OCLogs: 2019-07-17.log

Stuff goes here

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L11[02:08:56] <Eddi|zuHause> "we use the fact that nobody died from dark matter collisions to deduce that this kind of dark matter doesn't exist"?

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L13[02:11:54] <Gasher[work]> well everyone died of brain failure, so no other causes of death exist anyway

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L97[09:23:19] <Althego> Curious Marc's AGC Repair Shop - Solid Work, Reasonable Rates, All Work Guaranteed. The only AGC repair shop in the Solar System

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L99[09:27:31] <Althego> that b12 module is basically useless, there are now 4 holes on it for the repairs

L100[09:27:53] <Althego> and i bet some museum has a working one that they dont use it is just on display

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L102[09:30:03] <Rokker> Althego: did you just say the word

L103[09:30:10] <Rokker> M U S E U M

L104[09:30:15] <Rokker> MUSEUM?

L105[09:30:20] <Althego> ah i almost forgot about you

L106[09:30:26] <Rokker> :(

L107[09:30:40] <Rokker> I started playing KSP again

L108[09:30:48] <Rokker> and it crashed

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L110[09:33:58] <packbart> it happens, but not often. I've seen it about two times now

L111[09:34:19] <Althego> he is probably using rss and stuff

L112[09:34:26] <Althego> so can be because of mods

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L128[10:09:49] <Rokker> yeah

L129[10:09:54] <Rokker> its mods

L130[10:13:14] <Althego> hah it is flying

L131[10:13:18] <Althego> bigger wings

L132[10:13:28] <Althego> 6x8 mid blade

L133[10:13:36] <Althego> i forgot to put on the additional solar panels

L134[10:13:43] <Althego> but still

L135[10:13:50] <Althego> the props also help to slow donw for landing

L136[10:13:57] <Althego> if only they generated power too

L137[10:14:09] <Althego> but that never worked, not even for wheel

L138[10:14:10] <Althego> s

L139[10:15:57] <Gasher> like, recuperation?

L140[10:20:09] <Rokker> guys

L141[10:20:23] <Rokker> guess what is coming to a museum that is like 40 minutes away

L142[10:22:12] <Gasher> something about the recent anniversary?

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L144[10:27:19] <Althego> http://www.warpology.com/k/flying.png

L145[10:27:29] <Althego> http://www.warpology.com/k/notflying.png

L146[10:27:42] <Althego> something going on with those blades

L147[10:27:58] <Althego> also i dont get why it cant land

L148[10:28:03] <Althego> it can easily land on kerbin

L149[10:28:22] <Althego> it lands with around 35 m/s on duna with low vertical speed and low gravity

L150[10:28:31] <Althego> and then it just wants to push its nose into the ground

L151[10:28:49] <Althego> i guess the main landing gear generate some huge force

L152[10:31:07] <Gasher> i noticed that in 1.7 there are some issues with wheels

L153[10:31:17] <packbart> oh my, even the Truck Simulator released an Apollo 11 update with Apollo-styled trinkets to hang in the cabin and some lunar paint jobs. It's everywhere! :)

L154[10:31:28] <Gasher> Althego, also maybe if you change the spring/damper values it'd be better?

L155[10:33:14] <packbart> notflying.png looks to me as if the rotor speeds goes beyond the Kraken limit

L156[10:33:47] <Gasher> looks like a load of bats

L157[10:36:21] <Althego> it shouldnt, because all of the motors are limited to 460 rpm

L158[10:36:52] <Althego> that picture looks funny when actually moving, all the blades moving around the motors seemingly as random noise

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L167[11:55:15] <transitbiker> bwoop

L168[11:55:34] <transitbiker> so, like... where did the kerbodyne big tank adapter go in 1.7?

