L19[09:09:54] <Althego> fueling is

L20[09:10:00] <Althego> almost complete

L21[09:10:01] <Althego> fueling is

L22[09:10:02] <Althego> eh

L23[09:10:06] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21X5lGlDOfg

L24[09:10:57] <Mat2ch> Uh, nice, thanks!

L30[10:50:09] <Althego> kikkerikii

L33[11:33:38] <Mat2ch> Hoooooooold

L34[11:41:51] <sandbox> what's up?

L35[11:42:52] <umbralraptor> sandbox: launch commentary will begin after tanking commentary

L36[11:43:11] <Althego> sandbox: sls launch

L37[12:14:00] <Mat2ch> How far was it delayed?

L38[12:20:50] <Fluburtur> so about that artemis launch

L39[12:20:52] <Fluburtur> the youtube countdown looks like it was pushed back a bit

L40[12:20:54] <Fluburtur> but im still hoping for fireworks

L41[12:24:34] <Althego> i doubt it is going to happen today

L43[12:35:26] <umbralraptor> ...and scrubbed

L44[12:35:40] <Althego> yes

L45[12:35:41] <Mat2ch> scrrub

L46[12:37:39] <Althego> over there at ##space, invention: klingon space program :)

L47[12:38:28] <packbart> well, at least there won't be any tedious rescue missions

L50[13:32:22] <Raptop> !mission add You look for ways to spice up tedious rescue missions.

L51[13:32:22] <LunchBot> Added mission: You look for ways to spice up tedious rescue missions.

L52[13:33:18] <Raptop> !mission add You spice up you mission with Sriracha and Tabasco sauce.

L53[13:33:19] <LunchBot> Added mission: You spice up you mission with Sriracha and Tabasco sauce.

L54[13:33:40] <SporkWitch> ;mission fixup s/you/your/

L55[13:33:40] <LunchBot> New text is: You spice up your mission with Sriracha and Tabasco sauce.

L56[13:34:11] <SporkWitch> now i want some scrambled eggs with sriracha....

L57[13:34:27] <SporkWitch> spicy scrambled eggs = best scrambled eggs

L58[13:35:10] <Althego> spicy scrambled radio transmissions

L59[13:36:30] <SporkWitch> ... wtf were the apple guys smoking when they thought "i know, let's have a weird cut-out descend into the monitor for the camera" on a LAPTOP?! lol

L60[13:36:59] <Althego> hehe

L61[13:37:01] <SporkWitch> oh, right, it's Apple, they were all smoking weed, and sometimes crack...

L62[13:37:02] <Althego> nobody likes nothes

L63[13:37:06] <Althego> notches

L64[13:37:40] <Althego> btw for years there was this rumor for the under screen cameras

L65[13:37:45] <Althego> and they are still not here

L66[13:38:09] <SporkWitch> i can tolerate it on a phone, because i get the very serious physical space compromises involved, but a notch on a LAPTOP? it's a 16" macbook pro, what does this thing cost? 3000 USD? make the lid 1cm longer and don't put a bloody notch into the display itself

L67[13:38:45] <Althego> if you bought a mac, you are in the cult anyway

L68[13:38:51] <SporkWitch> company laptop

L69[13:38:55] <Althego> you will buy anything for any amount

L70[13:39:13] <SporkWitch> they asked what i wanted and my response is always going to be "not windows," so i get to learn MacOS lol

L71[13:39:31] <SporkWitch> i expect to spend a lot of time in the terminal or running linux in parallels lol

L72[13:42:44] <SporkWitch> ... dammit steve jobs, you hold fn to access things at the TOP of the key, not the bottom! (was trying to fix the brightness; apparently you have to hold the function key to access the F-keys, not the non-standard special FUNCTIONS on those keys lol)

L73[13:43:03] <Izaya> why would you ever want to use the F-keys?

L74[13:43:16] <Izaya> what POSSIBLE USE would you have for F-keys? F1? F2? Who needs em?

