wonder if I turn on window's wine decorator if this game stops derping.

L1365[17:01:30] <xarses> which you use a license to imply loosening too

L1366[17:01:43] <g> well, yeah

L1367[17:01:58] <g> anyway, as I say, you only really have to worry about that stuff if you're in the US

L1369[17:02:16] <g> and at that rate, nobody's going to worry about you cloning the api for a piddly little MC mod

L1370[17:02:20] <xarses> outright say it

L1371[17:02:20] <g> :P

L1372[17:02:30] <DeanIsaKitty> g: Yeah, the EFF was so pissed though when the Federal court ruled as it did.

L1373[17:02:31] <xarses> well, they may

L1374[17:02:35] <xarses> but what is the damages

L1375[17:02:41] <g> DeanIsaKitty, yeah, I remember

L1376[17:02:44] <g> xarses, well.. none?

L1377[17:02:47] <xarses> the EFF is a troll now days

L1378[17:02:57] <g> they're trolls, but they troll for good

L1379[17:03:11] <xarses> erm, probably not any longer

L1381[17:03:35] <g> I doubt their focus is just going to change overnight

L1382[17:03:37] <xarses> they have no member elected board members any longer

L1383[17:03:58] <xarses> they aren't punishing members who are mis-behaving any more

L1384[17:04:02] <g> worry about that when it turns out like the reddit board

L1385[17:04:08] <g> I gotta go, sorry

L1386[17:04:10] * g fultons out

L1387[17:04:11] *** g is now known as gAway2002

L1388[17:04:42] <DeanIsaKitty> xarses: [Citiation needed]

L1389[17:04:52] <xarses> for EFF?

L1390[17:05:09] <DeanIsaKitty> For EFF not punishing members for gross missbehaviour

L1391[17:05:13] <xarses> https://lwn.net/Articles/672640/

L1392[17:06:08] <DeanIsaKitty> xarses: That is about the Linux Foundation...

L1393[17:06:37] <xarses> oops, wrong foundation =/

L1394[17:06:48] <DeanIsaKitty> Yeah.

L1395[17:06:53] <xarses> I was talking about this one

L1396[17:07:03] <xarses> sorry

L1397[17:07:07] <DeanIsaKitty> The Linux foundation IS getting shady. The EFF (imho) is still going very strong.

L1398[17:07:57] <DeanIsaKitty> Were both of your points against the Linux foundation xarses?

L1399[17:08:16] <xarses> yes sorry, I confused the two

L1400[17:08:26] <xarses> my points where about LF, not EFF

L1401[17:08:36] <DeanIsaKitty> No problem, happens. ^^

L1402[17:12:58] ⇨ Joins: surferconor425|Cloud (uid77899@id-77899.tooting.irccloud.com)

L1403[17:18:28] <Inari> what does +z do o.o

L1404[17:19:52] * Antheus grunts at IntigratedCircut problems

L1405[17:20:30] <Mimiru> Inari, the channel mode +z?

L1406[17:20:43] <Inari> ya

L1407[17:20:45] <Antheus> it puts you to sleep

L1408[17:21:05] <Mimiru> It means +q and +b clients messages still get delivered to ops

L1409[17:21:13] <Inari> interesting

L1410[17:21:17] <Mimiru> same with messages to the channel if I set +m

L1411[17:21:18] <Inari> now whys that not on espers website

L1412[17:21:18] <Inari> :P

L1413[17:21:50] <Mimiru> +z Op moderated: messages that would normally be blocked by +m, +b, and +q are instead sent to the channel operators only.

L1414[17:21:53] <Mimiru> How do you figure?

L1415[17:22:24] <Inari> oh

L1416[17:22:29] <Inari> its not actualyl sorted alphabetically

L1417[17:22:29] <Inari> :P

L1418[17:22:53] <Antheus> Ooh

L1419[17:22:59] <Antheus> so like, if you quiet me

L1420[17:23:07] <Antheus> OPS will still be able to see my chat

L1421[17:23:10] <Mimiru> I still have to see everything you say.

L1422[17:23:11] <Antheus> but no one else

L1423[17:23:11] <Mimiru> yes.

L1424[17:23:14] <Antheus> cool

L1425[17:23:29] <Mimiru> That's why you'll notice me quite someone, and still talk to them

L1426[17:23:29] <Antheus> Hmm

L1427[17:23:38] <Mimiru> Like what happened the other day

L1428[17:23:40] <Antheus> I always think you are just insane

L1429[17:23:48] <Antheus> als

L1430[17:23:49] <Antheus> o

L1431[17:23:53] <Inari> +q is the preferable option to +b

L1432[17:23:53] <Antheus> nvm

L1433[17:27:32] <Antheus> Who do I throw bugs at for Int. Circuts?

L1434[17:28:09] <Inari> i tried int circuits the other day

L1435[17:28:17] <Inari> then the server woudl carsh when i logged into my base next time

L1436[17:28:18] <Inari> much fun

L1437[17:28:34] <Lizzy> Antheus, Skye or Vic

L1438[17:29:19] <Kodos> I've come to the conclusion that nothing will replace P:R for me, so I just use P:R's ICs

L1439[17:29:46] <sugoi> Kodos: what was wrong with pr ics?

