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L7[02:20:43] <Dread_Boy> I'm playing Railcraft in 10.0.1 on 1.10.2 and I'm missing switch rails and switch levers. All modules are enabled. Are they just not ported yet or is something wrong with my modpack?
L8[02:20:57] <Dread_Boy> I'm playing Railcraft 10.0.1 on 1.10.2 and I'm missing switch rails and switch levers. All modules are enabled. Are they just not ported yet or is something wrong with my modpack?
L9[02:21:01] <bballboy2002> not ported
L10[02:21:02] <CovertJaguar> not ported yet, currently working on it
L11[02:21:55] <Dread_Boy> ok, thanks for quick answer ? Is there currently a way to route minecarts, I tried vanilla method but it doesn't seem to work?
L12[02:22:08] <bballboy2002> not yet
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L14[02:22:16] <bballboy2002> thats what i miss most from 1.7 xD
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L17[04:09:19] <yepidoodles> Try the mod Signals
L18[04:09:49] <yepidoodles> https://mods.curse.com/mc-mods/minecraft/245824-signals
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L30[07:39:50] <Swehunter2000> Hi, quick question, is Junction tracks missing, or have they changed name to something else?
L31[07:40:08] <bballboy2002> not ported
L32[07:40:15] <Swehunter2000> Hi, quick question, is Junction tracks missing, or have they changed name to something else? Playing Direwolf20 1.5.1 (mc 1.10.2)
L33[07:40:21] <Swehunter2000> okay, thx ?
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L42[09:29:44] <GeneralCamo> https://github.com/CovertJaguar/Railcraft/issues/377
L43[09:29:55] <GeneralCamo> I am feeling I should probably do this bit myself
L44[09:30:05] <GeneralCamo> Since the code is semi-open now and that is a possibility
L45[09:31:29] <GeneralCamo> Some specifics:
L46[09:32:55] <GeneralCamo> -Each track should store an amount of Water (or fluid dict equivalent). This should have a decreasing amount to simulate evaporation, perhaps 1mb/t?
L47[09:33:38] <GeneralCamo> -Steam Locomotives have the ability to pick up water, assuming they are going at a speed of at least level 2.
L48[09:34:27] <GeneralCamo> -When a steam locomotive goes over a trough track, it should collect water at a steady rate. Some of the water should be wasted. I'm thinking a third of water could disappear to simulate this by default. This could also be speed dependent
L49[09:34:48] <GeneralCamo> -Troughs are available for wooden, basic, and advanced track. High speed track and electric track will not have trough tracks.
L50[09:35:30] <GeneralCamo> Any thoughts on this?
L51[09:38:46] <Forecaster> probably simpler to just have them pick up x amount once per block they pass over if going at the right speed
L52[09:39:20] <Forecaster> not sure there's a point to having water evaporation given how easy water generation is most of the time
L53[09:39:34] <bballboy2002> ^
L54[09:40:00] <GeneralCamo> That's fair
L55[09:40:18] <GeneralCamo> I was thinking more compatibility with some hard mode configs
L56[09:40:26] <GeneralCamo> Ones that disable infinite water
L57[09:40:40] <GeneralCamo> GregTech and chickenbones' old hack comes to mind
L58[09:40:51] <Forecaster> I use that, water is still pretty easy to get
L59[09:41:12] <GeneralCamo> Alright, then waste only
L60[09:41:21] <GeneralCamo> (Less laggy that way thinking about it)
L61[09:41:28] <Forecaster> I think the constant overhead of the evaporation is unecessary
L62[09:41:37] <GeneralCamo> Was just thinking that
L63[09:41:40] <Forecaster> the loss when picking up sounds fine
L64[09:41:57] <GeneralCamo> So what is MrConductor?
L65[09:42:05] <GeneralCamo> It's a link of some sort
L66[09:42:06] <Forecaster> A Discord relay
L67[09:42:07] <GeneralCamo> But to what?
L68[09:42:12] <bballboy2002> IRC <-> Discord relay
L69[09:42:14] <GeneralCamo> Ahh, link to Discord?