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L170[11:57:03] <transitbiker> and wow

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L172[11:57:26] <transitbiker> i need to check the wiki because the craft i was going to build seems to be missing parts in the editor's part selection

L173[11:58:47] <Althego> some parts have changed visuals, so i constantly have problems finding them

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L177[12:03:02] <LupiDragon> everyone requested that they make it into a fuel tank, so they did @transitbiker

L178[12:03:18] <transitbiker> -_-

L179[12:03:45] <LupiDragon> like when they announced the revamp people were on a lot of the discussion avenues saying "squad you should make it a fuel tank" so they did

L180[12:04:23] <LupiDragon> also i'm trying to test a vehicle for flight on laythe, around what altitude on kerbin does the atmosphere approximate that of laythe?

L181[12:04:33] <transitbiker> or maybe i dunno have both since i dont need a super heavy diamater adapter

L182[12:05:03] <transitbiker> or make tanks with the bevel built in on top

L183[12:05:07] <LupiDragon> you can just take the fuel out of it can't you

L184[12:05:13] <transitbiker> like the mk2 to mk3 ones

L185[12:05:20] <transitbiker> its still like 2x heavier

L186[12:05:48] <transitbiker> empty mass is higher than the plain adapter

L187[12:07:05] <transitbiker> plus now if i use it for a space station i'll have liquid fuel and hydrogen meters needlessly

L188[12:08:02] <LupiDragon> then make an adapter out of a fairing, take a fairing one size less than your tank diameter, widen it out, then clip the base in and close it to a tank of a smaller diameter?

L189[12:08:47] <transitbiker> then i gotta mess around with staging

L190[12:09:18] <LupiDragon> you can remove fairings from staging

L191[12:09:21] <LupiDragon> rightclick them

L192[12:09:30] <transitbiker> man i am just really unhappy with the direction ksp has been going since take-two took over

L193[12:10:13] <LupiDragon> the adapter isn't to blame on take two, blame the large vocal part of the community who were like "this thing is dumb if you're gonna revamp it you should actually improve it and make it a fuel tank"

L194[12:10:34] <transitbiker> same with microsoft and minecraft to be frankly honest

L195[12:10:57] <transitbiker> yeah i get it, but some people still used it as a low mass adapter

L196[12:11:13] <LupiDragon> I am patently of the opposite belief, minecraft has just been getting better as they've gone through and patched all the stuff that seemed half finished or poorly implemented like the oceans, villages, et cetera

L197[12:14:08] <transitbiker> 1.13 is still a giant mess

L198[12:14:23] <transitbiker> and 1.14 still has chunk loading issues

L199[12:14:33] <transitbiker> as well as lighting update lag

L200[12:15:16] <Althego> you can turn off the meters

L201[12:15:55] <transitbiker> dont get me wrong, i'm glad they are trying to innovate, but, if there are bugs, they should be addressed head-on

L202[12:16:15] <LupiDragon> i mean, yeah, sometimes bugs creep in, but it's not like they're not working on those? they've clearly been paying attention and working through reports and feedback given that they went from "we're changing how this works, no more iron farms" to "try iron farms in this snapshot let us know if it seems fair"

L203[12:16:22] <transitbiker> i leave the resource panel up basically all the time

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L205[12:17:03] <transitbiker> 1.14 was roundly slammed by basically everyone that runs a server and aslo a vast majority of single player world content creators/streamers

L206[12:17:19] <transitbiker> myself included

L207[12:17:36] <LupiDragon> Oh I'm aware, I watch hermitcraft and scicraft

L208[12:17:55] <transitbiker> i dont just watch

L209[12:18:22] <transitbiker> i'm on the back end of several medium sized servers and its been hair pullingly frustrating

L210[12:18:51] <transitbiker> and i had to stop my 1.14 survival series first episode because of the mountain of bugs

L211[12:19:27] <LupiDragon> I did my time playing it back in like 2012-2015 or so with occasional returns; heck, I used to play with someone who's now on hermitcraft. Either way, they're clearly working on it just like Squad works on things; since take two we've gotten things they previously said they'd never do, "stock delta v? this is a toy game"

L212[12:20:00] <transitbiker> could i personally write code to improve these issues? no. do i expect a multi-billion dollar company like microsoft to have the capacity to release vetted and pest controlled software? yes..