L1440[17:30:07] <Kodos> Nothing was wrong with PR ICs

L1441[17:30:36] <Kodos> But updating is a pain, the mod has a shyt license, and I was hoping to find a replacement, but no other mod I can find that works adds a control panel type block

L1442[17:30:45] <Kodos> I found a mod called Automatic Redstone, but it was crashing on startup, so I pulled it

L1443[17:30:57] <sugoi> ha, i didn't even read the license

L1444[17:31:01] <Inari> http://imgur.com/gallery/yiy8vpc

L1445[17:31:03] <sugoi> any specifics you didn't like?

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L1447[17:31:29] <Inari> what was that mod with the stupidl icense...

L1448[17:31:32] <Inari> uhhhh

L1449[17:31:36] <Inari> oh right, factorization

L1450[17:31:48] <asie> factorization's license is stupid but also interesting from a social point of view

L1451[17:31:54] <Antheus> ?

L1452[17:31:55] <VanillaBean> had anyone used agricraft's computer controlled analyzer with oc?

L1453[17:31:58] <asie> it's essentially a license which enforces that people actually explore your mod before you use it

L1454[17:32:02] <Skye> Antheus: Inari: for integrated circuits, please, please, please, use the bug tracker. >_<

L1455[17:32:02] <asie> before they can use it*

L1456[17:32:10] <asie> it's not stupid. i haven't even tried and got permissions for 3 modpacks

L1457[17:32:15] <asie> just by finding bugs in the mod :)

L1458[17:32:18] <Inari> i dont have the crashlog and i cant be bothered as its an old verison anyway

L1459[17:32:20] <Inari> (yay modpacks)

L1460[17:32:24] <asie> hitn

L1461[17:32:31] <asie> hint: neptunepink has never enforced it

L1462[17:32:35] <Inari> haha

L1463[17:32:38] <asie> and honestly, it was mostly because he hates

L1464[17:32:43] <asie> all the packs adding factorization for no reason

L1465[17:32:47] <asie> other than to be a kitchen sink

L1466[17:32:54] <Antheus> lol

L1467[17:32:57] <Inari> well im not touching FZ with a 5-foot pole

L1468[17:32:59] <Inari> so thats that

L1469[17:33:09] <asie> FZ is like

L1470[17:33:10] <asie> the best mod

L1471[17:33:33] <Inari> if you like terrible clunkiness in placing stuff and terrible documentation on like everything :P thouhg at least the latter part imprvoed slightly

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L1473[17:37:58] <asie> i have access to the sourcetree now

L1474[17:38:01] <asie> so if you have issues...

L1475[17:38:12] <asie> also

L1476[17:38:12] <Antheus> asie, what DON"T you have access to...

L1477[17:38:14] <asie> less clunky than BC

L1478[17:38:17] <asie> \o/

L1479[17:38:19] <asie> Antheus: IC2 source cod

L1480[17:38:21] <asie> e

L1481[17:38:25] <asie> i do have rights to redistribute modified copies, though

L1482[17:38:30] <Antheus> ic2 is still around? /s

L1483[17:38:31] <asie> in my modpacks

L1484[17:38:45] <Inari> asie: not last i tried :P

L1485[17:38:55] <Inari> the cables very just horrible, the whole energy system at that too

L1486[17:39:00] <asie> the energy system is

L1487[17:39:03] <asie> great

L1488[17:39:13] <Inari> felt like they tried to have rp2 cables but horrible wrong :P

L1489[17:39:13] <asie> so great in fact i was collaborating with neptunepink on a new universal energy system

L1490[17:39:22] <asie> for charset

L1491[17:39:39] <gamax92> (relevant xkcd)

L1492[17:39:45] <Antheus> ^

L1493[17:39:51] <asie> gamax92: for charset.

L1494[17:40:04] <asie> it's universal because it's meant to be usable by anyone, but the goal was to make it for charset and FZ

L1495[17:40:06] <asie> :P

L1496[17:40:06] <Antheus> https://xkcd.com/927/

L1497[17:40:08] <Inari> well if you find non-documented energy systems with super-clunky to place cables (the kind where half the time it doesnt plac ebecause you're 0.11 blocks too far to the right) and it generally being a huge PITA great

L1498[17:40:09] <Inari> maybe

L1499[17:40:09] <MichiBot> XKCD Comic Name: Standards Posted on: 7/20/2011

L1500[17:40:21] <asie> Inari: it's stupidly simple

L1501[17:40:29] <asie> a conductor creates a network of charge receivers/providers

L1502[17:40:33] <asie> they have a single buffer, shared.

L1503[17:41:01] <Inari> whats a conductor

L1504[17:41:31] <asie> a wire

L1505[17:41:41] <asie> also

L1506[17:41:44] <asie> i never had placement issues?

L1507[17:43:08] <Inari> maybe they improved dunno, last time i tried servos and those were horrible too so yeah

L1508[17:43:59] <asie> those are getting a rewrite

L1509[17:44:04] <asie> because everyone knows they're clunky

L1510[17:44:06] <asie> however

L1511[17:44:09] <asie> barrels, portable crafting tables

L1512[17:44:14] <asie> FZ has the nicest implementations to me

L1513[17:46:22] <Inari> i just recall the cables being a huge pain, the energy system a huger pain since you literally had no clue what "1 charge" would mean or stuff like that and very little control over flow direction or anything really and everything using a huge amount of energy

L1514[17:47:12] <asie> i used FZ and i never cared about these

L1515[17:47:15] <asie> all generation is passive

L1516[17:47:20] <asie> which is a very important thing

L1517[17:47:25] <asie> there is no flow direction

L1518[17:47:28] <asie> energy doesn't flow

L1519[17:47:56] <asie> all wires are is a single integer

L1520[17:48:00] <asie> producers add to that single integer

L1521[17:48:03] <asie> consumers take away from it

L1522[17:48:06] <asie> there is no direction, no path.