L70[09:42:23] <bballboy2002> yep
L71[09:42:25] <GeneralCamo> I find that easier than IRC sometimes
L72[09:42:33] <Forecaster> it connects a channel in the Railcraft discord server to the irc channel
L73[09:43:10] <Forecaster> should be a link to it in the topic
L74[09:43:12] <GeneralCamo> Well hi
L75[09:43:14] <GeneralCamo> Thanks
L76[09:43:50] <Forecaster> Hello :P
L77[09:43:53] <GeneralCamo> It's been YEARS since I modded in Java though
L78[09:43:54] <Forecaster> <:railcraft:283729771219648512>
L79[09:44:03] <GeneralCamo> So... I need to download eclipse and figure out Java again
L80[09:44:09] <GeneralCamo> I remember some of the functions at least
L81[09:44:22] <Forecaster> I'd recommend IntelliJ Idea
L82[09:44:30] <GeneralCamo> I just don't know the specifics of setting it up for minecraft (Plus it probably changed since minecraft 1.7.10
L83[09:45:21] <Forecaster> I don't know about eclipse, but with Idea all you need to do is pull the code from github, then import it into Idea as a gradle project
L84[09:45:35] <GeneralCamo> Alright IntelliJ it is
L85[09:45:44] <GeneralCamo> I have TortoiseGIT for that
L86[09:45:46] <Forecaster> you can even check a project out from github directly
L87[09:45:51] <Forecaster> in Idea
L88[09:46:01] <GeneralCamo> Hmm, good to hear that Idea has Git integration
L89[09:46:16] <GeneralCamo> I think I'll stick to TortoiseGIT though since it has explorer integration
L90[09:46:31] <Forecaster> I use SourceTree for most git stuff
L91[09:46:35] <Forecaster> Idea for the rest
L92[09:47:04] <GeneralCamo> Well, before I do anything, I need to do some texture work
L93[09:47:13] <GeneralCamo> (Though I guess I could just use placeholders)
L94[09:50:01] <Vexatos> <:rail_turn_se:283732833195917321> <:rail_h:283735743375998987> <:rail_h:283735743375998987> <:rail_h:283735743375998987> <:rail_turn_sw:283732833019625474>
L95[09:50:01] <Vexatos> <:rail_v:283735471660466176> ? ? ? <:rail_v:283735471660466176>
L96[09:50:01] <Vexatos> <:rail_turn_ne:283732833351237632> <:rail_h:283735743375998987> <:rail_h:283735743375998987> <:rail_h:283735743375998987> <:rail_turn_nw:283732833066024962>
L97[09:50:03] <GeneralCamo> Putting troughs on the tracks shouldn't be TOO hard, though I need to think of semi-balanced recipes for the things
L98[09:50:05] <GeneralCamo> Oh?
L99[09:50:31] <GeneralCamo> (Hey Vex, long time no see)
L100[09:50:55] <Vexatos> <:rail_turn_se:283732833195917321><:rail_h:283735743375998987><:rail_h:283735743375998987><:rail_h:283735743375998987><:rail_turn_sw:283732833019625474>
L101[09:50:56] <Forecaster> I'd use water tank sidings in the recipe
L102[09:50:56] <Vexatos> <:rail_v:283735471660466176>???<:rail_v:283735471660466176>
L103[09:50:56] <Vexatos> <:rail_turn_ne:283732833351237632><:rail_h:283735743375998987><:rail_h:283735743375998987><:rail_h:283735743375998987><:rail_turn_nw:283732833066024962>
L104[09:51:10] <Forecaster> you end up with extra ones after making a tank
L105[09:51:30] <GeneralCamo> Well it definitely needs to be more expensive than a liquid loader
L106[09:51:36] <GeneralCamo> So that sounds like a good start
L107[09:51:40] <Forecaster> why?
L108[09:51:56] <GeneralCamo> It's more "advanced" than a liquid loader in a sense
L109[09:52:03] <Forecaster> mm not really
L110[09:52:12] <GeneralCamo> (Though I guess the fact that you need more than one already makes it more expensive)
L111[09:52:12] <Forecaster> if it's limited to water and locomotives
L112[09:52:29] <Forecaster> plus takes up a lot more space
L113[09:53:36] <GeneralCamo> Alright
L114[09:57:36] <GeneralCamo> I'm going to take some time to brainstorm this whole thing in a document or something
L115[09:57:42] <GeneralCamo> Recipes mainly, but also some specifics
L116[09:57:51] <Forecaster> kay
L117[10:20:31] <GeneralCamo> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UDWOBMxBfmJRDV5gYJX-Mb9E-GsFqXLQ4Fol4ncsUz8/edit?usp=sharing
L118[10:20:45] <GeneralCamo> Also realized that perhaps we might need some piping in this mod...