L213[12:20:40] <Althego> they dont even do that with windows

L214[12:20:46] <Althego> last few updates were quite bad

L215[12:21:00] <transitbiker> the bugs in ksp were mostly related to constantly active simulation cone like wheels and textures... the fundamental core, the game engine has been solid for some time now

L216[12:21:09] <transitbiker> code not cone

L217[12:21:33] <LupiDragon> anyway where does the atmosphere on Kerbin equate to that of the first couple KM of laythe? if I can get my little multirotor up to 4.5km will it fly on laythe

L218[12:21:45] <transitbiker> with minecraft, they updated content ANd the core game engine at the same time

L219[12:21:52] <Althego> also now that we have propellers, where are my balloon and submarine parts (aero and hydro stat)

L220[12:21:54] <LupiDragon> That's what I came here to ask as well as engage here

L221[12:22:12] <transitbiker> which i think is what they did wrong to bring about all the problems

L222[12:22:23] <Althego> what i hate in this dlc, that the bundled the mu8ch needed props and robotics parts what i have been waiuting for to science stuff

L223[12:22:32] <Althego> why not modularize, release these separately

L224[12:22:37] <transitbiker> you mean you pay for propellers

L225[12:23:19] <transitbiker> yeah... in all i think the quality of software has been going downhill with few exceptions... too much emphasis on marketing not enough emphasis on solid coding

L226[12:23:24] <LupiDragon> if you want to, nobody's putting a gun to your head and saying you have to buy BG, there's no shortage of plane parts mods still out there and last i checked mods like BDB and FASA didn't get taken down when the MH parts pack dropped

L227[12:24:08] <transitbiker> ive been playing ksp for a very long time, and some updates were very welcome, but others have been just added frustration to something that should be enjoyable

L228[12:24:19] <LupiDragon> but yeah, bundling the ground science stuff with robotics seems a little curious, but then they added a desert launch site in maknig history for some reason

L229[12:24:29] <transitbiker> yeah

L230[12:24:33] <Althego> i like the desert launch site

L231[12:24:49] <transitbiker> prolly to simulate white sands proving grounds

L232[12:24:49] <LupiDragon> I'm just pointing out the sorta variance of theme that resulted from it

L233[12:24:52] <Althego> which is called dessert

L234[12:25:00] <Althego> and i never noticed until month later somebody said it here

L235[12:25:08] <Althego> months later

L236[12:25:24] <transitbiker> where the redstone and others were tested before being ok'd to be fitted for a manned capsule

L237[12:26:01] <transitbiker> away from public eyes and far from heavily populated areas

L238[12:26:23] <LupiDragon> but yeah i like the ground science stuff, i can't wait to put it to work; and the sequencer in BG is pretty cool, i've found plenty of unorthodox uses for it.

L239[12:26:43] <transitbiker> i dont think people really understand how gigantic of a feat it was to get people into space

L240[12:26:55] ⇨ Joins: Ezriilc_ (Ezriilc_!~Ezriilc@096-059-118-031.res.spectrum.com)

L241[12:27:26] <transitbiker> we went from breaking the sound barrier and balloon testing to orbital flight in 8 years

L242[12:27:35] <LupiDragon> I find it funny how the maintainer/creator of the SEP mod decided to throw in the towel the day before BG was announced

L243[12:27:41] <LupiDragon> that's one of those funny timing things

L244[12:27:46] <transitbiker> then orbital flight to waling on the moon in what another 6?

L245[12:29:21] <transitbiker> 66 years from first recorded powered flight to waling on the moon

L246[12:29:31] <transitbiker> walking

L247[12:30:26] ⇦ Quits: Ezriilc (Ezriilc!~Ezriilc@185.245.86.38) (Ping timeout: 206 seconds)

L248[12:30:26] *** Ezriilc_ is now known as Ezriilc

L249[12:31:01] <transitbiker> anyway, enough venting..... i need to rebuild thie launch vehicle i accidentally deleted in yesterday's livestream

L250[12:31:25] <Althego> hehe

L251[12:31:28] <transitbiker> i thought it was a solid performer, and i want a new launch vehicle that isnt mongoose 1 based