L1523[17:48:15] <DeanIsaKitty> The energy doesn't move man, the cables move around the energy man

L1524[17:48:24] <asie> yeah

L1525[17:48:27] <asie> pretty much

L1526[17:51:14] <VanillaBean> solid state energy?

L1527[17:56:38] <VanillaBean> agricraft's analyzer has an api, getPlant(direction) and I'm not sure what direction is supposed to be

L1528[18:04:58] ⇦ Quits: fotoply (~fotoply@2-104-228-18-static.dk.customer.tdc.net) (Ping timeout: 186 seconds)

L1529[18:05:23] <Antheus> .p

L1530[18:05:24] <^v4> Ping reply from Antheus 1.17s

L1531[18:05:29] <Antheus> :<

L1532[18:05:31] <Antheus> .p

L1533[18:05:32] <^v4> Ping reply from Antheus 0.51s

L1534[18:05:37] <Antheus> %p

L1535[18:05:39] <MichiBot> Ping reply from Antheus 1.69s

L1536[18:05:42] <Antheus> :(

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L1545[18:15:57] *** Gavle|Away is now known as Gavle

L1546[18:16:22] <Gavle> Hello

L1547[18:17:46] <sugoi> Gavle: question, why do you need a boot file to be hidden to ls?

L1548[18:18:02] <Gavle> what?

L1549[18:18:40] <sugoi> you were creating a file in boot/

L1550[18:18:48] <sugoi> prefixed . for to be hidden

L1551[18:18:52] <sugoi> but it loaded too soon

L1552[18:19:04] <sugoi> so "why do you need a boot file to be hidden to ls?"

L1553[18:19:34] <Gavle> what?

L1554[18:20:29] * sugoi gives up

L1555[18:20:45] <Gavle> I know what you are talking about :P

L1556[18:20:51] <Gavle> I just don't want to answer XD

L1557[18:21:06] <sugoi> whatever

L1558[18:21:53] <Gavle> have I offended you?

L1559[18:22:24] <sugoi> nope

L1560[18:22:34] <Gavle> ok, good :)

L1561[18:22:34] * Sharidan puts a put of fresh coffee on the room table..

L1562[18:23:00] * DeanIsaKitty empties it in one go

L1563[18:23:11] <Sharidan> hiya Dean :)

L1564[18:23:11] ⇦ Quits: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com) (Quit: geeettttttt dunked on!!!)

L1565[18:23:20] <Sharidan> you'll make the next pot ;)

L1566[18:23:24] <DeanIsaKitty> Hai ^^

L1567[18:23:34] * DeanIsaKitty goes to brew a new pot of coffee

L1568[18:23:55] <vifino> oooh, coffee :o

L1569[18:24:04] <Sharidan> hehe

L1570[18:24:27] <Sharidan> got a wallpaper of a squirrel drinking coffee, subtexted: "need more coffee"

L1571[18:24:34] <Antheus> .p

L1572[18:24:35] <^v4> Ping reply from Antheus 0.35s

L1573[18:24:38] <Antheus> %p

L1574[18:24:40] <MichiBot> Ping reply from Antheus 0.7s

L1575[18:25:33] <Antheus> .p

L1576[18:25:33] <^v4> Ping reply from Antheus 0.35s

L1577[18:42:34] <Gavle> I have an error

L1578[18:42:46] <Gavle> My program, http://pastebin.com/BdczBG4K returns an error on line 9

L1579[18:42:47] <Sharidan> 2+2=5?

L1580[18:43:00] <Gavle> It says it tries to index local wF (a nil value)

L1581[18:43:11] <Gavle> is it because I tried to use io.open on a file that does not exist?

L1582[18:43:39] <Sharidan> you really should check if wF ~= nil

L1583[18:44:14] <Sharidan> file operations are never finite. plenty of things can prevent the fileopen from happening, so checking the file handle ensures you know if the file got opened or not

L1584[18:44:48] <Gavle> ok, but I want to open the file

L1585[18:44:51] <Gavle> It needs to happen

L1586[18:45:07] <Gavle> can I not have two files open at once?

L1587[18:45:15] <Sharidan> you might not be able to open it "w" if it already exists

L1588[18:45:43] <Gavle> the file does not exist

L1589[18:47:31] <Sharidan> uhm, if you have run this multiple times, previous handles might still be open preventing more to be opened

L1590[18:47:50] <Gavle> :|

L1591[18:47:56] <Gavle> I need to add '' around the w

L1592[18:48:00] <Sharidan> when you work with files, you should check the handle you get from io.open() operations and you -really- also should close them when done

L1593[18:48:16] <Gavle> Sharidan, the program remains unfinished :)

L1594[18:48:39] <Sharidan> I'm aware of that, but I'm urging you to do things the right way :)

L1595[18:49:08] <Sharidan> leaving file handles hanging like that is a bad no-no and will eventually cause weird things to happen

L1596[18:49:25] <Sharidan> such as not being able to open more files, because the lua environment still things the previous ones are open