L75[13:43:29] <Althego> lot of laptops are like that

L76[13:43:43] <Althego> combines with fn key at the corner, where control should be

L77[13:44:04] <Izaya> I have a tablet with that setup - it doesn't even show the F-key labels on that row - but the default keymap under Linux has them swapped so it's sane to use

L78[13:44:32] <SporkWitch> i've literally never encountered one that has a distinct key for F-keys and requires holding a modifer to use them as F-keys. I have seen some non-full keyboard layouts that put the F-keys on the number row and require holding fn to access them.

L79[13:44:44] <Izaya> What do you mean that F-keys are an important part of the CUA?

L80[13:44:53] <Althego> they are important for me

L81[13:45:01] <Althego> without f keys the keyboard is useless

L82[13:45:32] <SporkWitch> regardless, we're talking about half a century of basic standards and conventions. If you wanna toss that then we should toss qwerty too and switch to dvorak.

L83[13:45:56] <Althego> other thing is the missing insert on full keyboards

L84[13:45:58] <Izaya> I'm pretty sure there's an option in the OS X settings for that

L85[13:46:05] <Althego> and the rotated 2x3 group

L86[13:46:24] <Althego> why would somebody come up with such monstrosities

L87[13:46:37] <SporkWitch> rotated 2x3 group?

L88[13:46:39] <Althego> even the ones where there is power and such there and the normal keys are shifted

L89[13:46:56] <Althego> not 3 wide and 2 high, but 2 wide and 3 high

L90[13:46:57] <Izaya> I had a HP laptop with the 2x3 group as a 1x6 line down one side of the keyboard

L91[13:47:03] <Althego> that is a laptop

L92[13:47:04] <Izaya> I didn't hate that, but it was an adjustment

L93[13:47:07] <Althego> but on a fukll keyboard

L94[13:47:32] <Althego> because then home and end are left to right, thanks i hate it

L95[13:47:43] <SporkWitch> ah, that group

L96[13:47:43] <Althego> i get it, they want to sell something insteresting

L97[13:47:54] <SporkWitch> yeah, that's silly as hell lol

L98[13:48:15] <Althego> no need to innovate the keyboard layouy

L99[13:48:21] <Althego> in fact, you cant

L100[13:48:30] <Althego> that is why we are stuck with a silly typewriter layout

L101[13:48:37] <Izaya> if you're going to change it go full retard, do something NEW

L102[13:48:56] <Althego> they could innovate the switches, latency, power consumption, led lighting, i dont care

L103[13:49:01] <Althego> in fact tehy should

L104[13:49:08] <Izaya> I liked the steam controller pinwheel keyboard

L105[13:49:11] <SporkWitch> my last vaio really drove me nuts. it advertised as a full-size keyboard but i didn't look closely enough at the images. it's not. oh, it has all 104 keys, sure, but the numpad, 2x3 group, and arrow keys are compressed, and the numpad 0 is half size with the right arrow where the left half of it would be. as someone that touchtypes the number pad, it really messed with me

L106[13:49:14] <Althego> yes, if you change it, at lerast optimize it

L107[13:49:54] <Althego> another idiocy: american enter looks like a shift. european enter is shorter but two rows high

L108[13:50:02] <Althego> why?

L109[13:50:12] <SporkWitch> you CAN innovate on keyboard layout, it's called dvorak. The reason we use the typewriter layout is no one old enough to have a say is willing to sacrifice their typing speed temporarily to learn it, and thus make the change necessary to raise a new generation on the superior layout lol

L110[13:50:44] <Althego> if i try to use an american enter i always hit between the enter and the backslash, adding additional \ before newlines

L111[13:50:56] <SporkWitch> re: enter, that varies. I remember the DEC machines i had in the past, and I think my C64 as well, had the vertical enter keys

L112[13:51:13] <Izaya> this conversation has given me a great idea for what to do with the alt layout of my touchscreen keyboard

L113[13:51:47] <Izaya> gonna have the right half be a numpad, the left half contain F1-F12 (maybe to F24?), XF86LaunchN, media and volume control keys...

