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L9[00:58:05] <Althego> detecting Planet 9
via a sub-relativistic spacecraft fly-by and the measure of its
Hawking radiation in the radio band
L10[00:58:09] <Althego> sound like sci-fi
to me
L11[01:00:34] <ObservatoryRaptop> Assumed:
Planet 9 is a primordial black hole, and that laser sail craft are
build/launched
L12[01:00:52] <Althego> as i said,
sci-fi
L14[01:01:38] <Althego> do we want it to be
a black hole?
L15[01:01:40] <ObservatoryRaptop> (bottom
of page 5)
L16[01:01:57] <Althego> that would make the
solar system really strange
L17[01:02:01] <ObservatoryRaptop> Some
physics people do. I'd hope for a super earth/sub neptune,
really
L18[01:02:10] <Althego> but we would gain
an insteresting object relatively close by
L19[01:02:20] <Althego> yes we need a super
earth
L20[01:02:54] <Althego> there are already
some unusual features in the solar system, the less we have, the
better it is for probable life elsewhere
L21[01:03:28] *
ObservatoryRaptop eyes the moon uneasily
L22[01:04:43] <Althego> the sun already is
not exactly the most common type, then it rotates slowly, and then
we have this unusual moon. we also dont have a super earth, and
having a black hole on top of that would be just weird
L23[01:09:07] <ObservatoryRaptop> The sun
is adequately common. I'd still wait for at least JWST (and maybe
HabEx) before making any definitive statements about the
habitability of M-dwarf planets, though
L24[01:10:55] <Althego> always only a few
years more :)
L25[01:11:42] <ObservatoryRaptop>
lolsob
L26[01:12:32] <Althego> what would the head
of nasa say if rocket with jwst exploded on the launchpad? easy
come, easy go
L27[01:13:41] <ObservatoryRaptop>
aaaaaaaaaaaaa
L28[01:19:38] <Althego> (there is this joke
where the lumberman goes each day to the forest to fell trees. he
sells the trees for a small amount of money. after 20 years he goes
into the city to gamble, puts all his money on a number, and loses.
easy come, easy go)
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L52[03:49:20] *
Deddly just watched "The first man". Why didn't they call
it "Camera shake simulator"?
L53[03:50:55] <Althego> hehe
L54[03:52:18] <Deddly> And also, when they
burn prograde in orbit, it's like warp speed
L55[03:52:48] <Deddly> The earth just zooms
off in the distance
L56[03:52:55] <Althego> hehe
L57[03:53:10] <Althego> remember the scene
from first contact when they launch the rocket?
L58[03:53:20] <Althego> and i am like: no,
you dont go straight up
L59[03:53:31] <Deddly> I don't remember
that
L60[03:53:56] <Deddly> But it was such a
long time ago since I saw that film, I wouldn't have been educated
by KSP
L61[03:54:23] <Althego> you reminded me to
this because of warp speed
L62[03:54:32] <Deddly> Ah
L63[03:55:18] <Deddly> I liked Star Wreck:
In the Pirkinning as a parody to that film
L64[03:57:19] <packbart> Aye
L65[04:07:41] <Mat2ch> Althego: with the
warp thingy you do go straight up
L66[04:07:54] <Althego> yes but it launched
on a rocket
L67[04:07:54] <Mat2ch> because you don't
need an orbit
L68[04:08:06] <Mat2ch> And old icbm
L69[04:08:18] <Althego> and in the scene
you could see them being more than 1000 km up and still going
up
L70[04:08:22] <Althego> before they went to
warp
L71[04:08:40] <Mat2ch> which is totally
possible
L72[04:08:57] <Althego> ok, what if the
warp drive fails
L73[04:09:02] <Althego> you fall back
straigth down
L74[04:09:07] <Mat2ch> yep
L75[04:09:17] <Althego> it would be still
safer to just remain in orbit
L76[04:09:25] <Mat2ch> Depends
L77[04:09:29] <Althego> also they never
explained how they survived reentry
L78[04:09:41] <Mat2ch> did you see any sign
of a rentry possibility?
