OCLogs: 2022-02-03.log

Stuff goes here

L1[00:00:56] <transhohmann> How in the Kraken do I collect a mun stone?

L2[00:01:10] <transhohmann> Is a surface sample not enough?

L3[00:01:29] <transhohmann> The same goes for limestone from Minmus]

L4[00:01:31] <darsie> No. Go to one of the suggested biomes and find one, e.g. wiht a rover.

L5[00:01:33] <SporkWitch> transhohmann: i find a lot of people these days mistake their opinions for facts, and facts for opinions. (don't take this as targeted, it's just a really good and common example in the last couple years). Take not just the conflation of gender and sex, but the outright denial that biological sex even exists. You can have opinions about gender (it IS a cultural construct, literally invented by

L6[00:02:06] <transhohmann> by

L7[00:02:10] <SporkWitch> that sick SOB John Money), but sex is a biological fact, we can prove it through DNA, bone structure, etc. The argument when pointing it out though is usually claiming that saying sex exists is an opinion, when it IS a fact

L8[00:02:16] <SporkWitch> transhohmann: mun stones are a SPECIAL geological feature

L9[00:02:39] <SporkWitch> unlike the ground clutter, they're collidable and you'll get a special interaction when right clicking your kerbal to collect it

L10[00:02:47] <transhohmann> ah

L11[00:03:03] <transhohmann> I'm not sure if I can get a rover going

L12[00:03:12] <SporkWitch> best way to find them in stock (without cheating) is to zoom out and move the camera around close to the ground to try to find something that looks different than the other clutter.

L13[00:03:15] <darsie> Or you could look from a flying rocket for one, and once you found one, reload and go there more efficiently.

L14[00:03:46] <transhohmann> I have tried to build them and when testing them on kerbin I cannot get the rover wheels to move

L15[00:03:55] <SporkWitch> cheating, there's a toggle to put giant flashing red arrows over all the ones in the loaded area (think beacon waypoints in most action games)

L16[00:04:05] <transhohmann> lol

L17[00:04:13] <SporkWitch> and some mods ad better compromises, that give indications when you're close and a general sense of direction

L18[00:04:33] <SporkWitch> (one of the ones i'm running right now has a couple things intended to be mounted to planes or rovers for this purpose)

L19[00:05:34] <transhohmann> I have made upper rocket stages with wheels in order to scoot along, but rover wheels are something I have not yet figured out

L20[00:05:37] <darsie> You can move through the usual rocks, but the special ones are solid.

L21[00:06:30] <darsie> transhohmann: Try continous (non snap) mode when attaching rover wheels. And maybe mirror symmetry.

L22[00:06:33] <transhohmann> I do have a visual mod that adds more rocks to the mun, ones that you lip through

L23[00:06:48] <transhohmann> is that the circular one

L24[00:07:01] <darsie> yes

L25[00:07:05] <transhohmann> always mirror symmetry

L26[00:07:19] <transhohmann> my problem is they will not move

L27[00:07:49] <SporkWitch> note: ALWAYS use absolute snap when ROTATING wheels; any deviation from perfectly perpendicular with the ground does REALLY wonky stuff, even with strong gravity, but it goes absolutely bonkers with weak gravity

L28[00:08:09] <transhohmann> this much I know

L29[00:08:17] <transhohmann> lol

L30[00:09:06] <transhohmann> my first lander had continuous wheels on and it bounced around like a kikkerland toy

L31[00:10:38] <transhohmann> https://youtu.be/o5yZHZcxjJE

L32[00:10:46] <transhohmann> like that

L33[00:11:52] <darsie> Hmm, someone said they didn't want to give us ropes becaues their physics is too hard, but we have chutes on ropes.