L114[13:51:56] <Izaya> plus the 2x3 group

L115[13:52:16] <SporkWitch> heck, part of my setup today is going to be remappying command, option, and control to align with linux/windows conventions; i'm fine learning a new OS, not nearly 40 years of muscle memory on key shortcuts lol

L116[13:52:48] <Izaya> ngl I kinda like the OS X style setup for it

L117[13:52:53] <Izaya> especially copy and paste

L118[13:52:56] <Althego> yes that command thing is also silly

L119[13:53:14] <Izaya> no more "is it ^c, ^C, or ^ins to copy?"

L120[13:53:47] <SporkWitch> i don't, just on layout alone. command is an awkward key to hit, and the standard combos like C^A, C^C, C^V, etc. are all command instead of control on map

L121[13:54:08] <SporkWitch> s/map/mac

L122[13:54:53] <Izaya> concept: ctrl replaces caps lock, mod4 goes into the corner

L123[13:56:50] <SporkWitch> i remap caps lock to compose

L124[13:56:56] <SporkWitch> compose key = win

L125[13:57:06] <SporkWitch> (as in winning, not windows key :P)

L126[13:57:20] <Izaya> compose goes on either right hand mod4 or XF86Launch1

L127[13:57:22] <Izaya> for me

L128[13:57:35] <SporkWitch> bah, trying to set up 2FA as required and it doesn't like my yubikey. i'll have to wait for the IT support bridge in an hour...

L129[13:58:01] <Althego> cant you just install linux on the mac? :)

L130[13:58:21] <Izaya> if it's one of the new ones, no :D

L131[13:58:27] <Izaya> *yes, but it's very much not 100%

L132[13:58:55] <SporkWitch> in ADDITION to macos? probably heh. i did ask my boss, when asking what laptop to select, if i was required to use the pre-installed OS and the answer was yes, heh

L133[13:59:19] <SporkWitch> m1 chips are just arm; plenty of distros support arm, including debian

L134[14:00:07] <Izaya> for quite a while you couldn't even boot any distro on them though

L135[14:00:16] <Izaya> something to do with the chipset and crypto coprocessor

L136[14:00:23] <Althego> in the long run apple is going the motph the chips to their liking, they will be not arm

L137[14:00:45] <Izaya> I do like that Apple is doing something other than IBM PC Compatibles though, there's a valid argument for buying them now

L138[14:01:20] <SporkWitch> true; they learned to well from Microsoft: standards are bad, only work with stuff you sell yourself

L139[14:01:27] <SporkWitch> s/to/too/

L150[21:18:09] <FLHerne> ;mission add Across the gulf of space, minds that are to our minds as ours are to those of the beasts that perish, intellects vast and cool and unsympathetic, regard Kerbin with envious eyes, and slowly and surely draw their plans against us.

L151[21:18:09] <LunchBot> Added mission: Across the gulf of space, minds that are to our minds as ours are to those of the beasts that perish, intellects vast and cool and unsympathetic, regard Kerbin with envious eyes, and slowly and surely draw their plans against us.

L152[21:18:44] <umbralraptor> Someone's been reading a Stross novel

L153[21:19:56] <FLHerne> ...

L154[21:20:18] <umbralraptor> ...?

L155[21:20:30] <FLHerne> I've been reading a novel, certainly :p

L156[21:20:39] <umbralraptor> hm

L157[21:21:14] <FLHerne> I thought that line was pretty famous

L159[21:23:41] <umbralraptor> (after googling) Well, I guess Wells was *also* a British SF author

L161[21:27:12] <FLHerne> Yes

L162[21:28:41] <FLHerne> Even the modern American movie quotes it pretty much verbatim https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8y_UqIM1RcQ

L163[21:29:34] <FLHerne> tbh, while I mostly hate Americanised movies, they did a really good job of that adaptation IMO

L164[21:40:16] <FLHerne> ;stupid H. G. Wells

L165[21:40:16] <LunchBot> "I'm doing the dearest little serial for Pearson's new magazine, in which I completely wreck and sack Woking – killing my neighbours in painful and eccentric ways." -- H. G. Wells.

L170[22:28:11] <SporkWitch> one of the trainings at the new job has timers on each page, even the quiz pages. It made me sit on the page a full minute after telling me my answer was right to "absorb the information"; obviously i absorbed it, i got the answer right! lol

L171[22:32:07] <umbralraptor> Have they considered providing an anki deck of training materials?