L79[04:09:48] <Althego> no, not
really
L80[04:10:12] <Mat2ch> Yeah, that's what
bothers me the most
L81[04:10:19] <JVFoxy> was probably left
open for later figuring out?
L82[04:10:54] <Mat2ch> Technically you
could jump to warp when you upward motion is nearing zero
L83[04:11:03] <Mat2ch> and then jump back
at a very low altitude
L84[04:11:15] <Mat2ch> then you would fall,
but accelerate pretty slowly
L85[04:11:28] <JVFoxy> ya but any ships
ever tried warping into atmos?
L86[04:11:28] <Mat2ch> somebody should try
this in RSS :P
L87[04:11:55] <Althego> hehe
L88[04:11:59] <Althego> yes these are
viable
L89[04:12:04] <Mat2ch> JVFoxy: 200 km up is
almost no atmosphere, but falling down will be not that
deadly
L90[04:12:11] <Althego> but not really for
an early prototype
L91[04:12:33] <Althego> say i am the
inventor and i intend to launch on my own rocket. would i do it
like this? no way
L92[04:12:48] <Mat2ch> Have drogue chutes,
deploy them early
L93[04:13:35] <Mat2ch> Althego: depends of
if you wanna get back or not...
L94[04:13:40] <Mat2ch> *depends on
L95[04:15:27] <FLHerne> Althego: To be
fair, if you think it's *close* to working, falling back into the
atmosphere is the least of your potential problems
L96[04:16:04] <FLHerne> ISTR that flaky
warp drives are interesting to be around
L97[04:18:43] <JVFoxy> trying to figure out
how the ship go back down.. feeling Enterprise might have helped in
some way..?
L98[04:18:51] <Althego> istr looks like a
fortran intrinsic function
L99[04:19:37] <Althego> but again, unless
cochran was planning for a suicide, he could not have taken that
into account in his original design
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L101[04:21:01] <FLHerne> According to
Memory Alpha, effects of misconfigured warp drives can include a
"wormhole effect", hyperspatial distortions, improbably
rapid genetic mutation, or just destruction of the ship
L102[04:22:34] <FLHerne> So anyone
terribly concerned about their personal safety should just refrain
from piloting experimental warp spacecraft at all
L103[04:23:01] <JVFoxy> ah here we
go
L105[04:23:12] <FLHerne> Oh, it can also
cause time travel
L106[04:23:16] <FLHerne> of course
L107[04:23:53] <darsie> The guy in the
expanse who invented the fast drive died.
L108[04:24:28] <FLHerne> Same in the
Honorverse, I believe
L109[04:24:54] <darsie> Acceleration was
too high for him to reach out to turn the drive off.
L110[04:26:08] <JVFoxy> so.. star trek
warp drives, at least the primitive ones had issues around gravity
fields.
L111[04:37:00] <Deddly> They always do,
don't they? That's why they use impulse thrusters
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L113[04:38:51] <darsie> I thought impulse
was to get away from space stations.
L114[04:39:18] <darsie> Maybe to not tear
them apart with positive or negative space warp.
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L118[05:35:17] <TheKosmonaut> IIRC in ST
they were not allowed to use Impulse near stations.
L119[05:35:50] <TheKosmonaut> Though ST
and consistency around space maneuvering is like asking Deddly not
to be an oppressive moderator, they're incompatible.
L120[05:35:51] <darsie> How did they get
away from stations, then?
L121[05:36:19] <TheKosmonaut>
"thrusters"
L122[05:36:22] <packbart> by scraping
their hull along the dock
L123[05:36:27] <darsie> IIRC they used 1/4
impulse near stations.
L124[05:36:44] <darsie> But thrusters are
impulse.
L125[05:36:56] <Deddly> packbart, hehe, I
know that film ;)
L126[05:37:03] <TheKosmonaut> No
L127[05:37:09] <TheKosmonaut> Thrusters
and Impulse were different
L128[05:37:39] <darsie> There could be
magnetic impulse, too.
L129[05:38:15] <darsie> Or light
pressure.
L131[05:39:02] <darsie> Or, indeed,
physical contact.
