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L1[00:00:59] <Nightmare> @boiler comcast has been injecting shit like this for years
L2[00:01:12] <boiler> ree
L3[00:59:05] <Moongoodboy{K}> Net neutrality doesn't actually say anything about injection.
L4[01:00:08] <Moongoodboy{K}> Although injections that break or hinder your use of the site would be against it (in spirit at least; I'm sure the terribad ISPs would fight)
L5[01:00:22] <Moongoodboy{K}> but those that don't, well…!
L6[01:00:40] <Moongoodboy{K}> This is why you use TLS. For everything. Always.
L7[01:01:25] <Moongoodboy{K}> Unless you're already using a different in-transit privacy protocol (e.g. SSH)
L8[01:03:20] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: your work runs a proxy server on their VPN? O.o
L9[01:05:19] <Moongoodboy{K}> That said, we have seen the effects of not having legal NN long before, immediately before, and immediately after its repeal (including a quiet takedown of a page by one of the big horrible four that promised not to fuck people over).
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L12[02:25:33] <Kodos> Wheeee, internet went to shyte for some reason
L13[02:25:40] <Kodos> 70 Kbps...
L14[02:29:47] <Forecaster> I still have no internet at home since yesterday >:
L15[02:31:22] <Kodos> Indeed. I'm going to bed, but if this is still this slow in the morning, I'm calling and demanding credit to my account for every day this slow shit persists
L16[02:31:51] <Izaya> payonel: you have a program or something for testing Lua code, right?
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L18[02:40:34] <Moongoodboy{K}> Testing Lua code?
L19[02:40:48] <Moongoodboy{K}> wouldn't you just test Lua code…with more Lua code?
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L22[02:52:18] <Forecaster> How do you know the program isn't a Lua program? :P
L23[02:54:47] <Izaya> Moongoodboy{K}: I'm hoping for something that can automate my testing
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L44[03:10:39] <Forecaster> %shell
L45[03:10:39] * MichiBot loads Raiko into a shell and fires it. It strikes the ground near infina, alfw and Yarillo. They each take 1, 5 and 2 splash damage respectively.
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L47[03:32:59] <Inari> %pet AmandaC
L48[03:32:59] * MichiBot pets AmandaC with an apple. AmandaC recovers 4 health!
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L50[04:02:41] <Moongoodboy{K}> Izaya: a good language will have a testing module in its stdlib >.>
L51[04:02:53] <Moongoodboy{K}> …but since this is Lua we're talking about… ;p
L52[04:03:05] <Moongoodboy{K}> Someone's probably written a third-party one
L53[04:03:08] <Izaya> Are these languages you speak of not fuckhuge?
L54[04:03:26] <Izaya> :D
L55[04:03:28] <Moongoodboy{K}> Basically every language ever, except C
L56[04:03:37] <Izaya> Forth isn't fuckhuge :D
L57[04:03:55] <Moongoodboy{K}> has Forth even updated since, like, 1985?
L58[04:04:00] <Izaya> That said I've come to the conclusion that Forth programmers are either paid lots or mentally deranged.
L59[04:04:03] <Izaya> Including myself.
L60[04:04:04] <Moongoodboy{K}> I never hear jack about Forth
L61[04:04:10] <Izaya> Forth is no single implementation
L62[04:04:16] <Izaya> It's more a concept or family of languages
L63[04:04:26] <Moongoodboy{K}> s/Forth/any major Forth implementation/
L64[04:04:32] <Moongoodboy{K}> that applies to most languages as well
L65[04:04:39] <Moongoodboy{K}> including Java!
L66[04:04:52] <Moongoodboy{K}> which is, like, one where you'd least expect that XP
L67[04:05:03] <Izaya> no but like, you don't say C and mean C#
L68[04:05:15] <Izaya> There's lots of variation and each implementation is usually incompatible
L69[04:05:26] <Izaya> except for the ones that comply with that standard most people don't care about
L70[04:05:48] <Izaya> and often you'll end up implementing your own Forth if you're doing embedded work or similar
L71[04:05:58] <Izaya> but uh
L72[04:06:06] <Izaya> most major implementations don't get updates much because uh
L73[04:06:08] <Izaya> well
L74[04:06:16] <Izaya> a) it's not very popular
L75[04:06:34] <Izaya> b) people that use it often don't release their code because it's specific to their application and useless for just about anything else
L76[04:11:40] <Moongoodboy{K}> C and C# are completely different languages.
L77[04:11:50] <Moongoodboy{K}> Are the various Forths similarly different languages?
L78[04:12:04] <Moongoodboy{K}> You'd think, being called Forth, that they'd be largely the same.
L79[04:12:18] <Moongoodboy{K}> Maybe, like, stdlib differences at most.
L80[04:12:33] <Moongoodboy{K}> Or, like, differences in minor langauhe features
L81[04:13:01] <Izaya> The core concept is that you have a stack
L82[04:13:20] <Moongoodboy{K}> ew, stack-based. :(
L83[04:13:24] <Izaya> beyond that there isn't a huge amount of standardisation, unless you're using ANSI forth of some kind
L84[04:13:53] * Moongoodboy{K} stares.
L85[04:14:05] <Moongoodboy{K}> You have a stack. That's it?
L86[04:14:25] <Moongoodboy{K}> Surely there's a common syntax, type system…?
L87[04:14:33] <Izaya> No types.
L88[04:14:36] <Izaya> Just pointers.
L89[04:14:40] <Izaya> Unless you implement your own types.
L90[04:14:42] <Izaya> :D
L91[04:14:58] <Izaya> And the syntax is generally 'spaces separate words,' unless they don't.
L92[04:15:03] <Moongoodboy{K}> how do you implement your own types from scratch without dropping into assembly?
L93[04:15:15] <Izaya> generally you can read and write memory locations
L94[04:15:25] <Moongoodboy{K}> okay, there, see, that's something
L95[04:15:32] <Izaya> not always though
L96[04:15:32] * Moongoodboy{K} …wikipedias Forth
L97[04:15:37] <Izaya> sometimes you'll also have multiple stacks
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L101[04:19:59] <Moongoodboy{K}> …hah, there's a GNU Forth. Go figure.