L1597[18:49:39] <Sharidan> thinks*

L1598[18:50:47] * Gavle flips table

L1599[18:50:52] <Gavle> my boot script corrupted again

L1600[18:50:52] * gamax92 flips Gavle

L1601[18:51:33] <Sharidan> that would be yet another example of bad file handling

L1602[18:51:54] <Sharidan> if you are strictly doing a file copy operation Gavle, you don't really need that junkTable inthere

L1603[18:51:56] <Gavle> Sharidan, it's not from file handling

L1604[18:52:17] <Gavle> It's from me not bothering to fix issues in a program that I fixed manually

L1605[18:52:44] <Sharidan> Gavle: I didnt say that - just mentioned that file corruption is another example of what can go wrong when not doing file handling properly :)

L1606[18:53:14] <Gavle> yeah

L1607[18:53:27] <Gavle> file corruption can also result from being a bad programmer XD

L1608[18:53:35] <Sharidan> true - heh

L1609[18:54:01] <Sharidan> I did my fair share of data corruption 30 years ago when I started programming

L1610[18:54:19] <Gavle> alright, fixed that piece of the program

L1611[18:54:24] <Gavle> now back to work on file splitting

L1612[18:55:18] <VanillaBean> I worked with someone named sharidan a long time ago.........really curious

L1613[18:55:37] <Sharidan> sure it wasn sheridan ? :P

L1614[18:56:13] <VanillaBean> oh I think it was

L1615[18:56:23] <Sharidan> there you have it :)

L1616[18:57:09] <Sharidan> did you figure out the agricraft thing, VanillaBean?

L1617[18:57:31] <VanillaBean> I did, thanks

L1618[18:57:39] <Sharidan> cool cool :)

L1619[18:57:52] <Sharidan> was the direction numeric or string based?

L1620[18:59:24] <VanillaBean> string, all caps, map directions

L1621[18:59:42] <Sharidan> I figured as much :)

L1622[18:59:54] <Gavle> whoo

L1623[19:00:03] <Gavle> file splitting works in theory

L1624[19:06:41] ⇦ Quits: cpup (~cpup@32.218.119.214) (Ping timeout: 198 seconds)

L1625[19:07:47] <Gavle> well crap

L1626[19:08:02] <Gavle> the file is way too long for me to read

L1627[19:08:18] <Gavle> on my screen that is

L1628[19:08:23] ⇦ Quits: keda (~keda@79-133-3-90.bredband.aland.net) (Ping timeout: 189 seconds)

L1629[19:08:25] <sugoi> more

L1630[19:10:54] ⇨ Joins: Nachtara (~Nachie@50-83-108-134.client.mchsi.com)

L1631[19:11:08] <Gavle> I tried, but I either didn't pipe it right, or didn't know how to use more properly :(

L1632[19:11:28] <Gavle> either way, I just shoved it in another file

L1633[19:12:13] ⇨ Joins: cpup (~cpup@32.218.118.223)

L1634[19:14:49] <Gavle> the concatenation marker is .. right?

L1635[19:15:11] <sugoi> yep

L1636[19:15:16] <sugoi> #lua 'a'..'b'

L1637[19:15:16] <|0xDEADBEEF|> > ab

L1638[19:15:33] <Gavle> why u no work then????

L1639[19:16:14] <Sharidan> are there any binary files in OpenOS ?

L1640[19:16:37] <sugoi> no

L1641[19:16:59] <Sharidan> I didnt think so. thanks for confirming :)

L1642[19:18:50] <Gavle> there's a whole /bin folder

L1643[19:19:04] <Gavle> btw, gamax92 and Kodos, I got file splitting to work

L1644[19:19:07] <Gavle> It wasn't too hard

L1645[19:19:15] <Kodos> Oh? Do share

L1646[19:19:32] <Gavle> only 27 lines and 531 characters

L1647[19:19:36] <Gavle> one minute

L1648[19:19:41] <Kodos> Pastebin that shiz =D

L1649[19:19:49] <Tiin57> Gavle: Those are all text files, with .lua extensions and lua code in them, but not binary

L1650[19:20:17] <Gavle> Kodos, http://pastebin.com/bLjFVDjs

L1651[19:20:22] <Tiin57> Unless the mod now does luac in OpenOS

L1652[19:20:31] <Gavle> Tiin57, elaborate on the difference

L1653[19:20:41] <sugoi> it doesnt. we cannot load "b"

L1654[19:20:53] ⇦ Quits: Inari (~Pinkishu@p5dec6833.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: KVIrc 4.3.2 Aria http://www.kvirc.net/)

L1655[19:21:06] <Gavle> Kodos, the program needs to be tweaked slightly in order to modify the original file, but that's minor

L1656[19:21:08] <sugoi> Gavle: binary != plain text

L1657[19:21:13] <sugoi> every file in openos is plain text

L1658[19:21:15] <Gavle> ah

L1659[19:21:33] <Tiin57> Gavle: All plain-text files are binary, not all binary are plain text

L1660[19:21:40] * vifino yawns and flops on Lizzy

L1661[19:21:42] * vifino zZZ

L1662[19:21:42] <Gavle> makes sense

L1663[19:21:58] * Lizzy pets vifino

L1664[19:22:07] <Gavle> Kodos, whatdya think?