L132[05:39:53] <TheKosmonaut> Inside
spacedock, the vessels in the federation were limited to thrusters
which are chemical
L133[05:40:05] <Althego> except if you are
captain kirk
L134[05:40:14] <TheKosmonaut> Althego:
that is a star trek constant
L135[05:40:24] <TheKosmonaut> All rules
apply, unless K is in the equation
L136[05:40:28] <darsie> So impulse is ion
propulsion while thrusters are chemical?
L138[05:40:47] <kmath> YouTube - Leaving
spacedock ST6.wmv
L139[05:41:04] <Althego> just got to love
uhura and spock
L140[05:41:35] <TheKosmonaut> The funny
thing w/ the movies is they always seem to just say to hell with it
when it comes to their established* propulsion/mechanical
rules
L141[05:41:45] <Deddly> TheKosmonaut, Kirk
could also use impulse and Twist drive whenever he wanted
L142[05:41:59] <Deddly> Sorry, I mean
Pirk
L143[05:42:33] <TheKosmonaut> The problem
w/ impulse is that time dilation becomes a factor
L144[05:42:51] <Althego> twist
drive?
L145[05:43:07] <Deddly> Althego, Star
Wreck :)
L146[05:43:20] <Althego> yes it is a
factor if you are using to move fast enough
L147[05:43:50] <TheKosmonaut> But again,
Impulse seems to change in every season and indeed from season to
season
L148[05:44:30] <TheKosmonaut> Then you get
Inertial Dampening systems which are super magic
L149[05:44:41] <TheKosmonaut> effectively
reducing the mass of a vessel
L150[05:46:11] <Althego> super secret
higgs field nullifier
L152[05:48:29] <packbart> 2005 even
L153[05:51:48] <Althego> hehe all too
familiar ship shapes
L154[05:54:03] <TheKosmonaut> Shot in
2.39:1 at that
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L165[06:43:56] <Judge_Dedd> the
L166[06:44:24] <Judge_Dedd> TheKosmonaut,
I always imagined inertial dampers were an application of
artificial-gravity tech
L167[06:44:41] <TheKosmonaut> Also
magic
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L169[06:46:20] <Althego> and how does
gravity change the mass?
L170[06:48:01] <flayer> i'm sleepy
L171[06:48:23] <Mat2ch> Althego: depends
on how gravity works...
L172[06:48:28] <TheKosmonaut> IDs were a
combined use of the artificial gravity and the structural integrity
field
L173[06:48:57] <Althego> ah another magic
phrase
L174[06:49:03] <Althego> what is
structural integrity field
L175[06:49:06] <TheKosmonaut>
TECHNOBABBLE
L176[06:49:10] <Judge_Dedd> Universal
translators are also magic
L177[06:49:34] <TheKosmonaut> Technobabble
is great, because every explanation just brings a new word into the
lexicon
L179[06:49:46] <Althego> also structural
integrity field is the weakest shield in tyrian
L180[06:49:51] <TheKosmonaut> You want to
realign your inertial dampeners?
L181[06:50:02] <TheKosmonaut> Try
reversing the polarization on the tachyon emitters
L182[06:50:22] <TheKosmonaut> You tachyon
emitters are not primed? Have you considered inverting the EPS
manifold pressure?
L183[06:50:30] <TheKosmonaut> No such luck
eh?
L184[06:50:39] <TheKosmonaut> Ok, here's
an idea...
L185[06:50:44] *
TheKosmonaut grabs random object
L186[06:50:49] <TheKosmonaut> this is the
ship
L187[06:51:00] *
TheKosmonaut throws ship into rubbish bin
L188[06:51:02] <packbart> shunt all power
from the life support to the deflector. that usually works
L189[06:51:15] <TheKosmonaut> now go look
inside and find a solution, because they're all pretty much
trash
L190[06:51:27] <flayer> i'm tired
L191[06:51:44] <TheKosmonaut> packbart: To
do that, you will need to manually change the particle flow by
going through 10km of Jefferies' tubes
L192[06:51:58] <TheKosmonaut> better send
the captain and first officer on such a perilous mission
L193[06:52:29] <packbart> a good sonic
screwdriver will revert the polarity of the neutron flow in a
jiffy
L194[06:52:31] <TheKosmonaut> What? You
have a superpowered android that doesnt need to breathe and is
practically indestructible?