L102[04:20:10] <Izaya> There's a GNU ada, too
L103[04:20:12] <Izaya> GNU objective C
L104[04:22:56] <Moongoodboy{K}> GNU ObjC?! :O
L105[04:23:02] <Moongoodboy{K}> …oh wait
L106[04:23:04] <Moongoodboy{K}> yeah
L107[04:23:07] <Moongoodboy{K}> gcc does objc
L108[04:23:21] <Izaya> GNU clone of the OS X UI libs
L109[04:23:37] <Izaya> GNUStep that is
L110[04:24:15] <Moongoodboy{K}> That sounds like a GNU implenentation of the OS <0 UI libs. xD
L111[04:24:45] <Izaya> You're not wrong, but you can write stuff for GNUStep then use it on OS X, apparently.
L112[04:28:07] <Moongoodboy{K}> wuuuut
L113[04:28:17] <Moongoodboy{K}> macOS runs NextStep stuff??
L114[04:28:35] <Izaya> No, but you can compile GNUStep programs for OS X, apparently
L115[04:28:47] <Izaya> I've never tried it and I'm not sure how current it is, admittedly
L116[04:28:55] <Moongoodboy{K}> Ahh.
L117[04:29:09] <Moongoodboy{K}> translation layer maybe?
L118[04:30:17] <Forecaster> %shell interruption
L119[04:30:17] * MichiBot loads an army of AmandaCs into a shell and fires it. It strikes the ground near interruption, TechnicianLP and Vindex. They each take 7, 8 and 3 splash damage respectively.
L120[05:17:02] * vifino waves at Izaya
L121[05:17:18] * Izaya waves in the direction of vifino
L122[05:17:45] <vifino> You wanna play something? :P
L123[05:18:15] <vifino> I slept at least.. 5 hours, so that's good.
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L125[05:57:47] <Inari> Time for coffee and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3syUejwzd3Q
L126[05:57:48] <MichiBot> What the HELL is Joshua and the Promised Land? (The WORST Animated Movie Ever) | A Review | length: 28m 33s | Likes: 20,527 Dislikes: 304 Views: 538,813 | by Saberspark | Published On 16/2/2018
L127[05:58:03] <Inari> %fling vifino
L128[05:58:03] * MichiBot flings depression in a random direction. It hits vifino in the small of the back. They take [6] damage.
L129[05:58:06] <Inari> :/
L130[05:58:47] <Lizzian> ffs Michibot
L131[05:58:55] <Corded> * <Lizzian> baps MichiBot
L132[05:59:05] * Izaya applies a lighter to MichiBot
L133[06:02:10] * Moongoodboy{K} frowns, leveling his entropy manipulator at MichiBot.
L134[06:12:50] <Forecaster> %inv add entropy manipulator
L135[06:12:50] * MichiBot summons 'entropy manipulator' and adds to her inventory. I could get some good swings in with this.
L136[06:13:07] <Forecaster> %inv list
L137[06:13:07] <MichiBot> Forecaster: Here's my inventory: http://michibot.pc-logix.com/inventory
L138[06:13:18] <Forecaster> oh
L139[06:13:20] <Forecaster> 404
L140[06:13:21] <Forecaster> huh
L141[06:25:22] <Moongoodboy{K}> No, the thing you get good swings in with is the Charged Staff.
L142[06:25:28] <Moongoodboy{K}> %inv add charged staff
L143[06:25:28] * MichiBot summons 'charged staff' and adds to her inventory. I could get some good swings in with this.
L144[06:27:13] <Forecaster> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTKeB8BnzPY
L145[06:27:14] <MichiBot> Homonyms | length: 11m 27s | Likes: 9,039 Dislikes: 55 Views: 87,457 | by DONG | Published On 22/3/2018
L146[06:27:35] <Forecaster> Moongoodboy it's based on the total length :P
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L155[07:32:50] <Katie> @Forecaster fixed..
L156[07:32:51] <Ristelle> in python I can do:
L157[07:32:51] <Ristelle> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/ecakurevok
L158[07:32:52] <Ristelle> is there anyway to do that in lua?
L159[07:36:01] <Forecaster> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/epelebefaq
L160[07:37:01] <Forecaster> also, vifino added "depression" to MichiBot's inventory :P
L161[07:37:38] <Forecaster> MichiBot works in mysterious ways
L162[07:40:56] <Ristelle> but I would like to start from like index 2 instead of 1.
L163[07:42:52] <Temia> Ah, are we slicing?
L164[07:42:57] <Temia> Fun times.
L165[07:43:17] <Temia> I for one would be interested in this too.
L166[07:44:13] <Ristelle> yeah
L167[07:44:14] <Ristelle> slices
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L169[07:46:01] <Forecaster> %lua local mytable = { "thing", "to", "iterate", "over" } for i = 2, #mytable do print(mytable[i]) end
L170[07:46:01] <MichiBot> to | iterate | over
L171[07:46:11] <Forecaster> hm
L172[07:46:47] <Forecaster> does that work?
L173[07:46:53] <Forecaster> @Ristelle
L174[07:47:02] <Ristelle> nope
L175[07:47:06] <Ristelle> wait
L176[07:47:10] <Ristelle> uh yeah. thanks ?
L177[07:47:14] <Forecaster> great
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L189[09:23:31] <S3> ok who wants to test something?
L190[09:23:46] <S3> somebody telnet to 141.114.204.83 port 2323
L191[09:24:22] <AmandaC> Universa?
L192[09:25:31] <Skye> S3, what is it?