L119[10:20:59] <GeneralCamo> But the basic recipes are there
L120[10:21:57] <bballboy2002> Railcraft will probably never have pipes as there are already so many mods that have them, but maybe not a bad idea to have them exist but be disabled when a different pipe is detected
L121[10:22:03] <bballboy2002> from another mod
L122[10:22:12] <GeneralCamo> Perhaps.
L123[10:22:42] <GeneralCamo> I was thinking something simple
L124[10:22:53] <GeneralCamo> I know a lot of mods have them however
L125[10:23:01] <GeneralCamo> CovertJaguar would probably judge that
L126[10:23:32] <GeneralCamo> But I was thinking about a pipe that is compatible with Support Frames, similar to Shunting Wire
L127[10:23:46] <bballboy2002> aha
L128[10:23:48] <GeneralCamo> If we could have pipes that can ONLY carry water, even better
L129[10:23:53] <bballboy2002> you might be on to something
L130[10:24:22] <GeneralCamo> I do have a recipe for Wooden support Frames, which are cheaper than the current wire support frames (which I suggested be renamed to metal support frames)
L131[10:24:43] <GeneralCamo> Those can only carry pipes, no wiring
L132[10:25:41] <Forecaster> we have tank carts
L133[10:25:43] <Forecaster> :P
L134[10:26:11] <Forecaster> there has been talk of pipes at some point though
L135[10:26:15] <bballboy2002> I think he is talking about keeping the troughs supplied without other mods
L136[10:27:31] <Forecaster> tank carts :P
L137[10:28:01] <bballboy2002> that kinda defeats the whole purpose of the troughs
L138[10:28:24] <Forecaster> you don't have to use a locomotive....
L139[10:28:42] <bballboy2002> but then how would it move?
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L141[10:28:45] <Forecaster> just feed the trough from a nearby water tank with tank carts and booster tracks
L142[10:29:01] <Vexatos> furnace carts? :>
L143[10:29:13] <bballboy2002> furnace carts cant be automated xD
L144[10:33:28] <Forecaster> https://github.com/CovertJaguar/Railcraft/issues/675
L145[10:33:33] <Forecaster> I think this is what I was thinking about
L146[10:37:25] <Vexatos> They can
L147[10:37:36] <Vexatos> you just need something that can click entities :3
L148[10:37:58] <bballboy2002> we're talking about just Railcraft and vanilla
L149[10:38:24] <bballboy2002> with other mods there would be pipes and this whole conversation is irrelevant
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L152[11:10:58] <GeneralCamo> I'm thinking consistency with the electric rail. Troughs are basically lower tech electric rails
L153[11:11:37] <GeneralCamo> Using a different system could complicate it for the end user
L154[11:18:45] <Forecaster> uh, that's not really what they are
L155[11:18:51] <Forecaster> unless you're talking code wise
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L158[12:38:26] <GeneralCamo> Well in terms of refueling
L159[12:38:39] <GeneralCamo> Pans refuel steam locomotives
L160[12:38:47] <GeneralCamo> Third Rails refuel electric locomotives
L161[12:43:48] <Xilandro> Pans?
L162[12:44:53] <Forecaster> the water trough tracks
L163[12:47:50] <neptunepink> err, are those in RC now?
L164[12:48:12] <neptunepink> Is there any way to put coal on a moving train I wonder?