L1665[19:22:11] * vifino purrs

L1666[19:22:31] <Kodos> Needs some comments

L1667[19:22:34] <Kodos> Other than that, looks okay =)

L1668[19:22:39] * Gavle cheers

L1669[19:22:48] <Gavle> feel free to use the code

L1670[19:23:43] <sugoi> if you're going to hard code the line offset

L1671[19:23:49] <sugoi> you could also just hard code the byte offset

L1672[19:24:01] <Kodos> Gavle: A good example of well commented code would be https://pastebin.com/bdZKz46c

L1673[19:24:04] <sugoi> before=f:read(num_bytes_before)

L1674[19:24:11] <sugoi> after=f:read("*a")

L1675[19:24:12] <Kodos> Granted, I commented that to the point of being a learning tool, but still

L1676[19:24:19] <sugoi> result=before..injection..after

L1677[19:25:24] <Gavle> Kodos, I didn't bother adding comments because the end use would make comments detrimental

L1678[19:25:44] <sugoi> security through obfuscation

L1679[19:26:01] <Gavle> points to sugoi

L1680[19:29:15] * Gavle stabs face

L1681[19:29:20] <Gavle> I broke my ls.lua

L1682[19:29:24] <Gavle> and I must go

L1683[19:31:39] *** Gavle is now known as Gavle|Away

L1684[19:32:45] ⇨ Joins: t3hero (~t3hero@2601:202:200:fb50:bdb7:a3f7:1500:7590)

L1685[19:37:50] ⇨ Joins: AngryDragonoid (webchat@50.127.62.110)

L1686[19:37:56] <AngryDragonoid> hello

L1687[19:38:05] <AngryDragonoid> anyone know where to find the APIs?

L1688[19:38:32] <Sharidan> which apis?

L1689[19:38:36] ⇦ Quits: AngryDragonoid (webchat@50.127.62.110) (Client Quit)

L1690[19:39:27] <Mimiru> Ahh, the /quit APIs

L1691[19:39:34] <Sharidan> aparantly :)

L1692[19:39:51] *** alfw is now known as alfw|Off

L1693[19:41:02] <Sharidan> meh ... brain needs fuel

L1694[19:51:30] *** alfw|Off is now known as alfw

L1695[19:53:25] <Saphire> Heh

L1696[19:57:49] <Shuudoushi> DeanIsaKitty: lol, that plane i've been working on still can't turn worth shit, but it can do Mach 2.6 with FAR installed!

L1697[19:57:57] <Shuudoushi> too bad it does this to the engines: http://puu.sh/mRi4t/39acd43551.png

L1698[19:58:57] <Sharidan> woa that looks weird

L1699[20:00:01] <Shuudoushi> lol

L1700[20:00:38] <Shuudoushi> I meant to make it unstable, so it can maneuver well, but I made it incable of turning instead >.>

L1701[20:00:56] <Sharidan> lol

L1702[20:01:02] <Shuudoushi> well, unless it's under afterbuners...

L1703[20:01:11] <Shuudoushi> then it can turn on a fucking dime!

L1704[20:01:19] <Sharidan> she flies perfectly, as long as you only wanna go in a straight line :P

L1705[20:01:32] <Shuudoushi> then fly into bits b/c it pulls 15gs at Mach 1.6 >.>

L1706[20:01:39] <Shuudoushi> or fast lol

L1707[20:02:30] <Kodos> ~w error

L1708[20:02:30] <ocdoc> http://www.lua.org/manual/5.2/manual.html#pdf-error

L1709[20:02:41] <Sharidan> ugh - 15gs - that's a lot

L1710[20:03:04] <Kodos> Reminds me of when I used to red out playing Elite

L1711[20:03:12] <Kodos> Back before my GPU died =(

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L1713[20:05:20] <Shuudoushi> and a perfect landing to boot! http://puu.sh/mRiBn/0662a3a336.png

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L1716[20:07:24] <Shuudoushi> now to toy with a plane can can still turn lol

L1717[20:08:00] <Shuudoushi> btw, FAR is an unforgiving dick >.>

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L1724[21:31:10] <sugoi> ~w gpu

L1725[21:31:10] <ocdoc> http://ocd.cil.li/component:gpu

L1726[21:34:46] <Sharidan> hmm .. are the libraries listed in packaged.loaded directly accessible?

L1727[21:35:02] <sugoi> Sharidan: yes, but can you elaborate what you mean

L1728[21:35:36] <Sharidan> uhm, basically is: local compo = require("component") the same as: local compo = package.loaded.component

L1729[21:35:52] <sugoi> yes

L1730[21:36:19] <Sharidan> ok

L1731[21:36:19] <sugoi> require stores it in package.loaded if it was not yet loaded

L1732[21:36:50] <Sharidan> yea I've seen that happened, hence why I was asking about package.loaded references

L1733[21:37:03] <sugoi> they are safe in this context for use

L1734[21:37:07] <sugoi> and i intend to leave it that way

L1735[21:37:39] <Sharidan> ok, so if I do: local compo = require("component") ... does compo then contain a copy of the component table(lib) or a pointer reference?