L193[09:27:24] <S3> it's a MUD codebase I've been working on with someone
L194[09:27:25] <Forecaster> I entered a username and hit enter and it closed
L195[09:27:28] <S3> it doesn't do much
L196[09:27:32] <Forecaster> :P
L197[09:27:34] <S3> uh oh
L198[09:27:42] <S3> forecaster that's good to know.. rofl
L199[09:28:00] <S3> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/Dm2c0tkL/
L200[09:28:04] <S3> it crashed
L201[09:28:09] <S3> you could try again to see if it repeats
L202[09:28:19] <S3> the engine didn't crash, just the acceptor
L203[09:28:48] <Forecaster> again
L204[09:29:00] <Forecaster> for the record I just enter `Forecaster`
L205[09:29:07] <AmandaC> I should poke my MUD sometime again
L206[09:29:32] <Katie> Someone should finish porting https://github.com/PC-Logix/OpenSecurity/tree/1.12.2/src/main/java/pcl/opensecurity for me. kthx
L207[09:29:47] <Katie> I linked a bit deep there, but yeah :P
L208[09:31:48] <S3> Forecaster. weird. I have the error, so I'll look into that
L209[09:33:40] <Forecaster> I also tried with just a period
L210[09:34:05] <S3> Forecaster: We think that it is a unicode issue
L211[09:34:19] <S3> maybe it thinks you're using unicode and you're not, for example
L212[09:34:26] *** MalkContent_ is now known as MalkContent
L213[09:34:44] <S3> that's not your problem, it means we need to figure out how to detect that..
L214[09:34:57] <S3> because an average mudder will have no idea what unicode even is
L215[09:35:15] <Izaya> This muddies the water.
L216[09:35:33] <Skye> I won't connect
L217[09:35:41] <Skye> because I'm tryina hide my IP
L218[09:36:10] <S3> Skye: rofl
L219[09:36:19] <Forecaster> well, you were successful then :D
L220[09:36:35] <S3> you mean 37.221.195.170
L221[09:36:35] <S3> ?
L222[09:36:46] <AmandaC> S3: probably a bouncer
L223[09:36:51] <S3> yeah probably
L224[09:36:57] <Skye> do you collect IPs, technically it's against the GDPR to keep them
L225[09:36:59] <Skye> :P
L226[09:37:11] <Forecaster> I stuff em and put them on my wall
L227[09:37:34] <S3> I have no reason to keep IP addresses
L228[09:37:38] <Forecaster> sends 37.221.195.170 to a taxidermist
L229[09:37:51] <S3> why would I care
L230[09:37:53] <S3> lol
L231[09:37:59] <S3> an IP is just an IP
L232[09:38:19] <S3> that IP address I pasted here earlier, the 141 one
L233[09:38:20] <Forecaster> but you could send *packets* to it!
L234[09:38:29] <S3> that is my laptop right in front of me here at the uni
L235[09:38:39] <S3> every computer on this campus even on wifi gets a public IPv4
L236[09:38:47] <Forecaster> that's neat
L237[09:38:48] <AmandaC> S3: what a waste
L238[09:38:57] <S3> AmandaC: haha
L239[09:39:09] <AmandaC> IPv6 I'd understand,but v4?
L240[09:39:45] <S3> we get ipv6 as well
L241[09:39:55] <S3> but we've had multiple /16 blocks since ARPAnet
L242[09:40:01] <S3> just about, anyways
L243[09:40:10] <AmandaC> inb4 S3 doesn't believe in v6 because it's too new
L244[09:40:11] <S3> since the movement from IPX
L245[09:40:20] <S3> I love v6
L246[09:40:36] <Forecaster> it's a scam by big pharma!
L247[09:40:43] <S3> v6 is actually faster routing
L248[09:40:49] <Corded> * <Forecaster> puts on tin foil hat
L249[09:40:51] <S3> despite being larger
L250[09:40:59] <AmandaC> v6 explicitly disallows NAT, which is probably why
L251[09:41:16] <AmandaC> Less logic to be involved in the routing tables
L252[09:41:36] <S3> well part of it is also that a properly set up v6 has a very standard segment size of subnet and network length, etc
L253[09:42:01] <S3> so for routing through the large trunks it's super fast because it doesn't have to worry about subnets
L254[09:42:01] <Skye> S3, the annoying thing is, IPs are getting more and more accurate
L255[09:42:09] <Skye> I dislike geolocation and IPs
L256[09:42:18] <Skye> I need to cycle my IP I guess
L257[09:42:23] <AmandaC> Skye: just get your block put into the databases as "Low Earth Orbit"
L258[09:42:38] <Skye> AmandaC, I would if I owned an IP block
L259[09:43:35] <AmandaC> But, tbh, I'd probablynot have blindly connected toit were I not on hotel Wifi far away from home
L260[09:44:10] <AmandaC> Esp since I'm leaving for home tomorrow. :P
L261[09:44:11] <S3> Skye: now, despite that I care less about IP addresses I'm not part of the EU ad the GDPR I can simply ignore
L262[09:44:18] <Izaya> If you connect to my site or whois me you get my real IP anyway
L263[09:44:20] <Izaya> So fuck it
L264[09:44:44] <AmandaC> S3: uh. GDPR applies to any service that collects EU citizen's data, not just seervices in the EU
L265[09:44:45] <ben_mkiv> and what should anyone do with it?
L266[09:44:51] <ben_mkiv> worst case ddos until they got shut down
L267[09:44:51] <Skye> AmandaC, correction
L268[09:44:51] ⇦ Quits: MalkContent (MalkContent!~MalkConte@p4FDCC15D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving)
L269[09:44:55] <Skye> if you're an individual
L270[09:44:58] <Skye> it doesn't apply to you
L271[09:45:00] <Skye> so S3 is fine
L272[09:45:06] <Skye> even if they were in the UK
L273[09:45:10] <Skye> or EU
L274[09:45:20] <S3> Well there's nothing they can really do
L275[09:45:26] <S3> plus I'm not a business
L276[09:45:39] <Skye> still
L277[09:45:47] <Skye> S3, a lot of the GDPR is actually just common sense
L278[09:45:56] <S3> I'm sure they can complain about all of the people out there who have logs for abuse purposes
L279[09:46:06] <Skye> S3, logs for abuse purposes are okay
L280[09:46:14] <S3> bbut that collects IPs
L281[09:46:16] <Skye> but you're not allowed to mix them with any other data you collect
L282[09:46:26] <Skye> or publish them without doing anonimisation
L283[09:46:43] <AmandaC> So, logging IP adresses is fine. associating it with Bob From Accounting is not.