L165[12:49:42] <Forecaster> no they're not
L166[12:50:08] <Forecaster> it's an idea at the moment :P
L167[12:51:49] <Xilandro> neptunepink, you're better off prefilling with solid fuel, and using a water tank refuel station
L168[12:51:57] <Xilandro> Solid fuel will last longer than the water will
L169[12:56:20] <GeneralCamo> Pan Tracks are on the RoadMap for RC
L170[12:56:43] <GeneralCamo> I figured since I'm back and I suggested the things in the first place that I should go ahead and do them to take care of them for the next major release
L171[12:57:23] <GeneralCamo> NeptunePink: No there isn't. Generally solid fuel lasts longer than water though, so this is really only for long trips that you don't want the trains to stop
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L173[12:58:03] <GeneralCamo> Just like the real pans that were installed in Britain during the late 1800s early 1900s
L174[12:59:07] <GeneralCamo> I'm looking up more specifics
L175[12:59:59] <GeneralCamo> Apparently they used to freeze up in snow. Not sure if I should implement that somehow
L176[13:00:04] <GeneralCamo> That might be more annoying than anything
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L182[13:22:05] <bballboy2002> It could be interesting, and placing torches would get rid of it just like with vanilla ice
L183[13:23:18] <Forecaster> I don't see the value in that
L184[13:23:42] <Forecaster> people would just put torches next to the tracks, which would melt the snow around it making it look ugly
L185[13:23:52] <bballboy2002> true
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L203[17:26:20] <GeneralCamo> I'm an idiot
L204[17:26:25] <GeneralCamo> I completely forgot about the new kit system
L205[17:26:38] <GeneralCamo> My recipes (except for the fluid pipe) are invalid as a result
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L209[18:00:34] <Forecaster> oh yeah, I was going to mention that, but got distracted
L210[18:00:36] <Forecaster> sorry
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L215[19:05:07] <CovertJaguar> @GeneralCamo We discussed troughs here once, it was generally agreed that the best implementation was a block that you put under the tracks rather than a track itself
L216[19:05:21] <CovertJaguar> this solves the pipe issue rather elegantly.
L217[19:08:22] <CovertJaguar> block models can extend into other blocks, so you just make a raised section that covers the railbed between the rails
L218[19:09:36] <GeneralCamo> Hmm, fair
L219[19:09:56] <GeneralCamo> I was just thinking something similar to the electric rails, but as a kit
L220[19:10:27] <CovertJaguar> yeah, that was what we originally were tossing around, but concerns with attaching pipes made it impractical
L221[19:10:28] <GeneralCamo> Alright then, this changes a few things
L222[19:10:40] <GeneralCamo> Well, I thought of the system similar to what was used for Shunting Wire
L223[19:10:55] <GeneralCamo> But I see your point
L224[19:11:09] <CovertJaguar> that's possible too, but more work and I'm not sure you gain much over just making it a block
L225[19:11:27] <GeneralCamo> Space management I'm thinking (only need one block instead of a whole section)
L226[19:11:40] <GeneralCamo> But alright, block it is
L227[19:12:13] <CovertJaguar> well it would be a "connected texture block" like block, like fences do
L228[19:12:39] <GeneralCamo> But with the model extending to the track, yes?
L229[19:12:42] <CovertJaguar> and each pass would add a fixed about water to the locomotive, a half bucket maybe
L230[19:12:47] <CovertJaguar> yep
L231[19:13:22] <GeneralCamo> Yeah, I would say about a half bucket per tile. A third bucket waste by default, to simulate most of it splashing out.
L232[19:13:30] <CovertJaguar> sure
L233[19:13:48] <CovertJaguar> you could add some particle effect too ;)
L234[19:13:51] <GeneralCamo> Indeed
L235[19:13:56] <CovertJaguar> if you are ambitious
L236[19:14:11] <GeneralCamo> Now, the only thing is: This needs to not work on electric rails. Water + Electricity = bad things
L237[19:14:42] <CovertJaguar> hmm...it might be possible to prevent you from placing electric rails on the block
L238[19:15:06] <CovertJaguar> I know its techincally possible, but I'm not sure if the code is set up for something like that, but it shouldn't be too hard
L239[19:15:17] <GeneralCamo> I was also thinking about hi-speed rails, but for those we could just increase the waste to two-thirds of a bucket or so, assuming the train is actually high speed.