L1736[21:37:41] <sugoi> do you prefer that syntax or were you just curious

L1737[21:37:52] <sugoi> it's a pointer ref

L1738[21:37:55] <Sharidan> nice

L1739[21:38:04] <Sharidan> I'm asking because I know that tables eat a ton of memory

L1740[21:38:25] <sugoi> :)

L1741[21:38:31] <Sharidan> and I'm trying to build up my UI library with that in mind - i.e. trying to have it spend as little memory as I can

L1742[21:39:25] <Sharidan> I'd like to put misc. general purpose UI controls in my UI lib, but some of them require a lot of code and rely on misc. components to work

L1743[21:39:50] <Sharidan> so knowing if require() returns a pointer or a table, does make a difference in terms of memory spendage as pointers are way cheaper :)

L1744[21:40:04] <sugoi> require would cost a tiny bit less than a package.loaded to invoke

L1745[21:40:14] <Sharidan> aha - how come?

L1746[21:40:20] <sugoi> your ref cost is the same

L1747[21:40:28] <sugoi> in either case, you have a pointer to a table

L1748[21:40:42] <sugoi> but invocations have a cost at each level

L1749[21:40:59] <Sharidan> elaborate please? :)

L1750[21:41:07] <sugoi> so require("component") vs package["loaded"]["component"]

L1751[21:41:23] <sugoi> the different is very small, i predict <12 bytes

L1752[21:41:33] <sugoi> though, plus the size of the string "loaded"

L1753[21:41:37] <Sharidan> require() would be cheaper because it's a functional call vs. a table reference, correct?

L1754[21:41:43] <sugoi> yes

L1755[21:41:46] <sugoi> that's what i'm getting at

L1756[21:41:48] <Sharidan> ok good - I do get it :)

L1757[21:42:08] <Sharidan> ok, so I have another question on the same topic

L1758[21:42:23] <sugoi> glad i can be a good resource, ask away :)

L1759[21:42:39] <Sharidan> let's say I create a local table variable, put something in the table and then pass that table variable as a parameter to a function

L1760[21:42:50] <Sharidan> will that pass a pointer to the variable or the variable contents ?

L1761[21:43:01] <sugoi> just the table

L1762[21:43:14] <sugoi> it'll just be one push

L1763[21:43:17] <Sharidan> so it does pass the entire table to the function?

L1764[21:43:24] <sugoi> yes, but just a pointer

L1765[21:44:01] <Sharidan> uhm, sorry I got confused

L1766[21:44:32] <Sharidan> let's say I have: local myList = {} ... then add a bunch of strings to it table.insert(myList, "something") x10

L1767[21:44:37] <sugoi> a table of 1 element or a table of 1000 elements have equal cost to send as a function argument

L1768[21:44:42] <sugoi> yeah

L1769[21:44:45] <Sharidan> then I do a call like this: someFunction(myList)

L1770[21:44:55] <sugoi> yeah doesn't matter how large myList is

L1771[21:45:04] <Sharidan> local someFunction(junk) ... end

L1772[21:45:10] <Sharidan> junk will be a pointer, right?

L1773[21:45:13] <sugoi> yes

L1774[21:45:16] <Sharidan> ok cool

L1775[21:45:50] <Sharidan> I'm trying to figure out how to reference my general purpose text rendering functions from anywhere in my library

L1776[21:46:01] <sugoi> real memory costs you need to consider are what are you keeping in memory

L1777[21:46:10] <sugoi> in my work i've reduced memory in two ways

L1778[21:46:29] <sugoi> 1. what memory is allocated that could be allocated later, or once and released when done

L1779[21:46:43] <sugoi> 2. what memory is allocated but this code could be written functionally instead

L1780[21:46:58] <sugoi> note that for #2, functional code is going to be slower, but lower mem cost

L1781[21:47:15] <Sharidan> yea that's the biggest issue with a UI library this large. I've got ~20 UI controls defined

L1782[21:47:24] <sugoi> for example, openos 1.6 /bin/ls is quite advanced in comparison to openos 1.5

L1783[21:47:41] <sugoi> sadly, the mem cost to run ls / -R was huge, something like 50k

L1784[21:47:52] <Sharidan> ouch

L1785[21:48:29] <sugoi> but the #1 rule in optimizing code is measure! :) so after a lot of tests and measuring, i decided to make it as functional as possible

L1786[21:48:46] <sugoi> i'm not sure the "widest" point of that same call, but it's easily half

L1787[21:48:56] <Sharidan> nice :)

L1788[21:49:13] <sugoi> yes it's a bit slower, slightly, but it's the difference between "works" and "crashes" for some users

L1789[21:49:36] <Sharidan> indeed it is

L1790[21:50:02] <sugoi> note openos 1.6 allocates less ram than 1.5 :) (or will, when the PR passes review)

L1791[21:50:39] <Sharidan> one feature I'd like to implement in my UI library is the ability to bind it to multiple GPUs

L1792[21:50:54] <sugoi> why?

L1793[21:51:04] <sugoi> honestly curious, as i'm giving term a rework atm

L1794[21:51:38] <Sharidan> well, one scenario is having say two graphics cards with two screens attached

L1795[21:51:54] <Sharidan> one screen displays say base stats, while the other one monitors a big reactor

L1796[21:52:00] <sugoi> yes that, i thought you meant >1 gpu per screen

L1797[21:52:19] <Sharidan> through the UI library I could bind one desktop object to one GPU and another to the other GPU

L1798[21:53:01] <Sharidan> nah, I don't really wanna mess with screen swapping on a single GPU - that's messy at best

L1799[21:53:01] <sugoi> sounds good

L1800[21:53:38] <Sharidan> basically doing this: local desk = uilib:newDesk() ... this would bind to primary

L1801[21:54:07] <Sharidan> but you'd also be able to: local desk2 = uilib:newDesk("89d") ... which would bind to the GPU starting with "89d"

L1802[21:54:16] <Sharidan> or you can pass the full addr of course

L1803[21:55:16] <Sharidan> can local functions be called or do I have to add everything to the return table?