L284[09:47:20] <AmandaC> ( AIUI )
L285[09:48:47] <Skye> ye
L286[09:49:28] <Forecaster> the comment system for the Boiler Calculator I made uses hashed ip addresses instead of usernames
L287[09:49:42] <Skye> hashing is one way
L288[09:49:46] <Skye> so that's fine
L289[09:49:48] <AmandaC> ( That is, without explicitly telling Bob that it's going to happen )
L290[09:50:17] <Forecaster> it's not deep hashing with salts or anything
L291[09:50:33] <Skye> still
L292[09:50:33] <Forecaster> iirc it's just once, with nothing added
L293[09:50:41] <Skye> it's still one way
L294[09:50:47] <AmandaC> BRB building a rainbow tabke
L295[09:51:00] <Skye> ...maybe time to change your scheme
L296[09:51:26] <Forecaster> I made that thing several years ago
L297[09:51:36] <Forecaster> and I didn't want to make something where you had to enter a username
L298[09:51:59] <Skye> do you display the hash
L299[09:52:38] <Forecaster> yeah
L300[09:52:50] <Skye> aieeeg
L301[09:52:54] <Forecaster> it's where you'd see a username
L302[09:53:19] <Skye> it's not awful
L303[09:53:21] <Skye> but could be better
L304[09:53:38] <Forecaster> I'd link it but my server is offline because I don't have internet right now
L305[10:04:33] <Inari> AmandaC: Amacchi~
L306[10:04:37] <Forecaster> http://tinyurl.com/y8dp2hd9
L307[10:04:38] <Forecaster> huh
L308[10:05:10] <AmandaC> payonel: so you were saying this should work, right? https://gitlab.darkdna.net/amanda/oc-fileserver/blob/master/elevator/etc/rc.d/elevator-control.lua#L215-216
L309[10:08:26] <Forecaster> http://abstrusegoose.com/582
L310[10:10:31] <payonel> AmandaC: i would set the screen first
L311[10:11:53] <payonel> Moongoodboy{K}: you asked about my work, vpn, and a proxy server. proxy server to what?
L312[10:13:05] <AmandaC> payonel: that seems to have done it, danke
L313[10:13:20] <payonel> Izaya: no testing framework, a mash of inconsistent asserts and stderr prints, etc.
L314[10:13:56] <Izaya> Ah fun. Might implement one.
L315[10:22:30] <S3> uh
L316[10:22:34] <S3> Izaya: I just found out
L317[10:22:40] <S3> I can pick people up and stuff them in my inventory
L318[10:22:48] <Izaya> ...
L319[10:22:53] <Izaya> Nice.
L320[10:23:06] <Izaya> Does it chibify them? :3
L321[10:23:11] <S3> should I just... sweep that bug under the carpet?
L322[10:23:25] <S3> call it a feature
L323[10:23:32] <S3> well
L324[10:23:38] <S3> funny thing is
L325[10:23:48] <S3> we had them talk while in my inventory
L326[10:23:50] <S3> and it crashed the socket
L327[10:23:53] <ben_mkiv> https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/workflow.png
L328[10:23:54] <ben_mkiv> ^^
L329[10:24:05] <S3> and when it crashed teh socket, they were still connected XD
L330[10:24:15] <S3> it was like nothing happened
L331[10:26:56] <S3> ben_mkiv: yep.
L332[10:27:50] <Forecaster> "Nothing happened" - the game
L333[10:36:42] ⇨ Joins: Vexatos (Vexatos!~Vexatos@p200300556E187E18583891602BF17FCA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L334[10:36:42] zsh sets mode: +v on Vexatos
L335[10:43:44] <S3> Izaya: okay
L336[10:43:53] <S3> Izaya: do not pick yourself up
L337[10:43:54] <S3> :D
L338[10:44:05] <S3> you can pick yuourself up and put yourself in your inventory
L339[10:44:07] <S3> WEIRD shit happens
L340[10:44:31] <Forecaster> recursion!
L341[10:45:32] ⇦ Quits: cpp (cpp!~cpp@47-142-124-91.pool.ukrtel.net) (Quit: WeeChat 1.6)
L342[10:46:37] <Forecaster> %shell recursion
L343[10:46:37] * MichiBot loads lewd peace signs into a shell and fires it. It strikes recursion. They take 16 damage. tehbeard and dmod stood too close and take 5 and 8 splash damage respectively.
L344[10:46:52] <Inari> S3: What are you even talking about :o
L345[10:46:58] <Inari> %fling Forecaster
L346[10:46:58] * MichiBot flings an artificial Inari in a random direction. It hits Forecaster on the heel. They take [3] damage.
L347[10:47:31] <S3> Inari: get testperson
L348[10:47:34] <S3> you get a testperson
L349[10:47:38] <S3> connection closed by remote host.
L350[10:48:02] <Inari> testperson of what, in what
L351[10:49:53] <Forecaster> the matrix
L352[10:50:56] <Inari> I mean inventory and such sounds like minecraft
L353[10:51:07] <Inari> But has to be some mod?
L354[10:51:14] <Forecaster> it's neither!
L355[10:51:18] <Forecaster> dun dun duuun
L356[10:53:26] <Inari> %stab Forecaster
L357[10:53:26] * MichiBot stabs Forecaster with a fantasy life doing [3] damage
L358[10:53:32] <Inari> Huh
L359[10:53:37] <Inari> I haven't used %stab in ages I think
L360[10:54:41] <Forecaster> %shiv Inari
L361[10:54:41] * MichiBot shivs Inari with a friendly rod doing [1] damage
L362[10:54:48] <Forecaster> hm
L363[10:54:48] <Inari> Lewd
L364[10:54:56] <Inari> Hm?
L365[10:55:32] <Forecaster> maybe things that have "friendly" in the name shouldn't do damage :P
L366[10:55:45] <Inari> Heh
L367[10:55:51] <Inari> You did muse about something like that once upon a team
L368[10:55:59] <Inari> Stuff like "soft" too :p
L369[10:56:17] <Inari> I belieuve in the end the only thing that came from it was that items can have varying durability
L370[10:57:22] <Forecaster> yeah but just because something is soft doesn't mean it can't hurt you
L371[10:59:28] <Vexatos> %give MichiBot friendly world annihilator
L372[10:59:29] * MichiBot accepts friendly world annihilator and adds it to her inventory
L373[11:21:21] <AmandaC> %give MichiBot Baby's First WMD
L374[11:21:22] * MichiBot accepts Baby's First WMD and adds it to her inventory
L375[11:21:25] <S3> Inari: my game engine!