L34[00:12:22] <SporkWitch> not really, it's just a visual effect

L35[00:14:29] <SporkWitch> that's why the angle betwen the chutes and the vessel can be weird, it just applies a linear drag force, as far as i can tell, no rope-like behaviour at all, it's just some lines drawn between the module and the chute graphic

L36[00:14:45] <transhohmann> thankfully

L37[00:14:57] <transhohmann> I'd have entagled myself many times

L38[00:14:59] <SporkWitch> actually USABLE ropes would be harder to do. haven't messed with the winch in KAS yet, but i'd suspect they use a similar trick

L39[00:17:21] <transhohmann> https://imgur.com/a/wxG7qcg

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L51[01:53:48] <transhohmann> KSP is now making no noise at all and I find it very disconcerting

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L59[02:03:25] <transhohmann> I lost audio because I kicked the power button on my speaker system

L60[02:08:19] <packbart> SporkWitch: "Recyclables" are resources from MKS or Interstellar? Never had those in my game. I use the workshop's recycle option mainly to convert the MaterialKit spacedrop containers into more MaterialKts. and the inline workshop after it built the mobile one. and maybe some unused craft parts after extending a build with a redesigned Kit

L61[02:08:44] <packbart> so it just makes parts go poof and MaterialKits in its containers appear

L62[02:13:21] <packbart> I fire a few containers full of MaterialKits and SpecialParts at, say, Minmus and decouple it at about the right moment so the transfer stage crashes into Minmus and the container makes a low retrograde swing-by

L63[02:14:32] <packbart> a spacecrane in orbit catches it and takes it safely-ish down to the build site or assembly line

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L70[04:11:22] <transhohmann> ;mission

L71[04:11:22] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You attempt to create a mod to add Lagrange points to the game. Jeb doesn't let you forget about it for a month.

L72[04:11:29] <transhohmann> ;mission

L73[04:11:29] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You place shims under the uneven legs of Rokker's chair, causing him to stop Rokking. The radioactive fallout will take decades to clean up.

L74[04:11:47] <transhohmann> :D

L75[04:12:07] <transhohmann> ;mission

L76[04:12:07] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You attempt to use the penrose process to power an interstellar spacecraft. RandomJeb spends the next hour trying to convince everyone that he is the real Jebediah.

L77[04:12:18] <transhohmann> ;mission

L78[04:12:18] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You violate every law of thermodynamics. You melt Kerbin's scrith shell, causing it to fall into the singularity.

L79[04:12:24] <transhohmann> ;mission

L80[04:12:24] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You put a plane inside your plane so you can crash while you crash. When asked to explain your behavior, you can only offer a sheepish chuckle and the inexplicable craving for cream cheese.

L81[04:12:48] <transhohmann> oh man that's a dunian dustwom

L82[04:13:15] <transhohmann> brain parasite specifically evolved to feed on Kerbals

L83[04:14:37] <transhohmann> victims show strange behavior and a craving of cream cheese

L84[04:15:00] <transhohmann> ;mission

L85[04:15:00] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You build a craft to cover the KSC in debris. There is a relevant xkcd made tomorrow.

L86[04:15:06] <transhohmann> ;mission

L87[04:15:06] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Mission Control asks you to do a grand tour. Mission control bans you from KSP.

L88[04:15:23] <transhohmann> mission control is a bit bipolar

L89[04:16:00] <transhohmann> ;outcome add "my bottom is full of noodles"

L90[04:16:00] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added outcome: "my bottom is full of noodles"

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L93[04:21:03] <transhohmann> ;mission add You receive a tentacle-written note from the Kraken requesting the random detachment of 8937 control surfaces, or else.

L94[04:21:04] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added mission: You receive a tentacle-written note from the Kraken requesting the random detachment of 8937 control surfaces, or else.

L95[04:22:50] <transhohmann> ;outcome add Valentina loses all of her snacks do to extreme overheating.

L96[04:22:50] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added outcome: Valentina loses all of her snacks do to extreme overheating.

L97[04:22:59] <transhohmann> due

L98[04:23:31] <transhohmann> :mission del Valentina loses all of her snacks due to extreme overheating.

L99[04:24:10] <transhohmann> ;mission del Valentina loses all of her snacks do to extreme overheating.

L100[04:24:10] <LunchBot> transhohmann: No mission found matching "Valentina loses all of her snacks do to extreme overheating.".

L101[04:24:29] <transhohmann> ?