L252[12:32:16] <transitbiker> the mongoose line of launch vehicles are meant for super heavy lifting into medium to high kerbin orbit, not for capsules and small things

L253[12:32:35] <transitbiker> end up with massive extra fuel

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L255[12:34:36] <transitbiker> i do like the new big nose cone

L256[12:35:00] <transitbiker> and i think they had to have that due to the adapter being a fuel tank now

L257[12:35:18] <transitbiker> used to be you put an adapter and the old nose cone

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L259[12:35:46] <Althego> i like the tiniest nose cones, which despite their name can be used for the engines, obviously on the hub when you are running propellers

L260[12:36:06] <LupiDragon> yeah they're nifty

L261[12:36:21] <LupiDragon> https://i.imgur.com/29zzYym.png

L262[12:36:32] <LupiDragon> working on this lad, trying to figure out how to tell if it'l work on laythe

L263[12:36:46] <Althego> it is overpowered, it would

L264[12:36:48] <transitbiker> i use them for streamlining in the aft facing bits quite often

L265[12:36:57] <LupiDragon> it can only get to 4km

L266[12:37:01] <LupiDragon> on kerbin

L267[12:37:04] <Althego> hmm

L268[12:37:23] <transitbiker> can the props on the top be put on a taller shaft?

L269[12:37:38] <Althego> never tried that

L270[12:37:39] <LupiDragon> i have those motors torqued down to 2kn and that gives it about a 30 minute flight time?

L271[12:37:43] <transitbiker> then you could make the blades a bit longer?

L272[12:38:04] <Althego> you could change the small props to helicopter blades, those have higher lift

L273[12:38:08] <LupiDragon> too big

L274[12:38:17] <Althego> you just need two pairs in the center

L275[12:38:20] <LupiDragon> i just wanna figure out what altitudes on kerbin correspond to the first km or 2 of laythe's atmosphere so i can test without having to hyperedit there time and time again

L276[12:38:36] <LupiDragon> and reenter and wait to find out it doesn't generate enough lift to not plummet into theocean

L277[12:38:37] <Althego> you can use an exponential function for quick reference

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L279[12:39:08] <transitbiker> or better yet

L280[12:39:24] * Ezriilc 's Spidey sense tingles...

L281[12:39:41] <transitbiker> use the action groups to stage your prop sets based on altitude and lift requirements

L282[12:40:07] <LupiDragon> i have it set up to control entirely differently

L283[12:40:15] <Althego> sea level pressure * exp(- altitude / scale height)

L284[12:40:16] <LupiDragon> i'm using RPM between the motors using KALs

L285[12:40:18] <transitbiker> that way you have like an extra "gear" to shift into for lifting loads or going higher

L286[12:40:28] <transitbiker> hm

L287[12:40:28] <Ezriilc> HyperEdit's Planet Editor can change Kerbin's attributes to that of another body, to make testing crafts much easier.

L288[12:40:32] <Althego> scale hight and sea level pressure are available in the wiki

L289[12:40:49] <transitbiker> then again, i build craft very differently from most people ;)

L290[12:41:35] <Althego> yes we noticed :)

L291[12:42:10] <Althego> so sea level pressure on laythe is 0.6 atm compared to 1 of kerbin

L292[12:42:16] <LupiDragon> let's see, if i want to get to 3km on eve i wanna be atound 45kpa

L293[12:42:19] <LupiDragon> laythe*

L294[12:42:22] <transitbiker> you guise are gonna love this thing once i build it

L295[12:42:38] <transitbiker> livestream time in 5 minutes or less

L296[12:42:40] <Althego> and scale heights are 5.6 km and 8 km

L297[12:42:50] <LupiDragon> so if this thing can get to 5km on kerbin, it can get to about 2.5-3km on laythe?