L195[06:52:43] <TheKosmonaut> Dont send
him, keep him at the helm, operating the ship BY HAND
L196[06:52:55] <Althego> hehe
L197[06:52:57] <TheKosmonaut> You have a
holographic doctor that can literally not be killed?
L198[06:53:02] <flayer> lol
L199[06:53:09] <TheKosmonaut> Nope, he
needs to have feelings in his office for a girl that only lives 5
years
L200[06:53:14] <Althego> yes, the ship
computer should be quite capable since it can run intelligent holo
characters in its spare time
L201[06:53:22] <flayer> but the photon
emitters or some such don't reach in the jeffery tubes!
L202[06:53:41] <Althego> so why exactly do
they depend upon human interventin all the time?
L203[06:53:47] <packbart> unions
L204[06:53:50] <Althego> yes i know it
wouldnt be interesting
L205[06:53:52] <TheKosmonaut> You have a
rogue AI hologram that can leave the confines of the holodeck, is
super intelligent, and wants to find a life of its own? AND it's
taken on the personality of Dr. Moriarty from teh Sherlock HOlmes
novels?
L206[06:54:04] <TheKosmonaut> Better not
explain how he got off the holodeck
L208[06:54:22] <flayer> TheKosmonaut, they
were on the holodeck the entire time!
L209[06:54:32] <TheKosmonaut> So
holograms, like data, are used as a sort of metaphor for
racism
L210[06:54:38] <TheKosmonaut> which is why
theyre in the show to begin with
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L212[06:55:37] <TheKosmonaut> It's
revealed in an episode of VOY that the Doctor's EMH program was
refitted to mine dilithium (or some other magical element) in harsh
conditions
L214[06:56:26] <TheKosmonaut> The EMH also
proves that his program can be expanded, to the point where he is
functionally human.
L215[06:56:46] <TheKosmonaut> He can age,
if so desired
L216[06:57:00] <TheKosmonaut> He was able
to expand his knowledge through more conventional means, as
demonstrated through the show
L217[06:57:08] <flayer> sigh
L218[06:57:25] <TheKosmonaut> But
Starfleet-- humans, show that they had little to no regard for the
question of his sentience.
L219[06:57:33] <TheKosmonaut> That said,
an entirely holographic fleet would make sense
L220[06:57:52] <TheKosmonaut> There's also
an episode where a ship is more or less derelict and run by a
hologram as it limps back to home
L221[06:58:19] <TheKosmonaut> What I never
understand is how they let Barkley get away with so much through
his life
L222[06:58:29] <TheKosmonaut> THat dude
should have been locked up like 20+ times
L223[06:58:42] <Althego> was under alien
influence when he stole the ship :)
L224[06:59:02] <TheKosmonaut> Yeah, but he
also went against SF's orders to regain comms w/ voyager
L225[06:59:03] <packbart> because only he
knows how to fix "Error -23A"
L226[06:59:10] <Althego> idiotic
orders
L227[06:59:16] <TheKosmonaut> He became a
rogue intelligence that attempted to overthrow the Enterprise
L228[06:59:32] <TheKosmonaut> he had a
romantic relationship with a hologram of someone's likeness
L229[06:59:41] <TheKosmonaut> That's an
entirely different rabbithole
L230[06:59:52] <TheKosmonaut> Dude was a
freak
L231[07:00:10] <TheKosmonaut> Althego:
Yeah, the show demonstrates time and again that SF is pretty
stupid
L232[07:00:23] <Althego> the only
difference is, today we cant project our fantasies :)
L233[07:00:27] <TheKosmonaut> Though
Picard has been really beating a dead horse
L234[07:00:44] <TheKosmonaut> Which, btw,
I really enjoyed the first season
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L262[10:16:20] <sandbox> my parents saw an
AWACS in the sky today
L263[10:17:39] <sandbox> unidentified of
course
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L265[10:25:09] <Althego> hehe
L266[10:25:54] <Althego> which europe or
usa?
