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<Night's Edge> wtf...?
L4[01:01:38]
<Night's Edge> Why is this what
comes through now of all times...?
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L10[08:09:29]
<crazyminer63> Why did I just now find
this. And I wonder why he disappeared off of youtube.
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L13[11:46:25]
<fLAK>
@texaswriter @CovertJaguar thanks
L14[11:53:16]
<fLAK>
btw I just noticed there's two different booster tracks, the
vanilla one, and one added by RC, what's the difference?
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L19[11:55:20]
<liach>
@fLAK rc ones are based on kits. you don't need to craft the
rc one; you can just place the booster kit on the regular
tracks
L20[11:56:20]
<fLAK>
yeah but do the vanilla one and RC one function the same?
L21[12:02:00]
<liach>
rc ones drop the kit when broken and turns into track; vanilla ones
just drop itself
L22[12:02:09]
<liach>
function should be the same
L23[12:02:54]
<fLAK>
interesting, ok thanks
L24[12:27:34]
<liach>
prefer rc ones. rc ones (booster track kit) can be applied on
abandoned/wooden/electric track types
L25[12:27:51]
<liach>
and high speed as well
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L28[12:51:10]
<fLAK>
are electric reinforced tracks planned?
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L35[15:11:04] <travis-ci>
Railcraft/Railcraft#205 (mc-1.12.2 - e919b75 : Trinsdar): The build
passed.
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L38[17:10:40]
<liach>
i would like to see it as well. easy to add in theory
L39[17:47:33]
<fLAK>
also maybe buff reinforced tracks a bit, like have them 150% speed
of normal tracks since HS are 300%?
L40[17:49:15]
<fLAK>
I'll post the suggestion on github tomorrow after work
L41[17:56:48]
<LuigiHutch> I believe thats an
intentional design decision
L42[18:25:13]
<CovertJaguar> no... its actually a
design limitation
L43[18:25:26]
<CovertJaguar> any faster and tracks
just kind of stop being tracks
L44[18:25:49]
<CovertJaguar> the simulation speed
just isn't fast enough to keep up
L45[18:26:02]
<CovertJaguar> its why HS tracks are
the way they are
L46[18:27:47]
<CovertJaguar> I buffed the reinforced
track as high as I could and maintain reliability, even then I had
to use a dynamic speed controller to adjust max speed for slopes
and corners
L47[18:31:33]
<CovertJaguar> I'm fairly certain
the default track speed of 0.4 tiles per tick was choses
specifically because it fastest the simulation could support
L48[18:32:19]
<CovertJaguar> I'm fairly certain
the default track speed of 0.4 tiles per tick was chosen
specifically because it fastest the simulation could support
[Edited]
L49[18:32:33]
<CovertJaguar> I'm fairly certain
the default track speed of 0.4 tiles per tick was chosen
specifically because it was the fastest the simulation could
support [Edited]
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L51[18:53:22] <travis-ci>
Railcraft/Railcraft#206 (mc-1.12.2 - 876c187 : CovertJaguar): The
build passed.
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L56[19:18:22] <travis-ci>
Railcraft/Railcraft#207 (mc-1.12.2 - cc07e4a : CovertJaguar): The
build passed.
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(travis-ci!~travis-ci@ec2-54-80-227-188.compute-1.amazonaws.com)
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L60[19:24:07]
<liach>
the simulation can support fast boats on ice, so i think fast
minecarts are possible
L61[19:24:16]
<fLAK>
how do the HS tracks go so fast if a design limitation prevents
reinforced tracks from going half their speeds?
L62[19:24:41]
<fLAK>
less than half actaully
L63[19:24:59]
<liach>
because hs tracks only go straight
L64[19:25:25]
<liach>
if hs track goes on corners, wo don't simulate but explode the
cart
L65[19:26:03]
<fLAK>
so if you didn't explode the cart then the game would crash or
something?
L66[19:27:01]
<liach>
no, the cart will glitch off track
L67[19:27:37]
<fLAK>
so where's the limitation, is it the game's
tickrate?