L298[12:43:08] <LupiDragon> not factoring in weight reduction from laythe's lower gravity

L299[12:44:16] <transitbiker> first stage testing

L300[12:44:37] <transitbiker> if i built this right, it will be where i start the livestream

L301[12:44:55] <transitbiker> aaaand forgot struts

L302[12:45:03] <Althego> around 3.2

L303[12:45:16] <LupiDragon> that's probably enough

L304[12:45:46] <Althego> but this is just an approcimation because there are some variations in scale height by altitude

L305[12:45:51] <transitbiker> is there a mothership for this thing?

L306[12:45:59] <Althego> mothership. drives offline

L307[12:46:13] <LupiDragon> what, the tiny multirotor? No i'm just launching it Curiosity-style in an aeroshell on a conventional rocket

L308[12:47:09] <Althego> just have enough thermal protection for a direct laythe

L309[12:47:17] <Althego> that tends to get really hot

L310[12:47:28] <Althego> laythe has a somewhat weird atmosphere

L311[12:47:31] <LupiDragon> I'm not sure when/if i'm launching this in my main campaign, i just kinda wanted to make it

L312[12:48:04] <LupiDragon> my save has been going long enough that the first jool probe i launched in nov 2016 still hasn't made it, it's still a few weeks out from SoI entry

L313[12:48:37] <transitbiker> looks like some radiators are needed for the twin boar due to the added thuddies on the outside

L314[12:48:40] <transitbiker> lets try that

L315[12:50:16] <transitbiker> edge radiators installed and active

L316[12:50:39] <transitbiker> liquid helium cooling systems should be a thing

L317[12:51:02] <Althego> i dont know of an engine aside from the nuke that needs cooling

L318[12:51:14] <Althego> also you should be able to stick parts to the side of the nuke

L319[12:51:26] <Althego> like radiators

L320[12:51:40] <transitbiker> oh yeah they work holy cow

L321[12:52:14] <transitbiker> well the twin boar is fine on its own, but i have 3 thuds stuck on one side which makes for dense thermal area

L322[12:55:03] <Althego> arent you all happy because of the info on the dragon explosion?

L323[12:55:39] <transitbiker> no clue what that even is

L324[12:56:50] <Althego> you must be living under an asteroid :)

L325[12:57:29] <transitbiker> yes inside a space worm

L326[12:57:53] <Althego> is the empire chasing you?

L327[12:59:16] <transitbiker> no just some cyborg in black

L328[12:59:20] <transitbiker> stalker etc

L329[13:00:24] <transitbiker> brb

L330[13:00:30] <transitbiker> like 100 degrees f here

L331[13:00:57] <Althego> anyway if you remember a dragon v2, i think the one that returned from the station, exploded during a test of the superdraco engines a few months ago

L332[13:01:04] <Althego> and there is finally info on it

L333[13:01:16] <Althego> funny enough the engiens themselves were not hurt :)

L334[13:01:36] <Althego> the plumbing and valves were at fault

L335[13:03:06] * transitbiker looks at mario & luigi

L336[13:03:14] <transitbiker> plumbing problems eh?

L337[13:03:28] * transitbiker looks at mario & luigi again

L338[13:03:35] <Althego> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmIOSoeHyAw

L339[13:03:36] <kmath> YouTube - Mario Pipe Sound

L340[13:05:05] <Althego> now that a test version of the propeller plane works on eve and duna, i need to add some payload

L341[13:05:22] <Althego> and heatshield and stuff

L342[13:09:52] <Althego> hmm iss will be busty in the next few days. soyuz and dragon launches coming up

L343[13:09:57] <Althego> *busy

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L346[13:15:51] <transitbiker> everyone else in ksp "what is my delta v to jool?!"

L347[13:15:55] <transitbiker> me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3p55J-VA5k

L348[13:15:55] <kmath> YouTube - 1770 French Cugnot (Repro)(1)

L349[13:16:03] <Althego> 2k m/s

L350[13:16:22] <Althego> ah one of the first steam powered vehicles

L351[13:16:27] <Althego> or rather the replica of it

L352[13:16:37] <Althego> from the 18th century if i remember correctly

L353[13:16:41] <Althego> quite iconic

L354[13:19:22] <LupiDragon> wow that decrease in gravity helps too https://i.imgur.com/mCzRySr.png