L240[19:15:38] <GeneralCamo> That might be a bit too complicated though
L241[19:15:57] <CovertJaguar> I'd focus on getting the model and mechanics first, then add flourishes
L242[19:16:44] <GeneralCamo> Agreed
L243[19:17:05] <CovertJaguar> you can look at the fluid loaders to see how to render fluids as part of a model, a TESR in this case
L244[19:17:17] <GeneralCamo> Indeed
L245[19:18:00] <GeneralCamo> Need to do a bit of modeling I think, for the trough
L246[19:18:12] <GeneralCamo> Not too difficult I would imagine
L247[19:18:23] <CovertJaguar> three states I think
L248[19:18:29] <CovertJaguar> or wait, just two
L249[19:18:35] <CovertJaguar> well three states, two models
L250[19:18:46] <CovertJaguar> one model gets rotated
L251[19:18:52] <CovertJaguar> for the end caps
L252[19:19:10] <GeneralCamo> End Cap + Single Trough + Connected Trough
L253[19:19:17] <CovertJaguar> oh right
L254[19:20:17] <GeneralCamo> Also need to think of the recipe. Should def. use metal plates and the water tank siding (suggested by Forecaster), but the specifics I am unclear on.
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L256[19:20:52] <GeneralCamo> That's more for later though
L257[19:21:01] <GeneralCamo> But something to think about (needs one to be release ready :P)
L258[19:23:13] <GeneralCamo> @CovertJaguar Some mods have been dropping RF in favor of Forge Energy, or a custom equivilent that is compatible with FE, due to RF's apparent lack of maintenance. What are your thoughts on that in regards to Railcraft?
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L260[19:40:20] <CovertJaguar> not fan of FE personally, too vague, not interesting enough
L261[19:40:49] <CovertJaguar> not a huge fan of the balance of RF either
L262[19:41:01] <CovertJaguar> really I should probably just use my own system or something
L263[19:41:06] <CovertJaguar> make everything run off steam
L264[19:41:08] <GeneralCamo> RF balance was kind-of hurt by Thermal Expansion's little system.
L265[19:41:34] <GeneralCamo> I remember when they decided to monopolize power generation by arbitrarily increasing energy conversion rates
L266[19:41:48] <CovertJaguar> yeah, it was completely political
L267[19:42:09] <GeneralCamo> I have nothing against RF itself however, I find it quite efficient.
L268[19:42:16] <GeneralCamo> Just the balance of it was tainted
L269[19:42:22] <CovertJaguar> the api is fine, if boring
L270[19:42:50] <GeneralCamo> Yeah, EU I find more interesting. Especially after the experimental changes to remove some of the more frustrating aspects
L271[19:43:59] <CovertJaguar> I have been tossing around the idea of adding steam pipes to Railcraft, but that's kind of a long term goal
L272[19:44:08] <CovertJaguar> and then make the machines run on steam
L273[19:44:20] <GeneralCamo> That would be a decent idea.
L274[19:44:29] <CovertJaguar> and just remove myself entirely from the stupid energy wars
L275[19:44:44] <GeneralCamo> Make the steam turbine produce Railcraft Charge
L276[19:45:09] <CovertJaguar> it already does, both RC and EU
L277[19:45:15] <GeneralCamo> Oh nice
L278[19:45:21] <CovertJaguar> but I don't really have any complaints about EU
L279[19:45:29] <CovertJaguar> its been mostly stable for years
L280[19:45:47] <GeneralCamo> EU is pretty seperate from the energy wars. It's its own thing.
L281[19:46:18] <GeneralCamo> Which I like
L282[19:46:44] <GeneralCamo> IMO: Your machines should just run on Railcraft charge
L283[19:47:12] <CovertJaguar> there is a problem with all this though, the Rolling Machine is the gateway to everything else
L284[19:47:32] <CovertJaguar> atm the Hobbyist Engine can be used to jump start into bigger things
L285[19:47:42] <GeneralCamo> That uses RF/FE though
L286[19:47:59] <CovertJaguar> but I don't have anything that produces Charge that can be made early game
L287[19:48:04] <GeneralCamo> Hmm
L288[19:48:08] <GeneralCamo> This is something to think about
L289[19:49:00] <GeneralCamo> My thoughts: Railcraft should drop RF/FE support, add a block or something for compatibility with that.