L376[11:21:33] <S3> you can pick yourself up and put yourself in your backpack
L377[11:21:33] <S3> XD
L378[11:21:49] <S3> well if backpacks existed, you can at least put yourself in your own inventory
L379[11:21:52] <S3> weird shit happens
L380[11:24:08] <AmandaC> What about the room, can you pick that up?
L381[11:24:51] <S3> um
L382[11:25:16] <S3> I can't remember if the other guy decided to keep rooms as entities or not
L383[11:25:19] <S3> if they are then it's feasible
L384[11:25:31] <S3> I'd have to look at that part of the source
L385[11:32:50] <Inari> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aO3JgPUJ6iQ so good
L386[11:32:51] <MichiBot> Chinese Invisibility Cloak Hoax DESTROYED!!! | length: 13m 36s | Likes: 78,686 Dislikes: 957 Views: 581,292 | by CaptainDisillusion | Published On 16/3/2018
L387[11:45:22] <Inari> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/conefagasa
L388[11:55:38] <vifino> i like turtles. do you like turtles?
L389[11:55:45] <S3> TMNT!
L390[11:55:54] * S3 plays the tune
L391[12:19:13] <S3> vifino: got it stuck in your head yet
L392[12:21:40] <S3> Izaya I feel like you would hate yourself writing a MUD in Forth
L393[12:22:07] <Izaya> I did SMTP already
L394[12:22:13] <S3> seriously?
L395[12:22:24] <S3> doesn't the super proceduralness just kill you?
L396[12:22:46] <Izaya> You underestimate my insanity
L397[12:22:47] <S3> I love Forth but if you make a design mistake it can be a mess to debug
L398[12:22:57] <Izaya> I did it on ofw as well
L399[12:23:24] <MGR> Did you lose your legs after saying that?
L400[12:23:25] <S3> maybe you would like the designs for my homebuilt computer that looks kind of like a PDP-11
L401[12:23:36] <S3> since it is a stack machine for porting Forth to
L402[12:23:45] <S3> it's not finished, I'm still coming up with design work
L403[12:23:45] <Izaya> :D
L404[12:24:13] <S3> I'm releasing all pcb cad sheets
L405[12:24:16] <S3> and stuff
L406[12:24:22] <S3> to the public
L407[12:40:38] <IKnowBashFu> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/jejedemili
L408[12:40:38] <IKnowBashFu> @Inari fixed for ya. You want the comma and space in the hello section so that your else are looks nice too. Other than that, I see no problems with your code.
L409[12:40:46] <IKnowBashFu> Code Block pastebined https://paste.pc-logix.com/dahedupibo
L410[12:40:47] <IKnowBashFu> @Inari fixed for ya. You want the comma and space in the hello section so that your else area looks nice too. Other than that, I see no problems with your code. [Edited]
L411[12:47:43] <payonel> [Edited]
L412[12:48:51] <Inari> @IKnowBashFu Well I just transliterated the code
L413[12:48:51] <Inari> ?
L414[12:48:57] <Inari> Or whatever its called
L415[13:03:10] ⇨ Joins: MalkContent (MalkContent!~MalkConte@p4FDCC15D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
L416[13:24:33] ⇦ Quits: ben_mkiv (ben_mkiv!~ben_mkiv@p57972a36.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Ping timeout: 198 seconds)
L417[13:32:07] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: exactly!
L418[13:32:53] <Moongoodboy{K}> Either your IP wouldn't change just from connecting to the VPN, or your traffic would have to be going via some proxy that's on the VPN.
L419[13:42:16] <payonel> Moongoodboy{K}: connecting to vpn causes all sockets to go through the vpn first
L420[13:42:40] <payonel> so at first: my laptop -> phone hotspot -> vnc -> #oc
L421[13:42:52] <payonel> then with vpn: my laptop -> phone hotspot -> vpn -> vnc -> #oc
L422[13:44:36] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: so there has to be a proxy on that VPN. somewhere.
L423[13:44:43] <Moongoodboy{K}> s/\.//
L424[13:44:43] <MichiBot> <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: so there has to be a proxy on that VPN somewhere.
L425[13:46:46] <payonel> Moongoodboy{K}: that's the difference between full and split tunneling
L426[13:46:57] <payonel> it's not an additional "proxy"
L427[13:47:07] <payonel> our vpn tunnels full
L428[13:51:24] <Katie> ^
L429[13:55:03] <Kodos> Morning folks
L430[13:55:22] <Molinko> ? hi
L431[13:55:53] <payonel> @kodos o/
L432[13:56:01] <MGR> Hello!
L433[13:56:13] <payonel> also, hello @Molinko, thanks for all you do in the forums :)
L434[13:57:05] <Katie> We have forums?
L435[13:57:06] <Katie> :P
L436[13:57:12] <payonel> haha, i know!
L437[13:57:42] <Skye> equifax: http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff1300/fc01267.png
L438[13:59:26] <Katie> I approve posts when I get the chance..
L439[13:59:39] <Katie> I don't know enough lua to reply to many posts.
L440[13:59:52] <payonel> @Katie: you don't have to reply _in lua_
L441[14:00:12] * payonel trolols
L442[14:00:17] <Katie> ._.
L443[14:00:52] <payonel> most posts seem to be questions to other projects
L444[14:01:03] <payonel> like zyfreak's reactor control
L445[14:01:15] <Katie> lots of them are, the posts I was talking about replying to were the programming questsions.. :P
L446[14:01:19] <Katie> questions*
L447[14:01:22] <Kodos> Do we have a way to play a sound to only a client
L448[14:01:24] <payonel> when people have lua or openos questions, molinko is there too quickly for me to help
L449[14:01:47] <payonel> @kodos ONE client instead of ALL ?