L68[19:27:41]
<liach>
sonetimes the carts even fail to explode; they just go straight
until hitting block
L69[19:28:19]
<liach>
yes. if your speed is over 1block/tick the rail you pass might be
missed and fail to function
L70[19:29:11]
<fLAK>
is there anyway to raise the tickrate, and would it be practical to
do so?
L71[19:29:43]
<liach>
lol no
L72[19:30:13]
<liach>
many minecraft servers cannot even run at 20 tps
(ticks/second)
L73[19:30:25]
<fLAK>
I know that csgo servers are normally 128 tick (except for plebeian
valve servers) but I would assume there's much less going on
that needs to be processed
L74[19:30:57]
<fLAK>
and in that case the precision of a high tick rate is
possible
L75[19:31:21]
<liach>
in fact, in newer versions, motion has been more reliable without
change in tickrate
L76[19:31:29]
<liach>
e.g. elytra ice boating
L77[19:31:56]
<liach>
elytra is so fast: it is faster than arrows or ender pearls!
L78[19:33:20]
<CovertJaguar> elystra and boats
don't really need to inspect every block they travel
over
L79[19:33:28]
<CovertJaguar> minecart do
L80[19:34:27]
<CovertJaguar> a boat can skip several
blocks of ice and not care, but if a minecart skips several tracks,
well... it might no longer have any track under it
L81[19:36:22]
<liach>
@CovertJaguar apparently you cannot go through block corners with
boats, so i guess we may look at those code
L82[19:36:42]
<CovertJaguar> its not even over 1
block per tick, its over 0.5 blocks per tick that things start
falling apart, reinforced are set to 0.6, and they run inspection
on coming tracks to detect corners and slopes in order to slow down
to 0.4 in time to encounter them
L83[19:38:02]
<fLAK>
maybe you can group sets of rails together logically in their own
"chunks"
L84[19:38:02]
<CovertJaguar> @liach the collision
algorithm is more forgiving, as it will move the boat back out of a
block collision until its no longer colliding or something like
that
L85[19:38:04]
<fLAK>
umm
L86[19:38:18]
<fLAK>
idk how to explain this properly
L87[19:39:18]
<CovertJaguar> I might be able to push
the reinforced a little higher, but then you will find that locking
tracks and such become unreliable
L88[19:39:35]
<liach>
hmm, can we make air colliding blocks in a cart is on track
L89[19:39:51]
<CovertJaguar> I dont know what that
means
L90[19:41:45]
<liach>
so that we can use forgiving collision logic
L91[19:43:41]
<CovertJaguar> well part of the
problem is already that on up slopes the cart will collide with the
block under the track if its going to fast
L92[19:44:01]
<CovertJaguar> down slopes are pretty
safe, but not up slopes
L93[19:45:23]
<liach>
can't we add loops in the cart update code
L94[19:45:26]
<fLAK>
or maybe you could make a rail line its own logical network, for
example all rails connected together form a "line", carts
on the line will know exactly where every turn and change in
elevation is and when in motion will perform the correct movements
without needing to perform constant block checks to find the next
rail
L95[19:45:31]
<CovertJaguar> the only way to solve
this is to further expand the dynamic speed controller to slow down
on anything that isn't a simple straight piece of normal
track
L96[19:45:43]
<liach>
so the velocity vector is split to unit vectors
L97[19:46:03]
<CovertJaguar> it _might_ be possible
to tick carts twice... but that a is a huge headache
L98[19:46:19]
<CovertJaguar> it would help with a
lot of things like cart shuffling probably, but.... ugh
L99[19:47:03]
<fLAK>
do I make any sense at all?
L100[19:47:09]
<liach>
i don't mean to tick twice. i just want to handle velocity
more reliably, nothing else.