L102[04:24:58] <transhohmann> never use dragonspeak

L103[04:25:37] <transhohmann> 50 dollars wated

L104[04:25:41] <transhohmann> wasted

L105[04:26:02] <transhohmann> So either I can type poorly or be misintterpreted

L106[04:26:21] <transhohmann> How did I even get two t's

L107[04:46:33] <transhohmann> is 3600 dv to get 4 kerbals to a mun encounter bad

L108[04:46:49] <transhohmann> with 2353 left over

L109[04:53:40] <transhohmann> moreover is 1400 enough to return form the mun's surface

L110[04:55:53] <Althego> it should be, because about 600 to orbit, and about 300 to kerbin, the rest is aero

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L112[05:08:51] <transhohmann> thanks

L113[05:15:52] <transhohmann> lol the ship autosaved before I added landing legs

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L118[05:32:43] <transhohmann> all is well except when I try to eva I pull the ship over with my weight

L119[05:34:46] <Althego> hehe

L120[05:39:29] <transhohmann> a whole craft balanced on a spark

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L135[06:00:45] <transhohmann> should the same craft be able to rescue a kerbal from minmus

L136[06:01:09] <transhohmann> i would hope so, but I have misjudged before

L137[06:01:40] <Althego> if you dont mind the time, minmus is more easily accessible

L138[06:01:55] <transhohmann> ;outcome add Capital I's, dammit!

L139[06:01:55] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added outcome: Capital I's, dammit!

L140[06:02:10] <transhohmann> I don't mind the time lol

L141[06:02:28] <transhohmann> it's the landing in the right place that concerns me

L142[06:02:33] <transhohmann> I have a recue contract

L143[06:02:38] <transhohmann> rescue

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L147[06:43:47] <transhohmann> I still don't think i should be spending 3000 dv to get into LKO

L148[06:45:00] <Althego> on earth you need closer to 10000

L149[06:46:03] <Althego> so there isnt any problem with that

L150[06:57:36] <transhohmann> I figured out my problem

L151[06:58:55] <transhohmann> I can't turn as early as I would like because my boosters imbalance my craft, but I added small motors to the ends of the booster for stabilisation for tthe turn

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L156[07:46:08] <NGC3982> im so bored

L157[07:46:57] <Althego> you are just spacing out there :)

L158[07:58:04] <transhohmann> returning to kerbin with 200dv

L159[07:58:33] <transhohmann> I'm ecstatic, as are the kerbals

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L161[08:09:11] <Althego> hehe

L162[08:14:16] <transhohmann> now for this playthrough's first docking attempt

L163[08:39:46] <transhohmann> IF I can get into orbit

L164[08:39:57] <transhohmann> TWR

L165[08:40:33] <Althego> more boosters

L166[08:42:37] <transhohmann> I switched my 3rd stage to a bobcat rather than a poodle, my first two stages are pollux boosters, drop the pollux and light the bobcat that was once a poodle

L167[08:43:03] <transhohmann> by switchem them I have raised my delta v in the hanger to 7250

L168[08:46:42] <transhohmann> switching

L169[08:47:41] <transhohmann> ;mission

L170[08:47:41] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You upload SCORPION STARE to your ship's external cameras to ward off Kraken attacks. People start complaining about Kmath's mission function.

L171[08:47:51] <transhohmann> ;mission

L172[08:47:51] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You take off your engineering hat, and put on your management hat. You are challenged to a game of drop-ball.

L173[08:48:06] <XXCoder> ;mission silly

L174[08:48:06] <LunchBot> XXCoder: Icefire gets fed up with silly missions and outcomes.

L175[08:48:16] <transhohmann> that has to be one of mine, but I don't remember doing it

L176[08:48:22] <XXCoder> lol thats not normal

L177[08:48:29] <transhohmann> but that is a soldid Adventure time reference

L178[08:48:37] <transhohmann> *solid

L179[08:48:43] <transhohmann> what's not normal

L180[08:48:57] <XXCoder> lunchbot respond to my ;mission lol

L181[08:48:59] <transhohmann> oh the bot

L182[08:49:04] <transhohmann> ;mission

L183[08:49:04] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You ask someone what is their K/D on KSP. The last thing you see is a Blue Sky of Death.

L184[08:49:05] <XXCoder> it dont have typical mission and outcome

L185[08:49:21] <transhohmann> ;mission silly

L186[08:49:21] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Icefire gets fed up with silly missions and outcomes.

L187[08:49:26] <transhohmann> oh what

L188[08:49:30] <transhohmann> ;mission silly

L189[08:49:30] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Icefire gets fed up with silly missions and outcomes.