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L270[10:41:49] <sandbox> Althego,
british
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L276[11:21:19] <Mat2ch> but AWACS are
usually flying radar domes
L277[11:21:31] <Mat2ch> and for todays
problems it's better to have camera drones...
L278[11:21:35] <Mat2ch> well
"problems"
L279[11:23:20] <Althego> in the uk it
might have been one of the uk e-3d, not the usual e-3a that is in
europe or usa
L280[11:41:48] <Althego> hehe, xkcd. the
coax
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L282[11:46:44] <Webchat655> Helloo, I
haven't heard much about this topic but what is the aerodynamics of
KSP 2 going to be like? Will there be more parts etc etc?
L283[11:47:26] <raptop> we don't
know
L284[11:47:55] <raptop> I mean, the devs
are talking about more parts on the propulsion side, and having
stuff to do on other worlds, but beyond that...
L285[11:47:57] <Althego> at this point we
can be happy if ksp 2 happens at all
L286[11:48:31] <raptop> Anyway, FAR exists
for a reason
L287[11:59:01] <packbart> ah, the
atmosphere. that pesky barrier between launchpad and space
L288[12:00:03] <raptop> It does help with
slowing down at least. Shame about the heat
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L290[12:14:30] <packbart> well, use a
sterling generator to power the EM drive for landing
L291[12:14:58] <Althego> stirling?
L292[12:15:14] <packbart> oops,
right
L293[12:15:22] <packbart> not the silver
coin
L294[12:18:21] <Althego> i never liked the
stirling generator in surviving mars
L295[12:26:55] <umaxtu> I'm picturing Jim
Sterling turning a crank
L296[12:30:40] <UmbralRaptor> Yes, that's
definitely how it works
L297[12:51:10] ⇦
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L298[12:51:22] <raptop> Bah, no
althego
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L300[13:03:48] <hatrix> what's the line of
sight of KSC for commnet?
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L302[13:04:05] <hatrix> it appears I can
connect even though I can't technically see the KSC
L303[13:04:52] <raptop> Uh, there's a
setting for over the horizon capability, and it's a bit more of
planets with atmospheres
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L305[13:06:41] <hatrix> I'm trying to get
the maximum distance that needs to be covered by a sat in orbit for
the commnet
L306[13:08:45] <packbart> yeah, commnet
sees Kerbin some 25% smaller by default. occlusionMultiplierAtm =
0.75
L307[13:09:00] <packbart> if that's what I
think it is
L308[13:09:08] <hatrix> ooh ok nice
L309[13:09:19] <packbart> hmm, no that's a
weird way to look at it
L310[13:09:38] <packbart> anyway, you
could argue that the radiowaves propagate in the atmosphere around
the curve
L311[13:10:14] <packbart> I'm not sure
what the base radius is. could be just to account for terrain
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L317[13:24:47] <packbart> possibly. I'm
just going by the name of the parameter and I've seen commnet lines
passing through the surface. I don't how it works exactly :)
L318[13:25:39] <hatrix> yeah should be
fine
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L321[13:35:58] <flayer> haha, kerbals can
climb on another
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L325[13:39:51] <hatrix> ≃ 3492 km for a
geosync orbit (2863 km)
L326[13:40:22] <hatrix> ah no, how does
the radius work here
L327[13:40:34] <packbart> actually,
occlusionMultiplierVac = 0.9 by default
L328[13:40:47] <packbart> though I tend to
set it to 1
L329[13:41:55] <hatrix> ok I'll restrict
myself, I'll just assume the SOI is at 90°
L330[13:44:51] <packbart> huh. Line of
sight and loss of signal share the same acronym. from LOS to
LOS
L331[13:45:03] <hatrix> euh oups
L332[13:45:14] <hatrix> I was thinking
about "li"-ne
L333[13:45:20] <hatrix> and then
"of"
L334[13:46:34] <packbart> my parser came
up with two alternatives, both valid
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L338[14:24:34] <Mat2ch> it's
animated!
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L349[15:34:39] <darsie> joining the two
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L351[15:46:46] <darsie> Mun surface*
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L357[17:09:30] <JVFoxy> any of you file
after mission reports on the KSP forums? Been giving some thoughts
about being a bit more active there too
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