L101[19:47:52]
<liach>
@fLAK the line calculation is a bit costly. if we can make that, we
have already made a omnipotent signal system
L102[19:48:17]
<CovertJaguar> @fLAK I understand what
you are saying, ie remove the simulation to be external to the
world and handle it all ourselves, that's been discussed with
regards to train derpyness, but again.... ugh lot of work and very
complex
L103[19:49:30]
<CovertJaguar> carts don't have
"velocity" right now, they have momentum, from which
velocity is calculated
L104[19:50:31]
<fLAK>
I mean you don't need for the "line" to poll
constantly for changes in the line, you could have any new track
piece added on to trigger an update to the layout or
something
L105[19:51:13]
<fLAK>
and when tracks break they cause a trigger to update the line
L106[19:52:03]
<CovertJaguar> yes, there are ways to
do it, its possible, but it almost needs to be its own thread and
then everything would have to be rewritten to support it and then
we have simulate so much of the current behiavor we currently get
from Minecraft and it just turns into a boondoggle
L107[19:52:54]
<CovertJaguar> that's the kind of
bottomless hole I could jump into for a year and still not quite
have it right at the end
L108[19:53:02]
<liach>
don't all entities have motion?
L109[19:53:17]
<CovertJaguar> I don't know much
about living entities
L110[19:54:29]
<fLAK>
imagine if we had this kind of system already in the vanilla game,
we could have multi-block turns and other cool shit
L111[19:54:38]
<CovertJaguar> probably yes
L112[19:55:35]
<fLAK>
like the high speed rails making large shallow curves around
obstacles
L113[19:55:40]
<liach>
uh, not really. i don't want to make railcraft
immersiverailroading, a mod ij which every track block is a ticking
te
L114[19:56:11]
<fLAK>
is that a thing?
L115[19:56:38]
<liach>
imo we can just add other flags to cart data to handle big
turns
L116[19:56:46]
<CovertJaguar> well playing devils
advocate, you probably don't have to do it with a ticking TE,
just look at the Charge network and how it works
L117[19:58:11]
<fLAK>
then again, these problems would all be avoided if MC ran at even a
slightly higher tick rate
L118[19:58:31]
<fLAK>
would even 64 or 32 tick/s make a difference?
L119[19:58:45]
<CovertJaguar> I'd love to have a
super reliable train physics simulator, but once you start getting
to that point, its probably almost easier to just write a new game
from scratch that already supports what you need
L120[19:59:08]
<CovertJaguar> yeah, most games run at
a minimum of 60 ticks per second, it would make a huge
difference
L121[19:59:53]
<CovertJaguar> but to achieve that,
Minecraft would have break everything it currently does in a tick
into different threads
L122[20:00:15]
<CovertJaguar> break it into smaller
chunks and run it in parallel
L123[20:00:33]
<fLAK>
well hey, since microsoft seem content with breaking the game every
fucking patch, why the hell not lol
L124[20:01:07]
<CovertJaguar> well they did move
chunk loading and world saving to its own thread thankfully, which
helped smooth the game out a lot
L125[20:01:33]
<fLAK>
oh btw I see you implemented the laser rails I suggested like 7
years ago on the MC forums thread
L126[20:01:39]
<CovertJaguar> and each dimension now
operates in their own thread as well
L127[20:01:47]
<fLAK>
thanks for that
L128[20:01:59]
<CovertJaguar> haha, yeah they've
been around for a couple years
L129[20:02:26]
<fLAK>
man I forgot I even suggested that until I saw them just now in
jei
L130[20:03:24]
<liach>
we need a steam bridge!
L131[20:03:35]
<fLAK>
I think my in-game name was Tr1gg3r_F1ng3r9 or Deathguise back
then
L132[20:03:51]
<liach>
you promised it in forums (minecraftforum)
L133[20:04:12]
<liach>
yeah, laser track was an advancement
L134[20:04:26]
<liach>
lol no, a patreon goal
L135[20:04:46]
<CovertJaguar> oh right, I forgot
about that
L136[20:04:57]
<CovertJaguar> its basically just a
reskin
L137[20:06:11]
<liach>
i hope to see two or three housing (not head) signals like those
used by union pacific or bnsf
L138[20:06:16]
<CovertJaguar> the laser tracks were
on the minecraft forum "todo list" from nearly the
beginning
L139[20:06:47]
<liach>
they are in essence iron tracks
L140[20:07:33]
<CovertJaguar> I'll need a
picture to understand what you mean by houing
L141[20:07:41]
<CovertJaguar> I'll need a
picture to understand what you mean by housing [Edited]
L142[20:08:15]
<CovertJaguar> speaking of which....