L190[08:49:33] <transhohmann> only one

L191[08:49:41] <transhohmann> ;mission

L192[08:49:41] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You explain how the orange rocket is good. You died for failing to GET OFF MY LAWN!

L193[08:49:52] <transhohmann> the orange rocket IS good

L194[08:49:53] <XXCoder> icefire isnt here thankfully or we'd constantly pinging that guy

L195[08:50:02] <XXCoder> ;mission orange

L196[08:50:02] <LunchBot> XXCoder: You invite all four orange suits, the KSC staff, and a few dozen gray suits into an among us tournament.

L197[08:50:16] <transhohmann> nooo

L198[08:50:24] <transhohmann> ;mission orange'

L199[08:50:24] <LunchBot> transhohmann: No mission found matching "orange'".

L200[08:50:33] <transhohmann> ;mission orange

L201[08:50:33] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You explain how the orange rocket is good.

L202[08:50:36] <XXCoder> think if you use a word, it gets first result and doesnt add outcome

L203[08:50:45] <XXCoder> or random one of that word anyway

L204[08:50:59] <XXCoder> ;outcome orange

L205[08:50:59] <LunchBot> XXCoder: Self-aware kmath is taken down by a mute woman in an orange jumpsuit.

L206[08:51:08] <transhohmann> :mission exit

L207[08:51:21] <transhohmann> ;mission beans

L208[08:51:21] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You are contracted to manufacture a series of ballistic missiles for the North Kerbeans.

L209[08:51:27] <transhohmann> ha

L210[08:51:35] <transhohmann> ker-beans

L211[08:51:59] <transhohmann> ;mission explode

L212[08:52:00] <LunchBot> transhohmann: UmbralRaptor explodes, emitting all kinds of dinosaur DNA.

L213[08:52:11] <transhohmann> h o t

L214[08:52:13] <transhohmann> lmao

L215[08:52:22] <transhohmann> ;mission green

L216[08:52:22] <LunchBot> transhohmann: you listen to some music GreeningGalaxy recommended on the forums.

L217[08:52:28] <transhohmann> ;mission blue

L218[08:52:28] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You fix a wiring defect using nothing but blue electric tape.

L219[08:52:44] <transhohmann> I have some of that on my desk

L220[08:52:52] <transhohmann> ;mission purple

L221[08:52:52] <LunchBot> transhohmann: No mission found matching "purple".

L222[08:52:59] <transhohmann> atrocious

L223[08:53:34] <transhohmann> ;mission add You are sent to eve and wonder if there will be any purple rain.

L224[08:53:34] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added mission: You are sent to eve and wonder if there will be any purple rain.

L225[08:54:50] <XXCoder> ol years ago you'd been kicked quite a while ago when this channel had 700-800 people

L226[08:55:38] <transhohmann> what

L227[08:55:39] <transhohmann> oh

L228[08:55:47] <transhohmann> am I overdoing it

L229[08:56:25] <XXCoder> not really just dont do it while other people is chatting lol

L230[08:56:33] <XXCoder> of course ops may say otherwise but doubt it

L231[09:01:47] <packbart> well, it does answer to /msg iirc

L232[09:02:36] <packbart> but nah, I don't feel threatened by missions, yet ;)

L233[09:11:44] <transhohmann> yet lol

L234[09:11:53] <transhohmann> ;mission

L235[09:11:53] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You try to find a way to affect spacetime and open wormholes. Your processor irradiates you, then explodes violently.

L236[09:12:27] <transhohmann> that outcome has already occurred

L237[09:12:35] <transhohmann> it is why I have the new one

L238[09:12:41] <transhohmann> ;mission

L239[09:12:41] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You search for the Mysterious Cities of Kerbin. Fortunately, all the gray-suits were lost.

L240[09:12:49] <transhohmann> lol

L241[09:13:16] <transhohmann> :outcome add Not all who wander are lost, buy you certainly seem to be.

L242[09:14:18] <transhohmann> ;outcome add Not all those who wander are lost, but you certainly seem to be.

L243[09:14:18] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added outcome: Not all those who wander are lost, but you certainly seem to be.

L244[09:31:42] <transhohmann> ;mission

L245[09:31:42] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You upgrade your shipboard computers to Ubuntu 14.04 LTS. The video goes viral on YouTube.