L1804[21:55:54] <sugoi> local fields cannot be acccessed outside a lua code block (e.g. a file)

L1805[21:56:24] <Sharidan> ok, so everything goes into the return table

L1806[21:56:52] <sugoi> are you going to have extensive libraries where probably one some of the methods are going to be utilised ?

L1807[21:57:03] <sugoi> probably only* some

L1808[21:57:36] <Sharidan> well, for now it's "just" my UI library with misc. UI controls like buttons, listboxes, textinputs, scrollbars etc.

L1809[21:57:56] <Sharidan> so I'd say that depends on the app that makes use of the UI lib

L1810[21:58:11] <sugoi> you intend for this to run on openos 1.6?

L1811[21:58:36] <Sharidan> atm I'm on 1.5 but eventually I'd like it to run on 1.6 too yes

L1812[21:58:43] <Sharidan> are the two versions that different?

L1813[21:59:04] <sugoi> i try to hide the differences

L1814[21:59:08] <sugoi> i really do :)

L1815[21:59:17] <sugoi> but there is a new feature (Again, all pending pr)

L1816[21:59:30] <sugoi> delayloaded methods

L1817[21:59:43] <sugoi> so...say you have in your ui lib code

L1818[21:59:45] <Sharidan> load on demand?

L1819[21:59:47] <gamax92> sugoi: dynamically loaded functions? :D

L1820[21:59:59] <sugoi> function ui.createButton() ... end

L1821[22:00:18] <sugoi> dynamically loaded :)

L1822[22:00:37] <sugoi> the annotation is delayloaded, literally --[[@delayloaded-start@]]

L1823[22:00:53] <Sharidan> nice!

L1824[22:00:55] <sugoi> so if you changed that to: function --[[@delayloaded-start@]] ui.createbutton()

L1825[22:01:11] <sugoi> then your ui table you return would look the same (e.g. pairs the same)

L1826[22:01:25] <sugoi> but you actually didn't put that method into memory

L1827[22:01:44] <sugoi> until you call ui.createButton() (sorry for the lowercase b ^)

L1828[22:01:51] <Sharidan> that is really nice

L1829[22:02:30] <sugoi> using this feature i cut cost by 18k to boot

L1830[22:02:32] <Sharidan> I was thinking about doing some file trickery to accomplish the same in my UI lib to minimize the footprint a bit

L1831[22:02:39] <sugoi> all the delayed stuff isn't used by most users

L1832[22:03:25] <sugoi> e.g. (shell) file tab completion, globbing, boolean operators, piping

L1833[22:04:06] <Sharidan> just please don't do lua code suggestion in /bin/edit

L1834[22:04:12] <sugoi> haha

L1835[22:04:16] <sugoi> i didn't touch edit

L1836[22:04:16] <Sharidan> worst thing dan200 put in CC

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L1838[22:05:04] <Sharidan> every time you type "do" in his editor it suggests dofile( and locks the cursor in place until you decide to disregard "dofile(" by hitting enter

L1839[22:05:27] <sugoi> holy crap

L1840[22:05:27] <Sharidan> most annoying thing ever

L1841[22:05:29] <Sharidan> lol

L1842[22:05:33] <sugoi> haha yeah i can bet

L1843[22:06:05] <Sharidan> so please don't put crap like that inthere :)

L1844[22:06:28] <sugoi> Sharidan: anyways, if you get to the point where you are considering using the delay load annotation - i'd be happy to help review

L1845[22:06:52] <sugoi> the feature is picky, and failure falls back safely to a normal full load

L1846[22:06:55] <Sharidan> uhm, how far away is 1.6 ?

L1847[22:07:03] <sugoi> my pr is done

L1848[22:07:12] <sugoi> and The One is back from the break :)

L1849[22:07:14] <sugoi> so, no idea

L1850[22:07:35] <sugoi> now i'm just pounding on a new term lib

L1851[22:07:43] <sugoi> for no really good reason...

L1852[22:07:47] <sugoi> i should be working on rc

L1853[22:07:53] <sugoi> :)

L1854[22:07:54] <Sharidan> it wont be backwards compatible?

L1855[22:08:29] <sugoi> well in general, 1.6 is allowed to break things

L1856[22:08:37] <sugoi> but there isn't api with term i have issue with

L1857[22:08:54] <sugoi> it's how it creates the data and the new multi-term stuff that needs to be separated out

L1858[22:09:13] <sugoi> and i agree with gamax92 -- it's needs a restart, not a fixup

L1859[22:09:18] <sugoi> it* needs

L1860[22:09:20] <Sharidan> fair enough :)

L1861[22:10:07] <Sharidan> well, most of what I'm doing with my UI lib happens directly on the GPU object. only situation where I use the term lib is when I shutdown the UI lib and return to prompt and that's only to place the cursor at 1, 1

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L1863[22:10:48] <sugoi> because i'm separating out multi term, it'll actually be MORE compat with that :)

L1864[22:11:41] <Sharidan> one thing I'm sorely missing is paging - the ability to save-screen/load-screen in a fast way

L1865[22:12:06] <Sharidan> doing dialogs and having to re-render everything is slow

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L1867[22:12:26] <sugoi> you could serialize the screen

L1868[22:12:26] <sugoi> how slow is that?