L450[14:01:50] <Kodos> Yes
L451[14:01:54] <payonel> doubt it, Vexatos ?
L452[14:02:04] <Katie> one client? Hmm... that sounds.. hard.
L453[14:03:06] <Vexatos> very doable
L454[14:03:16] <Vexatos> just make sure no other client is nearby while it is playing
L455[14:03:17] <Vexatos> duh
L456[14:03:18] <Vexatos> :3
L457[14:03:24] * payonel trolols with Vexatos
L458[14:03:31] <Vexatos> also you can set the range to like 1
L459[14:03:51] <Kodos> I don't want the sound to play inworld at all
L460[14:04:01] <Vexatos> why
L461[14:04:07] <Kodos> Reasons
L462[14:04:12] <Vexatos> well
L463[14:04:15] <Kodos> This would be easier to explain if one of you played Second Life at all
L464[14:04:31] <Vexatos> make an HTTP request to your computer which listens for one and then plays a sound
L465[14:04:42] <Kodos> That's... no
L466[14:04:47] <Vexatos> well
L467[14:04:52] <Vexatos> implement headphones for me
L468[14:04:59] <Kodos> What if I want Mary to tell me something privately
L469[14:05:20] <Kodos> Or wait, actually
L470[14:05:27] <Kodos> Can the (creative) chat box send private messages?
L471[14:05:38] <Vexatos> debug card can
L472[14:05:50] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: VPNs don't inherently proxy. If you're on a VPN and it's proxying, something must be doing the proxying.
L473[14:05:58] <Moongoodboy{K}> And that something is, by definition, a proxy.
L474[14:06:20] <payonel> you've overcomplicating it
L475[14:06:25] <Katie> wat.
L476[14:06:36] <payonel> 're*
L477[14:06:49] <Moongoodboy{K}> I'm drawing a line between VPNs and proxies, because conflating the two is a pet peeve of mine. :I
L478[14:06:55] <Moongoodboy{K}> Neither implies the other.
L479[14:07:07] <payonel> then you need to read up on your pet peeve a bit more
L480[14:07:21] <Moongoodboy{K}> Not all VPNs proxy; not all proxies are on VPN.
L481[14:08:06] <payonel> that is not accurate
L482[14:08:07] <Katie> fucking hell.
L483[14:08:21] <Katie> I'm walking away now before my brain cells revolt.
L484[14:08:31] <Moongoodboy{K}> I have a VPN that doesn't proxy. Counterexample right there.
L485[14:08:47] <payonel> Moongoodboy{K}: are you the only node in the network?
L486[14:09:10] <payonel> are is or can any other node connect to that network?
L487[14:09:21] <payonel> and when you have two nodes in that network, can they see each other?
L488[14:09:30] <payonel> proxy
L489[14:09:32] <Moongoodboy{K}> No? Well, they're all owned by me, but that's irrelevant. There're a couple boxes on the network, plus the server.
L490[14:09:35] <Moongoodboy{K}> …oh.
L491[14:09:41] <Moongoodboy{K}> Okay, I needed to be more specific.
L492[14:10:03] <Moongoodboy{K}> I'm not counting IP routing as proxying.
L493[14:10:09] <payonel> haha
L494[14:10:12] <payonel> ok
L495[14:10:22] <payonel> note i never said proxy myself
L496[14:10:24] <payonel> i said tunnel
L497[14:10:26] <Moongoodboy{K}> Though, I suppose it /is/, in the more general and non-related definition of /proxy/.
L498[14:10:41] <payonel> i did literally say "proxy" like 5 lines ago
L499[14:10:48] <Moongoodboy{K}> You don't need to tunnel to proxy, though. :p
L500[14:10:49] <payonel> but, i was trying to play your game
L501[14:10:50] <S3> ...
L502[14:10:54] <Moongoodboy{K}> (…here we go again!)
L503[14:11:10] <payonel> like i said a while ago, "no additional proxy"
L504[14:11:15] <payonel> it's a full tunnel
L505[14:13:20] <S3> ...
L506[14:13:26] <Moongoodboy{K}> For these purposes, `proxy := [noun] a daemon that relays traffic generated by one or more clients to other, potentially-unrelated destinations, using itself to hide the existence|addresses|whatever of the clients | [noun] a box that runs a proxy`
L507[14:13:30] <Moongoodboy{K}> (revise as needed)
L508[14:13:41] <payonel> look i dont care what you call what
L509[14:13:50] <payonel> it is a full routing of connections vs a split
L510[14:13:58] <Moongoodboy{K}> Uh.
L511[14:13:59] <payonel> three is no additional software ,machine, thingie, noun
L512[14:14:05] <payonel> there*
L513[14:14:15] <S3> proxies don't have to be daemons
L514[14:14:16] <Moongoodboy{K}> We're into this this far because you were very specific about which words mean what.
L515[14:14:41] <Moongoodboy{K}> S3: pull requests on this definition happily accepted
L516[14:15:28] <payonel> i'm not trying to correct your labels, only clarifying the network mapping for you
L517[14:15:32] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: if the VPNds also do proxying, then they /are/ proxies.
L518[14:15:45] <Moongoodboy{K}> I never assumed or expressed that the proxies were separate machines or packages.
L519[14:15:50] <Moongoodboy{K}> if you wanna play like that. :)
L520[14:16:19] <Inari> %give MichiBot romantic fireworks
L521[14:16:19] * MichiBot accepts romantic fireworks and adds it to her inventory
L522[14:16:23] <Inari> %pet AmandaC
L523[14:16:23] * MichiBot brushes AmandaC with traaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaans agenda. AmandaC recovers 3 health!, traaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaans agenda vibrates into the ground.
L524[14:16:27] <Inari> Oo
L525[14:17:01] <payonel> Moongoodboy{K}: again, there is no additional anything, it is full vs split
L526[14:17:04] <Moongoodboy{K}> %give MichiBot traaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaains agenda
L527[14:17:04] * MichiBot accepts traaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaains agenda and adds it to her inventory
L528[14:17:17] <Inari> pls
L529[14:17:34] <S3> huh
L530[14:17:35] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: right. There's no additional anything.[*] It's just one piece of software doing two[**] things.