L246[09:40:24] ⇦ Quits: sasamj (uid193032@id-193032.ilkley.irccloud.com) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)

L247[09:47:16] <transhohmann> ;mission

L248[09:47:16] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You retune your ASAS' PID controller. It explains everything.

L249[09:47:23] <transhohmann> ;mission

L250[09:47:23] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You attempt to land on top of the VAB from orbit. Asteroid B612 lands on KSC.

L251[09:47:45] <transhohmann> I have managed that, moistly on accident

L252[09:47:49] <transhohmann> mostly*

L253[09:48:02] <transhohmann> ;outcome add Moist.

L254[09:48:02] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Added outcome: Moist.

L255[09:48:24] <transhohmann> ;outcome moist

L256[09:48:24] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Now all of your pets have an external moisture content of 100%.

L257[09:48:41] <transhohmann> ;outcome moist

L258[09:48:41] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Now all of your pets have an external moisture content of 100%.

L259[09:48:56] <transhohmann> ;outcome Moist.

L260[09:48:56] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Moist.

L261[09:49:03] <transhohmann> ;mission

L262[09:49:03] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You leave the channel right before PrefixCactus sends you a long and detailed reply. The Kraken dines on your save file.

L263[09:49:17] <transhohmann> ;mission kraken

L264[09:49:17] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You try to recapture all your base that are belong to the Kraken.

L265[09:49:28] <transhohmann> ;mission kraken

L266[09:49:28] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You receive a tentacle-written note from the Kraken requesting the random detachment of 8937 control surfaces, or else.

L267[09:49:34] <transhohmann> yssy

L268[10:08:00] <darsie> .

L269[10:09:04] <transhohmann> /

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L271[10:34:36] <transhohmann> I feel pretty bad leaving 1600dv of fuel floating around just to expose my docking port.

L272[10:35:05] <transhohmann> Should I revert and rebuild lighter for my first station part

L273[10:36:31] <Althego> or take the whole thing to the mun

L274[10:36:40] <transhohmann> I wouldn't even leave that much behind in sandbox but in career it is a funding nightmare

L275[10:36:51] <transhohmann> you've got to be kidding me

L276[10:37:02] <transhohmann> too many word names

L277[10:37:11] <sandbox> me again

L278[10:37:26] <Althego> hehe

L279[10:37:48] <transhohmann> I mean you, you're asking for it, sandbox on a sandbox loving game ;p

L280[10:38:23] <sandbox> I had this name before KSP even existed

L281[10:38:23] <Althego> there was somebody with the name snow too

L282[10:38:35] <transhohmann> I suppose I could take it to the mun, but will still be my first time docking

L283[10:38:42] <transhohmann> that's what she said

L284[10:39:10] <transhohmann> and in any case I was thinking of building a fueling station

L285[10:39:55] <transhohmann> I find my mun encounters arent always perfect and I'd like to just try things out at home

L286[10:40:00] <transhohmann> ;mission

L287[10:40:00] <LunchBot> transhohmann: You give the flight computer a departure angle measured in degrees, forgetting that it's in radians mode. You win a hundred BadS kerbals in a bet over the outcome of your mission.

L288[10:40:11] <transhohmann> whoa

L289[10:40:23] <transhohmann> recipe for disaster

L290[10:44:19] <transhohmann> I took off 6 tons of fuel and only lost 600dv

L291[10:44:54] <transhohmann> both rather perfect mathematically and also a reminder of how wasteful I'm being

L292[11:04:53] <Althego> no, recipe for disaster is trying to transport chlorine trifluoride

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L298[12:54:33] <transhohmann> lmao

L299[12:54:44] <transhohmann> no, that's the path to destruction

L300[12:54:52] <transhohmann> :outcome destruction

L301[12:55:00] <transhohmann> ;outcome destruction

L302[12:55:00] <LunchBot> transhohmann: Your ship dubsteps itself to destruction.

L303[12:55:06] <transhohmann> lmao

L304[12:57:55] <Althego> hehe

L305[13:03:17] <SporkWitch> relevant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDlif8Km4S4

L306[13:03:20] <SporkWitch> (also, morning o/)

L307[13:04:50] <Althego> i think it would be possible to kill me with dubstep

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L309[13:05:08] <Althego> maybe i could fight it back with some chiptune

L310[13:07:00] <Mat2ch> Althego: have you ever played Saints Row IV?