L1869[22:12:35] <sugoi> or serialize regions

L1870[22:12:35] <Sharidan> back in the day, I'd simply dump the textmode screenbuffer into a variable and back when I was done manipulating the screen

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L1872[22:13:19] <Sharidan> well, afaik there's no real memory buffer for what's on screen that we can access

L1873[22:13:51] <sugoi> no i was just saying something crazy like loop with a lot of gets

L1874[22:14:23] <Sharidan> yea but that's a pretty slow way of doing it, as each get eats 1 budget point out of 256 possible on a T3 card

L1875[22:14:49] <Sharidan> takes 8000 get's to parse a full 160x50 screen

L1876[22:15:04] <Sharidan> that's not taking getting colors into account

L1877[22:15:24] <sugoi> haha, man

L1878[22:15:25] <sugoi> ok

L1879[22:15:26] <Sharidan> ugh - that's 31.25 ticks it would take

L1880[22:15:34] <sugoi> didn't know the details of the cards

L1881[22:16:03] <Sharidan> I'd love something like the gpu.copy() method, but be able to either dump to /tmp or stuff in a variable

L1882[22:16:04] <sugoi> well, we'd need scala support for anything better

L1883[22:16:38] <Sharidan> true, we'd need features in the mod to do this stuff

L1884[22:17:17] <Sharidan> it's something that would come in very useful for anything with a UI

L1885[22:17:46] <Sharidan> someone posted a graphical OS of sorts on the forum. looked very nice indeed, but it was slow rendering at best

L1886[22:18:19] <Sharidan> when ever he put a dialog of sorts on screen, he had to re-render the entire desktop which took up to 10 seconds at times

L1887[22:18:41] <sugoi> did you try maxing out oc config options

L1888[22:18:45] <sugoi> just to see what it was like

L1889[22:19:23] <Sharidan> no. that's one thing I have avoided doing actually ..

L1890[22:19:47] <Sharidan> with my UI lib, I'm trying to get as good performance (rendering) as I can with the default settings

L1891[22:20:29] <Sharidan> in my CMB application, I completely rewrote my ListBox control to further render optimize it after asie gave me the graphics card budget listing

L1892[22:20:49] <Sharidan> that drastically increased the rendering speed on-screen even on lower end graphics cards

L1893[22:21:21] <Sharidan> but I'm still stuck having to re-render everything on-screen after closing a dialog that only covers parts of the screen

L1894[22:22:02] <Sharidan> having the ability to save screen to a temp file or variable and then restoring afterwards similar to how gpu.copy() works, would drastically increase the performance of UI based applications

L1895[22:22:48] <Sharidan> people are making paint programs, creating pictures etc. ... those types of apps would also benefit hugely from such a feature

L1896[22:23:25] <Sharidan> anyways, that's just me dreaming :)

L1897[22:24:33] <Izaya> All our cabling problems ever are solved

L1898[22:24:50] <Izaya> currently got a bag of ethernet cables

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L1901[23:09:41] <Sharidan> sugoi? are you still around?

L1902[23:09:46] <sugoi> yes

L1903[23:09:54] <Sharidan> excellent ..

L1904[23:10:08] <Sharidan> uhm, I wondering if you know if local functions are executed during load of a library?

L1905[23:10:21] <sugoi> executed? no

L1906[23:10:55] <sugoi> stored in memory, yes? if not referenced in any upvalue they are gc'd later

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L1908[23:11:03] <Sharidan> hmm ... so doing something like: uilib.somefunction = thisLocalFunc() ... that wont work?

L1909[23:11:15] <Sharidan> uilib would be the return table/class

L1910[23:11:28] <sugoi> that works, that would keep a reference to the function

L1911[23:11:43] <sugoi> i guess you may have been using the word "execute" differently than i was

L1912[23:12:10] <Sharidan> one thing is setting up a reference, another is having a function do it's thing - as in execute

L1913[23:12:40] <sugoi> oh i misread your example, you DID put ()

L1914[23:12:46] <Sharidan> uilib.somefunc = thisLocalFunc ... that's just a reference, where this would be executing: uilib.somefunc = thisLocalFunc()

L1915[23:12:54] <sugoi> yeah, sorry

L1916[23:13:05] <sugoi> but yeah that works fine

L1917[23:13:17] <sugoi> as long as your in the file where thisLocalFunc is defined

L1918[23:14:08] <Sharidan> yea I have a number of local construction functions, but I wasnt sure if I could leave them in uilib.lua file and still be able to run them when the lib is being loaded through require()

L1919[23:14:33] <sugoi> oh yeah, no problem

L1920[23:14:39] <Sharidan> sweet sweet :)

L1921[23:14:50] <Sharidan> thanks mate - appreciate the assist :)

L1922[23:14:59] <sugoi> :)

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L1924[23:38:16] <gamax92> Canceled classes, yay

L1925[23:38:39] <Kodos> Snow?

L1926[23:40:25] <gamax92> mmhm

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L1929[23:52:35] <Kodos> if computer.getArchitecture() ~= "Lua 5.3" works to check that, right?

L1930[23:55:46] <Sharidan> I guess ... not sure tbh

L1931[23:59:19] <gamax92> Kodos: _VERSION