L290[19:49:05] <GeneralCamo> As a seperate module
L291[19:49:12] <GeneralCamo> Switch entirely to RC/EU
L292[19:49:22] <GeneralCamo> Add a new tier for basic power generation
L293[19:50:38] <GeneralCamo> So we have Steam --> Basic Energy Tier --> Advanced Energy Tier
L294[19:51:30] <CovertJaguar> I'd need to add something like a crude steam boiler, made from iron ingots and a micro-turbine or something
L295[19:51:38] <GeneralCamo> Or bronze
L296[19:51:51] <CovertJaguar> probably a single block is best from a new user standpoint
L297[19:51:56] <GeneralCamo> Agreed on that though
L298[19:52:05] <GeneralCamo> Multiblocks should really be reserved for higher-tier stuff
L299[19:52:38] <CovertJaguar> well not so much a multiblock, but rather a block that produces steam and one that takes steam and produces charge
L300[19:52:48] <CovertJaguar> if we want the rolling machine to run on charge
L301[19:53:12] <CovertJaguar> or a block that takes water and fuel and produces small amounts of charge
L302[19:53:43] <GeneralCamo> Alternatively, could have a primitive bronze rolling machine that only accepts 2x2 recipes
L303[19:53:55] <CovertJaguar> oh, that's an idea too
L304[19:54:02] <CovertJaguar> remove the power requirement
L305[19:54:08] <CovertJaguar> that's probably the smarter idea
L306[19:55:01] <CovertJaguar> I'd probably remove the advanced automation features and just make it a crafting bench clone
L307[19:55:14] <CovertJaguar> not sure whether it should limit the recipe size
L308[19:55:21] <GeneralCamo> Could do that as well
L309[19:55:26] <GeneralCamo> Def. needs to be slower
L310[19:55:38] <CovertJaguar> yeah
L311[20:02:40] <GeneralCamo> Railcraft could turn into its own industrial mod
L312[20:02:54] <GeneralCamo> Already has most of the aspects of one, just needs a unified energy system
L313[20:04:54] <GeneralCamo> Still, a lot of this stuff is reserved for 10.2, yes?
L314[20:05:00] <GeneralCamo> 10.1 is the focus right now
L315[20:05:21] <GeneralCamo> https://github.com/wha-ha-ha/Rock-Crusher-Metal-Dusts-Addon
L316[20:05:35] <GeneralCamo> This old addon though could probably be partially integrated into Railcraft
L317[20:05:39] <GeneralCamo> Mainly for the ores
L318[20:09:01] <CovertJaguar> probably, everyone else does ore doubling, I was kind of wanting to do a liquid based system is the main reason I didn't though
L319[20:09:13] <CovertJaguar> but crushing could certainly be a stage of that
L320[20:11:11] <GeneralCamo> Liquid based.. interesting
L321[20:11:32] <liach> Isn't this Railroad based transport system?
L322[20:11:56] <GeneralCamo> Railroads are more than just the rails themselves
L323[20:12:18] <GeneralCamo> There is also the industry that both fuels and builds the railroads
L324[20:16:05] <GeneralCamo> As for Ore Doubling: IC2 experimental has probably the most interesting ore doubling mechanic I have seen in a while
L325[20:16:27] <GeneralCamo> I was personally surprised that GregTech kept it mostly intact, which is pretty rare of it
L326[20:20:41] <GeneralCamo> Ore doubling was pretty much stagnant ever since it was first introduced. Probably by IC, but I am not sure.
L327[20:29:06] <liach> aye it is indeed fun, macerator -> ore washing plant -> thermal centrifuge
L328[20:29:43] <GeneralCamo> Gregtech kept that mechanic pretty intact. It just added a tier lock for it
L329[20:29:51] <GeneralCamo> And changed a few percentages around
L330[20:30:59] <liach> :shock:
L331[20:31:19] <liach> ?
L332[20:31:33] <GeneralCamo> Yes it surprised me too
L333[20:32:16] <GeneralCamo> Full disclosure: I don't mind GregTech. Indeed, I find it fun, especially with other people
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L335[20:45:50] <CovertJaguar> I always likes the concept of gregtech, at least when greg is behaiving himself =P
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L342[23:09:18] <liach> ?
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