L311[13:07:22] <Althego> no

L312[13:07:33] <SporkWitch> it has a dubstep cannon lol

L313[13:08:00] <Mat2ch> jip jip

L314[13:08:01] <Mat2ch> :D

L315[13:08:08] <Mat2ch> My favourite gun in it

L316[13:08:12] <SporkWitch> i actually really liked 4, though; the Matrix-y mechanics made it a blast, and its vehicle handling is soooooo much better than GTA

L317[13:08:33] <Mat2ch> but it felt so small compared to GTA...

L318[13:09:03] <Mat2ch> and GTA V was released shortly after

L319[13:11:26] ⇨ Joins: sasamj (uid193032@id-193032.ilkley.irccloud.com)

L320[13:13:08] <SporkWitch> the series was always a less in-your-face brutal GTA knock-off. That said, I really enjoyed the comedy in it. GTA5 is really funny too, but if GTA is satire, Saints Row is overt parody. And also, the driving mechanics are SOOOOOOOOO much better in Saints Row. Neither are remotely realistic, but the drift mechanic totally makes up for it by just making things easy to control.

L321[13:15:17] <Althego> i happened to play a somewhat car game last year. mad max. but i think the last car game i played before that was ignition about 25 years ago

L322[13:15:31] <Althego> and now that i think back i liked that better

L323[13:17:58] <Althego> i used to know each track inside out, back and forth (there was a mirror mode where you raced in the other direction)

L324[13:17:59] <SporkWitch> don't remember ignition. think i was playing some dos-based car game back then, totally blanking on the name. You'd do illegal street races to make money (or could even race for pink slips) to upgrade your car or build a new one. Surprising degree of customization, especially for the time. Think it wasn't until maybe GT2 or 3 that i saw another game that went to the same level of detail

L325[13:18:51] <SporkWitch> Mad Max was surprisingly not terrible, and by the standards of games based on movies or tv shows, it was outright GOOD. I wouldn't have bought it, though, I just got it free with PS+

L326[13:23:15] <Althego> adaptation between film and game in both directions are usually way below average

L327[13:23:25] <Althego> yes mad max was good

L328[13:23:47] <Althego> but i still think i liked ignition more

L329[13:24:38] <SporkWitch> i want to say there was one really good game-to-movie adaptation, but i'm totally brainfarting on what it was

L330[13:25:23] <SporkWitch> and then of course there was the original Star Wars X-Wing and Star Wars TIE Fighter games (the separate ones; x-wing vs TIE was poopy)

L331[13:26:03] <SporkWitch> IIRC X-Wing was the first video game to have fully polygonal graphics (no textures, but still, NO SPRITES during gameplay)

L332[13:26:24] <SporkWitch> (well, i'm sure they still used sprites for eplosions and such, but all the actual models were polygonal)

L333[13:26:53] <Althego> elite 2?

L334[13:27:21] <Althego> ok same year but later

L335[13:27:47] <Althego> i never played the original elite

L336[13:28:10] <SporkWitch> i never played any of the Elites

L337[13:28:30] <SporkWitch> until E:D, and it was pretty bad. Just a lot of poor design choices, and all the ships handle like crap.

L338[13:28:59] <SporkWitch> LOT of issues with Star Citizen, but at least the ships handle like SHIPS, not square-wheeled refrigerators

L339[13:29:12] <Althego> hehe

L340[13:29:46] <Althego> i handle star citizen as a scam. takes in money and never finshed

L341[13:30:02] <SporkWitch> it's not a scam, there's no malice there, it's just not well-managed

L342[13:31:05] <SporkWitch> In no small part due to their abysmal community management. Combine that with their ambitions being as high as the fans' hype, along with zero mutliplayer experience, and you get feature creep and balance issues.

L343[13:32:10] <SporkWitch> I donated while in Europe, so I could probably get my money back if I wanted to, but I'm willing to wait it out and see what happens. Even in its current state it does have a full gameplay loop and is quite playable overall.

L344[13:32:26] <SporkWitch> Worst case, my money is better off in the form of internet spaceships than USD anyway.

L345[13:32:40] <SporkWitch> I already sold a couple ships when money was tight and made a profit

L346[13:33:00] <SporkWitch> (and that was 5 years ago)

L347[13:33:52] <Mat2ch> GTA V stopped being satire and took itself far to serious

L348[13:34:22] <SporkWitch> i didn't play the single player, the online mode was just too good and fun, but it still felt like satire to me.