L531[14:17:36] <Inari> %give MichiBot the literal best swimsuit type in this world
L532[14:17:36] * MichiBot accepts the literal best swimsuit type in this world and adds it to her inventory
L533[14:17:48] <S3> so technology is a 19th century thing
L534[14:17:56] <Inari> S3: What?
L535[14:18:21] <Moongoodboy{K}> Since we're being very picky about words here, /technology/ has existed since before stone tools. c:
L536[14:19:03] <Moongoodboy{K}> I bet we're /all/ surrounded by signs of myriad technological advances.
L537[14:19:27] <Moongoodboy{K}> And I'm not talking about the boxen we're undoubtedly using to communicate
L538[14:20:40] <Arcan> %give MichiBot Moongoodboy{K}'s collar
L539[14:20:41] * MichiBot accepts Moongoodboy{K}'s collar and adds it to her inventory
L540[14:21:04] <Moongoodboy{K}> Cute. You assumed it can be removed. ://3
L541[14:21:09] <payonel> Moongoodboy{K}: i didn't mean to escalate the discussion. you originall asked "your work runs a proxy server on their VPN?" and my answer is no. it is a full tunnel vpn
L542[14:21:15] <payonel> -l
L543[14:21:25] <payonel> er, +l, +y
L544[14:21:36] <Moongoodboy{K}> payonel: the answer is yes. It's just that the proxy servers and the VPN servers are the same software.
L545[14:22:03] <payonel> oh for crying out loud
L546[14:22:08] <CompanionCube> running a proxy *over* a VPN sounds very pointless.
L547[14:23:07] * Moongoodboy{K} sets up a DNS server that also happens to do DHCP things ( https://www.thekelleys.org.uk/dnsmasq/doc.html ) Vehemently denies running a DHCP server.
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L550[14:53:50] <AmandaC> Proxy and VPNs emulate different layers of the OCI stack, don't they?
L551[14:58:22] ⇦ Quits: MalkContent (MalkContent!~MalkConte@p4FDCC15D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) (Quit: Leaving)
L552[14:59:39] <AmandaC> Proxies are usually application-level, VPNs are lower
L553[15:05:56] <AmandaC> VPNs can be configured to only route trafic to internal nodes through itself, but that has nothing to do with proxies, it has to do with network routing, which is still lower level than a proxy would normally operate.
L554[15:06:27] <AmandaC> ( And has nothing to do with the VPN itself, eithr. You can do the same thing locally with ethernet/wifi adapters )
L555[15:07:31] <AmandaC> Using your definition of proxy, the common consumer router is a "proxy"
L556[15:07:36] <AmandaC> ( via NAT )
L557[15:14:44] <Inari> I wonder if high-tech/high-performance analogue computers (still using electronics, but not trying to use binary I guess) are possible and if they'd be any better tahn our computers
L558[15:15:20] <AmandaC> Inari: wasn't that what the old tube-based computers did?
L559[15:15:33] <Inari> Weren't they still binary?
L560[15:15:42] <AmandaC> Not sure.
L561[15:16:03] <Inari> Tubes wouldn't be viable either way though
L562[15:16:32] <AmandaC> anything analog probably wouldn't be anyway, due to being unable to precicely control the environment
L563[15:16:57] <Inari> Why would you be unable to precisely control it
L564[15:17:13] <AmandaC> humidity / air pressure / temperature would affect the properties of the parts in ways that wouldn't be as simple to smooth over as we do with digial stuff
L565[15:17:29] <Inari> Yeah, so we need parts that aren't affected by that :D
L566[15:17:55] <AmandaC> Right, parts that don't obey thermodynamics, got it
L567[15:18:01] <AmandaC> brb
L568[15:18:17] <Inari> Well just parts whose computations aren't affected by temperature or the like :p
L569[15:18:24] <Inari> Not sure how that disobeys thermodynamics
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L573[15:33:01] <Moongoodboy{K}> AmandaC: you can have an IP proxy
L574[15:33:08] <Moongoodboy{K}> NAT is IP proxying, actually.
L575[15:33:23] <Moongoodboy{K}> It hides the private IPs. That firs the definition I'm using.
L576[15:33:26] <AmandaC> So what you're saying is every consumer router is a proxy.
L577[15:33:43] <AmandaC> That's a silly definition, and you can't expect everyone to use your own made-up silly definitions
L578[15:33:54] <Moongoodboy{K}> okay, you come up with a better one.
L579[15:33:59] <Skye> NAT is the abuse of a firewall
L580[15:34:06] <Moongoodboy{K}> lol.
L581[15:36:12] <AmandaC> Proxies are generally HTTP/SMTP/other-protocol MitMs for filtering.
L582[15:37:22] <AmandaC> They
L583[15:37:52] <AmandaC> I don't see the point in making such an absurdly broad definition, when other defintiions fit better
L584[15:38:25] <AmandaC> Nobody calls the local routing table on their machine a proxy, but it can also be configured to act in the way you describe one
L585[15:39:06] <Inari> https://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/hardware/not-your-fathers-analog-computer neat
L586[15:39:10] <AmandaC> Proxies are generally just layman for HTTP tunnels, really.
L587[15:42:39] <Moongoodboy{K}> AmandaC: For filtering? So if I relay my traffic via a machine in $other_country in order to get $streaming_service to serve me some content it wouldn't otherwise, that's not proxying?
L588[15:42:51] * AmandaC sighs
L589[15:43:01] <Moongoodboy{K}> I'm trying to improve your definition.
L590[15:43:07] <Moongoodboy{K}> I would've welcomed the same to mine. :p
L591[15:43:41] <AmandaC> Moongoodboy{K}: 16:39:10 <AmandaC> Proxies are generally just layman for HTTP tunnels, really.
L592[15:44:09] <Moongoodboy{K}> Oh, okay, we're going off that definition.
L593[15:44:29] <Moongoodboy{K}> So if I make an SSH tunnel to hide my IP using my server's IP, but it's for IRC, not HTTP, that's not a proxy?