L355[13:19:41] <Althego> oh i didnt factior that in

L356[13:19:43] <Althego> just the pressure

L357[13:19:46] <LupiDragon> yeah i didn't either

L358[13:20:01] <LupiDragon> i knew it would help, but i was looking for worst-case

L359[13:20:16] <transitbiker> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWdLt3Afjrg

L360[13:20:16] <kmath> YouTube - Queen - Under Pressure (Lyrics)

L361[13:20:17] <Althego> jet engines struggle somewhat

L362[13:20:34] <Althego> because of the thin atmiospher that has lexx oxygen anyway

L363[13:20:41] <LupiDragon> i generally try to build for what i can imagine the worst case to be, then i'm proven wrong about how bad it could be

L364[13:20:42] <Althego> but this seems to be working really well

L365[13:20:55] <LupiDragon> like my moho probe where i had to sacrifice 1 of the 2 landers in order to make my capture burn

L366[13:21:02] <Althego> flying curiosity, just lacks the science arm

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L368[13:22:16] <Althego> hmm i still havent realy tried the props underwater

L369[13:22:21] <LupiDragon> me neither

L370[13:23:31] <Althego> also i havent checked if solar panels work underwater

L371[13:23:44] <Althego> let our experiments combine!ú

L372[13:27:58] <LupiDragon> so if this thing has 1300 EC, and uses .5 a second, that means about 40 minutes of flight time right

L373[13:29:06] <UmbralRaptop> yes

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L375[13:29:48] <LupiDragon> that's a good amount for biome hopping

L376[13:29:54] <transitbiker_> Apollo 11 TAKE TWO! Kerbal Space Program LIVE! Moon or bust! Tune in here: https://youtu.be/0Iy2LP49ng4

L377[13:29:54] <kmath> YouTube - Apollo 11 tribute LIVE in Kerbal Space Program! (TAKE TWO!)

L378[13:29:59] <LupiDragon> i'm not sure if it's enough for island hopping

L379[13:30:15] <LupiDragon> maybe if i'm not trying for altitude like this

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L381[13:33:49] <LupiDragon> i mean, i COULD replace the grip pad skids with some sorts of floats, maybe using mk0 tanks

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L384[13:39:57] <Althego> no, you dont need floats. everything floats

L385[13:40:12] <Althego> you need heavy parts, usually ore containers with oire

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L387[13:47:16] <Althego> surprisingly solar panels work under water

L388[13:47:42] <Althego> but i cant get deeper because i am stuck on the shore, havent thought of density imbalance

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L390[13:48:24] <Althego> and the prop although capable of rotation, does not generate any force

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L392[13:52:11] <LupiDragon> no i mean, i would need floats to land on the water

L393[13:52:22] <LupiDragon> and keep the props from getting' submerged

L394[13:52:27] <LupiDragon> on my little multirotor

L395[13:52:45] <LupiDragon> but that's assuming it wouldn't be able to cross a reasonable body of water on laythe

L396[13:52:48] <Althego> you could simply put all props on top

L397[13:54:12] <LupiDragon> that's slightly out of the spirit of what i wanted to do with it, bein' somewhat inspired by titan dragonfly

L398[13:55:52] <transitbiker> mmmm powah

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L410[14:56:58] <LupiDragon> this thing can get really movin'; i had just enough to get from the waypoint there to where i am now https://i.imgur.com/VdKO8SZ.png

L411[14:57:03] <LupiDragon> idon't know what sort of ground distance that is

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L425[16:30:40] <transitbiker> 150 tons hovering weeee

L426[16:32:11] <packbart> .oO(“The ships hung in the sky in much the same way that bricks don't.”)

L427[16:32:43] <transitbiker> HAH

L428[16:33:30] <JVFoxy> transitbiker this intentional?

L429[16:33:59] <transitbiker> nooopee

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L449[17:59:09] <transitbiker> WHEW

L450[17:59:16] <transitbiker> this is taking 5ever

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L452[19:02:05] <transitbiker> will be back tomorrow with the rest of our moon mission

L453[19:02:07] <transitbiker> <3

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