L349[13:34:50] <Mat2ch> GTAO is just grind. Dead cold grind.

L350[13:35:05] <SporkWitch> The heists and everything were semi-serious, but still over the top and cliche, which was the point. And the talk radio and tv shows are still just classic. I'd sit in my apt just watching the tv shows lol

L351[13:35:12] <Mat2ch> Yes, I have the penthouse in the casino.

L352[13:35:15] <Mat2ch> :D

L353[13:35:29] <SporkWitch> GTAO is definitely grindy, they want you to buy money, but once you get rolling, it's pretty easy to make plenty.

L354[13:35:40] <SporkWitch> I haven't played in a while, think the last addition was doomsday heists

L355[13:35:57] <Mat2ch> What bothered me the most are the stealth mechanics and the lag between players

L356[13:36:16] <SporkWitch> stealth mechanics were only bad if you couldn't kill people ;)

L357[13:36:18] <Mat2ch> you can't do the casino heist in stealth. We've tried for hours.

L358[13:37:18] <SporkWitch> as is usually the case, my main frustrations were with flying, though it was certainly playable, at least with fixed-wing aircraft. rotary wing can go eff themselves

L359[13:38:24] <SporkWitch> then again, rotary wing aircraft are just weird, since they behave in multiple different ways depending on horizontal speed and altitude. also, VRS is a [female dog]

L360[13:39:52] <Mat2ch> helicopters in GTA V are great. But you need a controller...

L361[13:40:08] <SporkWitch> back to kerbals: Mat2ch, you played with MKS at all?

L362[13:40:14] <Mat2ch> MKS?

L363[13:40:19] <SporkWitch> that answers that lol

L364[13:40:29] <Mat2ch> don't be like that :P

L365[13:40:31] <Mat2ch> What is MKS?

L366[13:40:39] <SporkWitch> Modular Kolonization System

L367[13:41:32] <Mat2ch> I really can't tell. I tried a few mods here and there, but if I used it it didn't stick

L368[13:41:45] <SporkWitch> you'd know if you had lol

L369[13:41:52] <Mat2ch> I'm not touching KSP anymore. The performance is too bad

L370[13:42:00] <Mat2ch> And I'm on a Ryzen 2700X...

L371[13:42:28] <Mat2ch> and since they're developing KSP2 on Unity as well, I have few hopes it'll have good performance.

L372[13:42:29] <Althego> hehe

L373[13:42:32] <SporkWitch> My load times are pretty crummy at around 3-4 minutes, but i'm running a boatload of ultra-complex mods right now

L374[13:42:57] <Mat2ch> I'm talking about vehicles with 100+ parts that are just unplayable.

L375[13:43:03] <Mat2ch> Not fun :/

L376[13:43:08] <Althego> with the complete rwrite they should have swwitched engines

L377[13:43:12] <SporkWitch> Overall game performance is acceptable for what it is. Unmodded, performance is perfectly fine for me and always was, even on my old Phenom IIx4 with 16GB RAM and GTX1060

L378[13:43:27] <SporkWitch> that's more of a RAM limitation, no?

L379[13:43:49] <SporkWitch> I've only had a couple with 100+ parts, but hadn't really noticed any issues that weren't GPU-related

L380[13:43:52] <Mat2ch> I had only a few mods, KER, MechJeb, DockingAlignmentIndicator for me last huge Jool mission.

L381[13:44:00] <SporkWitch> and those i solved by switching back to realplume instead of waterfall

L382[13:44:04] <Mat2ch> ok, the ship had 1000+ parts, but I can explain!

L383[13:44:34] <Althego> heh

L384[13:44:35] <Althego> e

L385[13:44:53] <Mat2ch> (and 1000 parts should not be a problem at all. I bet they tried to solve some NP hard problem there

L386[13:45:16] <SporkWitch> i'm in the process of rebuilding my station, since apparently i used some deprecated parts that just haven't been removed yet. I'm just building it fully in the VAB and gonna cheat it up then deorbit the old one (i lose some money, but save some time; it's not like it's my fault the parts weren't clearly labeled)

L387[13:45:46] <Althego> do you think they they will eb removed?