L594[15:44:37] * AmandaC skull-walls
L595[15:44:40] <AmandaC> fuck this
L596[15:45:09] <Moongoodboy{K}> I'm trying to collaboratively come up with a good definition of /proxy/!
L597[15:45:19] <AmandaC> Why, though?
L598[15:45:30] <Moongoodboy{K}> I tried to make one, but you didn't seem to like it, and you presented one of your own. So now we're iterating on that.
L599[15:45:47] <AmandaC> You can sit here and nit-pick every little detail of everything and still not have a concrete definition.
L600[15:47:47] <AmandaC> Proxies are tunnels that operate on OCI Layer 7, VPNs are tunnels that operate on Layers 3 or 4, when exposed to the user. Sure, they're both tunnels, but they're distinct in their usage and their interaction with software.
L601[15:48:28] <Moongoodboy{K}> Okay, that works!
L602[15:49:08] <AmandaC> %choose watch youtube or watch anime or code
L603[15:49:09] <MichiBot> AmandaC: code
L604[15:49:46] <Moongoodboy{K}> Watch a YouTube anime series about coders. :D
L605[15:51:45] <AmandaC> %choose play with terraform some or something else
L606[15:51:45] <MichiBot> AmandaC: play with terraform some
L607[16:05:51] <Nightmare> Anyone have any good tutorials on eeprom and robots? Last time i tried to use them i was so confused
L608[16:14:00] <Katie> AmandaC, welcome to my hell...
L609[16:14:00] <Izaya> ~w custom os
L610[16:14:00] <ocdoc> Predicted http://ocd.cil.li/tutorial:custom_oses
L611[16:15:30] <Moongoodboy{K}> Hayo
L612[16:15:37] <Moongoodboy{K}> That's quite nice.
L613[16:16:36] * Moongoodboy{K} imagines a bootloader that lets you configure boot order and looks for /sbin/init and /bin/sh (NB: not *.lua) on /those/ filesystems.
L614[16:18:00] <Izaya> Moongoodboy{K}: https://github.com/XeonSquared/PsychOS/blob/master/sebios.lua
L615[16:18:44] <Izaya> lets you select a boot device, at least
L616[16:19:57] <Izaya> also supports tape drives and network cards
L617[16:22:27] <AmandaC> Katie: Mew?
L618[16:22:39] <Katie> "skull-walls"
L619[16:23:05] <AmandaC> ah
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L623[16:53:38] * Moongoodboy{K} goes to the Nether and decorates the walls of the nearest fortress with mob heads.
L624[16:53:40] <Moongoodboy{K}> :D
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L626[16:55:23] <ccman> hello?
L627[16:55:54] <Moongoodboy{K}> https://youtu.be/gMgyt8KTrrM
L628[16:55:55] <MichiBot> [DnB] - Going Quantum - Hello (Centra Remix) [Monstercat EP Release] | length: 4m 31s | Likes: 3,975 Dislikes: 211 Views: 626,187 | by Monstercat: Uncaged | Published On 7/5/2012
L629[16:55:56] <Katie> %hello
L630[16:55:56] <MichiBot> Katie: Hello! Welcome to #oc! The one and only opencomputers channel! Please ask your questions directly (dont ask to ask) and provide error/code examples! (Use pastebin.com if theyre more than one line!) Dont mind the random conversation you might have walked into.
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L632[16:56:19] <Moongoodboy{K}> goodbye.
L633[16:56:27] <Katie> %goodbye
L634[16:56:31] <Katie> oh, guess not
L635[16:56:36] <Katie> %bye
L636[16:56:36] <MichiBot> Katie: Oh, well, bye I guess...
L637[17:10:33] <cat2002> I wish we had wireless tablet chargers.
L638[17:10:42] <cat2002> Would be nice.
L639[17:42:16] <ShadowFoxNixill> ~w command block
L640[17:42:17] <ocdoc> Predicted http://ocd.cil.li/block:case
L641[17:42:22] <ShadowFoxNixill> Nope. .w.
L642[17:47:24] <AmandaC> %choose s or w
L643[17:47:24] <MichiBot> AmandaC: s
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L646[18:07:17] <Kodos> Apparently F1 2015 is free on Humble Bundle
L647[18:07:52] <Molinko> Hi @payonel. Sorry I didn't get to respond to your compliment. I had to go deliver ~800lbs if donated dog food last minute. I love all the work you and others have put into OpenOS. Nice to hear from ya ?
L648[18:20:04] <cat2002> @ShadowFoxNixill If you're looking for something like a command block http://ocdoc.cil.li/component:debug
L649[18:22:06] <ShadowFoxNixill> I guess it's true that both would fit my needs. OpenComputers *does* have actual built-in command block support though (you have to use the Adapter block).
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L653[18:26:15] <cat2002> I would recommened the debug card over the command block
L654[18:26:19] <cat2002> it's better.
L655[18:32:13] <ShadowFoxNixill> It can't set blockstates.
L656[18:35:22] <AmandaC> Pretty sure there's a command in that with the same effect as a commandblock string
L657[18:36:23] <AmandaC> "runCommand"
L658[18:36:51] <AmandaC> %choose mc or no
L659[18:36:51] <MichiBot> AmandaC: mc
L660[18:36:56] <ShadowFoxNixill> ... So there is.
L661[18:38:16] <ShadowFoxNixill> Now if only there were a way to position the fake player, or worldedit commands to pos1/pos2 at specific coordinates.
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L663[19:24:01] <Moongoodboy{K}> Command block support vis adapters? o3o
L664[19:24:16] <ShadowFoxNixill> Yeah!
L665[19:27:36] <ShadowFoxNixill> http://tinyurl.com/y8smfy76
L666[19:27:44] <ShadowFoxNixill> (Does that create a link for you over on irc?)
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L668[19:33:48] <Katie> @ShadowFoxNixill yeah, it even tinyurls it for us
L669[19:34:06] <ShadowFoxNixill> Neat.
L670[19:34:20] <Katie> I pride myself in the modifications I've made :P
L671[20:19:35] <AmandaC> https://twitter.com/RebeccaTheGeek/status/976906055237210112?s=19
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