all the wayobject TESRs are broken, yay -.-
L143[20:08:44]
<CovertJaguar> probably some stupid on
line fix somewhere
L144[20:09:01]
<CovertJaguar> probably some stupid
one line fix somewhere [Edited]
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L146[20:10:01]
<CovertJaguar> yep, the main reason I
can't even consider big projects like a sim rewrite is because
the rest of mod is currently held together with duck tape and
chewing gum xD
L147[20:13:19]
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L148[20:14:16]
<Natesky9> And quickly running out of
duct tape
L149[20:15:29]
<fLAK>
found a way into my forum account, fuck u twitch
L150[20:15:37]
<fLAK>
and found the post
L152[20:17:49]
<CovertJaguar> oh look, three posts
down my very first post about the entity dupe bug!
L153[20:18:13]
<CovertJaguar> which might finally be
fixed now, seven years later xD
L154[20:18:22]
<CovertJaguar> which might finally be
fixed now, eightyears later xD [Edited]
L155[20:18:22]
<fLAK>
hahaha great
L156[20:18:31]
<CovertJaguar> which might finally be
fixed now, eight years later xD [Edited]
L157[20:19:37]
<fLAK>
huh, I forgot about the wooden and stone posts, what happened to
them?
L158[20:19:54]
<liach>
aren't the basic posts back?
L159[20:20:19]
<CovertJaguar> I think the hold up was
not knowing how to handle the emblem post and not having a stone
post model
L160[20:20:30]
<CovertJaguar> the painted metal posts
were restored
L161[20:20:47]
<liach>
the emblems can delay a bit
L162[20:20:56]
<CovertJaguar> they need to be
flattened is what needs to be done
L163[20:21:18]
<liach>
we can add models to emblems and load models with some client hooks
like that teisr
L164[20:21:57]
<fLAK>
I see, oh and it turns out I wasnt the first to suggest the laser
rails, I apparently suggested the abandoned tracks and
droppers
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L166[20:22:26]
<liach>
droppers?
L167[20:22:38]
<CovertJaguar> disposal tracks?
L168[20:22:42]
<fLAK>
yeah that
L169[20:23:05]
<fLAK>
*it's something*
L170[20:26:00]
<liach>
i joined the rc team because i saw a reinforced track in some 1.4.7
ftb modpack and was immediately attracted to it. then i started
playing railcraft and now becomes a dev from a contributor and a
translator
L172[20:29:11]
<fLAK>
some things just sound better in my head...
L173[20:33:21]
<CovertJaguar> you have _no idea_ how
many people _begged_ me to let rails climb walls and run upside
down on ceilings, I eventually had to put up info notices saying
"no, this isn't happening"
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L177[20:40:42] <travis-ci>
Railcraft/Railcraft#208 (mc-1.12.2 - 9932f4b : CovertJaguar): The
build passed.
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L180[20:40:43]
<fLAK>
lol
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L182[20:41:48]
<fLAK>
oh do you remember the turntable suggestion?
L184[20:42:38]
<fLAK>
I feel like that could be made into some overly complicated
multi-block just for the fuck of it
L185[20:42:43]
<liach>
@CovertJaguar for the running on ceilings, traincarts is actually
doing that
L186[20:43:46]
<CovertJaguar> yeah, remember that,
its not super practical though, but I guess it could be
"done"
L187[20:46:41]
<fLAK>
also that suggestion I made wasn't to have carts run upside
down, I was thinking more like, you know like in donkey kong
country where they had those rails hanging down from rods in the
ceiling and you rode in the cart upright.
L188[20:47:03]
<fLAK>
also that suggestion I made wasn't to have carts run upside
down, I was thinking more like in donkey kong country where they
had those rails hanging down from rods in the ceiling and you rode
in the cart upright. [Edited]
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