L388[13:45:50] <Althego> no development

L389[13:46:54] <SporkWitch> so it should scale at O(logN), if i'm not mistaken, since ships are just a tree from the root part. One of the big problems, though, is that the game uses a single thread PER SHIP, so having one ginormous ship means lots more work for a single thread.

L390[13:47:54] <SporkWitch> That's one of the reasons and benefits for MKS's logistics system letting structures "magically" move resources between each other within a short range: it allows lots of small structures, each running on its own thread, instead of needing your city-size colony to be one, connected structure running on a single thread.

L391[13:48:56] <SporkWitch> Althego: whether they remove them or not is largely immaterial, since they aren't WORKING right lol, or at least not quite right lol. Their inventories aren't being recognized correctly when dismantling parts, and i feel like they're the wrong ones since they're missing certain abilities that the documentation says they SHOULD have

L392[13:54:40] <Mat2ch> SporkWitch: O(log n) on 1000 parts is nothing for a modern computer...

L393[14:01:59] <SporkWitch> that assumes they're storing it as a btree, and not something else. But yes, no matter how they're storing it, 1000 elements is not a large number for a dataset, even 30 years ago. Heck, the dataset they had us using when we were implementing search algorithms was a few HUNDRED thousand entries, and it NEEDED to be that big just so we COULD notice a difference between our implementations and the

L394[14:02:02] <SporkWitch> built-ins

L395[14:03:10] <Mat2ch> exactly

L396[14:15:15] <Kalpa> Stop talking computer sciences :(

L397[14:15:30] <Mat2ch> How much are you paying?

L398[14:15:59] <Mat2ch> Would be a tragedy if somebody mentioned quicksort

L399[14:19:28] <Kalpa> But... bubble sort?

L400[14:20:12] <SporkWitch> ahah! the cause of my confusion is that CKAN only has 1.4.1, while the documentation includes parts added in the pre-release version

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L402[14:23:31] <Mat2ch> Kalpa: bubble sort is inefficient. Use rand sort instead.

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L404[14:24:02] <SporkWitch> bogosort!

L405[14:25:22] <Mat2ch> That one looks suspicious

L406[14:26:27] <SporkWitch> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGuJga2Gl_k

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L416[17:06:29] <Althego> kikkerikii

L417[17:13:40] <darsie> .

L418[17:40:29] <sheeep> Is it possible to rebirth killed kerbals?

L419[17:41:13] <Althego> if they are missing in action normally they respawn. but i think you can actually kill them, then they dont

L420[17:41:31] <darsie> I think you can create them with shift-F12.

L421[17:41:41] <darsie> You can load saved games.

L422[17:42:23] <darsie> You can copy them out of saved games, if you figure out how.

L423[17:42:42] <darsie> They have stats where they were, etc.

L424[17:49:21] <sheeep> got it... ty

L425[17:51:38] <darsie> yw. Which way did you go?

L426[17:52:11] <sheeep> persistent.sfs

L427[17:53:34] <sheeep> state = Missing >> state = Available

L428[17:53:55] <flayer> he's one upped ya, darsie !

L429[17:54:13] <darsie> :)

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L431[17:59:14] <Althego> launch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UY3fZ6PwuUY

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L433[18:02:43] <sheeep> nice

L434[18:12:08] <Althego> 90 sec

L435[18:14:48] *** Izaya_ is now known as Izaya

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L437[18:16:24] <sheeep> nice graphics.. which mod is that?

L438[18:16:28] <sheeep> :)

L439[18:17:25] <Althego> rss, ro, camera tool

L440[18:17:26] <Althego> s

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L442[19:00:10] <sheeep> ty for sharing

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L444[19:07:50] <Mat2ch> I missed it, but they do not show the deploy anymore :(

L445[19:08:05] <darsie> Maybe they had LOS.

L446[19:13:37] <Mat2ch> it is possible that they already know they can't show the deploy, so they stop the stream early

L447[19:13:51] <darsie> ye

L448[19:13:53] <darsie> s

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L453[20:56:45] <sheeep> does EVE make kerbin glowing that much? https://ibb.co/whV197V seems a bit much

L454[20:57:27] <darsie> It's Kerbol.

L455[20:59:24] <sheeep> the mod "EVE"

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